Gays and Education

  • jeggey

    Posts: 50

    Jun 20, 2011 3:53 AM GMT
    Ok I know this may sound judgmental but i mean no offense by it but its an observation i have made. I have notice that several gay men at least where I live never get an education past high school. They seem to settle for careers in ambercrombie and fitch. Why not get an education why not make that sacrifice to move forward with life yeah its hard for the time your in school but in the end its worth it. I also am a firm believer that if gays are going to get equal rights we need to be educated to show everyone we deserve it and that we can think for ourselves. I think if we as gays were more educated i think we could be further along in getting equal rights. Sorry if this offends some people but I just wanted to vent because the second I got my degree I got a good job and am ready to get to grad school and further my education. I am just wondering what people are thinking about all this?
  • sensible

    Posts: 40

    Jun 20, 2011 4:40 AM GMT
    I kind of agree, I am doing a doctorate and I hardly see any other gay men doing that icon_sad.gif
    Maybe there are a few in the social science but hardly anyone in life sciences.
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    Jun 20, 2011 4:43 AM GMT
    Are you kidding me? A majority of gays are highly educated unless you're only meeting boys at a twink bar. Just as in any community, educated, intelligent people tend to not frequent those types of places. As someone with a masters whose friends also all at least have a undergraduate degree, I do find this offensive. You're statement attempted to say that we should strive for gay equality which in turn would mean alleviating our community of the societal stereotypes. However, in that futile attempt you cloud yourself with hypocrisy saying all gays work at "Abercrombie and Fitch." Offensive... yes... productive forum... no.
  • swimmer8671

    Posts: 429

    Jun 20, 2011 4:43 AM GMT
    ummm i'm going for a masters possibly a doctorate.... and i see plenty of gay guys who are plenty smart, and who pursue higher education. The only difference is they don't have to announce that they are gay and make it super apparent that they are gay. Thats the only reason that you don't actually see alot of gay guys doing it because maybe they just arn't able to come out yet.

  • NerdLifter

    Posts: 1509

    Jun 20, 2011 4:43 AM GMT
    sensible saidI kind of agree, I am doing a doctorate and I hardly see any other gay men doing that icon_sad.gif
    Maybe there are a few in the social science but hardly anyone in life sciences.

    Here, 50%+ of the gay men I meet are bio-majors or biology graduates.

    As for me, I'm a Mechanical Engineer.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 20, 2011 4:48 AM GMT
    I would say my experience is somewhat different. At my company our CFO, Sr. VP of Production, Myself, Sr. Director of Business Affairs, VP of IT are all gay.
  • NerdLifter

    Posts: 1509

    Jun 20, 2011 4:48 AM GMT
    To continue my previous post, I do not intend to belittle the op, but I feel it might be more of a 'where-you-are-looking' problem.
  • austex85

    Posts: 572

    Jun 20, 2011 4:56 AM GMT
    theantijock saidhttp://www.realjock.com/gayforums/235771/
    .


    degree circle jerk?
  • JP85257

    Posts: 3284

    Jun 20, 2011 4:56 AM GMT
    I did not go to college because I didnt have the luxury of being able to move away from home. I had to start working immediately. I actually started working my Jr year of high school because my parents were in bad financial shape and I took it upon myself to make sure we had a home.

    I dont blame anyone, but I also was not about to go in to debt for a piece of paper that may or may not get me a better job.

    Ive been doing insurance work for years and have worked my ass off to acquire the skills I have.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 20, 2011 4:59 AM GMT
    Well, I am currently working toward a M.Ed. in Education and plan to teach abroad icon_smile.gif
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    Jun 20, 2011 4:59 AM GMT
    I wouldn't really say what you wrote was offensive,Just kinda dumb. Have you personally gone up to those guys and ask them if they are in school?
    Most of the people that work at A&F,At least where I'm from, Just work there for some extra cash in their pockets while they're going to school. You honestly can not make a living working as a sales associate at A&F. I have a lot of friends that work there and they also have a 2nd job,because you only get maybe 10 hours a week. Now,if the person is working there to work their way up to a managers position, I see nothing wrong with that at all.

    Having a college doesn't mean you're smarter than those that don't have one.


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    Jun 20, 2011 5:01 AM GMT
    Lenoxx saidI wouldn't really say what you wrote was offensive,Just kinda dumb. Have you personally gone up to those guys and ask them if they are in school?
    Most of the people that work at A&F,At least where I'm from, Just work there for some extra cash in their pockets while they're going to school. You honestly can not make a living working as a sales associate at A&F. I have a lot of friends that work there and they also have a 2nd job,because you only get maybe 10 hours a week. Now,if the person is working there to work their way up to a managers position, I see nothing wrong with that at all.

    Having a college doesn't mean you're smarter than those that don't have one.




    I dont think he meant it literally. It was just an example.
  • austex85

    Posts: 572

    Jun 20, 2011 5:03 AM GMT
    theantijock said
    austex85 said
    theantijock saidhttp://www.realjock.com/gayforums/235771/
    .


    degree circle jerk?


    lolol, sure looks it. funny.


    reminds me of this

    http://blogs.babble.com/strollerderby/2011/06/17/the-entitlement-of-millennials-woman-says-shes-too-educated-to-be-kicked-off-train-for-loudtalking-on-her-cell-video/
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 20, 2011 5:04 AM GMT
    I honestly think its about 50/50. I've met plenty of guys in school or that have degrees. I've also met alot of IHOP servers. Not all people are made for college and there is nothing wrong with that. Those of us that are fortunate to go to college to get a degree are very lucky and should take advantage of the oppurtunity that we have.
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    Jun 20, 2011 5:10 AM GMT
    This first doctorate owning, A.B.D. on a second doctoral degree thinks you should take your poorly drafted original post littered with grammatical, capitalization, as well as punctuation errors, and log off for the night.

    It seems like a third grader drafted your tear-filled political diatribe about the woefully undervalued higher education divide between the cultured gays and the others ... of course without taking into account that there are more difficult socioeconomic issues lurking behind each life decision in the ordinary process like getting kicked out of daddy's house and put on the street versus a trust fund to pay for any amount of lunacy in higher education.

    Having degrees on your wall does not necessarily make you worthwhile. A lack of degrees on your wall does not necessarily make you worthless.

    Somewhere in between life experience is creditable to earned degrees ... especially where an intelligent person had to pursue other means of making money than drawing a graduate assistant's salary for years. The same as centuries ago that economic realities conscripted certain people to certain fates, ability is not always measured by the degrees one attains.

    Some of the more intelligent gays have no degrees on their wall yet can still keep up admirably in the field of study you wrote your dissertation on - education is free if you know how to research cheaply. Meanwhile degrees cost a lot to pay for tuition, books, graduation notice placards, and cap/gown.

    Try to be less insensitive next time you equate "education" with "ability" - it is the same as equating attractiveness with likelihood of marrying you. A pretty poor rubric to live your life by.
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    Jun 20, 2011 5:11 AM GMT
    My housemate's boyfriend is doing a BSci(Hon), other friends are also in honours in neuroscience or psychology, and I knew one insanely intelligent guy in Switzerland studying a PhD in computer architecture. All gay.

    It's rarer, at least for me, to find a gay guy without some form of higher education than with, and perhaps rarer still to find a gay guy that works a trade like carpentry, bricklaying, mechanics or electrical (though no doubt there would be gay tradies out there).

    I don't see how being more educated would make gays more deserving of rights (shouldn't they just get the rights regardless of education or not ?), other than perhaps being able to wield a greater influence in society due to the positions than can hold.
  • awm55

    Posts: 619

    Jun 20, 2011 5:13 AM GMT
    I would avoid gay bars if you are looking for highly educated well adjusted people.
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    Jun 20, 2011 5:14 AM GMT
    I have two degrees.

    Management and Marketing

    Textile Design
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 20, 2011 5:18 AM GMT
    As others have said, the degrees one collects don't equate to success. These days they don't even guarantee getting a dream job! Look at how many recent college grads are currently unemployed or working retail and admin jobs outside their academic field! Meanwhile there are some without college degrees with considerable work experience who aren't doing too shabby right now. Each situation is different for everyone.

    Plus, you have to consider that there are probably a number of gay people (and people in general) who want to go college but currently don't have the resources to do it. Perhaps they can't go to college right now at 20-something. But it's certainly possible that the opportunity will present itself later when they're 30, 40, or 50-something. You never know.

    In my case, nearly all the gay friends I have now I met while I was in college. So I'd say they're fairly well educated at this point.
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    Jun 20, 2011 5:21 AM GMT
    jeggey saidI have notice that several gay men at least where I live never get an education past high school. They seem to settle for careers in ambercrombie and fitch.


    There are plenty of gay men with college degrees and advanced degrees.

    As for A&F, there are plenty of straight men who work there and plenty of people who work there who have college degrees. I used to work for A&F, and I am currently getting a master's degree.

    This entire post is based on extrapolating and hogwash. Makes no sense.


    awm55I would avoid gay bars if you are looking for highly educated well adjusted people.


    Ridiculous and false stereotyping. Plenty of perfectly normal and smart people go to gay bars. To suggest otherwise means you probably don't go to gay bars and don't know what you're talking about.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 20, 2011 5:22 AM GMT
    I dont think RJ represents gay men in general. I think this is a collection of the exception versus the norm for this community.

    A bunch of macbook toting successes. The opinions found here are I believe from a very small sampling of gaydom.

    Based on that, the majority here are probably educated beyond the bachelors level whereas your average gay is not.
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    Jun 20, 2011 5:25 AM GMT
    I totally disagree that gays are under-achievers. In fact, many are driven to over-achieve, as if to make up for being gay (in the process of rationalizing their sexuality).

    I myself have a PhD, and my partner is busy writing his thesis. While I am a natural science major, he is a social science major, so I do not think that there is a subject-discrimination amongst gays.

    As for having successful careers and being driven, I know many top academics and C-suite officers who are gay. So I do not think gays are not driven, and it is probably the small sample you are looking at.
  • tazzari

    Posts: 2937

    Jun 20, 2011 5:29 AM GMT
    In my small, immediate circle of friends, there are 4 Masters degrees, on PhD candidate and a 3rd year medical student... I only have a BA, but I used to be usefully fluent in 4 languages, and I've published three technical books in my field...
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    Jun 20, 2011 5:40 AM GMT
    I was wondering how long it would be before someone pointed this out:

    spaghettimonster saidThis first doctorate owning, A.B.D. on a second doctoral degree thinks you should take your poorly drafted original post littered with grammatical, capitalization, as well as punctuation errors, and log off for the night.

    It seems like a third grader drafted your tear-filled political diatribe about the woefully undervalued higher education divide between the cultured gays and the others ... of course without taking into account that there are more difficult socioeconomic issues lurking behind each life decision in the ordinary process like getting kicked out of daddy's house and put on the street versus a trust fund to pay for any amount of lunacy in higher education.

    Having degrees on your wall does not necessarily make you worthwhile. A lack of degrees on your wall does not necessarily make you worthless.

    Somewhere in between life experience is creditable to earned degrees ... especially where an intelligent person had to pursue other means of making money than drawing a graduate assistant's salary for years. The same as centuries ago that economic realities conscripted certain people to certain fates, ability is not always measured by the degrees one attains.

    Some of the more intelligent gays have no degrees on their wall yet can still keep up admirably in the field of study you wrote your dissertation on - education is free if you know how to research cheaply. Meanwhile degrees cost a lot to pay for tuition, books, graduation notice placards, and cap/gown.

    Try to be less insensitive next time you equate "education" with "ability" - it is the same as equating attractiveness with likelihood of marrying you. A pretty poor rubric to live your life by.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 20, 2011 5:56 AM GMT
    I have a BA in Geography and an MS in Atmospheric Science.....icon_biggrin.gif

    I believe the OP should stop making generalizations based on such a limited sampling pool....such as his personal contacts and the men on RJ, these would hardly constitute an un-biased sample. There is little reason to believe that gays would fare any differently than the population in general as far as education and the economy.
    Looking at data from the 2010 US Census, there are so many ways to slice and dice the way you analyze a demographic, that you can demonstrate any number of hypotheses.........over all US population, the number of college graduates is 29.5%

    http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/cats/education/educational_attainment.html

    Although, looking at other documentation , it appears that gays are MUCH more educated than the general population and have higher incomes...
    http://downloads.frc.org/EF/EF08L43.pdf

    It depends which part of the elephant you are touching as how you perceive and report your experiences.........icon_rolleyes.gif