What do you think about closet gay or bi men????¿

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    Jun 14, 2011 3:41 PM GMT
    I think people who admit that they gay, are very brave. But it is very difficult that lifestyle? What do you think? what should advised to those who have not done?¿?¿ icon_question.gif
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    Jun 14, 2011 3:46 PM GMT
    I think we who are out and living as gay men should encourage those still in the closet to really try and get stronger with who they are, go to counseling if they are struggling (I'm all for it, it changed my life in a million positive ways not just in terms of sexuality) and to eventually come out. The only way we're going to continue to change society for the better is by being brave and standing up for ourselves and our rights, and the only way to do that is to come out to friends and family and start to educate them in their ignorance. It's a huge risk and sometimes you may get a bad reaction but in my opinion it's much better to be strong in yourself first before even trying to come out, that way despite some negative reactions you can still be confident in yourself not to let it bring you down but instead use it to get stronger.

    This being said I get very down when I see so many gay men who are out judging those still in the closet and pressuring them to come out...I experienced it when I was buried in the closet and it did nothing to help me, only made me retreat further. We've all been through it and know how tough it is, rather than try and belittle those struggling I think it would be more beneficial for us all as a community to share our experiences with them and to be a good source of love and support...my 2 cents icon_smile.gif
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    Jun 14, 2011 4:37 PM GMT
    Yeah, very interesting your opinion and suggestions. That is what truly may not understand most of men who are outside the closet, put pressure on those who never have left. Excelentes palabras. If you collect a lot of cents, you are going to have one dollar in the future icon_smile.gif
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    Jun 14, 2011 5:09 PM GMT
    I think they have no balls. Of course, that's also area-specific. If they're in a country which has capital punishment for gays, then it's understandable why they'd stay quiet.

    In this country, however, even most people in hick towns don't care anymore...especially if you don't fit the stereotype, which most closeted gays don't; and that's why they stay closeted...because they can.

    Sure many will lose jobs, some family, and some friends; but what they'll gain is self-respect, a better life, and the opportunity to see those people (the lost ones) for who they really are: hateful bigots. The fear of what "might" be lost is always much greater than the reality of what IS lost.

    Something to think about: Staying in the closet is like building a coffin from the inside. Each year in the closet is another nail in the coffin. The longer you stay closeted, the harder it'll be to come out because you've build such a solid wall around yourself. If you don't come out eventually, you'll die in your own lonely existence because nobody ever really knew you.

    It may sound like I'm down on closet guys, but I'm really not...at least not all of them (anti-gay protesters, yes I'm down on them - they're all closeted). I just think that with today's increasing acceptance of gays, it's no longer necessary to hide.
  • mizu5

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    Jun 14, 2011 5:23 PM GMT
    I agree. I think they are pussies. They are liars. Situation dictates to what degree though.

    I am from Canada, so this is especially true. I have nothing but pity and disdain for closet cases. I'll help you, I'll talk with you, I'll work you through it, but I will not date you, it isn't fair to ak me.
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    Jun 14, 2011 5:28 PM GMT
    i don't believe in bi guys..that's bull****

    either your gay or stra8,either you like cock or pussy

    to me when someone says i'm bi it means they are to scared to admit they are gay because of society or what not so saying their bi makes it better because they like girls also not just guys...


    and closet guys are DUMB,hey lets wait till im 50 to come out
    lmfao
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    Jun 14, 2011 5:31 PM GMT
    Good point of view Paulflexes.
  • mizu5

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    Jun 14, 2011 5:33 PM GMT
    theantijock saidIt is less a reflection on the person who closets themself than it is on the world that coerces them into it.

    This shame belongs not to the person in the closet; it is owned by the world alone.
    When did you come out, if I may ask?
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    Jun 14, 2011 5:35 PM GMT
    mizu5 saidI agree. I think they are pussies. They are liars. Situation dictates to what degree though.

    I have nothing but pity and disdain for closet cases. I'll help you, I'll talk with you, I'll work you through it, but I will not date you, it isn't fair to ask me.


    So that's supposed to make them feel better LOL?

    Now, the only way I can somewhat agree with this is if they are being closeted 'on purpose'. Like, they have no issue going onto a4a or craigslist to meet guys for a hookup, or like a guy I went on a couple dates with...at the end of the night I was kissing him goodbye and he shuts the front door real fast and says, "my neighbors don't know about me, I'm in the closet." icon_eek.gif No it wasn't the 1st time he said that but that statement did it for me. I wanted to kick him in the balls. Jerk! It's like, you in the closet but you were comfortable enough to holla at me from within the closet? Now come out that closet so I can whip yo ass!

    But now you have the opposite extreme which are the married, bi men and for their situation is different, but no better. However it's only natural that they can't just jump out the closet for various reasons. A lot of men grew up in the days before the internet and just didn't have any other way to go about meeting guys so they did what was deemed natural for them at the time. Which was hook up with a woman.
  • mizu5

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    Jun 14, 2011 5:38 PM GMT
    theantijock said
    mizu5 said
    theantijock saidIt is less a reflection on the person who closets themself than it is on the world that coerces them into it.

    This shame belongs not to the person in the closet; it is owned by the world alone.
    When did you come out, if I may ask?


    I've been aware of my sexuality for as far back as I remember, at least before kindergarten. I first verbalized it to my 2nd year college roommate and then to my mother. I guess I was about 20ish. Since then I've never befriended anyone without them knowing i'm gay.

    What did you think my answer was going to be?
    I had no idea to be honest, I wanted to know because I thought maybe you were one of the people who, liek me, came out really early. Except maybe unlike me, sees thigns differently.


    fit4fit- no, it doesn't make them feel better, but that's not my job. I will hlp them come to terms, and work through it and everything if they ask. ANd when I say clsoeted, Ia ssumed the type who kept themselves there, the craigslist type, the A4A manhunt type.
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    Jun 14, 2011 5:50 PM GMT
    Well that's your opinion Bello, and I respect it. In my opinion that's not right, because I've met guys who don't like women at all (gays) and guys who like both, of course there are gay guys who say that they are bi men and they aren't, I do not deny. But if we talk about likes, is like music there are a lot of kinds. icon_wink.gif
  • mizu5

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    Jun 14, 2011 6:01 PM GMT
    theantijock said
    mizu5 saidI wanted to know because I thought maybe you were one of the people who, like me, came out really early. Except maybe unlike me, sees things differently.


    I don't require being judgmental of somebody else in order to justify myself.
    I think you are, for lack of a softer term, lying, if you say you have never judged someone. Judging people, based off many things, is human nature. I enver said they were bad people, but in today's day and age, especially in Canada, where I live, there is no reason to be afraid to come out for a long period of time.
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    Jun 14, 2011 6:08 PM GMT
    I think that there's another aspect to this discussion. Some guys are out of the closet, living and working happily in the world, and comfortable with who they are without being professional gays. (I stole that term from a movie -- I didn't make it up on my own)

    What that means is that some people feel very strongly about gay rights and issues and have the determination to educate the public and fight for justice. Some members of the gay community are outspoken activists who live to be gay in the public eye every minute possible. Some people's lives revolve around being gay. In other words, they are "professional gays" who embody the image of gayness.

    Other people are less concerned with being gay and more focused on other aspects of life. I'm not a professional gay. I own a business, and I'm very much focused on making my business successful and helping my clients. I don't make everyone aware that it's a gay owned business, and I don't ensure that my clients are gay friendly. But all of the employees know my spouse and accept us for being who we are.

    I've always believed that being myself is the best role model that I can provide for the gay community. I'm a software engineer who just happens to be gay. The thing is, a lot of people view you as being closeted when you're not a professional gay. I've had gay friends criticize me and cut off our friendship because I wasn't gay enough for them. I guess it depends on how wide you think the closet door has to be open.
  • Ryvick1212

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    Jun 14, 2011 7:15 PM GMT
    For me this has always been kinda weird. Where I'm living in the south, people my age dont really care if you're gay, but some families are a different story. I have one friend who had to drop out of college because his parents completely cut him off when he came out. I know another guy who just came out and his sister wrote him a note saying that Satan had stolen his soul. In an area where family is everything, and at a time when you need parents support (financially for college, that is) I understand being in the closet.

    Doesn't mean I like it. But I do understand it.
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    Jun 14, 2011 7:27 PM GMT
    ^ I agree with you, sometimes your situation is just not conducive to coming out and it's better to wait...though I still believe in at least acknowledging it to yourself.

    What really gets me is the conservatives/super religious people who speak out furthering gay hate...I bet a great percentage (not saying ALL) of these types are so far in the closet themselves that they're about to find Narnia, and are just bitter and angry about their situation and try to make it worse for the rest of us who have had the courage to come out and live an openly gay life.

    I will probably get some flack for this but it's my opinion, I think most Catholic priests are just really self hating gay men who have lived so long in the shadows that their minds are warped...I was raised in a Catholic school setting from pre-k all the way through highschool (brutal environment to grow up gay in, let me tell you) and I can tell you most priests I've come across aren't fooling me icon_razz.gif (and actually one of the few priests I actually liked ended up coming out, leaving the priesthood, and from what I hear is now married haha good for him)

    It's these types of closeted individuals that I have an issue with, I know it's hard and we all struggle with it at some point but by retreating into the closet so much that you start spreading homophobia doesn't end up helping anyone, least of all themselves.
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    Jun 14, 2011 7:53 PM GMT
    As long as the person is not trying to pass or support anti-legislation or making anti-gay comments, I do not care. If he is, and I find out, I WILL out him.

    Hypocrites deserve no place on this earth.

    I would not date someone who is closeted either. I have to much self-respect to date someone who would deny my existence.

  • mizu5

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    Jun 14, 2011 7:59 PM GMT
    theantijock said
    mizu5 saidI think you are, for lack of a softer term, lying, if you say you have never judged someone. Judging people, based off many things, is human nature. I enver said they were bad people, but in today's day and age, especially in Canada, where I live, there is no reason to be afraid to come out for a long period of time.


    And I think you are, for lack of a softer term, "rude, crude and socially unacceptable." (chill, just kidding)

    Did I say that I never judged someone as you say I said?

    Or did I say "I don't require being judgmental" as I actually said?

    Because there is a difference. Certainly everyone must judge for themselves. You want to be able to ascertain things. But you can not ascertain in isolation alone. You need context, you need to look at cause and effect. Though it is hopefully true that the more people who come out of the closet, the more the world will accept us, in the human equation, the corollary is not necessarily true that staying in the closet is the cause of the world not accepting us because that they don't accept us does not have to do with us, it has to do with them.

    When you look at a person only critically and not compassionately, you strip everyone of their humanity, including your own. And that is what I judge. No lie.
    I never said I don't have compassion. and I do look at the context, but I suppose i'm happier being honest with the world and eealing with what comes. hate me for who i am, not love me for who im not or however that goes.
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    Jun 14, 2011 8:52 PM GMT
    I don't agree with some of you. If someone wants to be closeted then that's their choice. Some people choose to stay in the closet not just because they're scared. There's cases out there that believe they'll be happy if only a select few people know. What makes you gay is not the number of people who know and how many can confirm the lifestyle. I for one being affiliated with the military will choose the safer closeted lifestyle. And I am just as happy with myself as I would be if I were open. I don't believe what I do in my personal life should be on the minds of anyone else matter of fact I don't see any heteros going around proclaiming to the heavens that they are straight. So why then must gay people have to do it?

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    Jun 14, 2011 8:59 PM GMT
    stlguy2010 said... matter of fact I don't see any heteros going around proclaiming to the heavens that they are straight.
    Yes they do. Ever heard the phrase "no homo?"

    stlguy2010 saidSo why then must gay people have to do it?
    Because if we/they didn't, homosexuality would still be punishable by death.
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    Jun 14, 2011 8:59 PM GMT
    paulflexes saidI think they have no balls....
    In this country, however, even most people in hick towns don't care anymore...especially if you don't fit the stereotype, which most closeted gays don't; and that's why they stay closeted...because they can.

    Sure many will lose jobs, some family, and some friends; but what they'll gain is self-respect, a better life,


    BULLSHIT

    i live in a hick town, and it is not true at all that they don't care anymore!
    where i live, if you come out, you have the shit kicked out of you.. my cousin came out, and now his family wont say one word to him, he was completely banned from his family..

    For most people, your job, family, and friends mean more than a little self-respect..

    in some areas i agree that it would be alot easier to come out, and maybe a good decision.. but in other places, like the one i live in, we CANNOT come out.. YOU are just as ignorant and suppressing as those straight people who treat us like crap..
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    Jun 14, 2011 9:02 PM GMT
    stlguy2010 saidI don't agree with some of you. If someone wants to be closeted then that's their choice. Some people choose to stay in the closet not just because they're scared. There's cases out there that believe they'll be happy if only a select few people know. What makes you gay is not the number of people who know and how many can confirm the lifestyle. I for one being affiliated with the military will choose the safer closeted lifestyle. And I am just as happy with myself as I would be if I were open. I don't believe what I do in my personal life should be on the minds of anyone else matter of fact I don't see any heteros going around proclaiming to the heavens that they are straight. So why then must gay people have to do it?




    Thank you! well put
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    Jun 14, 2011 9:04 PM GMT
    brittainswei saidBULLSHIT

    i live in a hick town, and it is not true at all that they don't care anymore!
    where i live, if you come out, you have the shit kicked out of you.. my cousin came out, and now his family wont say one word to him, he was completely banned from his family..

    For most people, your job, family, and friends mean more than a little self-respect..

    in some areas i agree that it would be alot easier to come out, and maybe a good decision.. but in other places, like the one i live in, we CANNOT come out.. YOU are just as ignorant and suppressing as those straight people who treat us like crap..
    Spoken like a true coward...
    Dude, I was raised in a fucking small hick town, and came out there.
    Yeah I got my ass kicked a few times, and kicked a few along the way...even shot at a few people in self-defense.
    I've also lost jobs, family members, and friends.

    Don't tell me I'm full of shit. I just have more balls than you'll ever have.

    PS. I'm also currently staying in Hinesville Georgia...just as hick as where I grew up. Everyone around me knows I'm gay. Nobody gives me shit cause they know I'd kick their ass.
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    Jun 14, 2011 9:20 PM GMT
    paulflexes said
    stlguy2010 said... matter of fact I don't see any heteros going around proclaiming to the heavens that they are straight.
    Yes they do. Ever heard the phrase "no homo?"

    I've heard of the phrase "no homo" I use it myself. I don't know how you've heard that being used but me and my friends use it as a joke and when were playing around.



    stlguy2010 saidSo why then must gay people have to do it?
    Because if we/they didn't, homosexuality would still be punishable by death.


    And proclaiming your orientation doesn't not demand equality. I'm all for being able to live how you want and not being scrutinized for it, but at the same time just live your life don't try to press your views and values down the throats of others. If people only cared about what they were doing and stayed out of the business of others (except when breaking the law) things would be a lot better.
  • ja89

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    Jun 14, 2011 9:28 PM GMT
    I agree with brittainswei, its not all peachy and teary like the movies. Funny how all of the shit talking and hate comes out when this subject arises. You guys are no better than bullies I feel, but it won't change.

    I personally don't go up the mountains screaming I'm gay because it's none of anyone's business. I think soo many people make gay all who they are, those are usually the ones who fuss about it the most. This guy I work with makes everything about him being gay, everything out of his mouth is gay this gay that. The guys who don't come out as soon as they leave the womb are molding themselves to be something more than their sexuality.
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    Jun 14, 2011 9:42 PM GMT
    stlguy2010 saidSo why then must gay people have to do it?
    Because if we/they didn't, homosexuality would still be punishable by death.[/quote]

    And to throw a little bit of knowledge your way being a homosexual was not always punishable by death that's a more recent thing to do. Participating in homosexual acts was not frowned upon since the time of the Ancient Greeks till the 20th century (1900s if you didn't know) men have been having sex and caring about with other men, that didn't make you gay. What made you gay was a man taking the role of a female and acting womanly.