Sharia law: Be afaird. Be very afraid... Period

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    Jul 31, 2010 7:31 AM GMT

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    Jul 31, 2010 8:01 AM GMT
    oh you are so clever. I wanted to embed this in the islam thread in politics
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    Jul 31, 2010 9:40 AM GMT
    Oh for fuck´s sake. She is slighly center of left. mainstream in European politics. The guy on the video is more earnestly liberal than she.
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    Jul 31, 2010 10:04 AM GMT
    Good idea. No Sharia law. Although conservative Muslims won't be a threat to America until around 2050.
  • Hunter9

    Posts: 1039

    Jul 31, 2010 2:49 PM GMT
    i do think it's fair to say that islam, as practiced by it's more conservative branches, is a pretty fucked up religion.

    that said, so is christianity and judaism.
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    Jul 31, 2010 3:47 PM GMT
    False belief systems will continue to remain a clear and present danger to all of this.

    In parochial states, where Muslims are the majority, terrible atrocities are happening TODAY. It's important to continue to bear this in mind and we try to balance false belief systems, and their victims, against the rights of free society to not have to be forced to be submit to those false belief systems.

    It's imperative that we set limits on those false belief systems for the sake of rational people.
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    Jul 31, 2010 3:54 PM GMT
    Yawn
  • Sebastian18

    Posts: 255

    Jul 31, 2010 4:05 PM GMT
    Wow. Just wow. I wonder where Newtie Boy got the idea that Sharia Law would even be a viable option - let alone a realistic possibility in the United States. I'm pretty sure establishing such would violate the First Amendment, and with the consequences that would follow should it happen (as in a snow-ball's chance in Hell, getting struck twelve times by lightning on the way down and winning the lottery in all fifty states simultaneously) would violate pretty much the rest of the Constitution all the way down the line.

    This kind of fear-mongering really makes me ill, especially when it comes down to hypocritical religious arguments that make it "okay" for one radical form of wing-nuttery to push their agenda into politics (i.e. Radical Christianist Fundamentalism) but heaven forbid the Other (i.e. Moderate Christianity, Mainline Islam, Judaism, etc.) have a say in anything. The growing hatred of Islam in America is no better than the Anti-Catholic & Anti-Jewish sentiments that were (and in some cases still are) common in America at the turn of the 20th Century.

    If history is to be a precedent, neither Catholicism nor Judaism proved to be a major threat much less a major influence (outside of voting demographics) on American politics. Hopefully these Christianists realize at some point that their agenda will likewise not have any significant role overall in changing things into a Christocracy. I'm pretty sure, as mentioned above, we don't have anything to worry about with Sharia/Wahabi jurisprudence invading our shores anytime in the near future.
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    Jul 31, 2010 4:08 PM GMT
    i'm not worried about this happening here. i'm worried about the fact it exists all over africa and the middle east. the destabilizing effect it has there affects us here. but no, i'm not worried about it becoming the law here.
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    Jul 31, 2010 4:09 PM GMT
    You might do well to study the history of human rights in countries that are over 75% of a particular false belief system / religion.

    If you use history as a guide, it's a very real indicator of what could happen if a particular false belief system gains political control.

    Sebastian18, clearly you weren't thinking when you wrote your reply. E.g. Catholics have held up sex education, birth control, and medical research for DECADES, while many folks have suffered due to their influence, which is not guided by truth, and rationale, but, rather by doctrine with no basis in fact (a false belief system) which is blindly followed by the brainwashed victims (and they are victims). Other false belief systems / religions are purely vehicles of hate, manipulation, and intolerance, like it, or not.

    Those same false belief systems have caused a puritan-style, largely failed, for profit, criminal justice system in this country.

    False belief systems, even in small doses, are a plague upon society.
  • Sebastian18

    Posts: 255

    Jul 31, 2010 4:15 PM GMT
    @ DancerJack
    dancerjack saidi'm not worried about this happening here. i'm worried about the fact it exists all over africa and the middle east. the destabilizing effect it has there affects us here. but no, i'm not worried about it becoming the law here.


    I can definitely concede that it would and have a destabilizing effect both on the nations that have succumbed to it as well as to secular nations. However, like you said, it won't become law in the latter.

    @chuckystud
    chuckystud saidQUOTE AUTHOR GOES HERE[/cite]You might do well to study the history of human rights in countries that are over 75% of a particular false belief system / religion.


    Apart from being interested in your definition of false belief systems, the fact remains that Sharia principals are highly unlikely to become established in countries with strong, secular principals.
  • HndsmKansan

    Posts: 16311

    Jul 31, 2010 4:20 PM GMT
    Very interesting indeed! Thanks for sharing that...

    And Rachel is left, but not way left. Pretty awesome.
  • Sebastian18

    Posts: 255

    Jul 31, 2010 4:21 PM GMT
    chuckystud saidYou might do well to study the history of human rights in countries that are over 75% of a particular false belief system / religion.

    If you use history as a guide, it's a very real indicator of what could happen if a particular false belief system gains political control.

    Sebastian18, clearly you weren't thinking when you wrote your reply. E.g. Catholics have held up sex education, birth control, and medical research for DECADES, while many folks have suffered due to their influence, which is not guided by truth, and rationale, but, rather by doctrine with no basis in fact (a false belief system) which is blindly followed by the brainwashed victims (and they are victims). Other false belief systems / religions are purely vehicles of hat, manipulation, and intolerance, like it, or not.

    Those same false belief systems have caused a puritan-style, largely failed, for profit, criminal justice system in this country.

    False belief systems, even in small doses, are a plague upon society.


    It seems you got to the punch (in edit) before I did. I wouldn't say it's solely a Catholic fault - in fact there are numerous other Christian sects (and other) sects that believe in limiting sex-ed, birth control, etc. I'm definitely not going to defend them nor agree with their view, but that's more of a cultural effect than anything else. Religion (which I gather you define as subjectively false) does play a role on culture, but overall people and politics are a lot more moderate. Point remains that we will not have a nation controlled by Sharia law, much less a nation controlled by the Roman Curia or Halakha principals.
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    Jul 31, 2010 4:37 PM GMT
    Sebastian18> Sharia principals are highly unlikely to become established in countries with strong, secular principals.

    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article4749183.ece
    Islamic law has been officially adopted in Britain, with sharia courts given powers to rule on Muslim civil cases.

    Quite the interesting article. (:


  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14354

    Jul 31, 2010 4:45 PM GMT
    The sad truth is that all religions are based on fear, superstition, and ignorance. There is no viable scientific data that prove any religious beliefs to be true. The scary fact remains is that religious beliefs and falsehoods still have a powerful impact on the politics and public policies of most of the world.
  • Hunter9

    Posts: 1039

    Jul 31, 2010 5:17 PM GMT
    Chucky - despite the fact that we probably agree on most things pertaining to religion, using the term "false belief system" means nothing, rendering about 90% of your posts completely senseless. everybody has their own beliefs and values that are true to them. it's a TRUE belief system because they say it's true, whether it's true to you or not.

    in other words, your belief system is false to everyone else.

    you're on the right track, just find another phrase for christ/allah/moses sake
  • Thaer

    Posts: 82

    Jul 31, 2010 5:27 PM GMT
    Let’s see from the 57 countries of the organization of Islamic conference, how many implement sharia law …. Ohh only one… so I think the last think you should worry about is that if the sharia law will be implemented in the US because. I would say that they have to convince the rest of the 56 countries on implementing it, first .. … And I’m not talking about civil laws , I’m talking about laws that deals with specific punishment.
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    Jul 31, 2010 5:33 PM GMT
    Sebastian18 saidApart from being interested in your definition of false belief systems, the fact remains that Sharia principals are highly unlikely to become established in countries with strong, secular principals.

    One of those countries NOT being the US, of course, as the Christian fundamentals keep telling us. We are a CHRISTIAN country, under GOD, and NOT secular.

    And pasting from an older thread by GQjock, here's what Newt Gingrinch had to say on the subject on FOX News (where else?). So remember that, all you gay secular fascists, trying to undermine Sunday School teachings in these holy United States. The only "series of values" that can imposed upon you are Christian ones, all the rest of you are fascists if you oppose it.

    "Look, I think there is a gay and secular fascism in this country that wants to impose its will on the rest of us, is prepared to use violence, to use harassment. I think it is prepared to use the government if it can get control of it. I think that it is a very dangerous threat to anybody who believes in traditional religion. And I think if you believe in historic Christianity, you have to confront the fact. And, frank -- for that matter, if you believe in the historic version of Islam or the historic version of Judaism, you have to confront the reality that these secular extremists are determined to impose on you acceptance of a series of values that are antithetical, they're the opposite, of what you're taught in Sunday school."

    And who could forget the recent rant against "secular socialism" inserted into the middle of an aluminum siding commercial. This is the real America, people, wake up:

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    Jul 31, 2010 5:35 PM GMT
    Hunter9 saidChucky - despite the fact that we probably agree on most things pertaining to religion, using the term "false belief system" means nothing, rendering about 90% of your posts completely senseless. everybody has their own beliefs and values that are true to them. it's a TRUE belief system because they say it's true, whether it's true to you or not.

    in other words, your belief system is false to everyone else.

    you're on the right track, just find another phrase for christ/allah/moses sake


    I believe the sky is green with purple polka dots.

    Does this make it true? No. It is false. It can be proven to be false by simple readings of light energy bouncing around in our upper atmosphere.

    Using the scientific theory there is *no* way for any religion to prove they're right. Until a religion can prove that their God(s) does(do) exist, they're false.
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    Jul 31, 2010 5:43 PM GMT
    Caesarea4 saidSebastian18> Sharia principals are highly unlikely to become established in countries with strong, secular principals.

    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article4749183.ece
    Islamic law has been officially adopted in Britain, with sharia courts given powers to rule on Muslim civil cases.

    Quite the interesting article. (:




    Did you actually read the article you linked to? No one in Britain is bound by Sharia Law. It can be used in arbitration if all parties agree. If Newt's law passed you could still have an identical thing here as arbitration is not a replacement federal law.
  • CarbGoggles

    Posts: 705

    Jul 31, 2010 5:46 PM GMT
    It is sad to think that people are still blind to the fact that Radical Islam has declared war on the world. Their convictions demand that they convert the world to Islam and exterminate any who resist. Jihad is 1 of the 5 pillars of Islam. Muslims interpret that to mean a struggle within. Radical Muslims have declared it to mean the struggle between Islam and the Infidels. They also crossed that w/ the first pillar of Islam. There is only 1 true religion and that is Islam. Under the first pillar, you must submit to Allah and never question Islam.

    If you don't know, Sharia is Islamic law. Islam is a complete lifestyle. The Quran gives guidance on how you should live your life, run your government, and conduct your finances. From a Radical's perspective; you must live this lifestyle to the T or you will be terrorized for it for you have disobeyed the word of Allah.

    Unlike the Bible that is a compilation of books written by men and declared to be the word of god... The Quran is believed to be the word of Allah. These words were given to Mohammed by the angel Gabriel. He spoke the words to his people and they wrote them down word for word in Arabic. Unless your Quran is in Arabic it is not the true word of Allah. It has to be in Arabic. I think it's ridiculous but whatever. For that reason it is doubtful that sharia will hold in a court of law. If you translate Sharia to English then it's not Sharia any more. It's a boot leg copy you prob scored in China town. I love my secular American Gov. Al-Qaeda can suck a fat Hebrew National.
  • CarbGoggles

    Posts: 705

    Jul 31, 2010 5:56 PM GMT
    GwgTrunks said
    Hunter9 saidChucky - despite the fact that we probably agree on most things pertaining to religion, using the term "false belief system" means nothing, rendering about 90% of your posts completely senseless. everybody has their own beliefs and values that are true to them. it's a TRUE belief system because they say it's true, whether it's true to you or not.

    in other words, your belief system is false to everyone else.

    you're on the right track, just find another phrase for christ/allah/moses sake


    I believe the sky is green with purple polka dots.

    Does this make it true? No. It is false. It can be proven to be false by simple readings of light energy bouncing around in our upper atmosphere.

    Using the scientific theory there is *no* way for any religion to prove they're right. Until a religion can prove that their God(s) does(do) exist, they're false.


    Lol tell that to an 8yo in Pakistan who has memorized the Quran in Arabic even though he can't read a lick of it. Oh yeah that 8yo along w/ every other child turned out by the madrassa (school) he attended feels there is no higher honor than to sacrifice himself in order to kill non-Sunni Muslims. All the science and logic in the world can't undo the damage and brainwashing done to these children. All you can do is hope that you don't get caught in the blast when they detonate themselves.
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    Jul 31, 2010 6:04 PM GMT
    CarbGoggles saidIt is sad to think that people are still blind to the fact that Radical Islam has declared war on the world.


    Islam hasn't declared war on any planet, it's not a space invader.

    edit: When I quoted this you didn't have the Radical qualifier in there.

    CarbGoggles saidTheir convictions demand that they convert the world to Islam and exterminate any who resist.


    I was never ever taught that.

    CarbGoggles saidJihad is 1 of the 5 pillars of Islam.


    It is NOT. The five pillars:

    1) To believe in the oneness of God ie monotheism.
    2) To pray.
    3) To give tithings (charity to the poor)
    4) To fast (Ramadan specifically)
    5) To perform a spiritual pilgrimage to Mecca (hajj) at least one in the lifetime.


    CarbGoggles saidThere is only 1 true religion and that is Islam.


    That's how it works in most religious.

    CarbGoggles saidUnder the first pillar, you must submit to Allah and never question Islam.

    If you don't know, Sharia is Islamic law. Islam is a complete lifestyle. The Quran gives guidance on how you should live your life, run your government, and conduct your finances. From a Radical's perspective; you must live this lifestyle to the T or you will be terrorized for it for you have disobeyed the word of Allah.

    Unlike the Bible that is a compilation of books written by men and declared to be the word of god... The Quran is believed to be the word of Allah. These words were given to Mohammed by the angel Gabriel. He spoke the words to his people and they wrote them down word for word in Arabic. Unless your Quran is in Arabic it is not the true word of Allah. It has to be in Arabic. I think it's ridiculous but whatever. For that reason it is doubtful that sharia will hold in a court of law. If you translate Sharia to English then it's not Sharia any more. It's a boot leg copy you prob scored in China town. I love my secular American Gov. Al-Qaeda can suck a fat Hebrew National.


    You're right about Radicals frothing at the mouths with their interpretation of Islam, I love my secular American government as well and want to keep it clean of that filth. Just be a little more educated about what you're talking about.

    (I am not a Muslim for the record, but I am a product of them.)
  • CarbGoggles

    Posts: 705

    Jul 31, 2010 6:09 PM GMT
    Eden said
    CarbGoggles saidIt is sad to think that people are still blind to the fact that Radical Islam has declared war on the world. Their convictions demand that they convert the world to Islam and exterminate any who resist.

    Had you known better, you'd know converting somebody is prohibited in Islam.

    CarbGoggles saidAl-Qaeda can suck a fat Hebrew National.

    You mean Muslims are terrorists? How enlightened.


    I'm pretty sure killing Muslims is prohibited in Islam but Sunnis and Shia still conduct suicide attacks against one another. Just because it is prohibited doesn't mean it isn't happening, habibi.

    Are you trying to say Al-Qaeda is not a terrorist organization?
  • CarbGoggles

    Posts: 705

    Jul 31, 2010 6:29 PM GMT
    tryandbuy said
    CarbGoggles saidIt is sad to think that people are still blind to the fact that Radical Islam has declared war on the world.


    Islam hasn't declared war on any planet, it's not a space invader.

    edit: When I quoted this you didn't have the Radical qualifier in there.

    CarbGoggles saidTheir convictions demand that they convert the world to Islam and exterminate any who resist.


    I was never ever taught that.

    CarbGoggles saidJihad is 1 of the 5 pillars of Islam.


    It is NOT. The five pillars:

    1) To believe in the oneness of God ie monotheism.
    2) To pray.
    3) To give tithings (charity to the poor)
    4) To fast (Ramadan specifically)
    5) To perform a spiritual pilgrimage to Mecca (hajj) at least one in the lifetime.


    CarbGoggles saidThere is only 1 true religion and that is Islam.


    That's how it works in most religious.

    CarbGoggles saidUnder the first pillar, you must submit to Allah and never question Islam.

    If you don't know, Sharia is Islamic law. Islam is a complete lifestyle. The Quran gives guidance on how you should live your life, run your government, and conduct your finances. From a Radical's perspective; you must live this lifestyle to the T or you will be terrorized for it for you have disobeyed the word of Allah.

    Unlike the Bible that is a compilation of books written by men and declared to be the word of god... The Quran is believed to be the word of Allah. These words were given to Mohammed by the angel Gabriel. He spoke the words to his people and they wrote them down word for word in Arabic. Unless your Quran is in Arabic it is not the true word of Allah. It has to be in Arabic. I think it's ridiculous but whatever. For that reason it is doubtful that sharia will hold in a court of law. If you translate Sharia to English then it's not Sharia any more. It's a boot leg copy you prob scored in China town. I love my secular American Gov. Al-Qaeda can suck a fat Hebrew National.


    You're right about Radicals frothing at the mouths with their interpretation of Islam, I love my secular American government as well and want to keep it clean of that filth. Just be a little more educated about what you're talking about.

    (I am not a Muslim for the record, but I am a product of them.)


    I never said Islam. I said Radical Islam. I'm talking about monsters who wish to exterminate Christians and Jews in the name of Allah. If you don't think they exist then this conversation really isn't going to go very far. No they may not be the majority of Muslims but they are certainly effective and making their ideals known. If you were never taught this ideal then you have not been radicalized by monsters and you know the peace that Islam is capable of when not corrupted by demons.

    You are right about the 5 pillars and I was wrong. I apologize. Shahadah, Salah, Zakat, Sawm and Hajj. If you want I'll delete my post or edit it.

    Believing that your religion has it right while all others have it wrong is fine. The problem comes in when you become radicalized and are willing to inflict suffering on others because they do not share your religious views. Al-Qaeda, Westboro Baptist Church, and Crusades are some examples of what I mean by radical monsters. Sorry if I offended you stating Jihad was a pillar. Again I was wrong it is not a pillar.