PayPal Disputes Over 45 days

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 02, 2011 11:19 AM GMT
    I ordered a couple of vests for the gym from this website:

    http://www.cityboyzfashions.com/

    And they didn't turn up. I contacted the orders e-mail address and the owner of the site and was told there was an issue with the shipping/warehouse and it would be sent out asap.

    That never happened, and I've sent several follow-up e-mails which haven't been replied to.

    I believe this website is fraudalent and I have basically been robbed of my money. However, because I opened the dispute with PayPal more than 45 days after the initial transaction (because I was waiting for the delivery and foolishly left it a while since the owner said there was an issue, plus it was being shipped from the US to the UK), now PayPal don't seem to be able to do anything about it and I am left out of pocket, without my order.

    Surely something can be done about this? PayPal are being extremely unhelpful, and obviously I am hearing nothing from the website/owner. I am really angry about this - would I be able to report this person/website to the local police in their home state? The owner is actually a member on here (I recognised his picture) and I have the details of the 'business'.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 02, 2011 11:21 AM GMT
    Contact the credit card company that's tied to your PayPal account and request a chargeback.
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    Jun 02, 2011 12:41 PM GMT
    I haven't tried that yet Paul, but I will do.

    But, will that mean that the guy gets away with my money? And it's my bank that, in effect, refunds me?

    I also would like to submit the website to a list of 'fraudulent' sites somehow so it doesn't happen to anyone else but I don't have a clue how to do that!
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    Jun 02, 2011 12:59 PM GMT
    Pure saidI haven't tried that yet Paul, but I will do.

    But, will that mean that the guy gets away with my money? And it's my bank that, in effect, refunds me?

    I also would like to submit the website to a list of 'fraudulent' sites somehow so it doesn't happen to anyone else but I don't have a clue how to do that!
    I'm not sure exactly how a chargeback works (haven't googled it), but I know you get your money back; and it red flags the seller. Given enough chargebacks, the seller could lose his merchant account.

    I don't even know of a site that lists fraudulent sellers, but I'd be wary of one if it exists simply because of the fact that people like to bitch, and would list sellers just to be mean.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 02, 2011 3:12 PM GMT
    This is a common "fraud" technique and your bank will likely not be willing to assist you either since it is past 45 days. Some banks will, but most won't.

    The common scam is to string the customer along promising that it was a glitch and that things will be sent out ASAP. They keep doing this until the 45 day window passes - which is a similar window for credit cards as well.

    If you have a dispute on your credit card statement you MUST contest the charge within the "window" of your card. Contesting a charge doesn't impact the vendor if your merchandise arrives eventually and it is easy to reverse if the product shows up the "day after you contest the charge".

    But if you don't contest the charge in that window, you're screwed most times.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 02, 2011 3:19 PM GMT
    Paul and I are on opposite ends of this; we have to deal with fraudulent customers who make purchases and claim they didn't. PayPal has no 45 day window. Have you gone on PayPal and initiated a dispute?

    I once had a customer do a credit card chargeback 3 YEARS after their purchase. Apparently they decided they wanted money so they went to the bank and acted like they never purchased a thing from anyone. And they won.

    The usual rule is if the merchant doesn't have a signed receipt, or they don't have a mailing tracking record, you will win.
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    Jun 02, 2011 3:33 PM GMT
    I guess the least you can do is file a complaint with the police in whichever state they're in.

    If that doesn't yield anything, or is outside of jurisdiction for whatever reason, you can always publicly smear him on RJ. So who was it, and have you tried contacting him on here?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 02, 2011 4:03 PM GMT
    Since you're in the UK, your chargeback window is eternity. I used to work for an ATM company (with machines in the UK) and we had some a year or more after the transaction. The merchant on the other hand only has a few weeks at most to respond, so your chances of getting your money back through the CC company are actually quite good. To find out about filing a dispute, just look at the back of your statement. It's actually quite easy. Good luck.
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    Jun 02, 2011 4:12 PM GMT
    wrestlervic saidPaul and I are on opposite ends of this; we have to deal with fraudulent customers who make purchases and claim they didn't. PayPal has no 45 day window. Have you gone on PayPal and initiated a dispute?


    Yes, I did initiate a dispute but because it is >45 days since the initial transaction it is automatically closed and they do nothing to follow it up.

    I think I'll have to contact my bank. But it annoys and angers me that this 'operation' is still able to operate - it should be shut down if it is a fraudulent company.
  • Twenty_Someth...

    Posts: 1388

    Jun 02, 2011 4:14 PM GMT
    Tazo995 saidI guess the least you can do is file a complaint with the police in whichever state they're in.

    If that doesn't yield anything, or is outside of jurisdiction for whatever reason, you can always publicly smear him on RJ. So who was it, and have you tried contacting him on here?


    Yeah, whose the douche???
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    Jun 02, 2011 4:21 PM GMT
    bpguru said
    Tazo995 saidI guess the least you can do is file a complaint with the police in whichever state they're in.

    If that doesn't yield anything, or is outside of jurisdiction for whatever reason, you can always publicly smear him on RJ. So who was it, and have you tried contacting him on here?


    Yeah, whose the douche???


    Maybe I'll give him the chance to see this thread and get in touch with me before I name and shame!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 02, 2011 4:27 PM GMT
    Apparently a lot of other people have had the same problem:

    http://ratepoint.com/seereviews/6741
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 02, 2011 4:33 PM GMT
    Try to deal with this with your credit card company. I don't know if contacting the police would do too much. I see this business is located in Toledo, Ohio and you not getting your vests is probably very low priority for the police there.
  • OutdoorAdvent...

    Posts: 361

    Jun 02, 2011 4:34 PM GMT
    Earlier this year, I ordered ink cartridges from a company via PayPal. The company charged me twice for the order and never shipped it. First I called the company, which said the order had been shipped (it hadn't) and that they would remove the second charge (they didn't). A week later, when the double charge hadn't been removed, I called my credit card company and they immediately adjusted it down to one charge. A week after that, when the shipment didn't arrive, I called PayPal to have the remaining charge removed. It took PayPal almost two months to do that.
    The lessons for me: Reduce my consumerism, shop locally, don't use PayPal unless necessary (but why would it be?)
    One option for you is to contact the chapter of the Better Business Bureau where the company is located. It'll try to resolve the dispute, and log your complaint.
    Good luck, mate.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 02, 2011 4:39 PM GMT
    PayPal seems to be fairly opaque and flakey in their policies. As a buyer, I've been hosed because a freight shipment took more than 30 days to arrive, and was therefore outside the warranty window. As a merchant, they always grant chargebacks with no questions asked. I get stiffed about two or three times per thousand transactions. The first I hear about it is when the money disappears from my account.

    If you call them, you just get some girl in Bangalore or some place who reads scripts to you.

    It's interesting though, I've done work directly for PayPal, AmEx, and some of Musk's other companies. They all pay by check.
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    Jun 02, 2011 4:43 PM GMT
    mindgarden saidIf you call them, you just get some girl in Bangalore or some place who reads scripts to you.
    .


    Yep that's basically what happened when I called. It's really put me off using them.
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    Jun 02, 2011 5:02 PM GMT
    Looked on the Better Business Bureau website for the business. The business gets an 'F' rating.

    http://www.bbb.org/toledo/business-reviews/mens-clothing-and-furnishngs-retail/cityboyz-fashion-menswear-in-toledo-oh-6002374#reasonrating
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    Jun 02, 2011 7:36 PM GMT
    This is why I don't use PayPal, and why I don't buy from unheard of websites.
  • mustangd

    Posts: 434

    Jun 02, 2011 9:11 PM GMT
    xrichx saidThis is why I don't use PayPal, and why I don't buy from unheard of websites.


    paypal is also a magnet for phishing/hacking,.
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    Jun 02, 2011 9:25 PM GMT
    Iceblink saidLooked on the Better Business Bureau website for the business. The business gets an 'F' rating.

    http://www.bbb.org/toledo/business-reviews/mens-clothing-and-furnishngs-retail/cityboyz-fashion-menswear-in-toledo-oh-6002374#reasonrating


    i judge companies based on their websites... this one is a big 'ol fail. Although I have to agree with you, BBB is probably the way to go.
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    Jun 02, 2011 10:00 PM GMT
    I buy on eBay alot and online buying, I hate going shopping. Alot of stuff is way cheaper buying online because you're not paying for their overhead.. I have had disputes with sellers then ending the dispute with Paypal. It has always ended in my favor.
    My bank had me open another checking account to be verified with Paypal. Then once the second one is verified remove the first one from Paypal. The account with Paypal only has enough in it to keep the account open. When I buy something I simply online transfer money (the amount of the purchase) from One account to the other. Hackers and thieves cant commit fraud on the account because theses nothing there.
    Whenever anything is mailed to me I always demand "Delivery Confirmation". The seller cant say We shipped it but it's out of our hands. You pay a couple dollars extra sometimes to get DC.. Then if anything gets lost in the mail either Paypal or the PO make it right. Hope this helps next time. Good Luck
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 02, 2011 10:36 PM GMT
    Paypal is gonna die eventually. Only ebay users will be stuck with that hot mess. I heard the big banks are working on their own Paypal-like service. It's going to be person-to-person money transfers at first. But I'm sure they will adapt it for online purchases eventually.

    Sure, the banks will find ways to nickel and dime you with transaction fees. But at least you'll get consumer protection in case something goes wrong. Unlike Paypal, which operates like a bank but isn't one, and therefore doesn't have to follow any sort of rules/regulations that banks typically follow.