It's Hard to be in the CLOSET!!! (its DARK in here)

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 28, 2007 11:02 PM GMT
    I've been in the closet since i was born...LOL. It's really hard to be in the closet and at the same time wanted to date someone or even have a boyfriend. I've dated a guy once 3 years ago and it lasted only for 2 months. The guy said that he likes me a lot and that he wants me to be his boyfriend. One Saturday night, i caught him having someone over in his apartment, which he told me that he was alone and was just chilling at his place. What a jerk! He let the guy leave though and had me in. LOL.. He was crying and was really sorry about it but i had to stop seeing him. Last year, I had a gf but it was weird and different. Sex life was great but i still think about guys. Why is it hard for gay guys to date closeted gay or bi guys?
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    Jun 28, 2007 11:33 PM GMT
    "Why is it hard for gay guys to date closeted gay or bi guys?"

    If someone is out it's hard to date someone in the closet because you are forced to keep your relationship in the "closet". Those who have gone through struggle in order to "come out" don"t want to look back.

    As to the second part of your question..........personally I wouldn't want to sleep with anyone (date) who is sleeping with women.......ewwwwwwwwwwww! lol

    Come out come out where ever you are!
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    Jun 29, 2007 6:59 AM GMT
    Yeah, i know some guys ive talked to and they have the same feeling like you. It feels "yucky" to be sleeping with someone who are into girls but personally, I don't mind at all. Personally, I still think that Penis is for Vagina.. Spermatozoa to Ovum. (that's why it still hard to come out) Having sex with a guy is awesome but to know someone "real" is hard to find.I don't know how many gay couples out there who like to settle down and grow old with their partner. I think its rare. Like everyone wants to be with anybody HOT , maybe not relationshipwise but to most part, sexually.I personally don't think that there's contentment/satisfaction being gay and I hope one day i will fully understand.
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    Jun 29, 2007 2:26 PM GMT
    My ex is bisexual. He leave in my house and when I not around he bring girl home to have sex with. Frankly, I dont really feel upset if he do it with girl, but when I find out he start bringing guy home, that really does it for me. That is the beginning to the end of our relationship.

    I dont know why , I dont think girl are any threat to our relationship. Any of you guy feel the same way?

    This is off topic but just a thought.
  • SoDakGuy

    Posts: 1862

    Jun 29, 2007 2:34 PM GMT
    Just come out, dude. It's easier. Hell, if I can be out in South Dakota - you can come out too.
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    Jun 29, 2007 2:39 PM GMT
    Personally, being in the closet made me feel like i was doing something wrong, cloak and dagger like and hiding from the world.

    A lot of that had to do with my own acceptance of being who i am. I spent years torturing myself, disgusted and feeling guilty and being angry and frustrated at myself. Its only in the last year and last 6months particlarly from talking to friends on here, that i moved forward and starting really understanding and accepting who i was.

    So on wednesday i kicked down the door of the so called 'closet' and told my parents, because i felt that to accept myself i had to square it with them, the only people that i really really care about. Bottom line is that everything is fine.

    It came about from wanting to move forward into trying a relationship with a guy rather than the occasional hook up. And i didn't want to be strangled by my own mind and restricted by what i wanted to be.

    As for women, i still love them physically and emotionally, always have. The 'coming out' has silence alot of negativity in my mind that i had when i was dating women, instead of really loving them i was using them as a way of moving away from the 'gay' side of me, no fair on either participant in the relationship.

    I still want a wife and kids and a white picket fence, but now i feel that i more emotionally stable to deal with the issues of either.

    In relation to your own closet. There is no rule or deadline to when or how you have to do it. The important thing is to learn to accept yourself for who you are and not what you may think people think you are. Everyone is different. Everyone handles it differently, the similarities are that we all want to be loved and to be happy.

    Different strokes for different strokes.

    Be Happy man.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 29, 2007 2:43 PM GMT
    sorry that last bit should read

    Different Strokes for different Folks

    oops



    And as for penis vagina, its all good. Just different.


    What i can't understand is arse and elbow! Fisting is not on my to do list, but hey if thats your thing thats your thing.

    No harm no foul.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 29, 2007 3:22 PM GMT
    Dating a BI guy would be no issue. Being BI means you can commit emotionally and sexually to either gender. I wouldn't care that he could choose to have sex with a woman any more than he could choose to have sex with a man. While we're together, I'd expect a committment.

    I would not date a closeted guy, sorry to say. Family is important to me as is shared friendships. Dating a closeted guy would mean we'd be reduced to scurrying around secretly to keep his secret.

    Plus, I remember when I was closeted....many, many issues that still needed to be resolved that would get in the way of the relationship.

    I do wish you luck in coming out. I'm sure you'll make the right decision and do so in your own time.
  • Lincsbear

    Posts: 2589

    Jun 29, 2007 3:57 PM GMT
    As someone who was in the closet far too many years,I can tell you it`s not a happy or healthy place to be.Everything becomes a secet,including any guys you`re seeing,you lie all about this constantly,you live in fear that someone will find out.Getting good at lying will cut you off from yourself,and you don`t want that.I can see how difficult all this must be.And the longer you leave coming out,the harder it gets.It was by far the best thing I did coming out,being honest with everyone,especially myself.I know there`s no hard and fast rules for doing it,but I`d advise you it`s worth it in the long run.Meeting other guys become much easier for me,and it will for you.Best of luck whatever you decide to do.
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    Jun 29, 2007 4:29 PM GMT
    Being in the closet just plain out sucks monkey dick. Your always worried about getting exposed, people finding out, just crap that you don't need. Plus when you date a "closet case" your dealing with the same crap, but instead your not able to go out for dinner, have a date, bring someone home...your just always paranoid for no good stinking reason. With this paranoia is the emotional distress that comes with it.
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    Jun 29, 2007 4:41 PM GMT
    I am closeted. I understand why some gay men remain in the closet. It not as easy as you think, to come out. There a lot of issue. Especially if you live in a conservative, religious society. You have to think about what people say. Your job , your co-worker ,family and friend and in some cases your very personal safety. I know , we shoudn;t give a darn with other people think , but what if you are the only gay in the whole department. Over here in my conservative country homosexuality are considered a social disease from the west, mental disorder, we have religious preacher condeming homosexual in religions sermons with treat of hell and story of Sodom and Gemorah.

    When I was a student in the US , I make a mistake of coming out to several friend from my country. They of course talk behind my back (yeah ...that the faggot still unmarriage at 42..), and now I back home I regretted what I have done. The best thing I can do is to stop being their friend so not to cause more damage.

    Further more, its really nobody business what my sexual orientation it. Just like you guy I am comfortable to be who I am. I date , fuck , function just like other gay fellow but I have to be carefull. That also the reason I just can put my picture here (eventhough I very much wanted to) I dont care if other Real Jock see me, but what if it leak to my workplace .

    Yes , it dark and hard in the closet, but it not any brighter or easier outside .
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 29, 2007 5:20 PM GMT
    zak how do you know if its any brighter or easier if you dont come out? just a question. I was closeted for quit some time...then I got over it. Family stays or leaves...its not your problem. If they cant accept you for you well fuck'em. Jobs come and go...if your single and in your 40's anyways...people probably already talking behind your back about your "gayness".

    My partner is from a small rural community with god at the center. Ultra conservative he is somewhat "closeted" with some of his family members even his mother. But to the point he does not have any kids, never brings home a girl..except for me...lol. And he don't think so but I am 100% certian they talk behind his back about his "gayness"

    Maybe I am naive to parts of the world...bu seriously fuck'em!!!! You as a person only live once. You only have one shot one chance. You might as well try and be happy and enjoy your one chance. I am sure there are people in your community that are in the same boat...reach out. I am sure your not the only gay man there.
  • Lincsbear

    Posts: 2589

    Jun 29, 2007 6:02 PM GMT
    zakariazul,I,too,was born and brought up in a rural,isolated,conserative,religous county in Great Britain.Whatever you may hear about the"liberated" West,it isn`t all true.Some of it`s still pretty backward!I remained in the closet for many years,too long by far,living a life of denial and fear.No,not living,existing from day to day.I suppose I reached rock bottom a few years ago,and then I resvolved to change this half-life.It took some courage on my part,fearing my family especially would disown me,but in the end it turned out for the best as most people who knew me had either worked it out for themselves,or weren`t shocked/surprised.Either way,I had underestimated them!I realize your situation is not mine,but I`m relieved I`m open about myself now.Life`s so much better.Have courage,zakariazul.If you want to come out,you will find a way.Best wishes on whatever you decide to do.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 29, 2007 6:47 PM GMT
    Turn on the light. I do not thin you are really in the closet. you seem more bi-sexual than gay. maybe you are looking for some acceptance in your lifestyle choice. But if you are wanting to meet and date guys. you need to come out of the closet.

    Long term gay couple are not as rare as you think. I know a few.

    Here is link to the HRC web site on coming out maybe it can help you.

    http://www.hrc.org/Template.cfm?Section=Coming_Out
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    Jun 29, 2007 7:12 PM GMT
    Keep in mind that zak lives in Malaysia. Malaysian society is not very tolerant of gays.
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    Jun 29, 2007 10:04 PM GMT
    It's overwhelming to read all of the replies. I sure have nobody to talk to about being gay or bi but just here online. I am glad that i've found this site where i have the freedom to express my thoughts/feelings. Some sites are mainly just for hook ups.. (A4A??) LOL.. Some of you guys say that It's an easier life being out than being closeted. OK, my family and friends (all of them) are very religious. My mom told me when i was around 14 that gay people will go to hell. WOW! I totally disagree about that. (i feel like crying upon writing this now) But anyways, for sure, she had an idea that i was different from the other boys. Growing up, my big brother calls me gay everytime we fight. My parents sent me to a sectarian/private school from grade school to college. I am not really a religious guy but I do believe in God. As of now, i try to open up my mind about what other people's beliefs are. From Muslims -Jewish- Christianity.
    Since i am a Christian, I believe that God loves Everyone.(including Saddam) :) but God hates the Sin. So, everyone can be Gay but hates it when you are involve sexually with the same sex or to a woman you are not married to or even have sex with animals ( some people do that) *sigh** Freedom!!!!! that's all we wanted. Everybody wants to be free. Free to do Whatever we like to do. A smoker can smoke 4 packs a day, a nudist likes to be naked 24/7, who cares? Its all about Freedom. Let say, i don't believe in God at all.. But for sure we've studied the human anatomy. Like I said before, a sperm is for ovum. not sperm for sperm. The anus is not a sex organ but a hole for excreting human waste. LOL.. i kinda like Anal sex though.. haha.. but seriously, having all of these thoughts makes it a little harder to come out. Because of Freedom of will/ to choose, then we want to do ANYTHING that pleases us. Sometimes its all about the pleasure of doing something. Like, nothing's bad and nothings good at all.
    And what kinda life out there outside the closet that would make me feel whole and complete? Gay PRIDE? :)
    And why being in the closet always called a "LIAR"? Am I really LYING to myself and to others? When you really have the need to FART then you have to..but do you have to tell the people in the room that you've just farted?? ..whoah..unless you made a really BIG farting sound then you have no option cause obviously everyone knows...I know its a SILLY example but I just can't stand it being called a LIAR when the fact I am struggling with this sexuality. Sometimes i just pray that God take my life while i am driving on the freeway. Hey! i am NOT suicidal but u know what i mean,, its really a hard life. This world is so complicated. But hey, I hope one day i will fully understand it. I will try to be more OPEn, accepting, considerate.. name it all.. i will try my best to live a substantial life and hope you do too.

    have a great week end to all..
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 30, 2007 12:05 AM GMT
    Tq for your response on my comment.

    First of all. Who say I am not happy. Just because I am in the closet, didnt meant I am not happy. Yes there are other gay people in my community. I reach out to them and make friend with them. We support one another, but that about as open as we can be. To each other, to our own kind , certainly not to the straight world. In this society you learn to enjoy your little world without rocking the boat to much, so not to hurt anyone.

    I am not like some people, that dont really care if thier family disown them .They are very important to me. Telling them my true self will really hurt them. I certainly dont want to be the object of ridicule /a laughing stock at my work place. I get enough of that when I was a effiminate /sissy kid growing a painful childhood at school. Just like everyone else I want to be treated normaly and respecfully.

    Just like I mention earlier, my sexuality is my own business. My family, straight friend or other people dont have to know . Just like you mention , I suspect they know that I just not interested in girl, that I am gay.(it seem strange that I have everything except a wife and family) My younger brother have ask me about it , an sadly I have to denied it. I think is best for everybody to leave it the way it is.

    That why I love this site. I can be a true gay man. Letting go of my feeling, opinion and frustration.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 30, 2007 1:32 AM GMT
    Most LGBT centers have support groups for people who are coming out or who are questioning their sexuality. I used google and found a link to one program in LA:

    http://www.lagaycenter.org/site/c.mvI4IhNZJwE/b.2279557/k.50F1/Coming_Out_Workshop_for_Men__Ongoing.htm

    The closet prevented me from knowing my true self. It reinforced the idea that I was flawed in a fundamental way. It made me feel defective.

    Coming out was one of the best things I've ever done for myself. I feel more secure now, more grounded, content and at home in the world; above all, not defective.

    For me, building a network of gay friends was an important part of the process. Again, gay social groups like hiking clubs (or whatever) can be a good way to find new friends. You've got a huge advantage living in LA, where I'm sure you'll have plenty of groups to choose from. Good luck!

    Also: congratulations to Surfwarrior for coming out to his parents!
  • Lincsbear

    Posts: 2589

    Jun 30, 2007 1:45 AM GMT
    It`s good that you have this website where you can be yourself,zakariazul;it`s a real outlet for you.I wish I`d had something like this when I was growing up in the`70s and `80s to express myself.Your concern for your family does you credit.In Great Britain people are more individualistic than in your country,and decide things more on what suits them,not others.I was like you in the sense of not wanting other people upset by what I told them.I remained in the closet too long.Neither of us was a liar,but we were less than honest,particularly with ourselves.This has done me some harm in the years afterwards.I`m working on this!Like you,I don`t make a big fuss of my sexuality,but if someone asks I`m completely honest with them.That`s all I can do.You have to find some kind of balance between yourself and society.
  • GQjock

    Posts: 11648

    Jun 30, 2007 10:06 AM GMT
    It takes a lot of work to constantly be on guard and lie to people
    I hope that the reason you're still in the closet is a good one...because finding someone on either side of that fence is gonna be very hard
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jul 01, 2007 7:50 PM GMT
    coming out? wow.. lying to myself? i dont know about it...

    http://www.youaction.com/view_video.php?viewkey=09587cf485ea990207f3&page=1&viewtype=&category=mr
  • atxclimber

    Posts: 480

    Jul 01, 2007 10:06 PM GMT
    I think the decision about sin, or whatever you choose to call it -- I like the Buddhist term "skillful," myself, just about which behaviors lead you towards enlightenment -- but anyway, I think deciding which things are sins / unskillful / whatever has to be personal.

    I suppose maybe some people buy into this idea that things are sins just because God said so, but I always thought there be some rhyme or reason to it. Just like the Buddha never randomly called behaviors and thoughts "unskillful" without also being able to explain why they didn't lead towards enlightenment.

    I was raised Catholic and to my mind, it was very intuitive that adultery, theft, murder, idolatry, etc. would be sins. They have these obvious negative repercussions, it fits into the belief system well. Homosexuality never clicked with me because the justifications were loose and predicated on this idea that God hated whatever was essentially unproductive. Same with masturbation. Don't waste sperm? Reminds me of the Monty Python song, and seems like a holdover from when reproducing was actually an imperative. Nowadays it'd be nice if people would slow it down with all the offspring.

    But obviously you have to make up your own mind. And there's certainly the "everyone has their burdens" argument, like, I'd love to eat a whole flourless chocolate-caramel cake every day, but I can't do that, and just because I was born with the urge to do it doesn't mean it's right.

    In my mind, though, it comes down to the difference between moderation and outright denial. I don't think chocolate-caramel cake is somehow bad or unholy, I just dispassionately recognize that if I eat too much of it, I'll get fat and/or die of a heart attack by age 30.

    It changes the approach, too. In my experience, flat-out denial has always made for this kind of desperate attempt to crush the urge where moderation has made for more of an acceptance of the urge and an approach towards balance with self-love.
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    Jul 02, 2007 2:27 AM GMT
    sin , unskillful.. a personal thing.. i agree with you since it deals with "spiritual" aspect of a person. A personal conviction.Freedom to choose. But yet, Life is governed by Rules, Regulations and Laws.

    Sometimes, I think that WE ,gay or bi people are not genetically normal. Like, I rather be called an Abnormal person and yet accepted and loved by the society than being Normal but an outcast. I think those are one of the reason that makes a person hard to come out.
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    Jul 02, 2007 3:43 AM GMT
    If everyone stayed in line and followed all of the rules, would we ever progress as a society? Many people thought it blasphemous and unnatural for humans to fly. Think about how different our lives would be if the Wright brothers followed the "rules" and heeded popular belief. What about slavery? Or women's liberation? Many of these rules were created out of fear of the unknown. I believe that as long as I am a productive member of society and do my best to promote love and peace (and have only really been able to accomplish this after having accepted all of myself), that I have every right to follow my heart and be with the person I choose. The true God doesn't discriminate. God is unconditional love.
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    Jul 02, 2007 4:59 AM GMT
    Smooth, couple thoughts for you for another closeted guy...

    "But for sure we've studied the human anatomy. Like I said before, a sperm is for ovum. not sperm for sperm. The anus is not a sex organ but a hole for excreting human waste."

    Don't get too hung up on men are designed for women and vice versa, or body parts are for certain things. We use our hands for anything, women's breasts are 'for breastfeeding' but they also play a role in sex, just like a woman or man's anus. The pleasure centers of the whole body are found in more places than just penis and/or vagina. Why is the neck or ears involved in sex, or lips for that matter? Sex is a whole body thing, and whole mind thing. The argument that gay sex is wrong because of physiological design is just a daft argument asserted by people who want you to think it can't be ok. Sex being a mind/body/spirit thing goes way beyond anatomy. The anti-gay crowd wants to keep it simple, and if you accept that, they win.

    "And why being in the closet always called a "LIAR"? Am I really LYING to myself and to others? "

    You are right, you don't owe it to anyone to announce that you are bi/gay. Withholding the information isn't lying. Now, if someone asks if you gay or like guys, you say 'no' - that's lying. But just because a person asks you something, YOU DO NOT OWE THEM AN HONEST ANSWER.

    In every situation you face in life you must use judgement about what and to whom you divulge truthful information about yourself or those under your charge. Lying is a social skill and not a fault. Bad judgement about who to lie to and why - that's a fault. You start learning it as soon as you start talking. You spend your entire childhood figuring out how to lie. The smarter your parents, the more challenging the lying and the better liar you become. Lying is work and it is more comfortable (skillful as atxclimber would say) to arrange your life so that you can be honest with everyone around you.

    Also, just because you can and do lie to a person or whole group of people, does not mean you are incapable of being completely honest with someone whom you trust.

    Lying is also NOT a malicious act. It can be, but it isn't inherently malicious. It gets a horrible reputation generally, because we spend the first 18 yrs being told by our parents 'Don't lie to me, young man! I know your lying, I wasn't born yesterday!' The underlying point to that situation being that parents don't want you to lie to them - because they are the ones you must trust to protect and guide you.

    My advice...

    Don't come out, until you decide the chance to rebuild your life surrounded by friends who 'understand' you; family who can hear about your real personal life; and go public with a boyfriend anywhere - the chance to have that is worth the possible loss of family/friendship/occupation that you have developed to-date. If you live with Mom and Dad, can't afford an apartment,don't have any other living arrangement made and don't think they'd take it well, it's probably not a good time to come out. If the boss is a jerk or other gay's in the company don't advance, works not safe either.

    Good Luck.