Why Jews Should Rejoice at the Overturning of Prop 8

  • metta

    Posts: 39133

    Aug 08, 2010 6:58 AM GMT
    Why Jews Should Rejoice at the Overturning of Prop 8
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rabbi-michael-lerner/why-jews-should-rejoice-a_b_672257.html
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    Aug 08, 2010 12:04 PM GMT
    Great post, I always enjoy huff post and have found some good pro GLBT articles on The Forward

    http://www.forward.com/articles/129840/
  • calibro

    Posts: 8888

    Aug 08, 2010 12:41 PM GMT
    i find that article rather poorly written and ignores the white elephant in the room. the author is clearly a member of the reformed/conservative sect of judaism, not the orthodox (which he refers to as tradionalists). and those orthodox really do abide by why he claims they don't and the old testament is the basis for a lot of hate against gays and it seems to be taking a roundabout way rather than having the discussion of how judaism is responsible for a lot of hate against gays.
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    Aug 08, 2010 1:06 PM GMT
    calibro

    Last week a statement was signed by 60 orthodox rabbis.
    The short article is in this link and if you click on 'statement' you can read the letter in its entirety. While it isn't wholesale equality it does state that homosexuality is not a choice, probably can't be changed, and that GLBT jews should not be encouraged to marry a person of the opposite sex.

    http://jta.org/news/article/2010/08/01/2740295/orthodox-rabbis-sign-statement-supporting-gays

    The full statement is here:

    http://statementofprinciplesnya.blogspot.com/

    I think it is a huge leap in the right direction. BTW it was studied and worked on for over a year.
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    Aug 08, 2010 3:20 PM GMT
    I love favorite lines" love thy neighbor"
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    Aug 08, 2010 3:26 PM GMT
    calibro said[...] reformed/conservative sect of judaism, not the orthodox [...]



    (For the record, it is the " 'Reform' Movement", they aren't "reformed" as in reformed ex-cons.)
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    Aug 08, 2010 3:41 PM GMT
    I am not Jewish, but I sometimes attend Jewish services with my friends. I find those services to be far more loving, humane, and civilized than the Christian counterparts. No drinking of blood or eating of flesh, or worshiping someone who was tortured to death. I have considered converting, but I'm not sure I believe in any God at all.

    But certainly Judaism is a far more loving religion than Christianity. And I don't hear of them being actively opposed to gays, except a few ultra-orthodox in Israel. The issue of the Israeli government and the Palestinians is a separate matter, with which I have problems. But as a religion alone, I find the Jewish among the most admirable in the world, and absolutely preferable to Christianity or Islam.
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    Aug 08, 2010 4:28 PM GMT
    Wilton saidI am not Jewish, but I sometimes attend Jewish services with my friends. I find those services to be far more loving, humane, and civilized than the Christian counterparts. No drinking of blood or eating of flesh, or worshiping someone who was tortured to death. I have considered converting, but I'm not sure I believe in any God at all.

    But certainly Judaism is a far more loving religion than Christianity. And I don't hear of them being actively opposed to gays, except a few ultra-orthodox in Israel. The issue of the Israeli government and the Palestinians is a separate matter, with which I have problems. But as a religion alone, I find the Jewish among the most admirable in the world, and absolutely preferable to Christianity or Islam.


    That is because we are mindful of our status as the ger, the stranger in most societies we live in and therefore are very tolerant of ways of life not our own, with the exception being when we are tried to be forced to abandon the faith (Story of Hannukah is a great example of this). We are told to embrace the stranger and that is why when I lead services at Hillel, I always explain what is going on because more often than not, I am leading a service with gentile guests that are there with an open mind and heart. If they can be open enough to join us on Shabbat, I owe them to explain our services and the meaning behind the prayers, practices and tradition. It is just what we do.

    Since I wear kippah (Yarmulke, skull cap w/e), I often get the "Jewish questions" and it is my duty to answer them in a respectful and intelligent way because of the belief of being a light unto the nations. That last statement is the reason Jews are tolerant, we attempt to live by example.

    BTW Please no political commentary on my post. Thx.
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    Aug 08, 2010 6:24 PM GMT
    agri_sci said
    Wilton saidI am not Jewish, but I sometimes attend Jewish services with my friends. I find those services to be far more loving, humane, and civilized than the Christian counterparts. No drinking of blood or eating of flesh, or worshiping someone who was tortured to death. I have considered converting, but I'm not sure I believe in any God at all.

    But certainly Judaism is a far more loving religion than Christianity. And I don't hear of them being actively opposed to gays, except a few ultra-orthodox in Israel. The issue of the Israeli government and the Palestinians is a separate matter, with which I have problems. But as a religion alone, I find the Jewish among the most admirable in the world, and absolutely preferable to Christianity or Islam.

    That is because we are mindful of our status as the ger, the stranger in most societies we live in and therefore are very tolerant of ways of life not our own, with the exception being when we are tried to be forced to abandon the faith (Story of Hannukah is a great example of this). We are told to embrace the stranger and that is why when I lead services at Hillel, I always explain what is going on because more often than not, I am leading a service with gentile guests that are there with an open mind and heart. If they can be open enough to join us on Shabbat, I owe them to explain our services and the meaning behind the prayers, practices and tradition. It is just what we do.

    Since I wear kippah (Yarmulke, skull cap w/e), I often get the "Jewish questions" and it is my duty to answer them in a respectful and intelligent way because of the belief of being a light unto the nations. That last statement is the reason Jews are tolerant, we attempt to live by example.

    BTW Please no political commentary on my post. Thx.

    And when I go to Jewish services, I wear a kippah, why would I not? And I touch the Torah as it is passed around. I find the Jewish ceremony much more beautiful than the Christian one, and I was raised Catholic, when we still spoke Latin, which I knew. Not unlike the Jews, some of who know Hebrew.

    No, if I chose a religion today, I would choose Jewish. I still sometimes attend an MCC, because of my partner, and because they are a gay Christian church. But otherwise, if I had to choose, it would be Jewish. They are the more humane, loving and intelligent of any religion of which I know.
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    Aug 08, 2010 11:26 PM GMT
    I will say this much, regardless of what happens over there... if your response are constantly angry and rife with attitude, then you shall reap what you sow. If Judaism teaches anything, its to be constructive and proactive. Give thoughtful and intelligent responses, rather than passive aggressive attacks on all Jews. If you truly seek battles with the Jewish individuals on this site, then bring it on. Be eloquent, have some sources to back up your rationale and produce ethical arguments. If you continue to insist to shoot rude, condescending comments on this site, you are simply hurting your own cause. Jews got to where we are in the pages of history because of our well-thought out responses to the world around us.

    If you cannot rise above your personal feelings about things and approach the world as an outsider... your feelings shall run unchecked and destroy you instead of inspiring you.

    Wilton, I converted to Judaism for alot of the reasons you stated. My main reason for converting was that the legalistic rationale of Judaism appealed to my logic. I was accepted with open arms and being Jewish got me out of some very self-destructive behaviours. I felt accountability for the first time...

    Honestly for any of the dudes here bothering to read this, I think that many of the people on here are angry and bitter towards organized religion, namely main stream Christianity. This attitude is not beyond the realm of logic and acceptable. What is not acceptable is the constant attacks on people of faith and attacking Jews under the guise of anti-Zionism. Attack the actions of the government as I do, through thoughtful letters and responses. Otherwise, you are only fueling the fire that you are so keen to extinguish.
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    Aug 09, 2010 5:35 AM GMT
    SoundAdvice saidHTW2y.jpg

    I'm not sure what this means. Is that a photo of Anne Frank? Please explain.
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    Aug 09, 2010 11:34 PM GMT
    Wilton said
    SoundAdvice saidHTW2y.jpg

    I'm not sure what this means. Is that a photo of Anne Frank? Please explain.


    Its disgusting...its making a reference to the fact that the Anne Frank was caught in hiding from the Nazis and led to her subsequent death in Bergen-Belsen. People wonder why we are so defensive...The Holocaust is not funny.icon_evil.gif
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    Jun 17, 2016 4:14 PM GMT
    Angels-image-angels-36145322-458-342.gif

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    theanticock saidtheantijock said:
    il_570xN.45935665.jpg


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    theanticock said
    theantijock saidgratuitous bump

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