New poll out indicates that the country is clearly, massively, overwhelmingly progressive

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    Jan 04, 2011 3:48 PM GMT
    "A new poll out indicates that the country is clearly, massively, overwhelmingly progressive. While they talk about cutting so-called entitlement programs in Washington, the American people have completely different priorities.

    When asked what's the first thing they would do to balance the budget, Americans had an unmistakably clear answer -- raise taxes on the rich. It came in number one by a mile, with a whopping 61 percent.

    If that wasn't progressive enough, cutting defense spending came in number two, with 20 percent.

    And if all of that wasn't clear enough, when asked about cutting Medicare, only 4 percent were in favor of it. Only 3 percent wanted to cut Social Security as a way to balance the budget.

    I thought the country was center-right? That's what all of the pundits tell us 24/7 on television. What happened now? Do those answer look center-right to you? They look decidedly center-left to anyone with a pulse.

    Washington is going to hate this news because they were just getting ready to cut people's Social Security. That's what the president's Deficit Commission suggested. That's what all of the Republicans are massively in favor of. That's what a lot of the Democrats are already saying is "necessary." All the meanwhile, they just gave a $407 billion tax cut to the richest people in the country.

    Well, apparently the American people disagree with Washington's priorities. If the Democrats, Republicans and the president persist in trying to cut Social Security in the face of these numbers, then we will know that we have lost our democracy all together. That the people in power couldn't give a damn what we want. That the take over of the American government by the corporations, the rich and the powerful is complete.

    Every time you hear any politician or pundit say we have to cut Social Security or what they derisively call entitlement programs (you paid into them your whole life, that is why you are "entitled" to them), send them this poll. And ask them why they don't care at all about the will of the American people."

    HuffingtonPost
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    Jan 04, 2011 4:03 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 saidAs Christian73 would say...

    "The Huffington Post is not a credible news organization, therefore the poll results are invalid."



    HuffPost didn't conduct the poll. They reprinted a Reuters story and the poll was conducted by 60 Minutes and Vanity Fair. Even so, HuffPost does not present itself as a news organization but as a blog that does produced some original reporting but is mostly opinion driven.

    I have one pollster Rasmussen that I find unreliable as many others do.
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    Jan 04, 2011 4:09 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    Christian73 said
    southbeach1500 saidAs Christian73 would say...

    "The Huffington Post is not a credible news organization, therefore the poll results are invalid."



    HuffPost didn't conduct the poll. They reprinted a Reuters story and the poll was conducted by 60 Minutes and Vanity Fair. Even so, HuffPost does not present itself as a news organization but as a blog that does produced some original reporting but is mostly opinion driven.

    I have one pollster Rasmussen that I find unreliable as many others do.


    And Vanity Fair is a credible news organization? Well, I guess in your book....


    I wouldn't call Vanity Fair a news organization. It's a magazine that does have reporting and some of is good and other is gossip. But I would say 60 Minutes is a credible news organization.

    Again, all you do is parse, parse, parse...
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    Jan 04, 2011 4:40 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    Christian73 said But I would say 60 Minutes is a credible news organization.


    Yes, you would. icon_rolleyes.gif


    And how is it not? Please provide details.

    Because it seems that while you're willing to post any crazed rambling from a right-wing message board, you feel perfectly comfortable criticizing the credibility of established journalistic enterprises like 60 Minutes, which while imperfect, is certainly among the least partisan and most ethical outlets on television.
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    Jan 04, 2011 5:01 PM GMT
    Oh here I thought you were meaning progressive as in people's attitudes towards gays and other things, but instead you're calling regressive ideas "progressive". Progressive would be eliminating all the entitlements you speak of in order to secure the future of the country.

    Progress means improvement in a situation, not policies that continue to create debt and finally collapse.
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    Jan 04, 2011 5:28 PM GMT
    UpperCanadian saidfaced with inconvenient facts, mock must resort to redefining "progressive" as "regressive." Right out of Goebbel's propaganda playbook. Intellectual dishonesty as its most blatant. disgraceful.


    Actually what's disgraceful and intellectually dishonest is your injection of nazi figures into my political philosophy. An FU would be in order.

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    Jan 04, 2011 5:41 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    Christian73 said
    southbeach1500 said
    Christian73 said But I would say 60 Minutes is a credible news organization.


    Yes, you would. icon_rolleyes.gif


    And how is it not? Please provide details.

    Because it seems that while you're willing to post any crazed rambling from a right-wing message board, you feel perfectly comfortable criticizing the credibility of established journalistic enterprises like 60 Minutes, which while imperfect, is certainly among the least partisan and most ethical outlets on television....


    .... in the opinion of a liberal New York city resident.



    Not really. 60 Minutes demographic is diverse and skews older and more conservative than NYC liberals.

    Try again. Remember details of how 60 Minutes is not a credible news organization. icon_rolleyes.gif
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    Jan 04, 2011 5:44 PM GMT
    mocktwinkie said
    UpperCanadian saidfaced with inconvenient facts, mock must resort to redefining "progressive" as "regressive." Right out of Goebbel's propaganda playbook. Intellectual dishonesty as its most blatant. disgraceful.


    Actually what's disgraceful and intellectually dishonest is your injection of nazi figures into my political philosophy. An FU would be in order.

    I think we are going to be seeing more bitterness and delusion from the left in the coming months. Yesterday, I noticed an example of the most feeble interpretation of the election results, showing what drinking the Kool Aid can do to the brain. I easily refuted the ridiculous point from the RJer with very convincing poll results from a respected source.

    http://www.realjock.com/gayforums/1308110

    It's not hard to see why most non-Kool Aid drinkers don't post here too often. It's becoming not worth dealing with.
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14342

    Jan 04, 2011 6:03 PM GMT
    I don't believe in these polls because they only sample a small number of the people and they also only sample them in certain, select locations. Furthermore if the majority of Americans really supported these so-called progressive views, they sure had a funny, weird way of showing it in the last Congressional elections. The conservative GOP gained control of the House, that is odd given the results of this recent poll.
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    Jan 04, 2011 6:08 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    Christian73 said
    Not really. 60 Minutes demographic is diverse and skews older and more conservative than NYC liberals.


    The user demographics of 60 minutes (viewers) or any news organization don't determine whether it is credible or not.



    Christian73 said
    Try again. Remember details of how 60 Minutes is not a credible news organization. icon_rolleyes.gif


    60 Minutes has and continues to operate in the same liberal supportive environment as the Dan Rather mess re: Bush and his military service. (Remember that?)



    You're really grasping for straws.

    Yes. I remember the Rather story, which, despite his being given fraudulent documents, was later proven to be accurate. And 60 Minutes dismissed Rather and his producers for going to air with false documents, which is what a credible organization does.

    Conversely, Fox News regulalry has it's personalities spread falsehoods on air and has not fired any of their "reporters" or "pundits" for spreading false facts even when there is incontrovertible proof that they're spreading lies.
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    Jan 04, 2011 7:11 PM GMT
    So did you guys come to any conclusion as to whether we're a progressive nation or not?
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    Jan 04, 2011 8:17 PM GMT
    UpperCanadian said
    Caslon17000 saidSo did you guys come to any conclusion as to whether we're a progressive nation or not?


    Pretty clear the US is not quite as conservative as the FOX narrative wants people to believe. The poll was quite specific on what areas people wanted trimmed, and what they wanted left intact. The things they favoured are elements of the "progressive" agenda, whatever mocktwinkie would like to re-label it.



    Absolutely.
    More to the point - "the things they favoured" are elements of the Democratic party's agenda, and the OPPOSITE of what the Repubs want to do.
    Since cutting spending and reducing the National Debt is the main campaign promise the Repubs made in 2010, and as we can see, the American people want the Debt reduced according to the agenda of the DEMOCRATIC party, not the Repub party's agenda - it really puts the new House majority Repubs in a no-win screwed up the ass position.
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    Jan 04, 2011 10:07 PM GMT
    Unfortunately, all this proves is that the country is progressive when money comes out of other people's pockets to fund their benefits. Try to cut it, and get voted out of office. It's not pork when it benefits my district.

    The average American (polled in one-sided polls that ask leading questions) cannot defend his/her contradictory opinions about taxes, the national deficit, entitlements, privileges and rights.
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    Jan 04, 2011 10:37 PM GMT
    q1w2e3 saidUnfortunately, all this proves is that the country is progressive when money comes out of other people's pockets to fund their benefits. Try to cut it, and get voted out of office. It's not pork when it benefits my district.

    The average American (polled in one-sided polls that ask leading questions) cannot defend his/her contradictory opinions about taxes, the national deficit, entitlements, privileges and rights.


    You're very right here.
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    Jan 05, 2011 6:06 AM GMT
    q1w2e3 saidUnfortunately, all this proves is that the country is progressive when money comes out of other people's pockets to fund their benefits. Try to cut it, and get voted out of office. It's not pork when it benefits my district.

    The average American (polled in one-sided polls that ask leading questions) cannot defend his/her contradictory opinions about taxes, the national deficit, entitlements, privileges and rights.
    which is exactly what most of us are trying to relay to our more 'GOP' talking heads here..

    There are only TWO ways to balance the federal budget and both dems AND repubs need to understand it, ANY economist will tell you the ugly brutal truth.

    1. ELIMINATE or drastically curtail spending (medicare, SS AND defense(wars and such)) Oh the screaming!

    2. Raise taxes.. oh the screaming.......

    the general American public will decide which to do...... and its that obvious..!
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    Jan 05, 2011 11:50 AM GMT
    And that's why polls irk me so much, because they never take to the next level, so that people actually have to hold 2 thoughts together when they answer these polls:
    i.e.
    for people who want to preserve their benefits, given the current deficits, how many of them would
    1. want them preserved but cut something else
    2. cut them
    3. raise taxes

    and then ask them what "something else" is, in their own words.

    The NYT budget puzzle was a start, but as others have pointed out, it doesn't include other stuff that can be cut or other sources of revenue.

    This country's education was and is spoiled by multiple choice questions.


  • GQjock

    Posts: 11649

    Jan 05, 2011 12:02 PM GMT
    q1w2e3 saidUnfortunately, all this proves is that the country is progressive when money comes out of other people's pockets to fund their benefits. Try to cut it, and get voted out of office. It's not pork when it benefits my district.

    The average American (polled in one-sided polls that ask leading questions) cannot defend his/her contradictory opinions about taxes, the national deficit, entitlements, privileges and rights.


    But needless to say ..................
    They'll cut programs and fail to fund what's needed for the citizenry so that they can have hundreds of Billions in tax cuts for the wealthy icon_rolleyes.gif

    The hypocrisy is so ridiculous you could trip over it