Why don't you have a face pic?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 16, 2008 6:56 PM GMT
    Sorry guys, I'm bailing on my own thread. Way too much anger and ugliness on here.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 16, 2008 7:57 PM GMT
    Off topic a bit...didnt take long, did it? ... icon_wink.gif

    Anyhoos...I underwent a security clearance twice. Once in the '80s and once in the '90s.

    The clearance wasnt a pleasant experience for me or the company. I was openly gay in my company, but they had forgotten when they submitted my name without asking me.

    The one question I remember clearly....Do you do it for money? I laughed and told the interviewer that I couldnt give it away, what was he talking about selling it.

    The investigation caused a lot of problems for me in my company because they dragged their feet about it. I had to go to my senator, Chuck Robb, to get things moving in time.

    I was young and green at that time.

    I got the clearance. ... icon_biggrin.gif


    In the '90s, I remembered my experience from the '80s and was not pleasant to the poor interviewer. He got all the venom I had stored up. I think I berated him about how he couldnt tell a spy if one came up and bit him on the ass, so why was he doing this. Oh, I spit my answers at him. I have no respect for their process at all. And I tell 'em. I just bristle at the very thought of them. And I dont try to conceal it.

    Judge: "Are you trying to show your contempt for this court?"

    Mae West: "No, I'm trying to conceal it." ... icon_lol.gif

    I got the clearance. ... icon_biggrin.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 16, 2008 8:03 PM GMT
    Errr, cause Im an ugly mutha fucker! icon_razz.gif

    The reason I don't is due to the very annoying and crippling fact I am not out yet. When I do, i'll be splashing my chops on here for you all to have a look at.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 16, 2008 10:19 PM GMT
    Sorry, I have a face pic and felt compelled to reply. I too worked in aerospace/defense and had a secret clearance for a while, then a step up to PRP, wont go into the details, then top secret.

    They do have full disclosure, and I saw many people that lied initially loose their clearance; mainly for unreported misdemeanors.

    However sexual orientation was/is never a question. They are spending the $10-45,000+ on a clearance to see if you are trustworthy. If they wanted to find out if you are gay it would be easy (ie: track your computer's IP address, credit/bank card bills (which they look at very closely), Google searches, IM chats... all easily accessible, especially with the Homeland Security Act).

    After aerospace I dabbled in IT security for the government and part of my job was to monitor security clearance profiles. With a small amount of data, usually a couple email addresses and the persons name, I could find out right away if someone was gay(or so I assumed, and was right most of the time). However by hiding their sexuality they often delayed the clearance process due to attempts to conceal information.

    For a long time, granted I am still young, I made a similar excuse to not come out of the closet. And for a while I had a holier than thou mentality because of the "sacrifices I was making for my country"(sacrificed sex for 5 years). The majority of my issues about being gay, I created myself. However, that was a brutal work environment for a gay guy, but I feel that my eventual confidence and pride changed perspectives.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 16, 2008 10:56 PM GMT
    I'm not out. It is really that simple.

    My private tell my story and show my face plenty. If someone takes the time, I will gladly open them up. I prefer not to use the internet as my free personal billboard. I'm as real as it gets and by no means ugly. icon_biggrin.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 16, 2008 11:42 PM GMT
    Well, girls, with the original post going the way of it's originator, straight down in flames, what I wrote (as brilliant as it was) has been put out of context and has no place here. Since this thread got close to 1000 views, I'm sure my message was read again and again by the right people. It's the wrong people reading it out of context that I am worried about. The rats have jumped ship gentleman, and since I never claimed to be anything higher than they are, I gotta own up to my place in the foodchain and join them. bon vouyage!


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    Feb 17, 2008 12:04 AM GMT
    I work with highly sensitive stuff, everyday, and work next to folks with clearances, all the time. I do enterprise systems administration, every day.

    Only when you are afraid of being outed does it become an issue. If you're already out, there's nothing anyone can pull on you.

    The sort of self-loathing, low self-esteem that you have, EMPOWERS those who would persecute you. Only when you stand tall and proud do you take that power away, that you give them, in your self loathing, and fear of integrity.

    When you're 100% honest, no one has anything on you. The interviewers on the NAQ (National Agency Questionaire) understand, that, too. Only if you're afraid of being who you are does it become a concern. An openly gay / bi man is not a security risk like a closeted and dishonest gay / bi man who is paranoid and easily intimated. An out person is, of course, logically, much less of a risk. You don't have to be an A student to understand that. Any schoolyard bully knows as much.

    Come to like yourself, and the rest will follow. Stop it with your self-fulfilling prophecy.

    You do yourself, and your community, a huge disservice with your lack of integrity.
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    Feb 17, 2008 12:37 AM GMT
    Please, you can't honestly think for one moment that no one would have posted a comment that didn't have a face picture....let alone think that they wouldn't have said something in regards to the fact that you choose to live a life in the closet because of your work. You post in a public forum and expect people not to reply? If we all lived our lives the way you chose to live your closeted life, we'd all still be trapped in the homophobic days. You're almost as bad as the government that you work for by trying to "force" people to not talk and have dialogue. Be thankful that people have choices and are willing to stand up for their rights!
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    Feb 17, 2008 12:38 AM GMT
    Hey, James Bond. If your work is so sensitive and your clearance so high and secure, trust me, they know you're a little light in the loafers. The only one fooled is you.
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    Feb 17, 2008 12:41 AM GMT
    Dang... tough crowd tonight.
  • Hunter9

    Posts: 1039

    Feb 17, 2008 12:41 AM GMT
    chuckystud said

    The sort of self-loathing, low self-esteem that you have, EMPOWERS those who would persecute you. Only when you stand tall and proud do you take that power away, that you give them, in your self loathing, and fear of integrity.

    Come to like yourself, and the rest will follow. Stop it with your self-fulfilling prophecy.

    You do yourself, and your community, a huge disservice with your lack of integrity.



    I apologize in advance for hi-jacking this thread, but this needs to be said...

    Chuckystud: Why do all your posts make you come off as such a condoscending prick?
  • Timbales

    Posts: 13993

    Feb 17, 2008 12:42 AM GMT
    I have no issue with someone choosing to show a face pic or not.
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    Feb 17, 2008 12:50 AM GMT
    I wonder how many people can boldly speak this way in public instead of using the internet like a bashing tool? Lots of guys here seem to have a serious case of OLC (online courage) which is worse then LC (liquid courage). Any yahoo can use a computer.

    In any case, whether a person has a face pic or not doesn't really prove anything and it's hilarious how many people come up with several theories as why people don't. So they don't have a face pic up. Big deal. I bet if you took the time to know them they'd be more then willing to show themselves easily. People have to feel comfortable to do anything and who are we to judge them for not being so open? I don't know their situation and doubt many of you here do either.

    Speaking as an individual who used to be in the military, my life was my business and I shared it with those who I felt needed to know. I never hid my status but I didn't go advertising it either. It was no secret that I liked men but the way I carried myself it didn't really bother people. The way I carry myself is basically the way I've been for ages since birth. There are some things that some people need to know and some things some people don't need to know.

    Everyone here talks about being themself and just being open and honest. That's all good in theory but you can't make people like and accept you based off of honesty alone. That's impossible. Does everyone here who's posted thus far tell everything about themself when they meet people? Do you openly tell a person that you are gay from day one or do you just tell them what they need to know and if they have questions do you let them ask it? I'm openly gay but I don't feel the necessasity to tell everything about myself to people, for the simple fact it's my business. Pure and simple. I also doubt that alot of you here were so high and mighty back in the day and you should be ashamed of yourselves for judging those who aren't ready to make that big leap yet. You know who I'm talking about.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 17, 2008 12:55 AM GMT
    OMG! I totally agree with ChuckyStud this time!

    gh
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 17, 2008 12:56 AM GMT
    Wow Meizer! "on-line courage"? Now isn't that the pot calling the kettle black.
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    Feb 17, 2008 1:05 AM GMT

    meizer, I have a rainbow belt, a pair of rainbow suspenders, an assortment of pink and tangerine tank tops, a limpening wrist (that gets more pronounced everyday), friends and family that i've come out to, a penchant for cruising anytime anywhere, and a serious dislike for Muscle Marys like you and Ript who would think otherwise that says I am totally GAY, totally PROUD, and totally OUT!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 17, 2008 1:06 AM GMT
    Girrrrrrl! ;-) Nice one, Guilty.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 17, 2008 1:07 AM GMT
    Not really? My post isn't meant to be read in an aggressive way and this isn't a case OLC. If I saw you or anyone else in public I'd be speaking to you this way in a civilized tone with no malice or attitude.

    Course you'll just have to take my word for it and if not then hey...no skin off my back.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 17, 2008 1:10 AM GMT
    Damn, what's up with you guys???You can't just attack someone like that, it's just wrong...If you guys actually bothered to meet these people you might have had a different opinion...clearly, you guys need to vent out...
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 17, 2008 1:11 AM GMT
    WOW. Kudos to you GG. That's who you are and I'm happy for you. Again I don't advertise because I don't need to. It's funny that you call me a Muscle Mary. I don't fit that discription in any way. I'm average at best. You on the other hand seem more mary and muscle then I'll ever be.

    Congrats and I tip my hat off to you.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 17, 2008 1:11 AM GMT
    clearly.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 17, 2008 1:13 AM GMT

    Thanks Vineyard(homo)! LOL, us queers have totally taken this thread over. Is anyone surprised?
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    Feb 17, 2008 1:16 AM GMT
    GuiltyGearmeizer, I have a rainbow belt, a pair of rainbow suspenders, an assortment of pink and tangerine tank tops, a limpening wrist (that gets more pronounced everyday), friends and family that i've come out to, a penchant for cruising anytime anywhere, and a serious dislike for Muscle Marys like you and Ript who would think otherwise that says I am totally GAY, totally PROUD, and totally OUT!


    Being gay doesn't mean any of what you just descriped. Being gay just means I like cock and a manly ass. It doesn't mean any of the above. I'm gussing you have aserious dislike for youself then cause you seem pretty muscular there, GG. Get off your high horse.
    If that's how you see it then that's your deal and I respect that but it doesn't mean I'm any less proud of who I am. I'm totally gay, I'm totally out, and totally proud of me.
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    Feb 17, 2008 1:25 AM GMT

    You're a stud , Meizer, the only fighting I want to do with you is over a bottle of lube. But, sweetheart, you misunderstand me. I wasn't talking about being gay. I was talking about having GAY PRIDE and i'll stay on my high horse because I have it in spades.
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    Feb 17, 2008 1:27 AM GMT
    I'm never surprised when queers take over anything. It's all for us, right?

    On the other hand, I think that those of us who are out and proud have a tendency to forget how courageous we were. Coming out is hard, particularly where there are likely to be consequences for others, and once through it, we tend to forget how hard it was. I think facelessness is dreary, but I understand people staying in the closet. I came out at 14 and suffered years of abuse as a result, and I'm sure there are many others with similar experiences. Hurrah for being gay, certainly, but let us not pretend that in today's society, it is something that is easy