Gay Men married to Women

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    Dec 30, 2010 5:58 PM GMT
    It is amazing how many hot gay men are on RealJock that are married to women! Some have kids, some don't. Some are messing around. Some aren't. But they all are doing the same juggling act: how to be honorable to your family while remaining true to yourself.

    Real Jock is such an amazing place. I think this is the perfect place to open this discussion and support our gay brothers with wives.

    Some of these men have told their wives they are gay. Some are living their lives in secret. Some came out to their wives later in their marriage. Some, like me, started into their marriages open to their wives about their sexuality. I just wanted kids, to experience the circle of life.

    Some married guys are having sex with other guys - some of their wives know this and some don't. Other guys are living faithful to their wives, but with a deep, unfulfilled inner longing. I fall into this category. My wife and I discuss this. I am lucky. My wife is fairly understanding. After all, I stopped to tell her I was gay on our first kiss.

    Some guys are living with deep longings for men, but are in deep fear of the repercussions of telling their wives. Some guys knew who they were all along, while others only discovered or acknowledged their love of men after they were married.

    After 12 years of being the only male body I have touched, I fell in love with a young man at the hot springs. We have not had sex. Yet? But, my wife could see the life light up in me and asked what's up. When I told her, it actually opened wonderful discussions between us and our marriage has been stronger and happier than it has been in years. The kids are even happier because the adults are less stressed and happier.

    I needed to acknowledge that, if I was going to ask to experience my feelings more openly and fully, with or without engaging in sex with men again, I would need to grant my wife the same openness and freedom.

    When you invite anyone into your life, you invite in everyone else that is part of their life. Quickies at the gym or in the park probably don't fall into this category, and this lack of complication is one of the joys of gay sex, but even then, once I start having sex with men again, I will not be able to have free, unprotected sex with my wife any more, as we do now.

    I am definitely wired for men.
    There was never a doubt about this.
    It is a wonderful thing to have someone go nuts wanting you sexually. We all experience this on Real Jock every time someone hot lists us or expresses their unbridled spontaneous lust for us.

    I realized, my wife needed to feel this as well, to fully experience joy in her life. She needed to be genuinely lusted after by a man and she wasn't getting that from me. Just because you can go through the actions with a woman doesn't mean you have given her what she needs. It's a cheap shot to say you have done your duty and feel off the hook.

    I think my wife is more open to my longings because I have recognized her right to experience being the object of some man's desire. Since we have children, we don't want to invite idiots or dangerous people into our home just because we were horny. The whole idea here is to improve our lives, and not make them more complicated.

    Beyond sex, which this discussion is about, we all have the right and responsibility to live our lives to the fullest so that we can help others do the same. The cumulative effect, in theory, is that we make this a better world for all of us.

    We are adults and we are all individuals. Regardless of what the noise in your head says, or all the people in the past of your life say, you have not only the right, but the ability to design your life to be anything you want it to be. This means you can design the way you want to define your marriage to be any way you want it to be, regardless of traditional definitions. It is your life. Not anyone else's.

    If you genuinely respectful of others (doesn't mean you have to agree with them) and not just forcing your desires on them, you will be able to move forward in your life with a sense of strength and confidence because in your heart you will know you have done the right thing.

    So guys, I know you are here. I have exchanged emails with many of you. Real Jock has given us a safe place to openly share our experiences, longings, challenges, etc. so we can share, learn and grow together.

    All my best always,
    Anton
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    Dec 30, 2010 9:12 PM GMT
    Great post, even tho this topic has been covered before on here, i think it is one that warrants a lot of discussion because I think there are a lot of us guys who have found ourselves in one or more of these sits.......Keithicon_cool.gif
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    Dec 31, 2010 3:52 PM GMT
    Thanks, Keith.

    I saw that forum post with a similar title.
    The energy there started with the usual Real Jock respect and somehow slipped off into...

    What I love about the Real Jock environment is that most of the guys seem to be very supportive and encouraging of each other.

    All my best always,
    Anton
  • Ironman4U

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    Dec 31, 2010 4:28 PM GMT
    Anton, I think you have definitely hit a subject that applies to many of the 45+ guys on this site. I agree that we all have taken our different paths and done what we need to do. I respect your integrity of being faithful to your wife with full disclosure of your attraction for men.

    For me, I married my college sweetheart and did my best to suppress my physical attraction to men. I never acted on those attractions and thought that I could live my life as others expected me too. And I truly did love my wife.

    Over time, 12 years into our marriage, I realized that my attractions for men were not subsiding. I felt to be fair to my wife, my daughter and myself; I had a choice to make. Either address these feelings and attractions or forever stuff them back into the dark recesses of my mind. In my own soul searching, I realized that I could not be the husband and father that I wanted to be if I was not truly happy. And it was the happiness of my wife and daughter that mattered most. I could sacrifice but they shouldn't have to. Ultimately, my decision was to share the truth with my wife and divorce.

    To say it was the hardest thing I've ever done or will ever do in my life is an understatement. But I have not one regret. Today, about 18 years later, I am an openly gay man with an amazing relationship with my daughter and a life that fulfills me.

    For most guys going through the same thing, I offer some simple advice for what it's worth.

    Courage - Have the courage to face whatever you need to face. That may be the courage to be totally open and honest with yourself and your wife.

    Acceptance - Accept the consequences of your open conversation. This can be scary and really depends on how your wife reacts and what you want your future to be. For some like me, it may be to accept that you have to give up your life as you know it, risk losing everything and start over.

    Peace - Whatever the outcome, be at peace that you have done the right thing. Regardless, you acted with courage, you accepted the consequences and you are living in a way that restores integrity to your life.

    I wish you all peace. - Will
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    Dec 31, 2010 4:48 PM GMT
    Count me in on this discussion Anton. I had the same experience in opening up to my wife a couple of months ago. We're having more honest and productive and intimate discussions than ever before. Both painful and fulfilling. We want to stay together if we can because we have such a strong foundation of affection, history, shared interests, kids, memories, etc. We've decided not to jump to future scenarios or non-negotiable positions too fast but to let some questions just sit in our minds and try on different answers for a few weeks and see how they feel over time.

    - what parts of the past do we need to explore to help us figure out the future?

    - how open should we be about my identity as a man who is attracted to men? Should it involve just us? the kids? some friends? some family? my gay friends? everybody?

    - how should we deal with the non-sexual friendships that allow conversation and activities with other men who relate to that part of me? Should I avoid them? Should I limit them to just one or two? Should I be open to new ones? Does she want to meet them?

    - how should we deal with my sexual attraction to other men? Should that be off limits? Should I find a close friend that is accepting of an open relationship? More than one? Only married guys?

    - how should we deal with her sexual needs? Should she wait to see if I redevelop an attraction to women? Should she look for a man friend for a sexual relationship, who accepts that she's in a committed marriage? A married man? More than one? Would I want to meet them? Shall we look for a man who wants to have sex with both of us? Is she even interested in having sex withsomeone else?

    - how should we deal with our physical intimacy as a couple? Enjoy only non-sexual contact and affection? Also try some naked interaction again without sexual expectations? Work on reconnecting in a fully sexual way?

    This is hard stuff to work through but we're both feeling good about having it all out in the open. We're also working with a great counselor who is keeping us from getting bogged down. And we agree that what we want the most is for each other to be happy.

    Life's a journey.
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    Dec 31, 2010 4:51 PM GMT
    This is definitely an area that gets mixed reviews on RJ. Those who are or have been married have a much different view on the reality of marriage and homosexuality then those who have never married. Each and every day forward brings with it two very important aspects of this topic: 1) It allows guys who are NOT married to better understand themselves and their sexuality BEFORE getting into a marriage relationship with a woman and 2) It provides society with a better understanding and more acceptance of homosexuality, making it easier for married men to come out.

    Finding support on sites such as RJ is very important. Any guys facing such a major change (and scary) needs a good support system. I've been fortunate to be a part of that support system for many guys here on RJ that I would never had known if it hadn't been for this site. I like to think that is has been of value to them, as it was for me during my coming out.

    Regardless of how your journey plays out, one thing remains constant and that is that coming out as a gay man while being married is very difficult. Taking the high road is always the best. Unfortunately, it's not always the way it works but in the end, each person begins a new life with new struggles and challenges but also with new friends and an openness that frees them to be who they are.

    Always a story worth sharing.
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    Dec 31, 2010 4:57 PM GMT
    utriman saidWe're having more honest and productive and intimate discussions than ever before. Both painful and fulfilling.
    Life's a journey.
    I can certainly relate to this. The best, most open, heartfelt discussions I ever had in the 22 years while married were after I came out. I often wondered if it would have all been different if we had been able to communicate that well from the get go. It taught me to be open from the beginning and in the few relationships I've had since, that is the single thing guys have told me that they appreciate (although find scary at first) is that they know where I am and how I feel from the beginning. Nothing hidden, no surprises.

    Yep, it's definitely a journey! Good luck to you.
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    Dec 31, 2010 5:02 PM GMT
    I don't get it. I really, really don't get it. But, who am I to judge. To each his own.
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    Dec 31, 2010 5:17 PM GMT
    catfish5 saidI don't get it. I really, really don't get it. But, who am I to judge. To each his own.


    Well, some guys are bi and married, (you aren't gay if you find women a sexual turn-on) and some gay guys are married because they were self denying or in the closet due to a hostile environment, or to be accepted by those they felt would shun them otherwise.

    Some gay guys married bi or gay women to have kids and gain legal rights.

    Some married straight women who weren't interested in sex but wanted companionship. Really, the permutations are many and the reasons quite fascinating.

    -Doug
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    Dec 31, 2010 5:34 PM GMT
    catfish5 saidI don't get it. I really, really don't get it. But, who am I to judge. To each his own.
    What don't you get? Why guys get married? Stay married? Don't start off out?
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    Dec 31, 2010 5:35 PM GMT
    meninlove said
    catfish5 saidI don't get it. I really, really don't get it. But, who am I to judge. To each his own.


    Well, some guys are bi and married, (you aren't gay if you find women a sexual turn-on) and some gay guys are married because they were self denying or in the closet due to a hostile environment, or to be accepted by those they felt would shun them otherwise.

    Some gay guys married bi or gay women to have kids and gain legal rights.

    Some married straight women who weren't interested in sex but wanted companionship. Really, the permutations are many and the reasons quite fascinating.

    -Doug


    Seems selfish and narcissistic to think that a marriage is all about "me" and my needs. And the spouse/kids are just along for the ride without any regard to their needs and best interests. But Que Sera Sera
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    Dec 31, 2010 5:39 PM GMT
    Thanks for this posting. It helped me understand some things. I could have easily gone down the same path. I grew up in a town of 25,000 in the Midwest. I dated a girl all through high school and we were going to go to college together then get married. It was expected that I would take over the family business from my father, working there till he retired, and living the same kind of life my parents did.

    My senior year I realized my girlfriend was way too much like my mother (who was way too much like my dad's mother), that I hated the family business, and I didn't want to go to the college my girlfriend and I had picked out.

    The hardest part for me was that I stumbled around a lot, since I was going off course. There was no guidance or direction and I made many mistakes, hurting some very good people in the process. When I came out at 19, I thought that I had found the answer and that life would be wonderful from then on...but of course it wasn't. I had to face and conquer a lot of demons. There were times I wish that I hadn't made the choices I did and just got married and had a family. I always wanted to have children and give them a happy, secure family life knowing they were loved unconditionally.

    I fell into another trap, thinking I was supposed to live a specific life as a gay man. It wasn't until I was in my 40s that I realized I was still living a lie and needed to own up to it.

    Each day I'm learning more about myself and making positive changes, for which I'm grateful. I've always met a man who has supported and encouraged me and been there for me during some of my most difficult times. He's also my best friend.

    I admire what everyone has written on this forum and I appreciate that you considerate of your wives and children.

    For those of you struggling through it, I wish you the best and hope you maintain your integrity through the process.
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    Dec 31, 2010 5:39 PM GMT
    eb925guy said
    catfish5 saidI don't get it. I really, really don't get it. But, who am I to judge. To each his own.
    What don't you get? Why guys get married? Stay married? Don't start off out?


    Nah, he simply doesn't "get" anything that's not the same as him. It's common. He asks "Who am I to judge," but simply posting on this awesome thread that he "really, really doesn't get it" is in itself a value judgement. I'm sure he fails to see the hypocrisy of his comment.

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    Dec 31, 2010 5:42 PM GMT
    catfish5 said
    Seems selfish and narcissistic to think that a marriage is all about "me" and my needs. And the spouse/kids are just along for the ride without any regard to their needs and best interests. But Que Sera Sera
    Well from my personal experience and experience supporting other guys, this is NOT the case. Perhaps there are a few of those but from what I've seen guys coming out after being married were married because they followed societies expectations and were ignorant of what being gay really was. This can also include religious reasons.

    Many, such as me, grew up in very conservative rural areas where homosexuality were not even discussed or talked about and NO one would certainly admit they were gay. You'll see this especially with guys in their late 40s and older. Metropolitan areas such as SF, Dallas, NY, Chicago and other large cities have been so much more open regarding homosexuality than the rural areas and guys living there had exposure to what 'gay' was therefore being able to better identify themselves as being gay before considering relationship or thinking that whatever that feeling is, it will go away once married and having sex with a woman.

    The value of the media blitz regarding gay marriage, DADT and bullying is that many younger guys across the country (and around the world for that matter) have now been exposed to homosexuality and what it is. They have the advantage of better understanding who they are than thinking it's just something they're experiencing because they are single.

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    Dec 31, 2010 5:42 PM GMT
    Ironman4U saidAnton, I think you have definitely hit a subject that applies to many of the 45+ guys on this site. I agree that we all have taken our different paths and done what we need to do. I respect your integrity of being faithful to your wife with full disclosure of your attraction for men.

    For me, I married my college sweetheart and did my best to suppress my physical attraction to men. I never acted on those attractions and thought that I could live my life as others expected me too. And I truly did love my wife.

    Over time, 12 years into our marriage, I realized that my attractions for men were not subsiding. I felt to be fair to my wife, my daughter and myself; I had a choice to make. Either address these feelings and attractions or forever stuff them back into the dark recesses of my mind. In my own soul searching, I realized that I could not be the husband and father that I wanted to be if I was not truly happy. And it was the happiness of my wife and daughter that mattered most. I could sacrifice but they shouldn't have to. Ultimately, my decision was to share the truth with my wife and divorce.

    To say it was the hardest thing I've ever done or will ever do in my life is an understatement. But I have not one regret. Today, about 18 years later, I am an openly gay man with an amazing relationship with my daughter and a life that fulfills me.

    For most guys going through the same thing, I offer some simple advice for what it's worth.

    Courage - Have the courage to face whatever you need to face. That may be the courage to be totally open and honest with yourself and your wife.

    Acceptance - Accept the consequences of your open conversation. This can be scary and really depends on how your wife reacts and what you want your future to be. For some like me, it may be to accept that you have to give up your life as you know it, risk losing everything and start over.

    Peace - Whatever the outcome, be at peace that you have done the right thing. Regardless, you acted with courage, you accepted the consequences and you are living in a way that restores integrity to your life.

    I wish you all peace. - Will


    It would be totally impossible to say it any better than this. Well said, sir!
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    Dec 31, 2010 5:43 PM GMT
    Last night I saw one of the best movies I have seen this year, Undertow, from Peru.

    It reflects on what is being discussed in this thread and I hope you all get a chance to see it.

    It's a beautiful film, and three of us had tears streaming down our cheeks at the end.

    Here's a review:

    http://movies.nytimes.com/2010/11/26/movies/26undertow.html
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    Dec 31, 2010 5:44 PM GMT
    DJdorchester said
    eb925guy said
    catfish5 saidI don't get it. I really, really don't get it. But, who am I to judge. To each his own.
    What don't you get? Why guys get married? Stay married? Don't start off out?


    Nah, he simply doesn't "get" anything that's not the same as him. It's common. He asks "Who am I to judge," but simply posting on this awesome thread that he "really, really doesn't get it" is in itself a value judgement. I'm sure he fails to see the hypocrisy of his comment.



    No, I literally don't get why someone would live a lie. I have several theories about it, but they would be regarded as judgemental in nature. So, I just accept the idea as something outside of my realm of understanding.
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    Dec 31, 2010 5:46 PM GMT
    DJdorchester said
    eb925guy said
    catfish5 saidI don't get it. I really, really don't get it. But, who am I to judge. To each his own.
    What don't you get? Why guys get married? Stay married? Don't start off out?


    Nah, he simply doesn't "get" anything that's not the same as him. It's common. He asks "Who am I to judge," but simply posting on this awesome thread that he "really, really doesn't get it" is in itself a value judgement. I'm sure he fails to see the hypocrisy of his comment.



    Yup... often wrong, but never uncertain.... has an opinion and knows you wanna hear it as badly as he wants to share it... and of course it must be right because it's HIS opinion.


    To the OP: I've known a few men who have been in your shoes. It sounds like a very complicated road... I hope you are able to do what you feel you have to do without causing harm. Best of luck.
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    Dec 31, 2010 5:52 PM GMT
    lissenup saidThanks for this posting. It helped me understand some things.
    I admire what everyone has written on this forum and I appreciate that you considerate of your wives and children.

    For those of you struggling through it, I wish you the best and hope you maintain your integrity through the process.
    In many ways, despite the struggles and the sever ups and downs, your is a success story. Recognizing at an early age that you were not willing to just fall trap to societies whims shows a level of understanding and maturity that many of us wish we had. Although I think married guys gain a tremendous understanding of relationships, selflessness and caring (mostly because of children), there remains a part of us that feels we missed out on those early years.

    I love my kids and my ex like no other. The lessons I learned while being married, I think, make me a better person in the relationship I value today. My understanding of what married guys go through, living life in a str8 world, trying to assimilate myself into the gay culture and experiencing the narcissism in the gay community have truly opened my eyes and made me a much better and more rounded person overall. I understand totally each of these communities and try not to judge either, but accept parts of both as my mantra for living.
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    Dec 31, 2010 5:53 PM GMT
    My father had a man work for him who was married and had three children. He came out of the closet when I was in my mid-teens and began living openly as a gay man. I was impressed with how accepting everyone was and I never heard anyone make fun of him behind his back or speak dismissively about him. I'm not sure if it played a role in helping me come out or not, but I'm guessing it did.
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    Dec 31, 2010 5:55 PM GMT
    SAHEM62896 said
    DJdorchester said
    eb925guy said
    catfish5 saidI don't get it. I really, really don't get it. But, who am I to judge. To each his own.
    What don't you get? Why guys get married? Stay married? Don't start off out?


    Nah, he simply doesn't "get" anything that's not the same as him. It's common. He asks "Who am I to judge," but simply posting on this awesome thread that he "really, really doesn't get it" is in itself a value judgement. I'm sure he fails to see the hypocrisy of his comment.



    Yup... often wrong, but never uncertain.... has an opinion and knows you wanna hear it as badly as he wants to share it... and of course it must be right because it's HIS opinion.


    To the OP: I've known a few men who have been in your shoes. It sounds like a very complicated road... I hope you are able to do what you feel you have to do without causing harm. Best of luck.


    AWWWW. Looks like someone's wittle bitty feelings were hurt by a comment I made regarding a prissy fit and some loogie hawking. So Sowwwry.
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    Dec 31, 2010 6:01 PM GMT
    catfish5 said
    Seems selfish and narcissistic to think that a marriage is all about "me" and my needs. And the spouse/kids are just along for the ride without any regard to their needs and best interests. But Que Sera Sera


    I use to have this same thought but then I realizes that they got married a long long time ago when being gay wasn't as acceptable. They had to suck it up and get married because that was the right thing to do. They are doing their best to salvage the life that they got into. It is not the ideal situation but they are trying to make the best of it. It sucks for them even when they are out because other gays think they are just old creepy married men preying on young boys.

    I say better late than never.

    However, this won't fly 30 years from now for 40 year old men pulling this shit. The free passes are running out every year.
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    Dec 31, 2010 6:08 PM GMT
    catfish5 said
    SAHEM62896 said
    DJdorchester said
    eb925guy said
    catfish5 saidI don't get it. I really, really don't get it. But, who am I to judge. To each his own.
    What don't you get? Why guys get married? Stay married? Don't start off out?


    Nah, he simply doesn't "get" anything that's not the same as him. It's common. He asks "Who am I to judge," but simply posting on this awesome thread that he "really, really doesn't get it" is in itself a value judgement. I'm sure he fails to see the hypocrisy of his comment.



    Yup... often wrong, but never uncertain.... has an opinion and knows you wanna hear it as badly as he wants to share it... and of course it must be right because it's HIS opinion.


    To the OP: I've known a few men who have been in your shoes. It sounds like a very complicated road... I hope you are able to do what you feel you have to do without causing harm. Best of luck.


    AWWWW. Looks like someone's wittle bitty feelings were hurt by a comment I made regarding a prissy fit and some loogie hawking. So Sowwwry.



    How crass and childish. Grow up. You left elementary school a long time ago. And apparently didn't learn much while there.

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    Dec 31, 2010 6:15 PM GMT
    catfish5 said
    No, I literally don't get why someone would live a lie. I have several theories about it, but they would be regarded as judgemental in nature. So, I just accept the idea as something outside of my realm of understanding.


    I don't really "get it" either, but to be fair, many people, myself included don't "get" your relationship status because I'm not in your situation and you're not in mine. These men have been put in a tough spot where there's no real perfect answers. There's a lot of wrong ones, for sure, but don't jump on people just because of a choice they made when society had different rules.
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    Dec 31, 2010 6:16 PM GMT

    Yep, it's definitely a journey! Good luck to you.[/quote]

    Thanks, Wouldn't it be great if everyone here could just accept that we're all just trying to figure things out over the course of our lives from whereever we started and find one or more meaningful connections with other guys. And the best way to do that for one guy isn't necessary right for another.

    Find love, be happy, don't judge.