Forgiveness, Saying you are Sorry, and Owning up to your Actions

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    Mar 20, 2011 2:13 AM GMT
    This probably pertains to both gay and straight men but since my experience lies with the former will just be talking to and about them.

    What is it with gay men’s inability to 1.) Forgive 2.)Say you are Sorry and 3.)Own up to your actions. I am more then happy to give anyone a second change and burry to hatchet so to speak but they have to first be will to say they are sorry for whatever (standing me up, acting like an ass etc). Yet some gay guys will not forgive you no matter what, and they will get upset at the smallest things. This one guy got mad at me because I got a little aggressive in bed, all I did was pin him down a bit and he threw a huge fit. He had not told me before hand that he was against it and since then he will not even talk to me or forgive me for what I did, even though I said I was sorry and explained that I would not have done it if I knew it would have been such a big deal.

    Then there are guys who will not say they are sorry. I do not mean for every little thing, saying sorry all the time gets on my nerves. But if you do something to hurt someone feelings or that makes this angry then say you are sorry and figure out what happened and make sure not to do it again. We all have bad days were we might be easily agitated or quick to snap and people and when we do later we have to say sorry for our actions and likewise know to forgive others in return on their bad days. There are people who don’t like certain words (for me fag is fine to say but others hate the word) and we need to be considerate to others. This does not mean always being PC in everything we say but know to back track when we say something that someone is strongly offended by.

    The last part is what I see the least of in the gay world. For some reason guys that say they don’t like drama means they don’t like owning up to their actions. When my ex and I broke up I had a lot of questions and mainly wanted him to explain his actions. He said he didn’t want to because that was drama. No owning up to your actions is not drama it’s being a man. Sure you can do whatever you want but there will be consequences one way or another and sooner or later you will have to answer for you actions. When you are little and you hit someone you have to explain why, you can’t say you don’t want to because that’s drama you have to give an explanation. Guess what that does not change when you are older. Yet many gay men hide behind the “no drama” shit so they don’t have to be held accountable.

    To those of you who this applies to own up for one and tell us why, why can’t you forgive others, say you are sorry, and own up to you actions. And for those of us who can or are learning how to don’t you think it’s better that way.?
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    Mar 20, 2011 3:19 AM GMT
    Simon78928 said This one guy got mad at me because I got a little aggressive in bed, all I did was pin him down and bit and he threw a huge fit. He had not told me before hand that he was against it and since then he will not even talk to me or forgive me for what I did, even though I said I was sorry and explained that I would not have done it if I knew it would have been such a big deal



    I swear some of this shit has got to ne made up, I can't stop laughing...sorry!icon_lol.gificon_eek.gif Did anyone else read this.....
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    Mar 20, 2011 3:32 AM GMT
    I'm sorry for my inability to apologize. I also might not forgive you, but I promise my ADD will help me to forget...

    Alright, I'll answer in a slightly more serious tone. I usually am not sorry, even if I offend somebody. If I am, and I feel that I am wrong, I will apologize. Sometimes I offer an insincere apology because social norms demand it and I offer it "just because." Usually I don't. I would prefer if people did not apologize for offending me if they are not actually sorry for what they said. I will get over it, I expect others to as well. If you are overly sensitive, likely you are not going to know me very well anyhow (which suits me just fine.)

    I can almost guarantee that I do not even notice when I offend somebody. I have some Aspergers traits (hell, it might even be full blown, but I really don't care to get diagnosed "properly.") What this means is that I miss social cues. If I upset you and you are pouting and visibly upset, chances are that I am not going to notice. If you tell me, and explain why you are upset there is a pretty good chance that I will offer a sincere apology even if I still can not figure out why I am apologizing and why you are upset. (As stated above, I will not apologize if I am not sorry, and in a case like this I might not be sorry for what I did, but I might be sorry for how it affected somebody else, making my apology valid.)

    As to the forgiveness, I usually don't really notice when people apologize to me because there is a pretty good chance that they noticed the incident and are stressing while I completely missed it (or as stated above, forgot about it...) As such, there is usually not a problem forgiving. However, if you piss me off time after time I remember the "feeling" that I really don't like you and no number of apologies are going to matter, because I will have forgotten about the specific incidents, and I will forget the apology leaving only a "feeling."

    Don't know if that helps in your search for the truth of people and their inability to say "sorry" and forgive or not.
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    Mar 20, 2011 3:40 AM GMT
    Hillie said
    Simon78928 said This one guy got mad at me because I got a little aggressive in bed, all I did was pin him down and bit and he threw a huge fit. He had not told me before hand that he was against it and since then he will not even talk to me or forgive me for what I did, even though I said I was sorry and explained that I would not have done it if I knew it would have been such a big deal



    I swear some of this shit has got to ne made up, I can't stop laughing...sorry!icon_lol.gificon_eek.gif Did anyone else read this.....

    .. Makes me wonder what happened if Sam Merlotte didn't wake up from that dream ... hmm.

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    Mar 20, 2011 3:49 AM GMT
    I'm not sure if it's a weakness, or a strength, but I do have the ability to forgive, even at times when I should not. I find it hard to hold a grudge for long. saddly many of our brothers half and full, are similar to women when it comes to forgiveness, they can behold a grudge over the smallest of thing forever; and if you ask what is wrong you get: "nothing!" So fine good nothing is wrong........

    Saying you are sorry, not a problem I have, I can stand corrected. But there are just things you can not say sorry for either, certainly if it's a premeditated action. I love the way there are certain people here who love to kick low to hurt, even get off their pedestal to do it, but if you do it back and better, there is no forgiveness or sorry either;icon_rolleyes.gificon_lol.gif

    I already said I can stand corrected. I am not narcissistic, and do not for one moment fool myself I am perfect, or want to be, so yes I can fuck up, and will own up to it as well.
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    Mar 20, 2011 4:18 AM GMT
    _Mohammed_ said
    Simon78928 said This one guy got mad at me because I got a little aggressive in bed, all I did was pin him down and bit and he threw a huge fit. He had not told me before hand that he was against it and since then he will not even talk to me or forgive me for what I did, even though I said I was sorry and explained that I would not have done it if I knew it would have been such a big deal.


    Ok, so you are astonished that someone who told you in different terms "Don't manhandle me in bed" is upset at you for "manhandling" him in bed?

    Can you not understand what he said the first time?

    Does he have to explain to you again that he does not like it?

    You said you would not have done it if you knew it was such a big deal. Well, he told you from the first time, HE IS AGAINST IT.

    Big deal does not mean he has to say it or show it twice.
    Big deal means it is a big deal.

    Whether I tell someone once or twice, he should get it from the first time.




    HE HAD NOT TOLD ME BEFORE .....that means that he DID NOT TELL ME that we was againt is, as in he DID NOT inform me that he didn't like to be manhandeled....was my english really that off or does everyone read it the way Mohammed did?
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    Mar 20, 2011 4:21 AM GMT
    Oh Crap....guys wow.....meant to say pinned him down A bit not "and bit" I don't bite people. All I did was pin one hand down with mine when I was over him, I'm not a vampireicon_redface.gif
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    Mar 20, 2011 4:25 AM GMT
    Simon78928 said
    _Mohammed_ said
    Simon78928 said This one guy got mad at me because I got a little aggressive in bed, all I did was pin him down and bit and he threw a huge fit. He had not told me before hand that he was against it and since then he will not even talk to me or forgive me for what I did, even though I said I was sorry and explained that I would not have done it if I knew it would have been such a big deal.


    Ok, so you are astonished that someone who told you in different terms "Don't manhandle me in bed" is upset at you for "manhandling" him in bed?

    Can you not understand what he said the first time?

    Does he have to explain to you again that he does not like it?

    You said you would not have done it if you knew it was such a big deal. Well, he told you from the first time, HE IS AGAINST IT.

    Big deal does not mean he has to say it or show it twice.
    Big deal means it is a big deal.

    Whether I tell someone once or twice, he should get it from the first time.




    HE HAD NOT TOLD ME BEFORE .....that means that he DID NOT TELL ME that we was againt is, as in he DID NOT inform me that he didn't like to be manhandeled....was my english really that off or does everyone read it the way Mohammed did?


    my apologies... I thought I read it correctly.. .seems not.

    In that case, I don't really know what to say.

    Some can argue that if he was really against it, he should have told you earlier while others will tell you that you should ask him first.
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    Mar 20, 2011 4:26 AM GMT
    Simon78928 said
    _Mohammed_ said
    Simon78928 said This one guy got mad at me because I got a little aggressive in bed, all I did was pin him down and bit and he threw a huge fit. He had not told me before hand that he was against it and since then he will not even talk to me or forgive me for what I did, even though I said I was sorry and explained that I would not have done it if I knew it would have been such a big deal.


    Ok, so you are astonished that someone who told you in different terms "Don't manhandle me in bed" is upset at you for "manhandling" him in bed?

    Can you not understand what he said the first time?

    Does he have to explain to you again that he does not like it?

    You said you would not have done it if you knew it was such a big deal. Well, he told you from the first time, HE IS AGAINST IT.

    Big deal does not mean he has to say it or show it twice.
    Big deal means it is a big deal.

    Whether I tell someone once or twice, he should get it from the first time.




    HE HAD NOT TOLD ME BEFORE .....that means that he DID NOT TELL ME that we was againt is, as in he DID NOT inform me that he didn't like to be manhandeled....was my english really that off or does everyone read it the way Mohammed did?


    No, Simon is right, Mohammed misread what Simon wrote
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    Mar 20, 2011 4:29 AM GMT
    I saw the 'and bit' part... good thing you cleared that up :S
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    Mar 20, 2011 4:48 AM GMT
    You highlight the reasons why I don't date pretty well, except for the pinning and biting. That's just a weird thing to bring up lol.

    That aside. You know what it all boils down to? Men have needy, delicate egos, and they'll do anything they can to have them stroked and carressed regardless of the cost to someone else. Men are competitive by nature, but when you add narcissism to the mix it takes things to a whole other level of being disrespectful and shallow.
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    Mar 20, 2011 4:50 AM GMT
    lol, there's nothing I can see in your post specific to gay people. All people have these conundrums. icon_wink.gif


    -Doug
  • Latenight30

    Posts: 1525

    Mar 20, 2011 11:32 AM GMT
    I have a wide range of gay friends. Some that look like the toughest ones on the block can't take shit.
    Delicate. You just have to find that stuff out.
    My guy does like to bite but we only find other guys who can take it.
    Hell after 10 years I have issues taking the aggressiveness. It creates that fight or flight instinct.
    I say sorry to much. If you just do the right thing in the beginning you have nothing to apologize for. Be a man, have some balls and just do it. Don't pansy ass pussy foot around. Make a decision and stick to it.
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    Mar 20, 2011 11:59 AM GMT
    Gay, straight, bi, or other: Contrition, forgiveness, and reconciliation preserves civilization. We are animals, but we also have the ability to rise above purely animal behavior. Empathy is a sign of evolution IMHO.
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    Mar 20, 2011 12:21 PM GMT
    Well regardless of whether your sexual partner at the time said he did or didn't like to be manhandled you should've taken the time and initiative and inquired about it before assuming it was ok. So really that is kind of your bad and I can see why your partner at the time was a bit annoyed. Seems you got a little overly excited in bed. It happens.

    As for forgiving....well some people are pretty strong when it comes certain things and don't like when certain morals or ethics that hold dear to them are broken. They cannot forgive because they might view it as a form of weakness and that's something they don't want to be associated with. It's either that are they are just flat out stubborn. Again it happens.

    Some people don't say sorry because of the the simple fact that they figure if they were sorry about whatever they did then they probably wouldn't have done it in the first place. They don't live in the past and move forward. What's done is done and they figure apologizing isn't gonna make it any better. Plus you have some people who don't like using it so casually and freely since it does seem to be said quite bit and sounds empty. No sense saying it unless you really genuinely mean it.

    Some people just lack ownership and are cowards and can't see their own mistakes and clearly can't accept them when they are made.
  • rnch

    Posts: 11524

    Mar 20, 2011 1:20 PM GMT
    if he was THAT much opposed to ANY certain type of bedroom activity; he should had told you about it before ya'll got busy.

    IMO, he sounds like a huge drama queen.
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    Mar 20, 2011 4:57 PM GMT
    I have absolutely no problem to apologize to somebody , when i am or done something wrong ..
    Forgiving is really easy for me , when the person has been sincere in his/her apology .....If i sense or feel dishonesty ...no-way , i won't forgive you ......
  • jimjock

    Posts: 278

    Apr 10, 2011 5:42 AM GMT
    Longlean saidGay, straight, bi, or other: Contrition, forgiveness, and reconciliation preserves civilization. We are animals, but we also have the ability to rise above purely animal behavior. Empathy is a sign of evolution IMHO.



    I love your hair! I hope it wins!
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  • MuscleComeBac...

    Posts: 2376

    Apr 10, 2011 6:06 AM GMT
    "It isn't easy, it doesn't count if it's easy, it's the hardest thing. Forgiveness. Which is maybe where love and justice finally meet."
    -- Angels in America