All Natural Workout

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    Dec 02, 2010 4:32 AM GMT
    So I was just wondering how many of you guys out there are fans of training "all natural"? What I mean by "all natural" is training without the use of supplements like creatine, NO, and even protein powder.

    When I first started working out seriously, I was on a lot of supplements... Cell tech creatine, Anator, NO, and protein powder. At my most intense I was using all of these at the same time.

    I don't really question if these supplements work, but I've been off all of them for a little over two years and I honestly dont miss them at all. I've come to the conclusion that I feel all these supplements are in a sense "cheating" kind of like steroids (not saying the two things are the same).

    I guess I feel a better sense of accomplishment working out without supplements than I ever did while using them (not to mention the money I have saved). Does anybody else feel this way? If not why? Discuss! icon_razz.gif
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    Dec 02, 2010 5:34 AM GMT
    At the moment, I'm not on ANYTHING. I was on Cellucor for three months, and just stopped taking the supps about two months ago. Right now, I'm not even taking protein shakes. I get my protein from chicken and eggs. I liked the results I got, but it was extremely expensive.

    I have no prob's with supps. It's more a convenience thing, I suppose, especially with protein shakes. I still have various protein powders at the gym, work, and home, but I almost never use them because I'm bringing meals with me wherever I go.

    I don't feel better about not using them. I'm just "eh." I am happy that I'm saving the money, at the moment, though.
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    Dec 02, 2010 5:36 AM GMT
    I would Love to just exercise and not rely on expensive supplements to get the results I want, but sadly, with my age and the body type I have, I need all the help I can get lol!
    I wonder, if we do our hard work and eat old school like what the classic bodybuilders did at the time (Sandow, not Arnold), we could still get the same results and SAVE money!
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    Dec 02, 2010 5:37 AM GMT
    Not really following how it's cheating to be honest..

    Creatine is found in beef
    Protien is found you know where, all over
    And NO, well you can get something of a similar boost and all crazy at the gym with caffiene...

    Not arguing with you at all, i'm just not following the thought that it's cheating that's all.



    *Edit, i also don't have a problem with steroids either... I don't do them, and won't consider them unless i fail my goal in another 4 years.. But yeah, i don't really see a problem with them, testosterone or anything else if it helps someone reach their goals and as long as they're doing it in a safe way (Even though steroids technically isn't safe)
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    Dec 02, 2010 5:38 AM GMT
    In some sense yes you can save money and not need them, but that would mean eating more healthier and making sure that you get enough of every nutrients, as for me, i use protein, glutamine, multivitamins, Omegas/flaxseed to supplement,the rest is mainly eating, i know i can workout without them, but i have them just in case i am not eating enough (protein shakes). I am a bigger guy, so i have to constantly eat to keep up....icon_idea.gif
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    Dec 02, 2010 6:36 AM GMT
    Samm77 saidNot really following how it's cheating to be honest..

    Creatine is found in beef
    Protien is found you know where, all over
    And NO, well you can get something of a similar boost and all crazy at the gym with caffiene...

    Not arguing with you at all, i'm just not following the thought that it's cheating that's all.



    *Edit, i also don't have a problem with steroids either... I don't do them, and won't consider them unless i fail my goal in another 4 years.. But yeah, i don't really see a problem with them, testosterone or anything else if it helps someone reach their goals and as long as they're doing it in a safe way (Even though steroids technically isn't safe)



    Guess I should have clarified a bit better, lol... I honestly dont consider people who use supplements or steroids to achieve a body type they want as "cheaters" (unless it's a professional athlete using steroids) I just feel that for me personally I like the idea of not having to use them better.

    I do realize that not everybody is 20 years old and for some people supplements are what works for them. Sorry if I was implying supplement users are cheaters.
  • titus8229

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    Dec 02, 2010 7:36 AM GMT
    YoungJock4 said... What I mean by "all natural" is training without the use of supplements like creatine, NO, and even protein powder.

    ...

    I've come to the conclusion that I feel all these supplements are in a sense "cheating" kind of like steroids (not saying the two things are the same).

    " />


    I think instead of "natural" what you mean to say is "exogenous supplementation". What you need to realize is that all three of those compounds are natural. In addition, creatine and NO are both produced by the body as they are essential for life. Creatine is a form of energy currency which can act as a precursor to ATP for cellular energy. NO is a very important signaling molecule that you surely cannot live without because it regulates many many signaling pathways essential for life... sorry to get technical / wordy but I'm just trying to point out that these compounds are as natural as them come.

    Also, being that we are all unique individuals our bodies produce and utilize these things with varying efficiencies. Some people may metabolize things more quickly than others so supplementation may be necessary. I don't think its reasonable to call it "cheating". Some athletes how been found to have a natural advantage because they naturally have higher concentrations of erythropoietin in their blood which causes a higher red blood cell count. Should we call these individuals cheaters because of there genetic predisposition?
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    Dec 02, 2010 4:47 PM GMT
    Without protein powder, I'd go broke trying to get enough protein. I don't make significant gains with anything less than 250g/day. I actually save a LOT of money by using it, and my GI system appreciates it. (Only other way I saw gains was by drinking >1 gal milk/day plus my regular, meat-heavy diet. That much milk is hard on me)

    As for the other stuff, sometimes I use it, sometimes I don't. Creatine helps a little, but not much. NO just makes me feel buff. Caffeine is probably the most potent supplement. It definitely helps me build muscle.

    So yeah, I think of protein powder as an inexpensive type of food. As for the rest of the stuff, you really don't need it. It's just fun to use. icon_smile.gif
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    Dec 02, 2010 6:26 PM GMT
    First off, I'm not exactly a model of great fitness, so I won't presume to make a judgment on others' use of supplements.

    That being said, I prefer not to use them for several reasons.

    1. Cost. These supplements are just that: supplements. Which means, to me, using them in addition to the money you're spending on food. They seem to be a fairly expensive way of getting nutrients that I could be getting in regular food. I've never been able to afford them, and even if I could I'd rather save that money for something better and just utilize normal food instead.

    2. Other nutrients. I think we need to have a healthy skepticism of the claims of nutrition science. The reason I say that is because we still have a hell of a lot of learning to do about the way that the human body works, how it utilizes macro and micro nutrients, and what important compounds are found in the foods we eat. Because of that, taking a supplement that is based on one single compound or small set of compounds is going to be a trade-off; though you'll be getting something that science has found to be clearly necessary and beneficial for proper muscle growth and nutrition, by taking it as a supplement instead of eating more of the foods its found in you're giving up all the extra nutrients that are found in that food. Now, granted, it could also be that many of those things are totally unnecessary, but I'd rather eat the food that a compound is found in and get some additional nutrients that I wouldn't otherwise be getting.

    I will admit that part of this is also my skepticism of the need for the amount of supplements, vitamins, and medicine that Americans take for everything under the sun. But I'm certainly willing to believe I may be giving up a certain amount of efficiency in my fitness by not taking these supplements instead of eating the foods they're found in. I'm just willing to do that for the reasons outlined above.
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    Dec 02, 2010 6:42 PM GMT
    I would go all natural as the best option. The human body has been optimized for movements/muscle building for hundreds of thousands of years WITHOUT supplements.

    I actually feel sick taking supplements, i.e. anabolic protein power that is so sweet, or whey, multi vitamin pills, etc. Amazingly raw organic eggs in fruit smoothies are amazingly effective - the old fashion way.

    Having take a stance on the natural way, supplements are useful if you know what you are doing. Testing one at a time, and note long term side effects, i.e. the liver can't stand years of high protein intake.

    There are alot of yoga that help build muscles, LONG muscles, and keep the body in optimal shape. It's SUPER natural and nearly free.
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    Dec 02, 2010 9:13 PM GMT
    precurser4t saidI would go all natural as the best option. The human body has been optimized for movements/muscle building for hundreds of thousands of years WITHOUT supplements.


    Though I agree with most of the rest of your post, this is not a terribly good argument. Besides being a naturalistic fallacy, humans also used to not live much past 30 years until the scientific era and the advances of medical--and nutritional--science.

    But again, pretty much the rest of your post I agree with.
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    Dec 03, 2010 4:09 AM GMT
    It's not cheating. It's cost effective.
    My current daily meal budget is $30+ USD per day to get all the nutrition I need (without supplements).
    When I was doing protein powder, my daily meal budget was under $15/day.
    The effects are the same.
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    Dec 04, 2010 7:41 AM GMT
    When I started once upon a time, I used nothing- just ate a lot of carbs and chicken and stuff. I found that I needed more protein than I was getting so I started taking protein shakes. Then again- I am a bigger guy.
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    Dec 04, 2010 7:52 AM GMT
    Sometimes people run into a wall called genetics. Where they can't get passed a certain weight (muscle-wise). For someone like i'm i'd assume that's around 170ish.. maybe closer to 165. Naturally before i started this gym kick 6 times a day for the past year and 3 months i was at a measily 135 lbs. I hated how i looked.. I still find myself to be a bit on the thin side. I want to be bigger...

    While i understand the argument that natural is better yadda yadda etc.. Personally, if i don't like what i see in the mirror and i think that getting to be what i find attractive.. Shit i have no problems what so ever taking steroids. The only problem is that it's not legal unless i'm going to a doctor and telling them "hey.. i have a harmone dificiancy.. please "Halp" me"..

    I told myself that i was going to go the non steroidal route for 5 years and try to achieve a goal of 185, since that's my goal weight with anywhere between 8-12% body fat hopefully less... But i know it's an unrealistic goal because genetically i won't get to 185 with out extreme supplimentation.

    It's what i want ;) I do not consider steroids a cheat.. I consider it a last resort to achieve my goal..

    Funny thing is.. People that use steroids still have to put in a huge amount of work.. The minute they stop working out and still take steroids, what do you think happens to them? So, even steroids isn't really a cheat if you have to put in just as much work at the gym anyhow.