Exorcism--another sign of the times

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    Nov 13, 2010 2:10 PM GMT

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/13/us/13exorcism.html?_r=1The closed-door conference is being held in Baltimore before the annual fall meeting of the nation’s bishops. Some Catholic commentators said they were puzzled why the bishops would bother with exorcisms in a year when they are facing a full plate of crises — from parish and school closings, to polls showing the loss of one of every three white baptized members, to the sexual abuse scandal flaring up again.
    ...
    “It’s a strategy for saying: ‘We are not the Federal Reserve, and we are not the World Council of Churches. We deal with angels and demons.’ ”

  • Gaymer

    Posts: 111

    Nov 13, 2010 3:14 PM GMT
    While the article was from a rather interesting point of view, I'm not sure what exorcism has to do with "another sign of the times"?

    Exorcism & other various occultic practices against demons or negative paranormal whatnot isn't uncommon; just uncommonly spoken about. The article was actually quite informing
  • gymfunu

    Posts: 28

    Nov 13, 2010 4:14 PM GMT
    Sign of the times because the Catholic Church is in crisis and at every turn their human-ness is evident and their supposed connection to their god/God is highly questionable. So, if the church begins to pretend that the necessity of exorcism is real then they are attempting to say that the supernatural is real and that they are somehow endorsed to deal with said supernatural. With a rise in secularism religions always become more and more fundamentalist and crazy in attempting to justify their existence (and the Catholic Church is no stranger to this phenomenon: Inquisition; Protestant Reformation; Liberation Theology).
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    Nov 13, 2010 4:21 PM GMT
    It's not often spoken about, but it does happen. Jesus does indeed free people from demonic harassment. Those who speak against it really have no clue about it.
  • sportsjockla

    Posts: 498

    Nov 13, 2010 4:29 PM GMT
    How stupid are people!?!?!? During medieval times, people with what we now know is epilepsy were thought to be Possessed by the Devil. In the 21st century for people to be so superstitious is mind boggling!
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    Nov 13, 2010 4:35 PM GMT
    Sign of the times because
    1. Red herring: just like when we should be putting heads together for healthcare, the wars and the economy, fundamentalist forces want to concentrate on banning gay marriage and Sharia law. Just when the Church should be reforming itself due to priests cum pederasts, it condones and revives medieval practices which had been ancient history which does nothing to help with primary reasons why people don't trust the Church any more.
    2. If the people want it, it must be right, no matter how nonsensical it is. Cutting the deficit while trying to revive the economy, wanting your SS but wanting to cut taxes...the exercise of holding contradictory thoughts in one's head is fashionable.
    3. Demonizing things like mental illness will not make it go away. Just like demonizing the President will not make the economy better.
    4. Reification of thoughts makes them real. Exorcism, energy medicine, anyone? You say toemehto, I say towmahto.
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    Nov 13, 2010 6:04 PM GMT
    TerraFirma saidIt's not often spoken about, but it does happen. Jesus does indeed free people from demonic harassment. Those who speak against it really have no clue about it.


    Terra, in the days when the bible was written, and in the days when Jesus lived, there was no knowledge of mental illness of any kind. One was possessed by demons, and the Earth was considered flat. icon_wink.gif

    -Doug
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    Nov 13, 2010 6:50 PM GMT
    TerraFirma saidIt's not often spoken about, but it does happen. Jesus does indeed free people from demonic harassment. Those who speak against it really have no clue about it.


    Evidence?
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    Nov 13, 2010 7:13 PM GMT
    MenschPress said
    TerraFirma saidIt's not often spoken about, but it does happen. Jesus does indeed free people from demonic harassment. Those who speak against it really have no clue about it.


    Evidence?


    Obviously, there is none icon_rolleyes.gif
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    Nov 13, 2010 7:46 PM GMT
    TerraFirma saidIt's not often spoken about, but it does happen. Jesus does indeed free people from demonic harassment. Those who speak against it really have no clue about it.


    Crazy much?
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    Nov 13, 2010 10:39 PM GMT
    Sometimes I wonder why holy water has to be blessed, one dose at a time. Why not have all the priests go outside and bless the water treatment plant? The lakes, underground water reservoirs, the clouds (which are made from water)? What is so special about that particular container of holy water? The fountain where it came from? Unless you include the bacteria:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_waterHoly water fonts have been identified as a potential source of bacterial and viral infection. Bacteriologists found staphylococci, streptococci, coli bacilli, Loeffler's bacillus, and other bacteria in samples of holy water taken from a church in Sassari, Italy in the late 1800s.[8] More recently, in a study performed in 1995, thirteen samples were taken when a burn patient acquired a bacterial infection after exposure to holy water. The samples were shown to have a "wide range of bacterial species," some of which could cause infection in humans.[9] During the swine flu epidemic of 2009, Bishop John Steinbock of Fresno, California recommended that "[h]oly water should not be in the fonts" due to fear of spreading infections.[10] Also in response to the swine flu, an automatic, motion-detecting holy water dispenser was invented and installed in an Italian church.


    Any news on using such automatic holy water dispensers in exorcisms? Certainly the Church doesn't want to contribute spreading bacteria with their asperges?icon_twisted.gif
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    Nov 13, 2010 10:47 PM GMT
    q1w2e3 saidSometimes I wonder why holy water has to be blessed, one dose at a time. Why not have all the priests go outside and bless the water treatment plant? The lakes, underground water reservoirs, the clouds (which are made from water)? What is so special about that particular container of holy water? The fountain where it came from?


    I do actually know this!!!

    Because a blessing "wears off" when it touches an unholy object.... it is said..

    so blessing all the water on earth would not work

    hmmm, crazy stuff, indeed kind of useless it seems

    I once received a blessing of holy water in a crowd, dont know what happened, I wasnt expecting anything, but I felt like this rush, and other people were making strange jerky movements... probably I jsut felt the rush everyone was feeling in response to seeing in what to them is perceived as a holy object, (like gazing at a statue of mary or something)

    that is if the explanation is psychological of course
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    Nov 13, 2010 10:48 PM GMT
    If somebody says they see spirits, dead people, demons I don't think they are possessed or have some gift. A much simpler explanation is schizophrenia. Sad but true. My cousin is a diagnosed schizophrenic and he sees and hears shit all the time. BUT, he knows what it is. Some of my family are convinced it's because he's rejected god and these are demons torturing him and he deserves it. A nice way to bury your head in the sand and not have to help a family member.
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    Nov 13, 2010 10:51 PM GMT
    amar_m said
    Because a blessing "wears off" when it touches an unholy object.... it is said..


    All the more reason for the good padres to get off their asses on the weekdays to bless every water treatment plant, 24 hours a day.
    Guess how many jobs that would create, a works-program for priests at water treatment plants, supermarkets with bottled water, water filtration systems...much easier and cheaper to get rid of demons on a mass scale.
    Unless the devils are so smart as to sequester their water.

    And I still have not seen any priest being able to distinguish holy water from regular water.
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    Nov 13, 2010 10:54 PM GMT
    This forum seems to think that you can mix regular water and holy water, and it'll all be holy!
    http://forum.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=290186

    Angels on a pinhead, IMHO.
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    Nov 13, 2010 10:55 PM GMT
    amar_m said

    Because a blessing "wears off" when it touches an unholy object.... it is said..


    a convenient excuse to keep people coming back.
  • dugandaniel

    Posts: 40

    Nov 13, 2010 11:01 PM GMT
    so funny reading these responses.

    being a seminole spiritual healer since the age ten when my grandfather passed his gifts to me, I know i chose the correct path by keeping silent unless i was in complete control of the environment.

    There are "gifts" by which we can all attain via the holy spirit simply by asking through faith.

    for those seeking proof.... come spend a week with me, lol. Upon meeting i'll know more about you than you can imagine simply by your generations of ancestors telling me what they know. I've cured genetic diseases, diagnosed tumors when doctors couldn't, and walked in the spirit world to learn things i've never been taught.

    yeah yeah, i know what some of you are thinking. FREAK. but i feel sorry for those who can't access it. your life is so limited.

    My grandfather was the first "doctor" in the county i'm from. His wife and mother were the nurses, my mom was dispatch and my dad drove the ambulance. STILL to this day my family members are called to hospitals BY DOCTORS when they can't stop internal bleeding. yeah, may sound hocus pocus but they read eze 16:6 and all healing done only points to God to be glorified.

    so proof, i've got proof for days. you don't have the courage to LEARN. Remain in your ignorance and retard your life. yup, you are truly retarded if you restrict yourself to just the physical. not judging....WARNING
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    Nov 13, 2010 11:01 PM GMT
    sportsjockla saidHow stupid are people!?!?!? During medieval times, people with what we now know is epilepsy were thought to be Possessed by the Devil. In the 21st century for people to be so superstitious is mind boggling!


    It goes even further Epilepsy in Ancient Rome meant that the gods were transcending unto the victim...Julius Caesar had it, according to Shakespears play.
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    Nov 13, 2010 11:02 PM GMT
    q1w2e3 saidSometimes I wonder why holy water has to be blessed, one dose at a time. Why not have all the priests go outside and bless the water treatment plant? The lakes, underground water reservoirs, the clouds (which are made from water)? What is so special about that particular container of holy water? The fountain where it came from? Unless you include the bacteria:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_waterHoly water fonts have been identified as a potential source of bacterial and viral infection. Bacteriologists found staphylococci, streptococci, coli bacilli, Loeffler's bacillus, and other bacteria in samples of holy water taken from a church in Sassari, Italy in the late 1800s.[8] More recently, in a study performed in 1995, thirteen samples were taken when a burn patient acquired a bacterial infection after exposure to holy water. The samples were shown to have a "wide range of bacterial species," some of which could cause infection in humans.[9] During the swine flu epidemic of 2009, Bishop John Steinbock of Fresno, California recommended that "[h]oly water should not be in the fonts" due to fear of spreading infections.[10] Also in response to the swine flu, an automatic, motion-detecting holy water dispenser was invented and installed in an Italian church.


    Any news on using such automatic holy water dispensers in exorcisms? Certainly the Church doesn't want to contribute spreading bacteria with their asperges?icon_twisted.gif


    Priests don't bless the water treatment plants because they are directed to bless hoses and sprinklers instead, by the Pope himself. icon_wink.gif
    Priests don't bless clouds because blessings pass through. They aren't solid icon_rolleyes.gif

    The Catholic church wants people to give people infections beacuse...

    Here is a good resource to answer reasonable questions about the Catholic faith.
    http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/
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    Nov 13, 2010 11:04 PM GMT
    n8696uPriests don't bless the water treatment plants because they are directed to bless hoses and sprinklers instead, by the Pope himself.


    Capitalist!icon_twisted.gif
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    Nov 13, 2010 11:06 PM GMT
    Hehehe through studies and trials 80% of asthma, allergy (any kind), autism, Chron's disease and even rheumatoid arthritis can be cured or controled with hookworm. An englishman went with a life of allergies and asthma and discovered that having hookworm will cure asthma and control allergies. The FDA has now banned his treatment in the U.S. saying that hookworm (an animal) is now a drug. Is the church the only corrupt one?
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    Nov 13, 2010 11:12 PM GMT
    I have no trouble with hookworms, as long as
    1. They do not pass into sewage systems and thence to drinking water systems
    2. Appropriate trials are made (case reports do not count) to document efficacy and side effects (that's where the FDA comes in)

    If people were really desirous of helminths, buy a ticket and go to Africa.http://www.asthmahookworm.com/jt_archive/info/myhookworm.php
    Yay, a modern day Typhoid Mary!

    Just as I have no trouble with introducing healthy feces into people with refractory C diff infections.

    But we digress...we were discussing angels on a pinhead.icon_razz.gif
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    Nov 13, 2010 11:18 PM GMT
    Actually, it is really effective and you only need 35 of these creatures. Our sewage system would kill the eggs emidiately. So unless you are stepping on your own shit you won't get them. Plus 300 of them is considered healthy by the CDC. You can always also go to Belize. Those last longer about 5 yrs and they prove to be a better parasite than the african species. Well some say that angels and demons are actually extraterrestials that get into the body. They also add that the gods are actually also extraterrestials with higher technology that make them seem godly. But then again who knows what is true nowadays. Others have a Kant-like idea of life where we are the god's of our lives. What we think happens and what we strongly wish for will occur. So if you have a (-) mindset (-) things will occur and vise versa...
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    Nov 13, 2010 11:21 PM GMT
    I.e. placebo effect.
    Which is fine, if only they will call it by its correct name.
    But then it loses its effect.
    And cheap/free placebos don't work as well as expensive, ritualistic ones:

    http://www.scienceagogo.com/news/20080204181613data_trunc_sys.shtml
    http://www.scienceagogo.com/news/20060101222555data_trunc_sys.shtml
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    Nov 13, 2010 11:22 PM GMT
    dugandaniel said

    so proof, i've got proof for days. you don't have the courage to LEARN. Remain in your ignorance and retard your life. yup, you are truly retarded if you restrict yourself to just the physical. not judging....WARNING


    yet, not proof provided.