"The Lord's Boot Camp", a documentary special on CBS about teens training to be missionaries

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    Apr 13, 2008 1:20 AM GMT
    I hate to start another atheist vs. Christians flame war, but I watched this special on CBS "The Lord's Boot Camp". This is sad. They are taking these young, impressionable teens who want to please adults and fit in with their peers and they're using that emotional manipulation to send them out to convert people, even people of other faiths.

    The adults leading this speak with the same infantile, simplistic religious platitudes that the children do. "There's a heaven and a hell and whether you believe in it or not, you're gonna go to one of them when you die."

    In one scene, one of the teen recruiters starts speaking with a woman and her daughter. They tell the girl they are Mormon. The woman starts getting upset at some of the girl's heavy handed proselytizing. That's when one of the adult leaders steps in... not to apologize or smooth things over, but to distract the mom and separate her from the young daughter, while the teen evangelist surreptitiously continues talking with her and eventually leads her in prayer to be "really" saved, not just fake saved as she is in her Mormon faith.

    Religion should be a personal faith. But these people tell the kids they must go out and convert others, likening the gospel to the cure for cancer. "If you had the cure for cancer, would you keep it to yourself? No, you'd share it with others so you could save their life."

    This is just pure brainwashing.

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    Apr 13, 2008 2:48 AM GMT
    Having been "schooled" on the campus of a combination University/Seminary, I got my belly full early in my "CHRISTIAN EDUCATION" of the rot these kids are being taught. Our teachers would have had us all believing that our existance was to "SPREAD THE WORD OF CHRIST" they're probably being taught that its imperative for them to "SAVE" everyone they can from eternal damnation. From the way I remember it, I was left with the impression that the school and preachers thought that the world had to see it the way we did or they would not go to heaven. That puts a hell of a load on a kids mind.
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    Apr 13, 2008 10:48 AM GMT
    Good lord.

    I wonder where they got the idea.

    Did Jesus EVER force his sermons into other people?!

    Sometimes, I wonder who REALLY are they worshipping?

    If there was a cure for cancer and it reduces people into living vegetables, sure I'd keep it to myself and feed it to the chickens.

    The next thing you know, there'll be a Christian Army intent on converting the world. Apocalypse, anyone?
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    Apr 13, 2008 2:10 PM GMT
    Sedative14 said
    The next thing you know, there'll be a Christian Army intent on converting the world. Apocalypse, anyone?

    Actually when I was in Sunday School (... so many years ago) that was a very real tenet of the belief at my church.

    I don't know if you mean a real army, trained militarily. That wasn't the case, but they very much wanted to train so many missionaries that they could have people proselytizing in every nation around the world.

    That's what Matthew 28:16-20 tells them to do. Singing "Onward Christians soldiers, marching as to war" only reinforced the idea.

    I look at it now and I think what's the difference between a church and a cult? Only the size of the membership apparently.
  • ShawnTX

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    Apr 13, 2008 3:30 PM GMT
    Sedative14 said
    The next thing you know, there'll be a Christian Army intent on converting the world.


    Again
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    Apr 13, 2008 4:08 PM GMT
    realifedad said Having been "schooled" on the campus of a combination University/Seminary, I got my belly full early in my "CHRISTIAN EDUCATION" of the rot these kids are being taught. Our teachers would have had us all believing that our existance was to "SPREAD THE WORD OF CHRIST" they're probably being taught that its imperative for them to "SAVE" everyone they can from eternal damnation. From the way I remember it, I was left with the impression that the school and preachers thought that the world had to see it the way we did or they would not go to heaven. That puts a hell of a load on a kids mind.

    So true, and the thing that galls me is how blatantly they are exploiting these kids and don't even seem to realize in the least that's exactly what it is, exploitation.

    They are trying to indoctrinate these young minds before they have a chance to mature and develop rational thinking skills.

    The one guy in the video smiles as he says, "People around the world love children. They're great evangelists."
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    Apr 13, 2008 4:11 PM GMT
    Always look on the bright side of life. On the bright side, at least they aren't cutting people's heads off and training suicide bombers.
    I'm not a Christian, I'm more of a born again pagan but; in the scheme of things, Christians are relatively benign.
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    Apr 13, 2008 4:21 PM GMT
    The only time I ever attended a church (besides visiting one with friends) was in my 20's. I did that for about 8 years. But that church had a no proselytizing policy. We only would talk about beliefs if someone brought it up or asked. Mostly we were supposed to just be a good example by being nice to people. The underlying belief was that if there was an almighty God that he had the power to "call" anyone he wanted. We were there mainly for "fellowship" and a support network, as well as "ministers" that conducted teaching. Also there were books and TV shows for the general populace. We were pretty much pacifists and stayed out of politics.

    I eventually left the organization as it began to splinter and I felt that I outgrew it anyway. I had other parallel interests in eastern philosophy that kept me busy as well the coming out I was going through.

    SO, when I see the heavy preachy types, it is really foreign and surreal to me. Anyone taught out of fear is really led into darkness anyway. It's like making little copies of yourself. People do that because there is "safety in numbers" so it makes you feel more secure if lots of other people to agree with you. Its a strange kind of "glue". It's the opposite of self realization and true knowledge.

    I think the best security comes from being able to find yourself which is something that no one can show or do for you. Also you have to embrace your insecurity until you find out it is a necessary part of you. Ultimately you can find self confidence and strength and can live with people as well as a without them.
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    Apr 14, 2008 1:59 AM GMT
    ShawnTO said[quote][cite]Sedative14 said[/cite]
    The next thing you know, there'll be a Christian Army intent on converting the world.


    Again[/quote]__---------------------------------------------------------------------Shawn you got that right !!! is there even a count of how many times the "CHURCH" tried to convert the world? or how many died who were condemned because of their "HERESY" ----------------------------------------Globalcitizen--- your mentioning that song "onward christian soldiers, marching as to war" sure brings back memories !!! I heard that song nearly every weekend for years, it calls to mind attending "CAMP MEETING" and skipping out of the meeting when the singing started, and going off and hiding somewhere to play poker with my buddy, then coming back for the "CLOSING SONG" (I always was a little devil) LOL !!!!
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    Apr 14, 2008 2:17 AM GMT
    ShawnTO said[quote][cite]Sedative14 said[/cite]
    The next thing you know, there'll be a Christian Army intent on converting the world.


    Again[/quote]

    No Still...
    The Mormon Missionaries are known as: "Gods foot solders."
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    Apr 14, 2008 5:26 AM GMT
    realifedad, there's another monotheistic religion already trying to do that. While your fixated on a docile monotheistic religion, the rabid one is bent on killing or converting you, and the rest of us.
    Then again, the docile are easier to pick on arent' they? You won't get a fatwah out of christians.
    fatwah, what a word, sounds like a thyroid condition.

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    Apr 14, 2008 9:19 AM GMT
    John43620 saidrealifedad, there's another monotheistic religion already trying to do that. While your fixated on a docile monotheistic religion, the rabid one is bent on killing or converting you, and the rest of us.
    Then again, the docile are easier to pick on arent' they? You won't get a fatwah out of christians.
    fatwah, what a word, sounds like a thyroid condition.



    Not ANYMORE at least.
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    Apr 14, 2008 2:24 PM GMT
    John43620 said While your fixated on a docile monotheistic religion, the rabid one is bent on killing or converting you, and the rest of us.

    Fundamentalist Christian authoritarianism has been the proximate cause of how many teen suicides in America? I'd say that body count is far greater than the number of Americans killed by Islamic terrorists.

    Do you think so many gay teens would kill themselves if they had a family that loved them unconditionally instead of a family that told them they're not welcome in the house anymore because they're an abomination in God's eyes?
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    Apr 14, 2008 2:27 PM GMT
    John43620 saidAlways look on the bright side of life. On the bright side, at least they aren't cutting people's heads off and training suicide bombers.
    I'm not a Christian, I'm more of a born again pagan but; in the scheme of things, Christians are relatively benign.


    True, but fortunately so are the vast majority of Moslems.
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    Apr 14, 2008 2:30 PM GMT
    Stories like this always depress me. I was hoping the world was getting away from the obsession with converting others to your faith. Why are some religious people so intolerant of other people's faiths? And this is coming from someone who lost a great aunt in Africa while doing missionary work.
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    Apr 14, 2008 2:30 PM GMT
    John43620 saidrealifedad, there's another monotheistic religion already trying to do that. While your fixated on a docile monotheistic religion, the rabid one is bent on killing or converting you, and the rest of us.


    Oh pity.

    I thought you were making stab at ultra liberals and the state and humanity god.

    Oh well back to OP: Not surprising, this has been going on for over a thousand years, at least now we have the mass media so we can hopefully breed generations of kids who can put aside their parents wishful thinking.


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    Apr 15, 2008 11:55 AM GMT
    realifedad, Are you sure you want to bring up ancient history? I could bring up the fact that the Democratic party supported antebellum slavery too. But of course, it doesn't do such a thing now.
    That was then (500 years ago) and this is now. No one is thinking of reviving the medieval crusades. At least from the Christian side anyway.

    WYSIWYG, The evidence supports the fact that the vast majority of muslems are not benign. Then again, they're benign to islam but not to western civilization.


    Trance,
    The term "Liberal" has been so fouled up in the American lexicon. What you call ultra-liberals are actually marxists. Such information is located in a Poltical Science-101 text book.






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    Apr 18, 2008 12:12 PM GMT
    John43620 said
    WYSIWYG, The evidence supports the fact that the vast majority of muslems are not benign.

    I'm always amused when people in forum debates like this refer to "evidence" but then cite none of it. It's a gratuitous assertion.

    What evidence are you referring to? If it's so prevalent, you should have no trouble posting some of it.

    I could just as easily say the evidence supports the fact that vast majority of muslims are peaceful and benign. But merely saying so doesn't lend any credence to the assertion and I wouldn't expect anyone to take it at face value unless I could back it up.
  • MikemikeMike

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    Apr 18, 2008 12:19 PM GMT
    I saw most of this. I wish I saw it from the begining. It looked like brainwashing. I also noticed there were many more young girls than boys. At that age I couldn't even been forced to go to regular camp. Even if I was hit.
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    Apr 18, 2008 12:33 PM GMT
    I want to see this documentary. Of course, my position is clear and all this hand-wringing and self-torture over absolute nonsense is an utter waste of time and energy. There is no God people, get over it already. icon_smile.gif
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    Apr 18, 2008 2:00 PM GMT
    Man will be punished for his own sins, and not for Adams transgressions.
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    Apr 18, 2008 2:54 PM GMT
    If this makes them happy then good for them. I think in this day and time we all need something to believe in and somewhere to put our faith. Just so happens that they put theirs in a man named Jesus. Who are we to judge...........ever?
  • ShawnTX

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    Apr 18, 2008 3:01 PM GMT
    I definately understand where you're coming from Chizzad, but this documentary is very similar to another one that was on A&E some time ago called Jesus Camp. I respect peoples right to worship how they choose, provided no one is abused in the name of faith, but don't you find stuff like this just a bit scary?

    The Lord's army? It's pretty harmless now, but it wouldn't take too much to go from hardcore proselytizing to something more dangerous and violent.

    I respect their right to worship how they choose, they should return the favour.
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    Apr 18, 2008 3:34 PM GMT
    ShawnTO said... this documentary is very similar to another one that was on A&E some time ago called Jesus Camp. I respect peoples right to worship how they choose, provided no one is abused in the name of faith, but don't you find stuff like this just a bit scary?

    The Lord's army? It's pretty harmless now, but it wouldn't take too much to go from hardcore proselytizing to something more dangerous and violent.

    I respect their right to worship how they choose, they should return the favour.

    This is by the same producers as Jesus Camp.

    And when people talk about how innocuous religion is, I make the point that it's only as innocuous to the degree which religious leaders constrain themselves from directing their membership's actions.

    If Jim Jones can lead nearly 1,000 people to emigrate to South America and then kill themselves, I think it can't be said that religion is altogether innocuous.

    Religious emotional manipulation is a powerful tool if put in the wrong hands.
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    Apr 18, 2008 3:34 PM GMT
    People can believe in and worship the purple spoon for all I care and I'll even defend their right to do so. However, defending the right to believe in or worship something doesn't mean I have to respect their faith.

    I have a very big problem when people are unable to separate their religous beliefs from government. Intermingling the two is clearly a violation of the Establishment clause and the Free Exercise clause and thus completely unconstitutional.