Countries w.r.t. Gay Tolerance

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 28, 2010 5:25 PM GMT
    Hello everyone,
    I have been living in Turkey since the day I was born and It is not a gay friendly country. It has no laws protecting lgbt people and actually it never mentions them to ignore their presence. Most of the people here is muslim and that plays huge role of course. My childhood and school life were not easy in a country like this. There were lots of bullying by not only children but also the grown-up. As you may guess, I didn't come out to my parents or my friends. Only a couple of people know that I am gay. In short, this situation will be permanent in Turkey with the current government which makes Turkey resemble Iran day by day.
    For these reasons, I want to move to USA, Canada or Europe and I have been searching about the gay tolerance in those countries. I know that you can't escape from homophobia wherever you go because there is always someone who will hate you because you are gay. But as a person living in those country, I want you to be honest about it and tell me whether moving to those countries worths changing my country and my citizenship. What I want from the country I will move to is that I want to walk in the street holding my bf hand without frowns and starings and not to be assulted or killed or judged because of my identity. What do you think the best country it is ? Btw the most likely country I have a chance to move is USA so I would be glad if you consider it more.
    Thanks everyone.
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    Nov 28, 2010 6:20 PM GMT
    Of the 3 choices you list, the US is the least gay friendly, and about to become more gay hostile for the foreseeable future. Canada's gay policies are friendly but recent & fragile, and may revert back. Therefore, I would recommend a European country with a stronger civil rights record than the US, that already recognizes gay rights.
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    Nov 29, 2010 2:20 AM GMT
    While I don't Think we as gays have it that bad here in the USA, I think Belgium, Holland, Norway or Sweden have the best long term gay friendly records. They also don't have a record of having troubles with being friendly toward muslim populations like the USA, Brittain and France whom have had some flare ups of prejudice.
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    Nov 29, 2010 2:30 AM GMT
    Art_Deco saidOf the 3 choices you list, the US is the least gay friendly, and about to become more gay hostile for the foreseeable future. Canada's gay policies are friendly but recent & fragile, and may revert back. Therefore, I would recommend a European country with a stronger civil rights record than the US, that already recognizes gay rights.



    Absolutely WRONG. No country has stronger equal rights legislation than Canada, none and it won't change. You can already see the cracks developing over in Europe including the Netherlands regarding rights for Muslims etc being eroded, trying to force them to change their ways etc..
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    Nov 29, 2010 2:34 AM GMT
    realifedad said While I don't Think we as gays have it that back here in the USA, I think Belgium, Holland, the Netherlands, Norway or Sweden have the best long term gay friendly records.


    So which one do you think has the best track record, Holland or the Netherlands? icon_wink.gif
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    Nov 29, 2010 2:39 AM GMT
    Tazo995 said
    realifedad said While I don't Think we as gays have it that back here in the USA, I think Belgium, Holland, the Netherlands, Norway or Sweden have the best long term gay friendly records.


    So which one do you think has the best track record, Holland or the Netherlands? icon_wink.gif


    Actually, perhaps Friesland.
  • danielek

    Posts: 124

    Nov 29, 2010 3:02 AM GMT
    Art_Deco saidOf the 3 choices you list, the US is the least gay friendly, and about to become more gay hostile for the foreseeable future. Canada's gay policies are friendly but recent & fragile, and may revert back. Therefore, I would recommend a European country with a stronger civil rights record than the US, that already recognizes gay rights.


    I'll add in that this view of Canada's gay rights is far off-base. Ontario (Canada's most populous province) has had same-sex marriage since mid-2003. Support for same-sex marriage is probably higher than its ever been. We've had gay marriage for almost 10 years and the sky hasn't fallen. And I don't think we're going to revisit it anymore than we're going to revisit abortion.

    Oh and let's not forget that Canada was the 4th country in the world to recognize same-sex marriage. And also remember that our marriage is 100% equal to straight marriage, unlike in some other jurisdictions with limited marriages that don't allow adoptions and such.
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    Nov 29, 2010 3:15 AM GMT
    Art_Deco saidOf the 3 choices you list, the US is the least gay friendly


    It depends on where you go, and the US is far more gay friendly than Turkey. Go to places like New York, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Seattle, Chicago. Those are gay friendly places. Other places...like small cities in the middle of America are not so friendly.
  • gumbosolo

    Posts: 382

    Nov 29, 2010 3:22 AM GMT
    Any place you've listed would be a big improvement over where you are as long as you chose the right city. So look at the other factors in which cities would be a good fit for you, e.g. your line of work, immigration policies, language barriers (seems you've got English down), and general culture. Freedom to be gay alone won't make you happy. Best of luck with this choice and I hope you find a place where you're free to be you.
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    Nov 29, 2010 3:27 AM GMT
    "The State has no business in the bedrooms of the nation" Pierre Trudeau, Minister of Justice in Canada circa 1967

    An interesting old clip (1967) of Pierre Trudeau, former Prime Minister of Canada speaking to the media on things like homosexuality. This was when he was Minister of Justice b4 he became Prime Minister.
    http://archives.cbc.ca/politics/rights_freedoms/topics/538/
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    Nov 29, 2010 3:29 AM GMT
    JAKEBENSON said
    Art_Deco saidOf the 3 choices you list, the US is the least gay friendly


    It depends on where you go, and the US is far more gay friendly than Turkey. Go to places like New York, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Seattle, Chicago. Those are gay friendly places. Other places...like small cities in the middle of America are not so friendly.



    He meant LEAST GAY FRIENDLY in terms of politics. And the states with the largest gay populations, New York, Florida, etc... tend to have the most homophobic laws. It's an odd coincidence, but true none the less.

    Miami Beach has a huge gay population. Sometimes I feel like it is 50% but I know it isn't. Then you go up to Ft. Lauderdale and everyone literally is gay. But FLORIDA legislation is extremely anti-gay because MOST of the state is the opposite of the few big cities in the South.
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    Nov 29, 2010 3:48 AM GMT
    Art_Deco saidOf the 3 choices you list, the US is the least gay friendly, and about to become more gay hostile for the foreseeable future. Canada's gay policies are friendly but recent & fragile, and may revert back. Therefore, I would recommend a European country with a stronger civil rights record than the US, that already recognizes gay rights.


    you kidding me right? homosexuality is a total non issue in Canada at least in the legal point of view, the conservatives even had a referendum vote to bring up the question of same sex marriage again but it was completely quashed by most politicians and the public and now forever closed. most of them were even angered by the notion of it so it shut up any opposition within the conservatives (not all of the conservatives are against it either)
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    Nov 29, 2010 7:45 PM GMT
    Art_Deco saidOf the 3 choices you list, the US is the least gay friendly, and about to become more gay hostile for the foreseeable future. Canada's gay policies are friendly but recent & fragile, and may revert back. Therefore, I would recommend a European country with a stronger civil rights record than the US, that already recognizes gay rights.


    Don't worry, because of leftwing immigration policies Europe is actually going down the tube slowly as far as "tolerance" is concerned.
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    Nov 29, 2010 7:53 PM GMT
    Tazo995 said
    realifedad said While I don't Think we as gays have it that back here in the USA, I think Belgium, Holland, the Netherlands, Norway or Sweden have the best long term gay friendly records.


    So which one do you think has the best track record, Holland or the Netherlands? icon_wink.gif


    lol!
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    Nov 29, 2010 8:32 PM GMT
    mocktwinkie said
    Tazo995 said
    realifedad said While I don't Think we as gays have it that back here in the USA, I think Belgium, Holland, the Netherlands, Norway or Sweden have the best long term gay friendly records.


    So which one do you think has the best track record, Holland or the Netherlands? icon_wink.gif


    lol!
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>OOOOOOOOOPS !!!!!! Caught me didn't ya guys !!! LOL !!!
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    Nov 29, 2010 8:43 PM GMT
    I think the comparisons being made here are a little off-base.

    The entities of "USA" and "Europe" cover vast territories and cultures which result it different attitudes towards homosexuality.

    You can wave your rainbow flag in San Francisco until your heart's content, or you can go to the official gay cruising park in Amsterdam. In either city, I think you'll feel safe and comfortable in your sexuality.

    If you do the same thing in the middle of Alabama or Serbia where homosexuality is generally not accepted, you could find yourself in a bit of a pickle.

    All places above are either in the USA or Europe.

    Canada is a different animal as the society is much more homogeneous and the population is small. While it's great their legislature has given equal rights to the LGBT community, don't take that as being evidence that gays are accepted around the country. I've worked with clients in not-so-metropolitan Canada, and there was definitely an anti-gay sentiment.

    To answer your question, I would definitely consider Norway, Sweden, or the Netherlands to be the most gay friendly countries.
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    Nov 29, 2010 9:24 PM GMT
    Diablo29 saidI think the comparisons being made here are a little off-base.

    The entities of "USA" and "Europe" cover vast territories and cultures which result it different attitudes towards homosexuality.

    You can wave your rainbow flag in San Francisco until your heart's content, or you can go to the official gay cruising park in Amsterdam. In either city, I think you'll feel safe and comfortable in your sexuality.

    If you do the same thing in the middle of Alabama or Serbia where homosexuality is generally not accepted, you could find yourself in a bit of a pickle.

    All places above are either in the USA or Europe.

    Canada is a different animal as the society is much more homogeneous and the population is small. While it's great their legislature has given equal rights to the LGBT community, don't take that as being evidence that gays are accepted around the country. I've worked with clients in not-so-metropolitan Canada, and there was definitely an anti-gay sentiment.To answer your question, I would definitely consider Norway, Sweden, or the Netherlands to be the most gay friendly countries.


    It's no different in Holland/Norway etc either. They also have large pockets of discontent.

    I don't know where you're getting your info from but this is hardly a homogenous country. It's the most ethnically diverse country on the planet, moreso than the USA. It's the fact that Canada is a relatively new country that makes being diverse work better than the truly homogenous (same race) old world countries. While the cited examples have made great strides it's also more likely that they can revert back to their closed homogenous mindsets which is exactly what is starting to happen over there regarding muslims, niqhabs, new mosque bans etc. I seriously doubt that would ever happen here and the same goes for the "gay thing"
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    Nov 29, 2010 9:48 PM GMT
    All the places recommended are like ridiculously cold right now.

    Turkey does have some agreements with various EU countries dating back to the seventies which might make them easier for you. But the fact that you already know the language is a huge advantage for suggesting Canada/US. And it sounds like you would be happy to have the Atlantic separating you and the people you know in Turkey.

    What about Germany though? Huge Turkish population and lots of gays. Probably lots of Turkish gays for that matter.
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    Nov 29, 2010 9:52 PM GMT
    pre_mortem saidAll the places recommended are like ridiculously cold right now.

    Turkey does have some agreements with various EU countries dating back to the seventies which might make them easier for you. But the fact that you already know the language is a huge advantage for suggesting Canada/US. And it sounds like you would be happy to have the Atlantic separating you and the people you know in Turkey.

    What about Germany though? Huge Turkish population and lots of gays. Probably lots of Turkish gays for that matter.


    Yea, Vancouver is totally freezing at 9 celsius icon_rolleyes.gif
  • Hokenshi

    Posts: 387

    Nov 29, 2010 9:57 PM GMT
    If Turkey can sort themselves out and get into the EU it'll open so many doors to more tolerant countries for you.

    When it comes to gay rights America is far behind Europe and Canada - gays can't even fight for their country let alone get married and some states have bugger all in the way of protection for gays when it comes to employment etc.

    Saying that it seems that what you want isn't in any country yet.
    There are gay areas you can go to where you'll be safer but holding hands or kissing your man in public might still get you looks from people, who aren't necessarily bad just curious. I've seen two boys walking down the main street of my city in Japan and I stared at them...they were cute though so that may have had something to do with it.

    So I would say Canada or Europe, and in time Europe should be very easy for you to move around in.