The latest news in global warming...

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jan 02, 2011 6:53 AM GMT
    ... Record coldest December set at Fort Lauderdale...
    http://www.wunderground.com/US/FL/072.html#REC
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    Jan 02, 2011 8:02 AM GMT
    At any given year there's going to be a record high or cold somewhere in the world. If a bunch of other cities hit records this Winter THEN you have some credible evidence.
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    Jan 02, 2011 10:15 AM GMT
    Here's a recent interesting article about some of the weird stuff that's going on and some reasons why:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/26/opinion/26cohen.html?scp=5&sq=globalwarminglondon&st=cse
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    Jan 02, 2011 11:42 AM GMT
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    Jan 02, 2011 2:24 PM GMT
    At the moment it's 3* in Santa Fe. A little global warming would be welcome.
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    Jan 02, 2011 2:31 PM GMT
    jprichva said
    TexDef07 saidAt the moment it's 3* in Santa Fe. A little global warming would be welcome.

    But aren't you under strict orders not to believe in it?

    Who are you including in this "you," JP? I'm as eco as can be, just not of the self-flagellating let's-move-off-the-grid-and-live-in-a-yurt variety.
    I prefer to be the Al Gore sort of environmentalist, who shows us you can still have multiple palatial homes and a private jet.
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    Jan 02, 2011 2:40 PM GMT
    jprichva said
    TexDef07 said
    jprichva said
    TexDef07 saidAt the moment it's 3* in Santa Fe. A little global warming would be welcome.

    But aren't you under strict orders not to believe in it?

    Who are you including in this "you," JP? I'm as eco as can be, just not of the self-flagellating let's-move-off-the-grid-and-live-in-a-yurt variety.
    I prefer to be the Al Gore sort of environmentalist, who shows us you can still have multiple palatial homes and a private jet.

    I'm still waiting for the day you aim one of your clever barbs at a Republican. Hurry. According to actuarial tables I only have 35 years left to live.

    35 more years? It must be very healthy living in your yurt.
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    Jan 02, 2011 2:48 PM GMT
    theatrengym saidHere's a recent interesting article about some of the weird stuff that's going on and some reasons why:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/26/opinion/26cohen.html?scp=5&sq=globalwarminglondon&st=cse


    Great article. I hope assholes like Glenn Beck and Sean Hannity read up.
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    Jan 02, 2011 4:07 PM GMT
    Great Article and great video both of which show that provisional minds will never understand GLOBAL warming since their tiny minds can't see beyond their tiny world. I prefer the term Global weirding coined by Thomas Friedman in Hot Flat and Crowded. Extreme flooding in Brisbane Australia covers an areas the size of France and Germany combined.

    http://musicifi.com/gossip/Australia-floods-cover-area-the-size-of-FranceGermany-4430436.html
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    Jan 02, 2011 4:11 PM GMT
    ...what I call 'human accelerated climate change'.

    -Doug
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    Jan 02, 2011 4:25 PM GMT
    friendormate saidGreat Article and great video both of which show that provisional minds will never understand GLOBAL warming since their tiny minds can't see beyond their tiny world. I prefer the term Global weirding coined by Thomas Friedman in Hot Flat and Crowded. Extreme flooding in Brisbane Australia covers an areas the size of France and Germany combined.

    http://musicifi.com/gossip/Australia-floods-cover-area-the-size-of-FranceGermany-4430436.html


    Friend, did you mean "provincial" instead of "provisional?"
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    Jan 02, 2011 4:30 PM GMT
    The models for global warming going back to the '90s predicted wild climate variations & anomalies, deviations from normal local patterns as major weather systems shifted. But throughout this the global AVERAGE temperatures everywhere over any 12 months would steadily rise.

    So that Fort Lauderdale could have its coldest December, but other parts of the world would have their warmest, and the Polar ice caps would still be steadily melting. This is exactly what's been happening.

    The overall AVERAGE temperature for the Earth continues to rise, no matter what Fort Lauderdale does. Indeed, an unusually cold December here actually PROVES the global warming model, it doesn't DISprove it.

    But don't tell that to my partner's sister. A conservative Republican, she was gloating over our recent local weather when we visited her on Christmas Day, saying it absolutely proved that global warming was a liberal conspiracy (just like southbeach here does).

    It did me no good to try to explain that micro-weather is not the same as macro-weather, which is what global warming is about. No, she had a cold December in Boca Raton, Florida, so global warming is proven to be a hoax. Never mind about disappearing Polar ice and drowning polar bears.

    Just like the right-wing columnists and radio talking heads keep telling her, it doesn't exist. Despite our having just gotten over one of our hottest sustained summer seasons on record here, less than 4 months ago, not just a single cold snap in December. But never mind, Republicans only pay attention to the cold days. icon_rolleyes.gif

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    Jan 02, 2011 4:38 PM GMT
    paulflexes said... Record coldest December set at Fort Lauderdale...
    http://www.wunderground.com/US/FL/072.html#REC


    As the temperatures in the polar latitudes increase, the temperature difference between the equator and poles decreases. This creates a condition that encourages larger amplitude (north-south) swings in the jet stream, which is found at the border between the polar air and the subtropical and warmer air masses to the south.

    These swings can and do bring cold air masses way far south, but you have to keep in mind that these air masses are actually warmer than they would have been, but for the climate changes that are producing warming on average.

    It's not a contradiction that global warming will be producing temperature extremes in the lower 48 during the winter. There will also be extremes in precipitation as well.

    All of these things are modulated by natural cycles, such as La Niña/El Niño.

    For California, for example, we're expecting through the first half of the 21st century a slightly higher average mean rainfall but with huge swings around the average (catastrophic flooding rains alternating at times with terrible droughts).

    For places in the southern tier of states, blistering hot summers (like July and August in the southern Great Plains) and apparently anomalous snowfalls unusually far south in the winter....etc.
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    Jan 02, 2011 5:03 PM GMT
    First of all, global warming is a joke. I have studied climate and I just can't wrap my head around the fact that the Earth is warming. It's even a bigger stretch to believe that the Earth is warming via anthropegenic pollution.

    First of all, Earth has a very volatile past. We've had 'snowball Earth' to an iceless planet and everywhere in between long before humans ever arrived on the scene. Going back 4.5 billion years, we've had glacial and inner-glacial periods (meaning ice and no ice).

    Temperature records from ice cores from Greenland and O16/18 isotope values indicate that indeed the Earth has been FAR hotter than it is today. Earth is still considered a very cold place compared to it's past.

    55 million years ago, during the Paleocene-Eocene Thermal Maximum, the planets oceans was nearly 15 degrees C warmer than it is today (that's nearly 25 degrees fahrenheit) and air temperature was 5-8 degrees C warmer. The Earth was iceless. There were ferns growing on Greenland and the Arctic Ocean had alligator-like creatures swimming in its waters. The Arctic is said to have been as balmy as 73 degrees F. Since no humans were around, obviously there are other mechanisms that drive climate. A sudden release of methane from the oceans? Perhaps continental drift?

    Continental drift actually plays a huge role in climate. Did you know that Antarctica froze over long before the North Pole? Do you know why? Next time you look at a globe, check out 60 degrees north vs. 60 degrees south. The South pole is completely surrounded by water...the worlds oceans connect there. But at 60 degrees north, it is surrounded by land. You could almost walk around the world. That is why when we enter Ice Ages, the ice at the North Pole is able to travel so much further south and expand versus the South Pole. The deep oceans and turbulant waters keep the ice at the South Pole in check. The reason continental drift is important is that over the years it has opened and closed sea ways. Connected and disrupted ocean currents that are moving warmer water poleward. It's the Gulf Stream that keeps Europe warm. If that were disrupted somehow (by dumping tons of freshwater into the oceans like what is currently happening and changing the salinity of the water), then Europe would freeze over. This is one of the main reasons for Antarctica freezing over. Australia broke apart from Antarctica shifting ocean currents.

    During the Oligocene period (24 million years ago), we see India break away from Africa and crash into Asia. It's the rise of the Himalayas. It is believed by my professors and other scientists that the mountains that rise nearly 30,000 ft. have disrupted air patterns causing micro and macro changes in the regions climate (rain shadows, droughts, shifts in the jetstreams). Afterall, these mountains pass through all the main atmospheric pressure layers of 1000 hPa, 850 (5,000 ft.) and 500 mb layers. So changes in continents plays a part.

    If you look at temperature record over the past 50,000 years alone, you will clearly see that even our 'hottest year on record' (1998 ) pales in comparison to years much further back in time. After all, what sank the Titanic 100 years ago? AN ICEBERG.

    According to John Baez (who contributed to this article) has said that the very fact that there are grasses on the planet versus big jungles is an indication that the planet is 'cold.' It's amazing how we take it for granted but they have not always been here.

    I guess the point is there has been very hot times and very cold times in Earth's past. We are still VERY cold. You have events like the Younger-Dryas event (very cold time) versus the Medieval Warm Period and the little ice age (Maunder Minimum). This is not taking into account changes in eccentricity and changes in axil tilt and Earth's orbit around the sun. So many variables so little time to discuss them all. Hopefully I touched on a little of everything.
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    Jan 02, 2011 5:34 PM GMT
    I do not believe in man made global warming. I do not believe that a build up of carbon dioxide is going to lead to temperatures increasing, and furthermore I don't believe that build up is happening.

    Since 1998 Earth has experienced falling temperatures. The UK has just experienced its coldest December since reliable records began in the early 1920s. We've had temperatures of -17 degrees centigrade in the MIdlands and Scotland has had its best skiing season since the 1970s. Last year (2010) people were still able to ski in the Cairngorms in the middle of May.

    In other parts of the world, Brazil has had unseasably cool weather, the East Coast of America has had yet another "blizzard of the century", meanwhile Australia's drought has come to an end with lots of rain.

    In the year 2000 the newspaper The Independent predicted the end of snowy winters for much of the United Kingdom by 2010. So much for that crappy prediction.

    Global warming is an excuse for some people to make a lot of money from wind farms while normal people get patronised, bullied and lectured to about their 'carbon footprint' and their recycling inadequacies.

    Well, I'm tired of being bullied and lectured and patronised by know it alls who think the world is coming to an end.
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    Jan 02, 2011 5:41 PM GMT
    I've seen more data to support the global warming theory then data to de-bunk it (although I'm not a fan of the term itself). Most scientists today do agree that we are having a negative impact on earth's climate, and I think one would have to be rather naive to believe that we don't. Having said this, earth has a history of changing climates, as indicated by looking back through our natural records. Core samples from undisturbed regions (eg: areas in Antarctica) give a great overview of what the climate was like hundreds of thousands of years ago, and fossil records provide data to indicate the climate back millions of years. These give great insight into the natural phenomenon which govern climate change, but don't detract from the obvious; That we are having a significant negative effect on one of the very things which allow humans to exist.
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    Jan 02, 2011 5:50 PM GMT
    QUOTE AUTHOR GOES HERE Most scientists today do agree that we are having a negative impact on earth's climate,


    See, this is what I hate. A sweeping generalisation. Who are these 'scientists'. And 'scientists' are always getting things wrong. Here are a few of their predictions:

    bird flu going to kill millions

    swine flu going to kill millions

    BSE from eating beefburgers

    Salmonella in eggs

    Global 'dimming' (seem to remember that one from a couple of years back) creating another ice age

    And what about the 2000 Millennium bug. That never happened.

    I think we should try to stop scaring each other and accept that weather is just weather.

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    Jan 02, 2011 6:01 PM GMT
    aggiedude saidFirst of all, global warming is a joke. I have studied climate and I just can't wrap my head around the fact that the Earth is warming. It's even a bigger stretch to believe that the Earth is warming via anthropegenic pollution.


    ....and what qualifies you to state that "global warming is a joke?" Are you seriously contending that thousands of climate and ocean scientists who are studying trends in temperatures are stupid, or part of a plot to suppress what's actually going on. Please tell me that's not true...

    Oh, wait, I guess you are right. I am part of the plot as well...and look at the neat "misinformation" we just promulgated. We've managed to fool the world into thinking that the Arctic Ice Cap is melting because the temperatures, well, have been higher than freezing later and later in the year. We've forged satellite images and the ice margin data...we've even hidden the polar bears to make it seem their ecosystem is stressed. Gad....We're clever in this plot.

    The truth is out there, aggiedude......

    Figure 1. Arctic sea ice extent for November 2010 was 9.89 million square kilometers (3.82 million square miles). The magenta line shows the 1979 to 2000 median extent for that month. The black cross indicates the geographic North Pole. Sea Ice Index data. About the data.
    —Credit: National Snow and Ice Data Center

    Arctic sea ice extent averaged over November 2010 was 9.89 million square kilometers (3.82 million square miles). This is the second-lowest November ice extent recorded over the period of satellite observations from 1979 to 2010, 50,000 square kilometers (19,300 square miles) above the previous record low of 9.84 million square kilometers (3.80 million square miles) set in 2006.
    Ice extent was unusually low in both the Atlantic and Pacific sectors of the Arctic and in Hudson Bay. Typically by the end of November, nearly half of Hudson Bay has iced over. But on November 30, only 17% of the bay was covered by sea ice. Compared to the 1979 to 2000 average, the ice extent was 12.4% below average for the Arctic as a whole
    ice.png
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    Jan 02, 2011 6:03 PM GMT
    aggiedude saidFirst of all, global warming is a joke. I have studied climate and I just can't wrap my head around the fact that the Earth is warming. It's even a bigger stretch to believe that the Earth is warming via anthropegenic pollution.

    ...

    I guess the point is there has been very hot times and very cold times in Earth's past. We are still VERY cold. You have events like the Younger-Dryas event (very cold time) versus the Medieval Warm Period and the little ice age (Maunder Minimum). This is not taking into account changes in eccentricity and changes in axil tilt and Earth's orbit around the sun. So many variables so little time to discuss them all. Hopefully I touched on a little of everything.


    Thanks for this! As for melting polar caps and drowning polar bears, this just in:

    http://www.examiner.com/seminole-county-environmental-news-in-orlando/canada-s-growing-polar-bear-population-becoming-a-problem-locals-say

    And Artic sea ice is melting you say? The sea ice extent has recovered since the danger year of 2007:

    AMSRE_Sea_Ice_Extent_L.png

    And reports from Antartica have stated that the ice is extending:

    http://www.ecoworld.com/global-warming/the-real-facts-on-increasing-antarctic-ice.html

    Now let's all keep the political brainwashing out of this and let the real scientists get back to us on the Earth's health - geologists, atmospheric physicists and the like. Because the names of climatologists are mud since the leak of the Climategate emails.
  • conservativej...

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    Jan 02, 2011 6:06 PM GMT

    Uhm, I see the Sexy Aviator of Lauderdale has been chilly this year. icon_cool.gif
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    Jan 02, 2011 6:09 PM GMT
    Climate change deniers have the blood of future generations on their hands.
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    Jan 02, 2011 6:14 PM GMT
    kangourou said

    And Artic sea ice is melting you say? The sea ice extent has recovered since the danger year of 2007:



    Do you know how to read this graph? If you read it correctly, you'll see for the short period (2002-2010) covered (which is NOT the period you should be looking at...you should be comparing the sea ice extent now to historical averages), the Arctic Sea ice extent was the lowest it's been for the period you've chosen to show here.

    That's consistent with my point...thank you, but doesn't say a thing about Global Warming...which is a climate change from the 20th century to the late 20th and early 21st.

    Finally, I am a meteorologist and a climatologist. There was no Climategate....that was a rip and read rape-job of a few emails between guys who should know better, using street-speak among themselves.

    Now, if you have a degree in meteorology or climatology, fine, then argue the issue on its merits. Meanwhile, you are reading the graph you directed us to backwards....and misinterpreting it.

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    Jan 02, 2011 6:19 PM GMT
    You know, those who don't know what they are talking about shove a bunch of colorful graphics down your throat in hopes to cover a moot point. It's like people who speak with big vocabulary to impress. If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with BS. The Earth's past speaks for itself. I guess you think the IPCC report is the 'Bible.' It is riddled with mistakes...just like the 'scientist' who said that the Himalayan glaciers would be gone in 20 years. Oops. Not even close to being accurate.

    I can't believe that people are so ignorant as to believe that ALL scientists feel the Earth is warming. According to John Coleman, there are 9,000 PhD climate scientists who feel that politics is the real issue at hand, not the climate. It amazes me how people can pick and chose a graph off of google images to make a point. I have given strong evidence to show that we are not as warm as in millenia past. Whether you chose to believe it or not is up to you. But NOBODY will ever make me believe the Earth is warming. I agree with John, "global warming is the biggest scam in history."

    Who is your 'leader' anyway? Al Gore? He has the largest carbon footprint of anybody in Tennessee and yet has the balls to tell me I should turn out my lights at night. I think not.
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    Jan 02, 2011 6:25 PM GMT
    aggiedude saidYou know, those who don't know what they are talking about shove a bunch of colorful graphics down your throat in hopes to make a moot point.


    Read my profile, before you claim I don't know what I am talking about.

    Please tell me you are not using a weathercaster from The Weather Channel as the source of your information that "9000 meteorologists" do not believe in Climate Change. Please tell me this....

    Actually, maybe I am doing Mr. Coleman a disservice and it's you who is misquoting him. Because it is true that I and every atmospheric scientist I know do in fact believe that the scientific evidence for climate change is being ignored BECAUSE of politics or, at least, political bias. Maybe that's what he was trying to say and you, like the other poster, are mischaracterizing either because you don't realize it or purposefully.
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    Jan 02, 2011 6:25 PM GMT
    Im really tired of people who still peddle the bike of man made global warming. How do people think that mans small influnce of CO2 is bigger than the suns influence!! Co2 was alot higher thousands of years ago when we were in the middle of an ice age!

    Its all cycles, hot,cold,hot,cold!! It was hot and cold when man wasnt around and it will be when we are no longer here.

    There is so much evidence out there to disprove warmists theory that I cant do it justice here, just look it up!! The warmists dont have the statistics to back there side up!! Have you ever heard of Al Gore debating with the other side??He knows he cant win so he wont debate even though the offer has been made 2 him several times. He is a brillant businessman looking 4 a quick $!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ag2AWst3Qv4&feature=related

    He doesnt have a clue about science or earth science.
    Please dont insult your own intelligence by beliving this scam!