Why are we such haters?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 16, 2007 9:41 PM GMT
    Seems like since we're all gay men that we should be encouraging each other when improvements are made. That said, it's more often the case that someone will make physical improvements and get not compliments (in the gym, the bar, whatever) but bitchy and envious looks. Then there's the search for a flaw, some way to cut the person down. Why are we (gay men) such haters when it comes to other gay men? When somebody's looking good, why don't we just say that rather than looking for all that's wrong with them?

    Any thoughts gents?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 16, 2007 11:05 PM GMT
    WE ARE ALL HUMANS FIRST.

    People will be people no matter what thier orientation is and don't try to change the world, it starts with one person at a time.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 16, 2007 11:49 PM GMT
    hmmm i agree, but gay guys just act like they think they are supposed to.........but fuck it, i like being superficial just as i like having a fucking good time at gig/drinking blah blah blah.

    But it's very irritating, i wish more gays were laid back, weren't so bitchy...you know most bars guys will catwalk into a bar, its hilarious and the homos give them bitchy glances, ok ok it;s not quite 'Paris is Burning' but it's bearable and everyone is guilty of hating at some point.
  • dfrourke

    Posts: 1062

    Jun 17, 2007 12:50 AM GMT
    ...I had to chuckle when I read this question...it's a good one...

    I have noticed [even in my self from time to time]...the need to feel that everyone is "reachable"...I see a gorgeous guy...I need to see SOMETHING wrong with him to believe he might be in my league...

    What does that say about him? [not much]...what does that say about me? [a great deal]...

    Thankfully, I have learned to take compliments, give them out, and appreciate those whose gifts are greater than mine as I have gotten older...but, on a bad day, when I am feeling insecure...it's hard not to go there...

    - David
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 17, 2007 3:16 AM GMT
    I think that we tend to be mean, stingy, and unkind because it in some perverse way makes us to feel better about ourselves. And that feeling doesn't last for long.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 17, 2007 4:40 AM GMT
    A happy, self-confident person has nothing to gain by cutting others down.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 17, 2007 4:57 AM GMT
    Runninchlt: "A happy, self-confident person has nothing to gain by cutting others down."

    So what does that say about the many, many bitchy queens one meets out on a Friday night? :-(

    There's no doubt that we're haters. But is it any surprise? We grow up feeling hated. Even if our families and friends are accepting, we still live in a society that tolerates prejudice and bigotry towards gay people. So, hating becomes a defense mechanism.

    Then there's the fact that when we're out, we're all somewhat in competition. We place a great deal of value, as a community, on looks, fashion, our bodies, etc. Regrettably, we strive to be superficial. And this includes caustic remarks and a dismissive attitude.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 17, 2007 5:41 AM GMT
    And adding to what Sierra said, when we are younger and in the closet we are self haters. The best way to learn to cut down someone else is by years of practice of cutting yourself down.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 17, 2007 5:52 AM GMT
    I'm not so sure people are "haters."

    Universal acceptance and encouragement is NOT a good thing. E.g., coddling weak and deceitful, excuse-making folks, only makes them weaker. E.g., some folks are so outrageous that by almost any standard applied they would still be outrageous. I think some folks resent folks that aren't universally accepting, which, in fact, is a very bad thing. We have to have some standards. Not set by anyone in particular that there is a consensus upon in society.

    Every week, I get some hate e-mail from someone lashing out at me because of my appearance. Of course, they don't know me, and so on. Obviously, they have some issues, there.

    I think praise and positivity can work wonders, but, one doesn't praise people whose behavior is not acceptable. E.g., I don't associate with pictureless. No exceptions. No much baggage there.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 17, 2007 7:20 AM GMT
    Everyone will want something they don't have, and when we see someone that has what we want of course there's going to be a stare.

    Some will disagree with me but i see the gay world being like a competition but were not the only ones feeling this way...put 10 girls in a room...they will analyze each other silently or with a bitchy look since (Oh look the blonde has bigger boobs then i do).

    Guys together in a room is a bit the same. Like someone else said above, we are human.

    And when you see a guy in a bar that used to be skinny to being buffed; some might be a bit jealous how his body changed so fast.

    Regardless of the race, I compliment the ones i feel they need to hear one.

  • shyguysport

    Posts: 62

    Jun 17, 2007 9:03 AM GMT
    I think a lot of this relates to simple immaturity. I can remember going out to bars when we were in our 20's, it was our main pastime -ragging on what soom poor soul was wearing, their hair, etc. I think most of us out grow out of it. Some of us do not and those people become the bitter, older, overweight cows that part themselves at the bar and fling around the gossip, just for kicks or for a fleeting moment of notoriety.
  • GQjock

    Posts: 11648

    Jun 17, 2007 9:49 AM GMT
    I don't think that's really true If someone Improves themselves I don't think gay men will go out of their way to cut them down ...If they already know him
    If we as gay men don't know someone who is attractive...we'll make up reasons why we can't get to know this person...he's stuck up
    or he's nothing like he looks...
    Our insecurities come out when we see someone we feel is out of our league
  • cityguy39

    Posts: 967

    Jun 17, 2007 3:16 PM GMT
    GQ, I couldn't have said it any better.
  • MikemikeMike

    Posts: 6932

    Jun 17, 2007 3:35 PM GMT
    Agree with GQ and Runnin on this one. For some it's human nature, but I do not want any part of it. It's what gives gay men a bad name. Chucky- u get negative comments because you tend to type before you think- did you ever read your post on smooth or not. Granted you r very opinionated, that is fine, but when you talk at people and not to them your point is moot. Maybe in real life you r different but in the forums you sound Napoleonic and insecure and the words of an unhappy man. Many of us can read between the lines! I have never received one hate mail from anyone on here. Maybe yours will be the first, but it also means you did not read what I just wrote. Just trying to help.

    Mike
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 17, 2007 6:02 PM GMT
    While I would agree that there is no need for major displays of attitude, I would also encourage people NOT to seek out validation / affirmation from those around them in bars, clubs, the like.

    I am by no means condoning annoying, childish pettiness. However, my reasoning is this, and we would ALL do well to repeat it and come to terms with it: I am not the hottest person in the world. Nor is anyone else for that matter. "Flaws" can be what makes a guy attractive - otherwise we would all be the same. People like what they like, appreciate or reject what they see around them, no matter the expressed or perceived justification for it.

    Those people who matter to me are my family, close friends, and myself... it is their opinion and a strong sense of self that has any real importance in the long run.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 17, 2007 10:19 PM GMT
    Part of me thinks we're like animals and when a group of us are in close proximity, we send out signals to the competition, letting them know who's ruling the roost. But, there seems to be something else going on there, maybe a bit of self-loathing ("Ugh, look at him...he's wearing that again") or internalized homophobia ("God, he looks good but maybe if he acted like a man instead of a chick..."), I'm not sure. I just get frustrated with the lack of praise gay men are willing to extend to one another. Sometimes my ego won't allow it, but if I encounter someone who's looking good and setting a great example, I'll let them know.

    The other night I was with friends at a club and this person walks by, looking frankly a bit out of it style-wise, and a friend of mine makes some slick comment. Now, it was funny but turned and said to him, "Yeah, he's a bit off but at least he's having an amazing time and not giving a fuck about what you think." Point is, we need to give each other better energy and minimize the bitching.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 18, 2007 12:51 AM GMT
    I hate haters!! oops makes me one .. just kidding.

    Actually I think CNJmascfella put it well. Its someone's imperfections that make them interesting. If we were all the same we would be bored and unhappy.

    The problem with perfection is it doesn't really exist as we think of it. It is a species variations that make it strong.

    I think the best we can be is perfectly imperfect. Comfortable with who we are for the most part.

    We all get angry with the things people do and misjudge people at best. We have more in common that we have in difference. We frequently "don't see" more than we "see" What is needed is to step back and see the big picture.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 18, 2007 8:54 AM GMT
    Sometimes I think it's more of a boredom thing almost. As most of us I too have been a witness to this, and I sit and sometimes will even ask a person if all of their jealousy and hateful comments are even necessary.

    It dosn't get them any closer to whatever goal they are reaching for, and whatever sense of superiority one gets after cutting down one person, is always short lived because soon they are the target of the hateful glances.

    This cycle is one of the many reasons I distance myself from the "mainstream gays" they irritate the hell out of me and I just don't think getting annoyed that often can be any kind of healthy.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 18, 2007 11:28 AM GMT
    Jackal69 "The other night I was with friends at a club and this person walks by, looking frankly a bit out of it style-wise, and a friend of mine makes some slick comment. Now, it was funny but turned and said to him, "Yeah, he's a bit off but at least he's having an amazing time and not giving a fuck about what you think."


    That must have been at Missy B's........god knows nobody at 303 would be caught a "bit" out of style there! lol
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 18, 2007 1:54 PM GMT
    Great minds talk about ideas, average minds talk about events, and small minds talk about people.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 18, 2007 2:51 PM GMT


    Jackal69: It defies logic and reason. Why we would be so mean and cruel to one another. We get that enough from the mainstream.

    I just recently had that happen to me this weekend and I am rather proud at the way I handled the matter. Here's the story.

    I walk into this book store of the weekend.

    When INVY and Jealousy come in to play coupled with self-hatred. This sort of thinking is always going to happen.

    When this happened to me, I could not help feeling sad for the two guys.

    They made me an un-willing participant in their theater of cruelty!

    The other option I could have confronted them and given them a verbal assault of my own and trust me they would not have been ready. I would have been loaded with ammo!

    I would have bought into their psychosis, for what?

    I have worked very hard for the body that I have and it is very sad when some one that I don’t know would have something negative to say. Some time this type of attitude can come from friends or so-called friends. It a good think that my parents raised to believe it doesn’t matter what others think about you, because there will always be someone who will not like you for what ever reason. It’s how you feel about yourself that matters.

    I am very quick to give a guy compliment for a job well done. I mean it, it's not a come-on just a statement of fact.


    For the record I chose the high road. Their opinion meant nothing to me.

    Cheers,

    Phoenix43
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 18, 2007 3:21 PM GMT
    Freak1, lol, you called that one though I don't know, I've seen some "offers" at 303! Still, less criticism would be nice.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 22, 2007 7:11 PM GMT
    Human beings are naturally competitive. Never forget that despite being so intelligent, were are animals.

    All animals have a sense of competition and will often do what they have to do to outshine others. Even though we have lost touch with our instincts, how many people can deny the fact the fact that they have done something simply to be better than someone else?

    I think its absurd to believe that because we're gay we should be more loving and understanding. This really is just opening your eyes up to the fact that their is more to us than being gay. Gay isn't really a home, you don't run to it be nurtured or at least I never have.

    Humans are humans gay or not.

    Also understand that a lot of gay people are inadequate and thus "hate" for the sake of feeling better. But can you really blame them when they turn to a society so shallow and vain? thats why people should really better themselves for themselves and not for other people, because when you do things for other people you'd never be happy.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 22, 2007 7:20 PM GMT
    Interesting topic.

    Gay + Shallow + Fat = Mean Fat Gays that are really ANGRY at themselves for being FAT and GAY.

    Fat gay guys seem to only want to assoicate with FIT gays... Which was why (when I was fat) I was dissed by this fat guy when I tried to flirt with him.

    I think because they know they're fat, they become defensive/sensitive... Like when Fat str8 men only want to have sex with sexy slim women... it's a paradox.

    Me? I'm just a nice guy all around - and yes, GAY! I learned a lot about being FAT and GAY... which is why I lost a lot of weight to experience life from a different perspective.

    So far so good!
    PS:
    (my photo is coming soon)
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jul 05, 2007 5:25 PM GMT
    I think the pettiness really does stem from thinking someone else is better than you are and it's a reaction to intimidation. Couple this with a low self esteem, and all of a sudden everyone is looking better than you so everyone is going to get a blast from the bitch beam.

    I know of some places I refuse to go out to anymore just because there's such an air of negativity and bitchy teen girl standoffishness. No, it's not because everyone is an ex trick, others agree ;)