Republican Teabagger Michele Bachmann caught lying...yet again.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jan 25, 2011 10:15 PM GMT
    Why do people even listen to this deranged person?

    There you go, GOPers...another vanguard of Today's Republican Party! You all must be so GOProud! Why can't Breitbart fuck with videos of Bachmann instead of Shirley Sherrod? They'd be a LOT funnier.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0HRzl-vRkM8
  • rnch

    Posts: 11525

    Jan 25, 2011 10:19 PM GMT
    Sad.

    Very Sad.
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    Jan 25, 2011 10:37 PM GMT
    And sad the members here who endorse her.
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    Jan 25, 2011 11:58 PM GMT
    Cooper has such a cool, calm approach in this commentary. I'm not sure if she is lying so much as just woefully ignorant. recall "really? The first amendment says that?" And she presents herself as some kind of Constitutional "expert."

    I wonder if she could pass High School U.S. History final exam.

    My high school teachers must be spinning in their graves, they were so insistent that their students have a good grasp of their history and civics.


    Mr Gage and Mrs Elder, I'm relieved you did not live to see this. You'd have been so ashamed of these people.


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    Jan 26, 2011 12:12 AM GMT
    If you want a "WTF" moment for Thomas Jefferson, read this book:

    Friends of Liberty: A Tale of Three Patriots, Two Revolutions, and the Betrayal that Divided a Nation: Thomas Jefferson, Thaddeus Kosciuszko, and Agrippa Hull


    friendsofliberty.jpg

    This is an amazing story of the apparent perfidy of TJ. Even after reading the book, I cant understand TJ's behavior.

    "Thomas Jefferson's betrayal of a loyal friend, the great Polish patriot Tadeusz Kosciuszko, is at the center of this book by Nash (The Unknown American Revolution) and Hodges (Anna May Wong). Jefferson had promised to use Kosciuszko's American estate to free some of his slaves. He reneged on that pledge, torn as always between his principles, his benefits from slavery and his debts. Kosciuszko, a skilled engineer who greatly contributed to the American military in the Revolution and was more deeply opposed to slavery than most Americans (it was a free African-American from Massachusetts who proved to the Pole the worth and humanity of black people) could not move his friend to free his slaves. Agrippa Hull—the third man in this fascinating story—was an army orderly who served Kosciuszko and the nation of his birth. Hull seems somewhat peripheral to the main story line, but the authors' telling of his life puts yet another man previously lost to history onto the historical record. All in all, this is a wonderful book, an outstanding example of how a scholarly monograph can be readable, moving and sobering all at once."
  • tazzari

    Posts: 2942

    Jan 26, 2011 12:24 AM GMT
    What is amazing is that the grand Old Party continues to find one nut job after the other, and ever more stupid people to support.

    Many years ago I was a Republican. I supported a lot of what the GOP used to stand for. Now it seems to be a haven for greed, religiosity, and reactionaries.

    Very sad. The country needs responsible, articulate debate. Not this sort of garbage.
  • creature

    Posts: 5197

    Jan 26, 2011 12:26 AM GMT
    Poor Bachmann. Trying to rewrite our nation's history.
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    Jan 26, 2011 12:27 AM GMT
    tazzari said

    Many years ago I was a Republican. I supported a lot of what the GOP used to stand for. Now it seems to be a haven for greed, religiosity, and reactionaries.

    EXACTLY! That's my story as well! I remember when the GOP disdained ignorance instead of celebrating it.

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    Jan 26, 2011 12:31 AM GMT
    If she runs for POTUS... I think it will be an unmitigated failure.

    And Huckabee.

    Ugh.
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    Jan 26, 2011 12:36 AM GMT
    Interesting that the 3/5 of a person was mentioned, but no discussion of why the compromise.

    Article 1, Section 2 and Paragraph 3 of the United States constitution:

    "Representatives and direct taxes shall be apportioned among the several States which may be included within this Union, according to their respective Numbers, which shall be determined by adding the whole Number of free persons, including those bound to Service for a term of years, and excluding Indians not taxed, three fifths of all other Persons."

    Note the last clause that in the last clause 3/5 of the slave population was included for representation in congress and for calculating direct taxes. The suggestion of the 3/5 compromise was presented by James Madison, who was deeply opposed to the institution of slavery. Most of the non free or slave population existed in the south . The compromise was struck because, while the slave population had no voting rights, if counted a a full person their numbers would be used to provide the south with the advantage of allowing the south to forever have disproportionate representation.

    The 3/5 compromise was agreed to by the anti-slavery northern states as an important means of maintaining the balance of power. After the Civil War this article was abolished.

    The 3/5 compromise had long term effects on the political developments and the balance of power in the states, as did other provisions made by the founding fathers regarding the institution of slavery.

    I heard no mention of the 20 year limit compromise, which limited the importation of slaves to a 20 year period following the ratification of the constitution and it's purpose , according to Madison as being to end the institution of slavery.

    "Where slavery exists the republican Theory becomes still more fallacious."
    James Madison


    "Twenty years will produce all the mischief that can be apprehended from the liberty to import slaves. So long a term will be more dishonorable to the National character than to say nothing about it in the Constitution"
    James Mdison


    Being a practical man, Madison and other founders knew the south would never agree to immediately outlawing slavery, so they attempt to put as many obstructions in it's way until such time as it could be outlawed.

    "Is the importation of slaves permitted by the new Constitution for twenty years. By the old it is permitted forever." James Madison

    "It ought to be considered as a great point gained in favor of humanity, that a period of twenty years may terminate forever, within these States, a traffic which has long and so loudly upbraided the barbarism of modern policy; that within that period it will receive considerable discouragement from the Federal government and be totally abolished, by a concurrence of the few States which continue the unnatural traffic in the prohibitory example which has been given by so great a majority of the Union. Happy would it be for the unfortunate Africans if an equal prospect lay before them of being redeemed from the oppression of their European brethren!"
    James Madison


    I didn't notice any mention of any of this. It's all laid out and more in 'Voices of the Political System of the United States', 'Federalist Paper #42 and "Memorandum on an African Colony for Freed Slaves"

    I heard no mention of the requests of Franklin and the Pennsylvania Quakers petitions to the Continental Congress to end slavery.

    So , why no mention of any of this? At best it would be the pot calling the kettle black. I guess no one has ever heard "people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones " ! Who's rewriting history?


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    Jan 26, 2011 12:43 AM GMT
    If only Ms. Bachmann had made mention of even half the points you did... but as it is, she may lack the intellectual vigor to survive the primaries, much less a run against Obama-the-campaigning-machine.
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    Jan 26, 2011 5:43 PM GMT
    Perhaps, Mr. Cooper and his staff should either learn the english language, history ot to lie better. As Ms Bachmann said, John Quincy Adams was not a founder, but she referred to him as a "forbearer" and did not, as Mr. Cooper said imply that he was a founder.

    Mr. Cooper also forgets to mention that many of the founders were forward looking and did intentionally set out principals Thea underlie the principals of the country and those of it's society. For example he neglects to inform us that it was the founders who deliberately moved the new country and it's Society away from a Hereditary Aristocracy and the system of primogeniture, cornerstones of European society. Such facts underlie Ms Bachman's remarks in the beginning of the clip.

    To say this wasn't an attack on Ms Bachman was the biggest joke of all. For some reason I don't remember Mr. Cooper just showed he didn't know as much as he pretended to or deliberately misled his viewers. I don't remember Mr Cooper being such a stickler for history when the current President of the United States said; "Over the last 15 months, we’ve traveled to every corner of the United States. I’ve now been in 57 states? I think one left to go. Alaska and Hawaii, I was not allowed to go to even though I really wanted to visit, but my staff would not justify it." Having a degree in history, I don't think I was ever thought the history of those other 7 states of the United States.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrsBKGpwi58&feature=player_detailpage

    Kind of puts History teacher, Mr Coopers little clip in context!


  • mke_bt

    Posts: 707

    Jan 26, 2011 8:23 PM GMT
    shybuffguy saidPerhaps, Mr. Cooper and his staff should either learn the english language, history ot to lie better. As Ms Bachmann said, John Quincy Adams was not a founder, but she referred to him as a "forbearer" and did not, as Mr. Cooper said imply that he was a founder.

    Mr. Cooper also forgets to mention that many of the founders were forward looking and did intentionally set out principals Thea underlie the principals of the country and those of it's society. For example he neglects to inform us that it was the founders who deliberately moved the new country and it's Society away from a Hereditary Aristocracy and the system of primogeniture, cornerstones of European society. Such facts underlie Ms Bachman's remarks in the beginning of the clip.

    To say this wasn't an attack on Ms Bachman was the biggest joke of all. For some reason I don't remember Mr. Cooper just showed he didn't know as much as he pretended to or deliberately misled his viewers. I don't remember Mr Cooper being such a stickler for history when the current President of the United States said; "Over the last 15 months, we’ve traveled to every corner of the United States. I’ve now been in 57 states? I think one left to go. Alaska and Hawaii, I was not allowed to go to even though I really wanted to visit, but my staff would not justify it." Having a degree in history, I don't think I was ever thought the history of those other 7 states of the United States.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrsBKGpwi58&feature=player_detailpage

    Kind of puts History teacher, Mr Coopers little clip in context!




    After 15 months of exhaustive campaigning I look at that as gaffe from someone who needs a little sleep. Do you REALLY believe he thinks there are 57 states? I love when the opposition pulls out this quote to justify someone like Bachmann.
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    Jan 26, 2011 9:37 PM GMT
    alphatrigger saidIf she runs for POTUS... I think it will be an unmitigated failure.

    And Huckabee.

    Ugh.


    Agreed. I think she just got lost in optimism, but she was sort of right about the founding fathers being increasingly interested in abolishing slavery. I think George Washington set his free and a number of other founders moved in that direction a little later on in their lives.
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    Jan 27, 2011 3:55 AM GMT
    mocktwinkie said
    alphatrigger saidIf she runs for POTUS... I think it will be an unmitigated failure.

    And Huckabee.

    Ugh.


    Agreed. I think she just got lost in optimism, but she was sort of right about the founding fathers being increasingly interested in abolishing slavery. I think George Washington set his free and a number of other founders moved in that direction a little later on in their lives.




    Maybe Huckabee will run with Bachman as his 'token woman' running mate, kinda like McCain's token Palin. we see how that worked out.
  • creature

    Posts: 5197

    Jan 27, 2011 3:57 AM GMT
    shybuffguy,

    You really missed the point. The point of what Cooper said is to point out the inaccuracy of Bachmann's speech.

    Bachmann said, "The very founders that wrote those documents worked tirelessly until slavery was no more."

    The above claim is not true. Whether the slaves were freed upon their death does not equate to working tirelessly to ending slavery. Franklin may have worked tirelessly, if that is the case, though he is but one of how many founding fathers?

    I don't think any serious U.S. Historian, with a focus on early America would lay such a claim. Some, or even all, may have had a distaste for slavery, even though they participated in it. But that does not equate to working "tirelessly." Working tirelessly is what Martin Luther King Jr. did for civil rights. It is what Susan B. Anthony did for woman's suffrage.

    Anderson Cooper did not have to talk about the Enlightenment principles that guided the minds and spirits of our founding fathers. He did not have to give a complete history lesson which includes Quakers. To discredit Bachmann, all he had to do was point out her error. That is it.