Why Drugs Should Be Legalized

  • swimbikerun

    Posts: 2835

    Dec 28, 2010 4:44 PM GMT
    Friedman makes some great points here:


    Portugal's drug easing policies has some
    http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2010/12/portugals-drug-policy-pays-eyes-lessons/

    USA Number One!

    https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/United_States_incarceration_rate

    Incarceration for possession or even transport of a small amount of marijuana and just about every other drug is a complete and utter waste of resources. It fails society since resources could be better used and it hurts individuals who are doing no harm but to themselves.
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    Dec 28, 2010 5:21 PM GMT
    Best reason: Because they're fun. icon_cool.gif
  • allatonce

    Posts: 904

    Dec 28, 2010 5:29 PM GMT
    There are some good points. And it is interesting that it is often more conservative voters that push against drug decriminalization while at the same time protest against governments telling them what to consume or buy. I can't even fathom the amount of resources that have been wasted and lives that have been lost on this war against drugs nonsense.
  • swimbikerun

    Posts: 2835

    Dec 28, 2010 6:10 PM GMT
    allatonce saidThere are some good points. And it is interesting that it is often more conservative voters that push against drug decriminalization while at the same time protest against governments telling them what to consume or buy. I can't even fathom the amount of resources that have been wasted and lives that have been lost on this war against drugs nonsense.

    Some of the people I met in jail seemed to be pretty harmless but were doing long sentences for drugs. Of course looks can be deceiving but Friedman is correct in that imprisonment tends to be an excellent educational system for producing criminals.
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    Dec 28, 2010 10:42 PM GMT
    Having been in recovery for 20+ years, I would have very strong reservations about the legalization of MOST drugs. I tend to be a little more lenient when it comes to pot....but that is about it.
    One of the primary reasons many people do not do drugs is because it is illegal and that in itself is a deterrent to many. There are, of course, a larger number of people who fully understand the dangers and poor judgment of introducing unnecessary chemicals into your body.
    I CAN see some benefits from legalization:
    Rid the streets of drug dealers
    Lessen the chance of people mixing drugs improperly with the possible end result being death. Privatization possibly improving quality.
    Lowering the possibility that some people would literally kill for their next high.

    BUT, on the other hand, the negatives far out weigh any good that could possibly come from legalization...such as:
    The onslaught of people becoming addicts would grow immeasurably.
    Thus, treatment facilities would be overrun beyond their capabilities.
    Government involvement would no doubt create even more corruption than already exists.
    I would have to say Hell No to this idea!!!
  • swimbikerun

    Posts: 2835

    Dec 28, 2010 11:33 PM GMT
    Friendsrbetter saidHaving been in recovery for 20+ years, I would have very strong reservations about the legalization of MOST drugs. I tend to be a little more lenient when it comes to pot....but that is about it.
    One of the primary reasons many people do not do drugs is because it is illegal and that in itself is a deterrent to many. There are, of course, a larger number of people who fully understand the dangers and poor judgment of introducing unnecessary chemicals into your body.
    I CAN see some benefits from legalization:
    Rid the streets of drug dealers
    Lessen the chance of people mixing drugs improperly with the possible end result being death. Privatization possibly improving quality.
    Lowering the possibility that some people would literally kill for their next high.

    BUT, on the other hand, the negatives far out weigh any good that could possibly come from legalization...such as:
    The onslaught of people becoming addicts would grow immeasurably.
    Thus, treatment facilities would be overrun beyond their capabilities.
    Government involvement would no doubt create even more corruption than already exists.
    I would have to say Hell No to this idea!!!

    But why then is alcohol legal? Cigarettes kill a lot of people too. So does overeating. People are allowed to make all these choices, good and bad.
    I do not think the amount of drug users would grow 'immeasurably'. I'm not sure what you mean by this term as people are finite in number and therefore such a number could be measured.
    In Portugal, the social network has allowed many people to get off the streets and make better lives for themselves.
    Finally, we're not talking about 'more' government involvement just a better use of resources. a shifting of resources.
    Instead of cops, courts and jailers, counselors, rehab clinics and the like.
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    Dec 29, 2010 1:34 AM GMT
    "BUT, on the other hand, the negatives far out weigh any good that could possibly come from legalization...such as:
    The onslaught of people becoming addicts would grow immeasurably.
    Thus, treatment facilities would be overrun beyond their capabilities.
    Government involvement would no doubt create even more corruption than already exists.
    I would have to say Hell No to this idea!!!"

    I am all for legalization of drugs. While I may not part take, I think it is so stupid that as free people we can go to prison for what we put into our bodies. I also think with legalization...control quallity, regulate, tax it to hell to pay for treatment. Also the amount we pay for prisons would go down.

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    Dec 29, 2010 2:00 AM GMT
    Obviously...

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    Dec 29, 2010 2:03 AM GMT
    The Dutch obviously have more self control than Americans or Canadians. Viz. the God-given right to obesity. icon_razz.gif
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    Dec 29, 2010 2:10 AM GMT
    http://neurobonkers.com/?p=1032E

    the war on drugs needs to be stopped. it's a waste of money. governments won't even listen to evidence. portugal is an excellent example where decriminalization is showing the opposite of what the U.S. wants to hear. in the link above a study shows that decriminalization works; and what does the UK government do? they decide they don't need science or studies anymore.

    WTF?!
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    Dec 29, 2010 2:14 AM GMT
    Someplace, during the last couple of days, I read a long feature about drug decriminilization in Portugal, which appears to have worked as planned. Can't find it right now... NYT maybe?

    Here's a link to an older story.
    http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1893946,00.html

    I do worry sometimes about the strategy of decriminilizing possession, but not distribution, because that seems to maintain the violent criminal enterprise.
  • swimbikerun

    Posts: 2835

    Dec 29, 2010 2:21 AM GMT
    If drugs were legal, then ambitious young men and women might have more incentive to seek work an employment in more productive avenues of commerce:
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    Dec 29, 2010 8:00 AM GMT
    allatonce saidThere are some good points. And it is interesting that it is often more conservative voters that push against drug decriminalization while at the same time protest against governments telling them what to consume or buy. I can't even fathom the amount of resources that have been wasted and lives that have been lost on this war against drugs nonsense.
    I'm glad I'm not the only one who has noticed this.
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    Dec 29, 2010 1:51 PM GMT
    Bullwinklemoos said
    allatonce saidThere are some good points. And it is interesting that it is often more conservative voters that push against drug decriminalization while at the same time protest against governments telling them what to consume or buy. I can't even fathom the amount of resources that have been wasted and lives that have been lost on this war against drugs nonsense.
    I'm glad I'm not the only one who has noticed this.


    + 2

    I really don't care for drugs, however I do not see the difference between allowing alcohol and allowing drugs to be legal.

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    Dec 29, 2010 1:55 PM GMT
    I may get blasted for this but marijuana and cocaine. I mean, cocaine used to be legal at the turn of the last century. Hell, parents used to give it to their children for sore throats and Coca-Cola used to contain actual cocaine as well. It was around WWI that some politicians decided to make it illegal and I believe it had to do with social attitudes about race more than anything else. I will try to dig up the link.

    One reason that 'conservative' voters push against it is because they view all so-called drugs as being harmful but have NO issue with drinking 6 cups of Starbucks coffee 7 days week nor eating fast food at every meal. This is just as dangerous as consuming copious amounts of drugs, you know? Can we spell H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T??? But chances are they won't do anything about it because they could NEVER live with caffeine and fried food.
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    Dec 29, 2010 5:33 PM GMT

    COLUMBUSITE SAID:
    "One reason that 'conservative' voters push against it is because they view all so-called drugs as being harmful but have NO issue with drinking 6 cups of Starbucks coffee 7 days week nor eating fast food at every meal. This is just as dangerous as consuming copious amounts of drugs, you know? Can we spell H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T??? But chances are they won't do anything about it because they could NEVER live with caffeine and fried food. "

    So, "copious" amounts of caffeine and food are just as bad as "copious" amount of meth, crack and heroine???
    Perhaps you're on to something here...they could open chains of:
    STAR-crack
    International House of Heroine AND
    McMeth Drive Throughs
    Just think about the amount of time addicts could save by having it so readily available...they could use that time to get high and DIE!!! And if they were placed in upper class neighborhoods, there wouldn't be the problem of getting shot while driving around looking for your connection!!!

    BRILLIANT....JUST F*CKING BRILLIANT!!!

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    Dec 29, 2010 5:37 PM GMT
    Friendsrbetter said
    COLUMBUSITE SAID:
    "One reason that 'conservative' voters push against it is because they view all so-called drugs as being harmful but have NO issue with drinking 6 cups of Starbucks coffee 7 days week nor eating fast food at every meal. This is just as dangerous as consuming copious amounts of drugs, you know? Can we spell H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T??? But chances are they won't do anything about it because they could NEVER live with caffeine and fried food. "

    So, "copious" amounts of caffeine and food are just as bad as "copious" amount of meth, crack and heroine???
    Perhaps you're on to something here...they could open chains of:
    STAR-crack
    International House of Heroine AND
    McMeth Drive Throughs
    Just think about the amount of time addicts could save by having it so readily available...they could use that time to get high and DIE!!! And if they were placed in upper class neighborhoods, there wouldn't be the problem of getting shot while driving around looking for your connection!!!

    BRILLIANT....JUST F*CKING BRILLIANT!!!



    Well...EXCUSE ME!
  • swimbikerun

    Posts: 2835

    Dec 29, 2010 7:49 PM GMT
    Friendsrbetter said
    COLUMBUSITE SAID:
    "One reason that 'conservative' voters push against it is because they view all so-called drugs as being harmful but have NO issue with drinking 6 cups of Starbucks coffee 7 days week nor eating fast food at every meal. This is just as dangerous as consuming copious amounts of drugs, you know? Can we spell H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T??? But chances are they won't do anything about it because they could NEVER live with caffeine and fried food. "

    So, "copious" amounts of caffeine and food are just as bad as "copious" amount of meth, crack and heroine???
    Perhaps you're on to something here...they could open chains of:
    STAR-crack
    International House of Heroine AND
    McMeth Drive Throughs
    Just think about the amount of time addicts could save by having it so readily available...they could use that time to get high and DIE!!! And if they were placed in upper class neighborhoods, there wouldn't be the problem of getting shot while driving around looking for your connection!!!

    BRILLIANT....JUST F*CKING BRILLIANT!!!



    Nope, copious amounts of food actually cause more deaths than all other substance abuses combined:

    Heart disease: 616,067


    Cancer: 562,875
    Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 135,952
    Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 127,924
    Accidents (unintentional injuries): 123,706
    Alzheimer's disease: 74,632
    Diabetes: 71,382
    Influenza and Pneumonia: 52,717
    Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 46,448
    Septicemia: 34,828

    http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/deaths.htm

    http://www.statisticstop10.com/Causes_of_Death_in_US.html

    Wow. The actual threat to Americans for Drug Abuse is totally out of proportion with reality.
  • Nayro

    Posts: 1825

    Dec 29, 2010 7:52 PM GMT
    It's legal here and i rarely see people having trouble with drugaddiction. But that might be biased ofcourse.. I think it's a good thing that soft drugs are legal here. I'm not a user, ofcourse I tried it but not more than that.
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    Dec 29, 2010 8:06 PM GMT
    Daelin saidIt's legal here and i rarely see people having trouble with drugaddiction. But that might be biased ofcourse.. I think it's a good thing that soft drugs are legal here. I'm not a user, ofcourse I tried it but not more than that.


    It's illegal here and I've rarely seen people having obvious problems with drug addiction. Though I rarely see it, it CLEARLY exists, perhaps even rampantly. I've never used any of it and keep away from people who I know or assume have dependencies. (I have great respect for people who are able to regulate their body naturally using their own brains.)

    Why legalize it? :
    1- FDA regulations making it as safe as possible.
    2- Taxes (City, State, Federal) = legitimate income (like from alcohol and cigarette purchases; speeding and parking tickets).
    3- Removes lots of the the mystique and resulting desirability from otherwise illegal crap.
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    Dec 29, 2010 10:10 PM GMT
    [size=25]http://www.flickr.com/photos/contemporary_angels/5304725630/

    RECENT STUDY DONE IN THE UK BY TOP SCIENTISTS AND PUBLISHED IN THE LANCET MEDICAL JOURNAL - OF COURSE TTHERE WAS A MEDIA BLOCKOUT - Alchohol and tobacco are worse than Pot, Ecstacy or LSD!!
  • allatonce

    Posts: 904

    Dec 30, 2010 12:37 AM GMT
    Friendsrbetter said
    COLUMBUSITE SAID:
    "One reason that 'conservative' voters push against it is because they view all so-called drugs as being harmful but have NO issue with drinking 6 cups of Starbucks coffee 7 days week nor eating fast food at every meal. This is just as dangerous as consuming copious amounts of drugs, you know? Can we spell H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T??? But chances are they won't do anything about it because they could NEVER live with caffeine and fried food. "

    So, "copious" amounts of caffeine and food are just as bad as "copious" amount of meth, crack and heroine???
    Perhaps you're on to something here...they could open chains of:
    STAR-crack
    International House of Heroine AND
    McMeth Drive Throughs
    Just think about the amount of time addicts could save by having it so readily available...they could use that time to get high and DIE!!! And if they were placed in upper class neighborhoods, there wouldn't be the problem of getting shot while driving around looking for your connection!!!

    BRILLIANT....JUST F*CKING BRILLIANT!!!



    This is of course the other side of the argument. That making it legal may make it more accessible and therefore cause more people to consume.

    There seem to be examples of decriminalization that prove otherwise. Portugal decriminalized drug possession a while ago now, and that appears to have been a large success. Check this article:

    http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=portugal-drug-decriminalization

    Also, as an economist, I would say that prices for many black market drugs are high because a large part of the costs going into the product are due to the illegality and the lack of safety in supplying them. This extra money goes directly towards funding drug wars and illegal activities a lot worse than simple drug consumption. Many people have died and states have been weakened because of this.

    If the United States and other countries in the West followed Portugal's example, and took all of the money put into fighting drugs and put it into prevention and treatment of addiction, results would be a lot better. Sometimes you can't fight fire with fire. In these times of burgeoning deficits, we cannot continue to try this failed war that causes many more deaths than it prevents.

    I am glad that more and more people are thinking this way. Addicts need to be helped, and isolating them by forcing them into the fringes of society by making their habits illegal is a lot less effective than attempting to incorporate them into society. Others who choose to use drugs that may (and those who never would) become addicts are also not helped in any ways by being sent to prisons and made more hardened by being socialized with criminals.
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    Dec 30, 2010 6:17 PM GMT
    allatonce said
    Friendsrbetter said
    COLUMBUSITE SAID:
    "One reason that 'conservative' voters push against it is because they view all so-called drugs as being harmful but have NO issue with drinking 6 cups of Starbucks coffee 7 days week nor eating fast food at every meal. This is just as dangerous as consuming copious amounts of drugs, you know? Can we spell H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T??? But chances are they won't do anything about it because they could NEVER live with caffeine and fried food. "

    So, "copious" amounts of caffeine and food are just as bad as "copious" amount of meth, crack and heroine???
    Perhaps you're on to something here...they could open chains of:
    STAR-crack
    International House of Heroine AND
    McMeth Drive Throughs
    Just think about the amount of time addicts could save by having it so readily available...they could use that time to get high and DIE!!! And if they were placed in upper class neighborhoods, there wouldn't be the problem of getting shot while driving around looking for your connection!!!

    BRILLIANT....JUST F*CKING BRILLIANT!!!



    This is of course the other side of the argument. That making it legal may make it more accessible and therefore cause more people to consume.

    There seem to be examples of decriminalization that prove otherwise. Portugal decriminalized drug possession a while ago now, and that appears to have been a large success. Check this article:

    http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=portugal-drug-decriminalization

    Also, as an economist, I would say that prices for many black market drugs are high because a large part of the costs going into the product are due to the illegality and the lack of safety in supplying them. This extra money goes directly towards funding drug wars and illegal activities a lot worse than simple drug consumption. Many people have died and states have been weakened because of this.

    If the United States and other countries in the West followed Portugal's example, and took all of the money put into fighting drugs and put it into prevention and treatment of addiction, results would be a lot better. Sometimes you can't fight fire with fire. In these times of burgeoning deficits, we cannot continue to try this failed war that causes many more deaths than it prevents.

    I am glad that more and more people are thinking this way. Addicts need to be helped, and isolating them by forcing them into the fringes of society by making their habits illegal is a lot less effective than attempting to incorporate them into society. Others who choose to use drugs that may (and those who never would) become addicts are also not helped in any ways by being sent to prisons and made more hardened by being socialized with criminals.


    BRAVO!!! THIS ACTUALLY MAKES SENSE!!
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    Dec 30, 2010 6:28 PM GMT
    Friendsrbetter said
    COLUMBUSITE SAID:
    "One reason that 'conservative' voters push against it is because they view all so-called drugs as being harmful but have NO issue with drinking 6 cups of Starbucks coffee 7 days week nor eating fast food at every meal. This is just as dangerous as consuming copious amounts of drugs, you know? Can we spell H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T??? But chances are they won't do anything about it because they could NEVER live with caffeine and fried food. "

    So, "copious" amounts of caffeine and food are just as bad as "copious" amount of meth, crack and heroine???
    Perhaps you're on to something here...they could open chains of:
    STAR-crack
    International House of Heroine AND
    McMeth Drive Throughs
    Just think about the amount of time addicts could save by having it so readily available...they could use that time to get high and DIE!!! And if they were placed in upper class neighborhoods, there wouldn't be the problem of getting shot while driving around looking for your connection!!!

    BRILLIANT....JUST F*CKING BRILLIANT!!!



    I still stand by my word no matter how much you 'shout' at me with bold type and capital letters. Additionally, I DO NOT appreciate your tone and sarcastic comments.
  • swimjohn

    Posts: 252

    Dec 30, 2010 6:43 PM GMT
    amar_m saidObviously...



    Just watching 20 seconds of that man's show to see someone make fun of him pissed me off. America is by far the dysfunctional country in this regard.