Top Ten C4's Myths about the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict.

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    Jul 26, 2010 4:52 AM GMT
    Myth #1 – Jews and Arabs have always been in conflict in the region.

    Although Arabs were a majority in Palestine prior to the creation of the state of Israel, there had always been a Jewish population, as well. For the most part, Jewish Palestinians got along with their Arab neighbors. This began to change with the onset of the Zionist movement, because the Zionists rejected the right of the Palestinians to self-determination and wanted Palestine for their own, to create a “Jewish State” in a region where Arabs were the majority and owned most of the land.

    For instance, after a series of riots in Jaffa in 1921 resulting in the deaths of 47 Jews and 48 Arabs, the occupying British held a commission of inquiry, which reported their finding that “there is no inherent anti-Semitism in the country, racial or religious.” Rather, Arab attacks on Jewish communities were the result of Arab fears about the stated goal of the Zionists to take over the land.

    After major violence again erupted in 1929, the British Shaw Commission report noted that “In less than 10 years three serious attacks have been made by Arabs on Jews. For 80 years before the first of these attacks there is no recorded instance of any similar incidents.” Representatives from all sides of the emerging conflict testified to the commission that prior to the First World War, “the Jews and Arabs lived side by side if not in amity, at least with tolerance, a quality which today is almost unknown in Palestine.” The problem was that “The Arab people of Palestine are today united in their demand for representative government”, but were being denied that right by the Zionists and their British benefactors.

    The British Hope-Simpson report of 1930 similarly noted that Jewish residents of non-Zionist communities in Palestine enjoyed friendship with their Arab neighbors. “It is quite a common sight to see an Arab sitting in the verandah of a Jewish house”, the report noted. “The position is entirely different in the Zionist colonies.”

    Myth #2 – The United Nations created Israel.

    The U.N. became involved when the British sought to wash its hands of the volatile situation its policies had helped to create, and to extricate itself from Palestine. To that end, they requested that the U.N. take up the matter.

    As a result, a U.N. Special Commission on Palestine (UNSCOP) was created to examine the issue and offer its recommendation on how to resolve the conflict. UNSCOP contained no representatives from any Arab country and in the end issued a report that explicitly rejected the right of the Palestinians to self-determination. Rejecting the democratic solution to the conflict, UNSCOP instead proposed that Palestine be partitioned into two states: one Arab and one Jewish.

    The U.N. General Assembly endorsed UNSCOP’s in its Resolution 181. It is often claimed that this resolution “partitioned” Palestine, or that it provided Zionist leaders with a legal mandate for their subsequent declaration of the existence of the state of Israel, or some other similar variation on the theme. All such claims are absolutely false.

    Resolution 181 merely endorsed UNSCOP’s report and conclusions as a recommendation. Needless to say, for Palestine to have been officially partitioned, this recommendation would have had to have been accepted by both Jews and Arabs, which it was not.

    Moreover, General Assembly resolutions are not considered legally binding (only Security Council resolutions are). And, furthermore, the U.N. would have had no authority to take land from one people and hand it over to another, and any such resolution seeking to so partition Palestine would have been null and void, anyway.

    Myth #3 – The Arabs missed an opportunity to have their own state in 1947.

    The U.N. recommendation to partition Palestine was rejected by the Arabs. Many commentators today point to this rejection as constituting a missed “opportunity” for the Arabs to have had their own state. But characterizing this as an “opportunity” for the Arabs is patently ridiculous. The Partition plan was in no way, shape, or form an “opportunity” for the Arabs.

    First of all, as already noted, Arabs were a large majority in Palestine at the time, with Jews making up about a third of the population by then, due to massive immigration of Jews from Europe (in 1922, by contrast, a British census showed that Jews represented only about 11 percent of the population).

    Additionally, land ownership statistics from 1945 showed that Arabs owned more land than Jews in every single district of Palestine, including Jaffa, where Arabs owned 47 percent of the land while Jews owned 39 percent – and Jaffa boasted the highest percentage of Jewish-owned land of any district. In other districts, Arabs owned an even larger portion of the land. At the extreme other end, for instance, in Ramallah, Arabs owned 99 percent of the land. In the whole of Palestine, Arabs owned 85 percent of the land, while Jews owned less than 7 percent, which remained the case up until the time of Israel’s creation.

    Yet, despite these facts, the U.N. partition recommendation had called for more than half of the land of Palestine to be given to the Zionists for their “Jewish State”. The truth is that no Arab could be reasonably expected to accept such an unjust proposal. For political commentators today to describe the Arabs’ refusal to accept a recommendation that their land be taken away from them, premised upon the explicit rejection of their right to self-determination, as a “missed opportunity” represents either an astounding ignorance of the roots of the conflict or an unwillingness to look honestly at its history.

    It should also be noted that the partition plan was also rejected by many Zionist leaders. Among those who supported the idea, which included David Ben-Gurion, their reasoning was that this would be a pragmatic step towards their goal of acquiring the whole of Palestine for a “Jewish State” – something which could be finally accomplished later through force of arms.

    When the idea of partition was first raised years earlier, for instance, Ben-Gurion had written that “after we become a strong force, as the result of the creation of a state, we shall abolish partition and expand to the whole of Palestine”. Partition should be accepted, he argued, “to prepare the ground for our expansion into the whole of Palestine”. The Jewish State would then “have to preserve order”, if the Arabs would not acquiesce, “by machine guns, if necessary.”
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    Jul 26, 2010 4:53 AM GMT
    Myth #4 – Israel has a “right to exist”.

    The fact that this term is used exclusively with regard to Israel is instructive as to its legitimacy, as is the fact that the demand is placed upon Palestinians to recognize Israel’s “right to exist”, while no similar demand is placed upon Israelis to recognize the “right to exist” of a Palestinian state.

    Nations don’t have rights, people do. The proper framework for discussion is within that of the right of all peoples to self-determination. Seen in this, the proper framework, it is an elementary observation that it is not the Arabs which have denied Jews that right, but the Jews which have denied that right to the Arabs. The terminology of Israel’s “right to exist” is constantly employed to obfuscate that fact.

    As already noted, Israel was not created by the U.N., but came into being on May 14, 1948, when the Zionist leadership unilaterally, and with no legal authority, declared Israel’s existence, with no specification as to the extent of the new state’s borders. In a moment, the Zionists had declared that Arabs no longer the owners of their land – it now belonged to the Jews. In an instant, the Zionists had declared that the majority Arabs of Palestine were now second-class citizens in the new “Jewish State”.

    The Arabs, needless to say, did not passively accept this development, and neighboring Arab countries declared war on the Zionist regime in order to prevent such a grave injustice against the majority inhabitants of Palestine.

    It must be emphasized that the Zionists had no right to most of the land they declared as part of Israel, while the Arabs did. This war, therefore, was not, as is commonly asserted in mainstream commentary, an act of aggression by the Arab states against Israel. Rather, the Arabs were acting in defense of their rights, to prevent the Zionists from illegally and unjustly taking over Arab lands and otherwise disenfranchising the Arab population. The act of aggression was the Zionist leadership’s unilateral declaration of the existence of Israel, and the Zionists’ use of violence to enforce their aims both prior to and subsequent to that declaration.

    In the course of the war that ensued, Israel implemented a policy of ethnic cleansing. 700,000 Arab Palestinians were either forced from their homes or fled out of fear of further massacres, such as had occurred in the village of Deir Yassin shortly before the Zionist declaration. These Palestinians have never been allowed to return to their homes and land, despite it being internationally recognized and encoded in international law that such refugees have an inherent “right of return”.

    Palestinians will never agree to the demand made of them by Israel and its main benefactor, the U.S., to recognize Israel’s “right to exist”. To do so is effectively to claim that Israel had a “right” to take Arab land, while Arabs had no right to their own land. It is effectively to claim that Israel had a “right” to ethnically cleanse Palestine, while Arabs had no right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness in their own homes, on their own land.

    The constant use of the term “right to exist” in discourse today serves one specific purpose: It is designed to obfuscate the reality that it is the Jews that have denied the Arab right to self-determination, and not vice versa, and to otherwise attempt to legitimize Israeli crimes against the Palestinians, both historical and contemporary.
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    Jul 26, 2010 4:54 AM GMT
    Myth #5 – The Arab nations threatened Israel with annihilation in 1967 and 1973.

    The fact of the matter is that it was Israel that fired the first shot of the “Six Day War”. Early on the morning of June 5, Israel launched fighters in a surprise attack on Egypt (then the United Arab Republic), and successfully decimated the Egyptian air force while most of its planes were still on the ground.

    It is virtually obligatory for this attack to be described by commentators today as “preemptive”. But to have been “preemptive”, by definition, there must have been an imminent threat of Egyptian aggression against Israel. Yet there was none.

    It is commonly claimed that President Nasser’s bellicose rhetoric, blockade of the Straits of Tiran, movement of troops into the Sinai Peninsula, and expulsion of U.N. peacekeeping forces from its side of the border collectively constituted such an imminent threat.

    Yet, both U.S. and Israeli intelligence assessed at the time that the likelihood Nasser would actually attack was low. The CIA assessed that Israel had overwhelming superiority in force of arms, and would, in the event of a war, defeat the Arab forces within two weeks; within a week if Israel attacked first, which is what actually occurred.

    It must be kept in mind that Egypt had been the victim of aggression by the British, French, and Israelis in the 1954 “Suez Crisis”, following Egypt’s nationalization of the Suez Canal. In that war, the three aggressor nations conspired to wage war upon Egypt, which resulted in an Israeli occupation of the Sinai Peninsula. Under U.S. pressure, Israel withdrew from the Sinai in 1957, but Egypt had not forgotten the Israeli aggression.

    Moreover, Egypt had formed a loose alliance with Syria and Jordan, with each pledging to come to the aid of the others in the event of a war with Israel. Jordan had criticized Nasser for not living up to that pledge after the Israeli attack on West Bank village of Samu the year before, and his rhetoric was a transparent attempt to regain face in the Arab world.

    That Nasser’s positioning was defensive, rather than projecting an intention to wage an offensive against Israel, was well recognized among prominent Israelis. As Avraham Sela of the Shalem Center has observed, “The Egyptian buildup in Sinai lacked a clear offensive plan, and Nasser’s defensive instructions explicitly assumed an Israeli first strike.”

    Israeli Prime Minister Menachem Begin acknowledged that “In June 1967, we again had a choice. The Egyptian army concentrations in the Sinai approaches do not prove that Nasser was really about to attack us. We must be honest with ourselves. We decided to attack him.”

    Yitzhak Rabin, who would also later become Prime Minister of Israel, admitted in 1968 that “I do not think Nasser wanted war. The two divisions he sent to the Sinai would not have been sufficient to launch an offensive war. He knew it and we knew it.”

    Israelis have also acknowledged that their own rhetoric at the time about the “threat” of “annihilation” from the Arab states was pure propaganda.

    General Chaim Herzog, commanding general and first military governor of the occupied West Bank following the war, admitted that “There was no danger of annihilation. Israeli headquarters never believed in this danger.”

    General Ezer Weizman similarly said, “There was never a danger of extermination. This hypothesis had never been considered in any serious meeting.”

    Chief of Staff Haim Bar-Lev acknowledged, “We were not threatened with genocide on the eve of the Six-Day War, and we had never thought of such possibility.”

    Israeli Minister of Housing Mordechai Bentov has also acknowledged that “The entire story of the danger of extermination was invented in every detail, and exaggerated a posteriori to justify the annexation of new Arab territory.”

    In 1973, in what Israelis call the “Yom Kippur War”, Egypt and Syria launched a surprise offensive to retake the Sinai and the Golan Heights, respectively. This joint action is popularly described in contemporaneous accounts as an “invasion” of or act of “aggression” against Israel.

    Yet, as already noted, following the June ‘67 war, the U.N. Security Council passed resolution 242 calling upon Israel to withdraw from the occupied territories. Israel, needless to say, refused to do so and has remained in perpetual violation of international law ever since.

    During the 1973 war, Egypt and Syria thus “invaded” their own territory, then under illegal occupation by Israel. The corollary of the description of this war as an act of Arab aggression implicitly assumes that the Sinai Peninsula, Golan Heights, West Bank, and Gaza Strip were Israeli territory. This is, needless to say, a grossly false assumption that demonstrates the absolutely prejudicial and biased nature of mainstream commentary when it comes to the Israeli-Arab conflict.

    This false narrative fits in with the larger overall narrative, equally fallacious, of Israeli as the “victim” of Arab intransigence and aggression. This narrative, largely unquestioned in the West, flips reality on its head.

    Myth #6 – U.N. Security Council Resolution 242 called only for a partial Israeli withdrawal.

    Resolution 242 was passed in the wake of the June ‘67 war and called for the “Withdrawal of Israel armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict.” While the above argument enjoys widespread popularity, it has no merit whatsoever.

    The central thesis of this argument is that the absence of the word “the” before “occupied territories” in that clause means not “all of the occupied territories” were intended. Essentially, this argument rests upon the ridiculous logic that because the word “the” was omitted from the clause, we may therefore understand this to mean that “some of the occupied territories” was the intended meaning.

    Grammatically, the absence of the word “the” has no effect on the meaning of this clause, which refers to “territories”, plural. A simple litmus test question is: Is it territory that was occupied by Israel in the ‘67 war? If yes, then, under international law and Resolution 242, Israel is required to withdraw from that territory. Such territories include the Syrian Golan Heights, the West Bank, and the Gaza Strip.

    The French version of the resolution, equally authentic as the English, contains the definite article, and a majority of the members of the Security Council made clear during deliberations that their understanding of the resolution was that it would require Israel to fully withdraw from all occupied territories.

    Additionally, it is impossible to reconcile with the principle of international law cited in the preamble to the resolution, of “the inadmissibility of the acquisition of territory by war”. To say that the U.N. intended that Israel could retain some of the territory it occupied during the war would fly in the face of this cited principle.

    One could go on to address various other logical fallacies associated with this frivolous argument, but as it is absurd on its face, it would be superfluous to do so.
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    Jul 26, 2010 4:55 AM GMT
    Myth #7 – Israeli military action against its neighbors is only taken to defend itself against terrorism.

    The facts tell another story. Take, for instance, the devastating 1982 Israeli war on Lebanon. As political analyst Noam Chomsky extensively documents in his epic analysis “The Fateful Triangle”, this military offensive was carried out with barely even the thinnest veil of a pretext.

    While one may read contemporary accounts insisting this war was fought in response to a constant shelling of northern Israeli by the PLO, then based in Lebanon, the truth is that, despite continuous Israeli provocations, the PLO had with only a few exceptions abided by a cease-fire that had been in place. Moreover, in each of those instances, it was Israel that had first violated the cease-fire.

    Among the Israeli provocations, throughout early 1982, it attacked and sank Lebanese fishing boats and otherwise committed hundreds of violations of Lebanese territorial waters. It committed thousands of violations of Lebanese airspace, yet never did manage to provoke the PLO response it sought to serve as the casus belli for the planned invasion of Lebanon.

    On May 9, Israel bombed Lebanon, an act that was finally met with a PLO response when it launched rocket and artillery fire into Israel.

    Then a terrorist group headed by Abu Nidal attempted to assassinate Israeli Ambassador Shlomo Argov in London. Although the PLO itself had been at war with Abu Nidal, who had been condemned to death by a Fatah military tribunal in 1973, and despite the fact that Abu Nidal was not based in Lebanon, Israel cited this event as a pretext to bomb the Sabra and Shatila refugee camps, killing 200 Palestinians. The PLO responded by shelling settlements in northern Israel. Yet Israel did not manage to provoke the kind of larger-scale response it was looking to use as a casus belli for its planned invasion.

    As Israeli scholar Yehoshua Porath has suggested, Israel’s decision to invade Lebanon, far from being a response to PLO attacks, rather “flowed from the very fact that the cease-fire had been observed”. Writing in the Israeli daily Haaretz, Porath assessed that “The government’s hope is that the stricken PLO, lacking a logistic and territorial base, will return to its earlier terrorism…. In this way, the PLO will lose part of the political legitimacy that it has gained … undercutting the danger that elements will develop among the Palestinians that might become a legitimate negotiating partner for future political accommodations.”

    As another example, take Israel’s Operation Cast Lead from December 27, 2008 to January 18, 2009. Prior to Israel’s assault on the besieged and defenseless population of the Gaza Strip, Israel had entered into a cease-fire agreement with the governing authority there, Hamas. Contrary to popular myth, it was Israel, not Hamas, who ended the cease-fire.

    The pretext for Operation Cast Lead is obligatorily described in Western media accounts as being the “thousands” of rockets that Hamas had been firing into Israel prior to the offensive, in violation of the cease-fire.

    The truth is that from the start of the cease-fire in June until November 4, Hamas fired no rockets, despite numerous provocations from Israel, including stepped-up operations in the West Bank and Israeli soldiers taking pop-shots at Gazans across the border, resulting in several injuries and at least one death.

    On November 4, it was again Israel who violated the cease-fire, with airstrikes and a ground invasion of Gaza that resulted in further deaths. Hamas finally responded with rocket fire, and from that point on the cease-fire was effectively over, with daily tit-for-tat attacks from both sides.

    Despite Israel’s lack of good faith, Hamas offered to renew the cease-fire from the time it was set to officially expire in December. Israel rejected the offer, preferring instead to inflict violent collective punishment on the people of Gaza.

    As the Israeli Intelligence and Terrorism Information Center noted, the truce “brought relative quiet to the western Negev population”, with 329 rocket and mortar attacks, “most of them during the month and a half after November 4″, when Israel had violated and effectively ended the truce. This stands in remarkable contrast to the 2,278 rocket and mortar attacks in the six months prior to the truce. Until November 4, the center also observed, “Hamas was careful to maintain the ceasefire.”

    If Israel had desired to continue to mitigate the threat of Palestinian militant rocket attacks, it would have simply not ended the cease-fire, which was very highly effective in reducing the number of such attacks, including eliminating all such attacks by Hamas. It would not have instead resorted to violence, predictably resulting in a greatly escalated threat of retaliatory rocket and mortar attacks from Palestinian militant groups.

    Moreover, even if Israel could claim that peaceful means had been exhausted and that a resort military force to act in self-defense to defend its civilian population was necessary, that is demonstrably not what occurred. Instead, Israel deliberately targeted the civilian population of Gaza with systematic and deliberate disproportionate and indiscriminate attacks on residential areas, hospitals, schools, and other locations with protected civilian status under international law.

    As the respected international jurist who headed up the United Nations investigation into the assault, Richard Goldstone, has observed, the means by which Israel carried out Operation Cast Lead were not consistent with its stated aims, but was rather more indicative of a deliberate act of collective punishment of the civilian population.
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    Jul 26, 2010 4:55 AM GMT
    Myth #8 – God gave the land to the Jews, so the Arabs are the occupiers.

    No amount of discussion of the facts on the ground will ever convince many Jews and Christians that Israel could ever do wrong, because they view its actions as having the hand of God behind it, and that its policies are in fact the will of God. They believe that God gave the land of Palestine, including the West Bank and Gaza Strip, to the Jewish people, and therefore Israel has a “right” to take it by force from the Palestinians, who, in this view, are the wrongful occupiers of the land.

    But one may simply turn to the pages of their own holy books to demonstrate the fallaciousness of this or similar beliefs. Christian Zionists are fond of quoting passages from the Bible such as the following to support their Zionist beliefs:

    “And Yahweh said to Abram, after Lot had separated from him: ‘Lift your eyes now and look from the place where you are – northward, southward, eastward, and westward; for all the land which you see I give to you and your descendants forever. And I will make your descendants as the dust of the earth; so that if a man could number the dust of the earth, then your descendants could also be numbered. Arise, walk in the land through its length and its width, for I give it to you.” (Genesis 13:14-17)

    “Then Yahweh appeared to him and said: ‘Do not go down to Egypt; live in the land of which I shall tell you. Dwell in the land, and I will be with you and bless you; for to you and your descendants I give all these lands, and I will perform the oath which I swore to Abraham your father.” (Genesis 26: 1-3)

    “And behold, Yahweh stood above it and said: ‘I am Yahweh, God of Abraham your father, and the God of Isaac; the land on which you lie I will give to you and your descendants.” (Genesis 28:13)

    Yet Christian Zionists conveniently disregard other passages providing further context for understanding this covenant, such as the following:

    “You shall therefore keep all My statutes and all My judgments, and perform them, that the land where I am bringing you to dwell may not vomit you out.” (Leviticus 20:22)

    “But if you do not obey Me, and do not observe all these commandments … but break My covenant … I will bring the land to desolation, and your enemies who dwell in it shall be astonished at it. I will scatter you among the nations and draw out a sword after you; your land shall be desolate and your cities waste … You shall perish among the nations, and the land of your enemies shall eat you up.” (Leviticus 26: 14, 15, 32-33, 28 )

    “Therefore Yahweh was very angry with Israel, and removed them from His sight; there was none left but the tribe of Judah alone…. So Israel was carried away from their own land to Assyria, as it is to this day.” (2 Kings 17:18, 23)

    “And I said, after [Israel] had done all these things, ‘Return to Me.’ But she did not return. And her treacherous sister Judah saw it. Then I saw that for all the causes for which backsliding Israel had committed adultery, I had put her away and given her a certificate of divorce; yet her treacherous sister Judah did not fear, but went and played the harlot also.” (Jeremiah 3: 7-8 )

    Yes, in the Bible, Yahweh, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Israel, told the Hebrews that the land could be theirs – if they would obey his commandments. Yet, as the Bible tells the story, the Hebrews were rebellious against Yahweh in all their generations.

    What Jewish and Christian Zionists omit from their Biblical arguments in favor of continued Israel occupation is that Yahweh also told the Hebrews, including the tribe of Judah (from whom the “Jews” are descended), that he would remove them from the land if they broke the covenant by rebelling against his commandments, which is precisely what occurs in the Bible.

    Thus, the theological argument for Zionism is not only bunk from a secular point of view, but is also a wholesale fabrication from a scriptural perspective, representing a continued rebelliousness against Yahweh and his Torah, and the teachings of Yeshua the Messiah (Jesus the Christ) in the New Testament.

    Myth #9 – Palestinians reject the two-state solution because they want to destroy Israel.

    In an enormous concession to Israel, Palestinians have long accepted the two-state solution. The elected representatives of the Palestinian people in Yasser Arafat’s Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO) had since the 70s recognized the state of Israel and accepted the two-state solution to the conflict. Despite this, Western media continued through the 90s to report that the PLO rejected this solution and instead wanted to wipe Israel off the map.

    The pattern has been repeated since Hamas was voted into power in the 2006 Palestinian elections. Although Hamas has for years accepted the reality of the state of Israel and demonstrated a willingness to accept a Palestinian state in the West Bank and Gaza Strip alongside Israel, it is virtually obligatory for Western mainstream media, even today, to report that Hamas rejects the two-state solution, that it instead seeks “to destroy Israel”.

    In fact, in early 2004, shortly before he was assassinated by Israel, Hamas founder Sheik Ahmed Yassin said that Hamas could accept a Palestinian state alongside Israel. Hamas has since repeatedly reiterated its willingness to accept a two-state solution.

    In early 2005, Hamas issued a document stating its goal of seeking a Palestinian state alongside Israel and recognizing the 1967 borders.

    The exiled head of the political bureau of Hamas, Khalid Mish’al, wrote in the London Guardian in January 2006 that Hamas was “ready to make a just peace”. He wrote that “We shall never recognize the right of any power to rob us of our land and deny us our national rights…. But if you are willing to accept the principle of a long-term truce, we are prepared to negotiate the terms.”

    During the campaigning for the 2006 elections, the top Hamas official in Gaza, Mahmoud al-Zahar said that Hamas was ready to “accept to establish our independent state on the area occupied [in] ‘67″, a tacit recognition of the state of Israel.

    The elected prime minister from Hamas, Ismail Haniyeh, said in February 2006 that Hamas accepted “the establishment of a Palestinian state” within the “1967 borders”.

    In April 2008, former U.S. President Jimmy Carter met with Hamas officials and afterward stated that Hamas “would accept a Palestinian state on the 1967 borders” and would “accept the right of Israel to live as a neighbor next door in peace”. It was Hamas’ “ultimate goal to see Israel living in their allocated borders, the 1967 borders, and a contiguous, vital Palestinian state alongside.”

    That same month Hamas leader Meshal said, “We have offered a truce if Israel withdraws to the 1967 borders, a truce of 10 years as a proof of recognition.”

    In 2009, Meshal said that Hamas “has accepted a Palestinian state on the 1967 borders”.

    Hamas’ shift in policy away from total rejection of the existence of the state of Israel towards acceptance of the international consensus on a two-state solution to the conflict is in no small part a reflection of the will of the Palestinian public. A public opinion survey from April of last year, for instance, found that three out of four Palestinians were willing to accept a two-state solution.
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    Jul 26, 2010 4:57 AM GMT
    Myth #10 – The U.S. is an honest broker and has sought to bring about peace in the Middle East.

    Rhetoric aside, the U.S. supports Israel’s policies, including its illegal occupation and other violations of international humanitarian law. It supports Israel’s criminal policies financially, militarily, and diplomatically.

    The Obama administration, for example, stated publically that it was opposed to Israel’s settlement policy and ostensibly “pressured” Israel to freeze colonization activities. Yet very early on, the administration announced that it would not cut back financial or military aid to Israel, even if it defied international law and continued settlement construction. That message was perfectly well understood by the Netanyahu government in Israel, which continued its colonization policies.

    To cite another straightforward example, both the U.S. House of Representatives and the Senate passed resolutions openly declaring support for Israel’s Operation Cast Lead, despite a constant stream of reports evidencing Israeli war crimes.

    On the day the U.S. Senate passed its resolution “reaffirming the United States’ strong support for Israel in its battle with Hamas” (January 8, 2009), the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) issued a statement demanding that Israel allow it to assist victims of the conflict because the Israeli military had blocked access to wounded Palestinians – a war crime under international law.

    That same day, U.N. Secretary General Ban Ki-moon issued a statement condemning Israel for firing on a U.N. aid convoy delivering humanitarian supplies to Gaza and for the killing of two U.N. staff members – both further war crimes.

    On the day that the House passed its own version of the resolution, the U.N. announced that it had had to stop humanitarian work in Gaza because of numerous incidents in which its staff, convoys, and installations, including clinics and schools, had come under Israeli attack.

    U.S. financial support for Israel surpasses $3 billion annually. When Israel waged a war to punish the defenseless civilian population of Gaza, its pilots flew U.S.-made F-16 fighter-bombers and Apache helicopter gunships, dropping U.S.-made bombs, including the use of white phosphorus munitions in violation of international law.

    U.S. diplomatic support for Israeli crimes includes its use of the veto power in the U.N. Security Council. When Israel was waging a devastating war against the civilian population and infrastructure of Lebanon in the summer of 2006, the U.S. vetoed a cease-fire resolution.

    As Israel was waging Operation Cast Lead, the U.S. delayed the passage of a resolution calling for an end to the violence, and then abstained rather than criticize Israel once it finally allowed the resolution to be put to a vote.

    When the U.N. Human Rights Council officially adopted the findings and recommendations of its investigation into war crimes during Operation Cast Lead, headed up by Richard Goldstone, the U.S. responded by announcing its intention to block any effort to have the Security Council similarly adopt its conclusions and recommendations. The U.S. Congress passed a resolution rejecting the Goldstone report because it found that Israel had committed war crimes.

    Through its virtually unconditional support for Israel, the U.S. has effectively blocked any steps to implement the two-state solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. The so-called “peace process” has for many decades consisted of U.S. and Israeli rejection Palestinian self-determination and blocking of any viable Palestinian state.
  • Webster666

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    Jul 26, 2010 8:56 AM GMT
    Hey, it's Palestinian propaganda 101, as taught to every generation of Palestinian children so that they can grow up and carry on their glorious tradition of suffering and dying for their hopeless cause.

    "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing again and again, and expecting a different outcome."

    The Palestinians decided, "We'll show Israel. We'll elect a terrorist organization to run our country.
    Yeh, that'll show 'em !"
    How's that working out for you guys ?

    Meanwhile, the United States keeps the billions of dollars a year flowing into Israel to ensure her strong defense and perpetuity.



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    Jul 26, 2010 11:11 AM GMT
    Funny I clicked on this thread and can't see anything except for Webster666 posts. It must be saturated with Palestinian terrorist sympathizers. icon_lol.gif Glad I clicked "ignore" on all of them.
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    Jul 26, 2010 2:48 PM GMT
    Pouncer saidI knew it was all coming from somewhere, because 90% of [C4's] posts (the non-insulting parts) are almost all quotes that can be traced by a Google search.

    Given C4's frequent use of cites when I read IanCT's obvious cut & paste job I was inspired by the above unfounded July 11th accusation from Pouncer ( to do my own google search on the "myths" and came up with lots of hits including:

    It'll be interesting to see if Pouncer calls out IanCT for implying his authorship by not citing the source of this thread and even more surprising if southbeach chastises him for wasting RJ server space with ten lengthy posts on an article that could've been referenced in one post in a single link. While there may be some validity to the article just because something is widely circulated all over the internet doesn't mean it's true, and personally attacking C4 in the headline by attributing these "myths" to him to generate more views is plain tacky.

    When I saw this July 10th post ( sxydrkhair's frequent supportive posts mere minutes after IanCTs posts made even more sense. Guys, IF you're childhood friends supporting each other that's cool but without disclosing this relationship in the context of these threads it smacks of collusion and additional bias - and that's definitely NOT cool.

    At the risk of reviving this chestnut, this "myth" thread underscores the hypocrisy of
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14062

    Jul 26, 2010 11:06 PM GMT
    IanCT, Those are some very good and valid points about the Palestinians and their right to their lands that are now occupied by the US backed terrorist nation of Israel. This is a pleasant contrast to all the pro-Israeli drivel that has been polluting the realjock forums as of late.
  • Webster666

    Posts: 9217

    Jul 27, 2010 1:40 AM GMT
    roadbikeRob saidIanCT, Those are some very good and valid points about the Palestinians and their right to their lands that are now occupied by the US backed terrorist nation of Israel. This is a pleasant contrast to all the pro-Israeli drivel that has been polluting the realjock forums as of late.

    A) They're not valid points. They're someone's bigoted slant on history.

    B) Israel is here, today.

    C) Israel will be here, tomorrow.

    D) Israel will be here, forever.

    E) So, stop your whining and get used to it.

    Israel didn't choose the Palestinian's fate.

    The Palestinians chose their own fate.

    The Palestinians could have had their own country, peacefully coexisting with Israel.

    But, the Palestinians insisted on all or nothing.

    So, they got nothing.


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    Jul 27, 2010 2:45 AM GMT
    Webster666 said
    roadbikeRob saidIanCT, Those are some very good and valid points about the Palestinians and their right to their lands that are now occupied by the US backed terrorist nation of Israel. This is a pleasant contrast to all the pro-Israeli drivel that has been polluting the realjock forums as of late.

    A) They're not valid points. They're someone's bigoted slant on history.

    B) Israel is here, today.

    C) Israel will be here, tomorrow.

    D) Israel will be here, forever.

    E) So, stop your whining and get used to it.

    Israel didn't choose the Palestinian's fate.

    The Palestinians chose their own fate.

    The Palestinians could have had their own country, peacefully coexisting with Israel.

    But, the Palestinians insisted on all or nothing.

    So, they got nothing.


    Absolutely correct (hey - away from the conserv/lib threads, I agree with just about everything you write)
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    Jul 27, 2010 5:58 AM GMT
    sxydrkhair said
    Funny how pro-Zionist never mention anything about "Halachic state" or "State of Judea" in the West Bank. And not even one Israeli like C4 mention Ami Popper.

    That will never happen. State of Judea
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    Jul 27, 2010 10:40 AM GMT
    Why are there so many Palestinian thread terrorists in this thread?
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14062

    Jul 28, 2010 9:49 PM GMT
    Webster666, man you are full of shit. The Palestinians did not choose their fate, Israel is the culprit that sealed their fate with its land grabbing and violent, imperialistic behavior. Israel is largely to blame for the horrendous mess on the Palestinians homelands. As for Israel having the right to exist, that is getting much less true everyday.
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14062

    Jul 28, 2010 9:52 PM GMT
    JB82, Because idiot sycophants like you and Webster666 both need to be educated about the harsh truth regarding Israel and its unlawful hatred and military brutality towards the Palestinian people.
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    Jul 29, 2010 4:30 AM GMT
    JB82 saidWhy are there so many Palestinian thread terrorists in this thread?

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    Jul 29, 2010 4:35 AM GMT
    IanCT spam propaganda topic title> C4's Myths

    Isn't it odd that nowhere am I quoted?
    This is just more of the same propaganda ping-pong between IanCT and sxydrkhair.

    OK, so let's deconstruct that falsehoods that are posted in response to the straw man "myths":

    > Arabs were a majority in Palestine prior to the creation of the state of Israel

    1A. Jews were a majority in the area allocated to the Jewish state by UNGAR 181, the UN partition compromise of 1947.

    > For the most part, Jewish Palestinians got along with their Arab neighbors. This began to change with the onset of the Zionist movement

    1B1. Jews were always treated as "dhimmi" under an offical system of apartheid under Arab/Muslim rule and faced routine persecution in "Palestine" long before the advent of the modern Zionist movement.

    1B2. In 1660, the entire Jewish community of Jerusalem was massacred by their Arab neighbors.

    1B3. In 1674, the Jesuit Father Michael Naud wrote that Jews were "paying heavily to the Turk for their right to stay here.... They prefer being prisoners in Jerusalem to enjoying the freedom they could acquire elsewhere... The love of the Jews for the Holy Land... is unbelievable."

    1B4. In the 18th century, Johannes van Egmont and John Hayman wrote that oppression was so great that Jews "pay for the very air they breathe."

    1B5. In 1834 the inhabitants of eastern "Palestine" (today's Jordan) crossed the Jordan River to join natives of Nablus, Hebron, and Bethlehem, 40,000 of them rushed on Jerusalem and looted the city for 5 days where the Jews (who by then had already regained a plurality) had their homes sacked and their women raped.

    1B6. Between 1848 - 1878, before the advent of modern Zionism, scores of incidents involving anti-Jewish violence, persecution, and extortions filled page after page of documented reports from the British Consulate in Jerusalem.

    1B7. Indeed, it was due to intolerance on the part of the Arab Muslims that the European powers got involved to protect minorities (e.g. the French supporting the Maronite Christians in Lebanon).

    1B8. Sheik Sulayman al-Taji, a leading Palestinian notable, declared in a poem in 1913: "Jews, sons of clinking gold ... are the weakest of all peoples and the least of them." That well before the Balfour Declaration.

    1B9. The Hamas Covenant, according to Benny Morris, "described 'the Jews' as 'an instrument of evil'; and it ascribes the outbreak of the French and Russian revolutions, the fall of the Ottoman Empire, and the eruption of World War I and World War II to Jewish machinations. The 'Covenant' posits the destruction of Israel as the organization's main political goal, and jihad as its method. Hamas (and Islamic Jihad) pamphlets during the first intifada, from 1987 to 1991, regularly described the Jews as 'sons of apes and pigs.'"

    1B10. Indeed, the Covenant sites Islamic lore: "The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him."

    1B11. Note the tacit admission that the people living here prior to the 20th century were not "Palestinians" but ARABS!

    > the Zionists rejected the right of the Palestinians to self-determination and wanted Palestine for their own, to create a “Jewish State”

    1C1. The Zionists accepted Arab self-determination. First (1922-23) in the eastern/Trans-Jordanian 78% of Mandate Palestine.

    1C2. In 1937 the Jewish Agency accepted the principle of partition suggested by the Peel Commission. The Arabs rejected it the proposal which would have established a Jewish and Arab state.

    1C3. In 1947 "the Zionists" accepted Palestian Arabs self-determination and state-hood in nearly half of the 22% of western Mandate Palestine that was allocated to the Jews in the prior partition.

    1C4. Jews were left with only 12% of "historic Palestine" (the Latin/European name for the Land of Israel) - and even that was too much for the Arabs to accept.

    1C5. Rather than establish another Arab state in "Palestine", in late 1947 and 1948 the Arabs attacked Israel, seeking to destroy it, threatening a "momentous massacre" and to "throw the Jews into the sea".

    1C6. Arabs ended up controlling 98.75% of the Ottoman Levant (mideast). The problem isn't that "the Zionists" reject this but that the Arabs rejected (and continue to reject) Jewish self-determination on 1.25% of the mideast, on a mere 12% of the historic Jewish homeland.

    > in a region where Arabs were the majority and owned most of the land.

    Again (see 1A), Arabs were not a majority in the 12% allocated to the Jewish state in 1947

    1D1. We've already seen that the "majority" of land was not privately owned.

    1D2. Resident Arabs only owned 3.3% of the land.

    All this from just IanCT's first propaganda PARAGRAPH.

    Given the history of these discussions, I think we all know that no one will even attempt to dispute these points.
    Instead we'll see new anti-Israel spam propaganda.
    Yet given the massive "errors" (falsehoods) in just the first paragraph, I think it can all safely be ignored.

    (If anyone has any questions about the rest of the nonsense posted or would like me to respond to something specific, please ask.)
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14062

    Sep 09, 2010 10:54 PM GMT
    I am really surprised that Caesarea4 hasn't gotten all bent out of shape over the actual truth about Israel's history and relationships with the Palestinian people. I was expecting endless tirades and propaganda from ol' C47 attempting to refute all the proven facts with his lies.
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    Sep 17, 2010 5:26 AM GMT
    Samxr just told me in an email that he has bad memory, so I suppose that might explain why he constantly "forgets" inconvenient facts and regurgitates his spam propaganda. (And justifies what I've called the "Memento" effect.)

    SDH> Myth: Former President Bill Clinton mediated an offer made by former Prime Minster Barak and gave "91 percent" of the West Bank to Arafat.

    As discussed in this topic:

    In search of a solution to the Arab-Israeli conflict: UNSCR 242, Oslo and Camp David/Taba
    (Or: I support the Clinton COMPROMISE parameters. Do you?!)

    Ahmed Qureia (Abu Ala), the former PA Prime Minister, admits that at Camp David the Arabs were offered not just 85% but 91% of the West Bank. (At Taba, this figure increased to 95% - in addition to 133% of Gaza.)
    the territorial concessions contemplated by Barak at Camp David -- to cede 91 percent of the West Bank to Arafat...

    Former PA Prime Minister and current President Abu Mazen (quoted from Al-Ayyam (PA) July 29, 2001) also admitted the 95% figure at Taba and rejected the paradigm of compromise:
    Regarding the proposals which came up following Camp David, and specifically with regard to what was termed the Clinton Proposal... When they say: "We offered you ninety-five percent," I'm asking: "Why not one hundred percent?"

    Note how I am quoting PRIMARY sources - people who were there during the negotiations.
    samxr doesn't tell us who his "sources" are, and he hides them for good reason.
    (Or, at best, it's "some random Jew said...", as if that's a qualification, a la "a 'cured' homosexual said....")

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    Sep 17, 2010 8:01 AM GMT
    sxydrkhair> What about East Jerusalem?

    Jerusalem is the subject of this topic:

    You were alleging that there was a "myth" of 91% in the Clinton compromise parameters, yet both Ahmed Qureia (Abu Ala, the former PA Prime Minister) and Mahmoud Abbas (Abu Mazen, the current President of the PA) - both of them primary sources present at the negotiations - have admitted figures of not only 91% but also 95%.

    So whose "myth" was exposed, mine or yours?
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    Sep 18, 2010 6:00 AM GMT
    As usual, samxr can't help but contradict himself:

    sdh 1> Myth: Former President Bill Clinton mediated an offer made by former Prime Minster Barak and gave "91 percent" of the West Bank to Arafat.

    sdh 2> "Barak offered to form a Palestinian State initially on 73% of the West Bank (that is, 27% less than the Green Line borders) and 100% of the Gaza Strip. In 10-25 years, the Palestinian state would expand to 90-91% of the West Bank (94% excluding greater Jerusalem)."

    In other words, you have just confirmed that Barak did offer to withdraw from 90-91% of Trans/Jordan's former so-called "West Bank".
    (94% if you consider the WB as discrete from Jerusalem, which it is.)

    Not content with that failure, he persists:

    sdh 3> No where said "95%" that is your lie.

    As noted, the 95% figure was at Taba, not Camp David, and was confirmed by Mahmoud Abbas (Abu Mazen, then a former PA Prime Minister, now the chairman of the PLO and the President of the PA).

    sdh 4> all of Israel used to be Palestinian land

    Once again samxr shows how little regard he has for the truth and how he doesn't hestitate to whore himself for the cause with his blatant lies.

    "Palestine" is the Latin/European name for Eretz Yisrael, the Jewish homeland
    - and Arab denials of the existence of "Palestine".
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    Sep 18, 2010 9:12 AM GMT
    SDH> Barak offer 91% of the West Bank to the Palestinians.

    Yes, that's true, and you've proven it.

    SDH> It said "10-25 years the Palestinian state would expand to 90-91% of the West Bank (94% excluding greater Jerusalem)." Ridiculous!

    That doesn't change the fact that 91% was offered.

    What is "ridiculous" about this?
    What time periods were involved in Panama and Hong Kong?

    The 10-25 is also wrong, it was over a period of 7 years.
    Could have been completed 3 years ago.

    So we see that samxr is unwilling to spend a few years building peace.
    Yet he's willing to waste generations squabbling and fighting.

    SDH> West Bank was never called "Tran Jordan". It was called the West Bank of Jordan, when Jordanian government occupied it.

    That's what I said. It was the so-called "West Bank" of Trans/Jordan.
    Trans-Jordan renamed itself as Jordan after annexing Judea & Samaria as its "West Bank".
    As you say, it is the "West Bank of Jordan".
    Why do you continue to call it "West Bank" if you deny that it is Jordan's?

    Did anyone consider it "occupied" between 1949-1967?

    the 95% figure was at Taba, not Camp David, and was confirmed by Mahmoud Abbas (Abu Mazen, then a former PA Prime Minister, now the chairman of the PLO and the President of the PA).

    SDH> Now Taba?

    Not "now", I said this from the start.

    SDH> According to ichad (Israeli human right group)

    ICHAD wasn't present at the negotiations.
    That they are an "Israeli... group" doesn't make them automatically right.

    Look, all 3 sides (American, Israeli and Palestinian Arabs) agree that the figure was 95%.
    The "problem" (as expressed by Abbas) is that this wasn't enough because it was less than 100% and thus entailed compromise from your side.

    Once again samxr shows how little regard he has for the truth and how he doesn't hestitate to whore himself for the cause with his blatant lies.

    SDH> Only person is lying is you.

    You are boring, too.

    From samxr's own Wikipedia source:
    During the 1948 Arab-Israeli War, the village [Suba] saw fierce fighting, due to its key location near the Jerusalem highway. In late 1947 and early 1948, irregular forces of the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood stationed in Suba took part in the fighting against Jewish forces, including attacks on Jewish traffic on the Tel Aviv-Jerusalem Road. The village was attacked several times by the Haganah, and finally conquered by the Palmach during the night of July 12–13 as part of Operation Danny. Most of the inhabitants had FLED during the fighting....

    What were Egyptian soldiers doing stationed in the village and attacking Jews already in "late 1947"?!
    As amply discussed in a topic about this subject, the Arabs had rejected the UN partition compromise and began the fighting:

    1947-1948: Arabs reject compromise and attack Israel