I got an idea Obama.....

  • mybud

    Posts: 11837

    Dec 02, 2010 3:43 PM GMT
    Stop all tax breaks for everyone....Hell... most of us under 250,000 will only receive about 500 bucks in tax breaks...Take the savings and create jobs...Mr. President we need a President with a back bone....Respectfully sir.....GROW SOME NUTS.....That is all....BUD
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    Dec 02, 2010 4:11 PM GMT
    Do you honestly believe that the government should be the institution in charge of job creation? How about letting the free market create jobs?
  • mybud

    Posts: 11837

    Dec 02, 2010 4:19 PM GMT
    ya they should
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    Dec 02, 2010 4:24 PM GMT
    mocktwinkie saidDo you honestly believe that the government should be the institution in charge of job creation? How about letting the free market create jobs?
    You are correct.. HOWEVER, the Governments job is to protect the citizens and thats what 'taxes' pay for.. how about EVERYONE paying taxes.. like the corporations that are being 'protected'.....just like everyone else?????
  • mybud

    Posts: 11837

    Dec 02, 2010 4:25 PM GMT
    mocktwinkie saidDo you honestly believe that the government should be the institution in charge of job creation? How about letting the free market create jobs?


    Spoken like a true Republican....The free market...Dude ...There is no free market......
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    Dec 02, 2010 4:27 PM GMT
    mybud said
    mocktwinkie saidDo you honestly believe that the government should be the institution in charge of job creation? How about letting the free market create jobs?


    Spoken like a true Republican....The free market...Dude ...There is no free market......
    Bought and sold on the floor of congress daily..
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    Dec 02, 2010 4:33 PM GMT
    mybud said
    mocktwinkie saidDo you honestly believe that the government should be the institution in charge of job creation? How about letting the free market create jobs?


    Spoken like a true Republican....The free market...Dude ...There is no free market......


    Well I suppose if you want to get that technical then we don't live in a "free" country either.
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    Dec 02, 2010 4:36 PM GMT
    mybud saidya they should


    So since the government can do it more efficiently than the free enterprise system why don't they just take over the whole thing, right? I mean, screw the people who own the health-food store down the road! Just tax the hell outta them!
  • mybud

    Posts: 11837

    Dec 02, 2010 4:40 PM GMT
    mocktwinkie said
    mybud said
    mocktwinkie saidDo you honestly believe that the government should be the institution in charge of job creation? How about letting the free market create jobs?


    Spoken like a true Republican....The free market...Dude ...There is no free market......


    Well I suppose if you want to get that technical then we don't live in a "free" country either.


    Your smarter than I thought....Right...We have no free country....
  • mybud

    Posts: 11837

    Dec 02, 2010 4:42 PM GMT
    mocktwinkie said
    mybud saidya they should


    So since the government can do it more efficiently than the free enterprise system why don't they just take over the whole thing, right? I mean, screw the people who own the health-food store down the road! Just tax the hell outta them!


    Ya ....if They're making over 250,000 or more tax those fuckers properly and as Good Americans living in our...ha "free society"...they should be honored to do so.....
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    Dec 02, 2010 4:48 PM GMT
    MOck, up here we have P3s.
    Here's how P3s can work.
    Gov't asks business to build a bridge or a highway, pays them, they employ workers then they (business) maintain the bridge with their EMPLOYEES, and charge tolls, part of which goes to gov't and rest is profit for the company. Same thing with roads.

    It's doable.


    http://www.pppcouncil.ca/

  • conservativej...

    Posts: 2465

    Dec 02, 2010 5:05 PM GMT
    My belief is we have created a government whose "configuration" or "business model" if you will is to support large numbers of folks whom for whatever reason cannot provide, through their own independent actions, part of their household income or in many cases any of their household income, to sustain themselves.

    With all due respect to both my conservative friends and to some degree folks of liberal persuasion, in my opinion, America has passed over the tipping point where those not being able to generate sufficient household income will overburden those who do produce sufficient and excess household income.

    In short, the American Dream is dying.

    Further, TropicalMark had commented "EVERYONE paying taxes.. like the corporations that are being 'protected'", referring it seems to corporations I assume he believes are breaking some U.S. based law and not paying taxes. Mark, you need to give specific examples.

    I can give you an example Mark will not like. I own companies, C corps, in different locations around the globe. These companies are not U.S. based companies. They, the company owns no U.S. income. In fact, if you know little at all about Internal Revenue Service code -- much written by liberals I might add -- you would realize it has never been the intent nor can it be due to the laws and treaties of many countries -- to tax a company incorporated in another country. If a company based in France conducts business in America it must form a U.S. base corporation through which to operate. The U.S. corporation is the company that is taxed, not the parent company incorporated in France. So international or multi-national companies cannot truly be those "protected" companies you refer to in your post.

    I think we can move beyond our disagreement here on RealJock. Go vote. I did. Millions did. For now greater control has shifted to the right. Conservatives will express through their votes in both State Legislatures and in Congress their views. It is their right just as it is for liberals.

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    Dec 02, 2010 5:18 PM GMT
    conservativejock said
    In short, the American Dream is dying.

    Further, TropicalMark had commented "EVERYONE paying taxes.. like the corporations that are being 'protected'", referring it seems to corporations I assume he believes are breaking some U.S. based law and not paying taxes. Mark, you need to give specific examples.


    Your first quote above is correct, It IS dying unfortunately. Greed is strangling it to death.
    Secondly, the US corporate income tax rate is 35%. Yet this year, Google, which made $5.5 billion in revenues, only paid an effective tax rate of 2.4%. Indeed, it’s not unusual for a corporation to pay only 6-7% in effective taxes.

    Such numbers put you and me and most small businesses to shame. What gives?

    It turns out that tax credits aren’t the only trick corporations use to evade taxes. From Intel to Bath & Body Works, most big American corporations have a subsidiary and income shifting scheme that radically skews the amounts they end up paying the IRS.
    The feds would rather get what they can without changing the law: Google and the IRS negotiated for three years before coming to “an arrangement” that let the company execute its transfer pricing strategy.

    What I meant by my statement is to eliminate ALL tax loopholes, negotiations, and deductions. I am a strong proponent of a fair flat tax system..
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    Dec 02, 2010 5:27 PM GMT
    conservativejock saidMy belief is we have created a government whose "configuration" or "business model" if you will is to support large numbers of folks whom for whatever reason cannot provide, through their own independent actions, part of their household income or in many cases any of their household income, to sustain themselves.

    With all due respect to both my conservative friends and to some degree folks of liberal persuasion, in my opinion, America has passed over the tipping point where those not being able to generate sufficient household income will overburden those who do produce sufficient and excess household income.

    In short, the American Dream is dying.

    Further, TropicalMark had commented "EVERYONE paying taxes.. like the corporations that are being 'protected'", referring it seems to corporations I assume he believes are breaking some U.S. based law and not paying taxes. Mark, you need to give specific examples.

    I can give you an example Mark will not like. I own companies, C corps, in different locations around the globe. These companies are not U.S. based companies. They, the company owns no U.S. income. In fact, if you know little at all about Internal Revenue Service code -- much written by liberals I might add -- you would realize it has never been the intent nor can it be due to the laws and treaties of many countries -- to tax a company incorporated in another country. If a company based in France conducts business in America it must form a U.S. base corporation through which to operate. The U.S. corporation is the company that is taxed, not the parent company incorporated in France. So international or multi-national companies cannot truly be those "protected" companies you refer to in your post.

    I think we can move beyond our disagreement here on RealJock. Go vote. I did. Millions did. For now greater control has shifted to the right. Conservatives will express through their votes in both State Legislatures and in Congress their views. It is their right just as it is for liberals.



    Unsurprising, since you are an avowed greedy bastard. Why would you have a company in the country that produced you and provided for your opportunities? Why employ American workers when they're SO darn expensive? Why do anything with a sense of morality or ethical consideration for your countrymen?
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    Dec 02, 2010 5:40 PM GMT
    mybud said
    mocktwinkie said
    mybud saidya they should


    So since the government can do it more efficiently than the free enterprise system why don't they just take over the whole thing, right? I mean, screw the people who own the health-food store down the road! Just tax the hell outta them!


    Ya ....if They're making over 250,000 or more tax those fuckers properly and as Good Americans living in our...ha "free society"...they should be honored to do so.....
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I couldn't agree with you more !!! and I'm also with you on Obama GROWING SOME BALLS, I am so sick of reading where he bargains away what the public is behind him on, at mere threats put out by republicans. He should be saying flat out NO to continued tax breaks beyond incomes of $250,000, poll after poll shows the public is behind him on this. What in hell happened to his spine !!!!
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    Dec 02, 2010 5:42 PM GMT
    realifedad said What in hell happened to his spine !!!!
    I dont think he ever had one actually.. sad.
  • Mepark

    Posts: 806

    Dec 02, 2010 5:51 PM GMT
    mybud saidStop all tax breaks for everyone....Hell... most of us under 250,000 will only receive about 500 bucks in tax breaks...Take the savings and create jobs...Mr. President we need a President with a back bone....Respectfully sir.....GROW SOME NUTS.....That is all....BUD


    Wasn't that the purpose of the stimulus package?

    Does a President call up a McDonald's or GM CEO and tell them to create a job. Better idea: you and I can create one!
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    Dec 02, 2010 6:33 PM GMT
    Mepark said
    mybud saidStop all tax breaks for everyone....Hell... most of us under 250,000 will only receive about 500 bucks in tax breaks...Take the savings and create jobs...Mr. President we need a President with a back bone....Respectfully sir.....GROW SOME NUTS.....That is all....BUD


    Wasn't that the purpose of the stimulus package?

    Does a President call up a McDonald's or GM CEO and tell them to create a job. Better idea: you and I can create one!
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Well my friend, yes, it would be best if you and I create jobs, but first we have to have demand or orders for the goods we want to sell, then we will hire someone to make those goods to sell. That's why now is not the time to cut back on safety nets for the lower and middle income groups who are proven to be far more likely to spend, which creates demand, and orders for goods. Giving money to the wealthy who only make up 2 to 4 % will not create jobs, they're not dumb enough to hire someone to make something that there's no demand or orders for. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> There is a place here for government to spend on infrastructure thereby creating jobs, so the working classes have money to spend on things they need, which creates demand and orders , that in turn spurs the wealthy to then hire more people to make the goods to fill the demand and orders. Ten years of the wealthy's income increasing at record rates DID NOT CREATE JOBS or we wouldn't be in this nearly 10% unemployed situation. Its against the wealthy's own interests to keep grabbing more and more at the middle classes expense, because it comes right to where we are, few in the middle class and lower income groups have money to spend.
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    Dec 02, 2010 6:54 PM GMT
    I'm so tired of people throwing around the word "greed". What is greed? Having more than you need? Do you really need that computer you're sitting in front of so you can argue that people shouldn't have things they don't need?

    Is wanting a bigger house greed? What size is "okay" according to the greedometer?? How about someone who drives an Aveo wanting a Camry, is that greed?

    The American dream RUNS on greed, and as long as someone isn't breaking the law and hurting someone else to make their fortunes, it's a great thing, but unfortunately some people are just too stupid to grasp basic concepts.
  • conservativej...

    Posts: 2465

    Dec 02, 2010 7:07 PM GMT
    TropicalMark said
    conservativejock said
    In short, the American Dream is dying.

    Further, TropicalMark had commented "EVERYONE paying taxes.. like the corporations that are being 'protected'", referring it seems to corporations I assume he believes are breaking some U.S. based law and not paying taxes. Mark, you need to give specific examples.


    Your first quote above is correct, It IS dying unfortunately. Greed is strangling it to death.
    Secondly, the US corporate income tax rate is 35%. Yet this year, Google, which made $5.5 billion in revenues, only paid an effective tax rate of 2.4%. Indeed, it’s not unusual for a corporation to pay only 6-7% in effective taxes.

    Such numbers put you and me and most small businesses to shame. What gives?

    It turns out that tax credits aren’t the only trick corporations use to evade taxes. From Intel to Bath & Body Works, most big American corporations have a subsidiary and income shifting scheme that radically skews the amounts they end up paying the IRS.
    The feds would rather get what they can without changing the law: Google and the IRS negotiated for three years before coming to “an arrangement” that let the company execute its transfer pricing strategy.

    What I meant by my statement is to eliminate ALL tax loopholes, negotiations, and deductions. I am a strong proponent of a fair flat tax system..


    Good plan. What rate do you want for the flat tax? This is for everyone and as you described removing all deductions, both corporate and private.

    Let's start with 17%. Sound good?
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    Dec 02, 2010 7:17 PM GMT
    mybud saidStop all tax breaks for everyone....Hell... most of us under 250,000 will only receive about 500 bucks in tax breaks...Take the savings and create jobs...Mr. President we need a President with a back bone....Respectfully sir.....GROW SOME NUTS.....That is all....BUD



    It's unfair and factually inaccurate to blame Obama.
    It's the pols in Congress who will determine whether or not the failed Bush tax cuts get extended.
    They care more about getting their lame asses reelected than they do about doing what's right or best.
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    Dec 02, 2010 8:50 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    TropicalMark saidHOWEVER, the Governments job is to protect the citizens and thats what 'taxes' pay for.. how about EVERYONE paying taxes.. like the corporations that are being 'protected'.....just like everyone else?????


    Careful.... By saying EVERYONE you are including the 48% of households that pay absolutely NO Federal income tax.

    Care to amend your "EVERYONE" shriek?



    He didn't specify "income tax" and you know very well that the 48% pays a host of federal (and occasionally regressive) taxes.

    The reality is that those corporations and wealthy individuals use up more of the "commons" than do middle class or poor people and have much more to protect through military intervention than do the poor. icon_rolleyes.gif
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    Dec 02, 2010 8:55 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    mybud said
    Ya ....if They're making over 250,000 or more tax those fuckers properly and as Good Americans living in our...ha "free society"...they should be honored to do so.....


    What has someone earning $250,000 or more (or in the case of individuals, $200,000 or more) done to deserve to be called a "fucker?"




    They've been recieving a much greater proportion of tax cuts for the last 9 years - thank to the Bush/Repub tax cuts.
    Which is blatantly unfair and immoral.
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    Dec 02, 2010 8:58 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    Christian73 said
    Unsurprising, since you are an avowed greedy bastard.


    And again, the liberal launches into a personal attack on an RJ member who has a different political point of view...




    ...which is something that RJ right-wingers are at least as guilty of.

    The only difference is - liberal RJ members don't CONSTANTLY and pathetically whine about it the way right-winger RJ members do.
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    Dec 02, 2010 9:01 PM GMT
    mocktwinkie saidI'm so tired of people throwing around the word "greed". What is greed? Having more than you need? Do you really need that computer you're sitting in front of so you can argue that people shouldn't have things they don't need?

    Is wanting a bigger house greed? What size is "okay" according to the greedometer?? How about someone who drives an Aveo wanting a Camry, is that greed?

    The American dream RUNS on greed, and as long as someone isn't breaking the law and hurting someone else to make their fortunes, it's a great thing, but unfortunately some people are just too stupid to grasp basic concepts.


    "Greed is an excessive desire to possess wealth or goods with the intention to keep it for yourself." So that's the definition.

    And America does not "run on greed". There is a difference between wanting what is commonly understood as a comfortable existence (your necessities and a portion more for niceties), and needing a 17 acre estate and 6 private jets. Even that, I wouldn't begrudge those who wish to pursue that, but they can do so while paying back their fair share to the government and community that makes their wealth possible.

    But if you achieve wealth, you can either be thankful for it and give back to your community through taxes and philanthropy, which would not be greed, or you can scream and cry and threaten to move your jobs to China, which would be greed.

    Frankly, I watch House Hunters (boyfriend's influence) and I see single people who want a 5 bedroom, 4 bathroom house. For what? Why in God's name would anyone want to clean four bathrooms!

    THAT, is a distortion of the American Dream, which is really about doing well (financially) but also about doing good (morally/ethically).

    A single person does not need a 5 bedroom, 4 bathroom hat. In fact, a family of six doesn't need a 5 bedroom, 4 bathroom house.

    So what drives that? Marketing and constant advertising and (you'll love this) the constant pushing of that very same distortion of the American Dream by corporations that make money off the relentless pursuit of wealth and excess by the majority of Americans who have put themselves into enormous debt in trying to achieve it.