Does misogyny towards effeminate gay men provoke internalized homophobia in closeted/openly gay, gay men?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 1:48 PM GMT
    I'm curious as to the root of internalized homophobia.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 1:52 PM GMT



    While the subject matter is interesting (and much overworked on this site), I immediately thought of this question:

    If you toss a match into a tub of gasoline, will it erupt in flame?

    icon_wink.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 2:03 PM GMT
    Sorry if this is repetitious.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 3:33 PM GMT
    YUP.
    I see it in a lot of guys I meet.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 4:25 PM GMT
    Misogyny is the hatred or dislike of women or girls.

    Effeminate men are not women or girls, they are men.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 4:28 PM GMT
    It is something I am currently struggling with and it is more or less, in my case a projection of frustration of not feeling welcome in either world. Its incredibly negative and it is something I am actively working on.

    So in a nutshell, its projecting discomfort with oneself.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 4:36 PM GMT
    Inostrankan saidMisogyny is the hatred or dislike of women or girls.

    Effeminate men are not women, they are men.


    +1
    Not to say femmephobia doesn't exist, because it does. However, it is quite possible to create a term for everything a person dislikes in life and throw rocks at them for it. I'm not attracted to fem guys and I will make no apologies for it. There are dozens, if not hundreds of other traits I dislike in a guy, and I won't be apologizing for those either. However, I also don't "hate" guys with these traits either, and I think that's where the real problem begins. What makes matters worse is the hyper politically correct gay man who insists (who am I kidding....DEMANDS) that we be open to everyone.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 4:37 PM GMT
    gymrat100 saidI'm curious as to the root of internalized homophobia.


    Unacceptance of one's self and pressured to conform to social norms.
    There you go.
    I know its much more complicated than that, but i think thats the basis of the problem.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 4:38 PM GMT
    I hit "SUBMIT" before I was finished:

    Guys who have issues with effeminate gays are the same as those who have issues with marriage equality.

    When asked 'How is your marriage negatively effected by two men or women getting married?" they are unable to say exactly how they were negatively impacted.

    The same applies to homos who have issues with feminine guys.

    Ask this next time someone espouses issues with feminine guys: "How are you negatively affected by some guy who swishes and lisps and screams "HEY GURL!"?

    Short answer: You're not.

    It's just self-projected, externalized drama and psychological issues.

    In closing, next time you wish to gauge a guy's mannerisms for butchess, get him to cross a busy, multiple lane street. Instead of tucking in his arms and sprinting, it seems to be that most self-described "masculine" guys turn in to flailing gay windmills.

    That said, I can throw a tantrum AND a football.

    END RANT.



  • JP85257

    Posts: 3284

    Sep 09, 2011 4:53 PM GMT
    No fat chicks.

    That said......I dont necessarily have a problem with effinate gays...I just dont hang around them. Its their choice to act like that and I dont have to hang out with them. Just like people choose to not be around me because I am a gigantic asshole. Same principle.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 5:02 PM GMT
    WARNING - This thread is highly flammable and may attract trolls.

    REDUCE ALL CREATION TO ASHES!!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 5:04 PM GMT
    Ah come on this isn't a troll thread... it's a valid question, no?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 5:08 PM GMT
    Tazo995 saidAh come on this isn't a troll thread... it's a valid question, no?


    Re-worked the troll warning lol... that's a default copypasta icon_biggrin.gif

    Valid question - but the whole femme vs masc/str8-acting thing is a horse's carcass that has people still happily smacking away at it's bones.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 5:17 PM GMT
    MuchMoreThanMuscle saidI find that the more secure and at peace a person is with himself the more accepting he is toward others. This is not limited to homophobia.


    Truth.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 5:25 PM GMT
    MuchMoreThanMuscle saidI find that the more secure and at peace a person is with himself the more accepting he is toward others. This is not limited to homophobia.


    #100000
  • Timbales

    Posts: 13993

    Sep 09, 2011 5:34 PM GMT
    A phobia is a psychological anxiety disorder. It is a strong, irrational fear of something that poses little to no actual danger. It is not a dislike of something.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 5:36 PM GMT
    alphatrigger said
    Tazo995 saidAh come on this isn't a troll thread... it's a valid question, no?


    Re-worked the troll warning lol... that's a default copypasta icon_biggrin.gif

    Valid question - but the whole femme vs masc/str8-acting thing is a horses carcass that has people still happily smacking away at it's bones.


    Do you really think the horse has bones at this point?

    Its like the annual pride debate, I mean...its over done but fun as hell.

    I will play devil's advocate because no one else is here to do it.

    I hate effeminate gay men because, in short, they make me look bad. If they got their act together, and acted like a real man, we would have equality by now.

    There I said it.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 5:37 PM GMT
    Inostrankan saidMisogyny is the hatred or dislike of women or girls.

    Effeminate men are not women or girls, they are men.


    This was going to be my post, almost verbatim
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 5:38 PM GMT
    Timbales saidA phobia is a psychological anxiety disorder. It is a strong, irrational fear of something that poses little to no actual danger. It is not a dislike of something.



    Exactly. But most gay men just cannot allow a guy to have a dislike for something without calling it some kind of phobia.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 5:38 PM GMT
    Chainers saidI hate effeminate gay men because, in short, they make me look bad. If they got their act together, and acted like a real man, we would have equality by now.

    There I said it.


    Absolute horse shit. It´s always been the fems who were on the front of gay rights activism.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 5:39 PM GMT
    I think part of it is how some gay men try to desperately hold on to masculinity. Its almost like its cool to be super masculine. I will admit, I have been guilty of acting this way too.

    Truth is, I love fem gay guys (unless they are annoying). They usually crack me the hell up! As far as attraction, maybe I am more attracted to a manly guy, but that isn't all I care about. Is it still considered the same "femmephobia" if a guy just isn't as attracted to an effeminate man as much as a more masculine man? That is something I have been wondering lately.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 5:43 PM GMT
    Lostboy said
    Chainers saidI hate effeminate gay men because, in short, they make me look bad. If they got their act together, and acted like a real man, we would have equality by now.

    There I said it.


    Absolute horse shit. It´s always been the fems who were on the front of gay rights activism.


    True...
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Sep 09, 2011 5:44 PM GMT
    alphatrigger said
    Tazo995 saidAh come on this isn't a troll thread... it's a valid question, no?


    Re-worked the troll warning lol... that's a default copypasta icon_biggrin.gif

    Valid question - but the whole femme vs masc/str8-acting thing is a horse's carcass that has people still happily smacking away at it's bones.


    Haha - nice one mate.

    Agreed this is a dead horse, but we're gonna be beating it for a while. We're still talking about religion too, after all.

    At least this is about real people.
  • Anto

    Posts: 2035

    Sep 09, 2011 5:49 PM GMT
    GigoloAssassin saidUnacceptance of one's self and pressured to conform to social norms.
    There you go.


    The norm to not be gay or the norm to be gay and feminine?
  • Anto

    Posts: 2035

    Sep 09, 2011 5:53 PM GMT
    Lostboy said
    Absolute horse shit. It´s always been the fems who were on the front of gay rights activism.


    Maybe, but then it also seems feminine gay guys are more socially acceptable than 'regular' gay guys and that being gay and feminine has become synonymous within the gay rights movement.