Are pessimists dragging out this recession?

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    Oct 05, 2011 12:48 PM GMT
    I understand that we need to be realistic, but how are things going to progress when there is nothing it seems but criticism criticism criticism and no real action being taken to resolve things?

    Getting out of a depression usually means looking beyond the things that are making you depressed.
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    Oct 05, 2011 1:09 PM GMT
    by "pessimisits", do you mean those without jobs but want to work? Then, no. icon_biggrin.gif

    But yeah, that's how politics work though. No matter how "good" something is, there will always be detractors to chip away at it via criticisms.
  • hawkeye7

    Posts: 565

    Oct 05, 2011 1:55 PM GMT
    No, republicans are ........they do not seem to understand that in their desire for the President to fail, we all fail.
    It is really very sad that the greatest nation on earth cannot fix its schools or repair its bridges.
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    Oct 05, 2011 2:47 PM GMT
    And gays and feminists and atheists and socialists and democrats and devil worshippers and abortionists and terrorists and illegal aliens and liberal Hollywood elites and...
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    Oct 05, 2011 2:49 PM GMT
    Nope. The roots go back 30 years says Bill Clinton. Thats when we started to become criminally fiscally irresponsible. You can't spend money that does not exist forever and billion dollar a day wars for "World security" don't help.
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    Oct 05, 2011 2:55 PM GMT
    hawkeye7 saidNo, republicans are ........they do not seem to understand that in their desire for the President to fail, we all fail.
    It is really very sad that the greatest nation on earth cannot fix its schools or repair its bridges.


    Assisted by democrats with a strong desire to raise taxes, take money out of the economy to throw at a system incapable of fixing those problems.
  • LJay

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    Oct 05, 2011 2:56 PM GMT
    On the radio yesterday, someone said that if we weren't careful we were going to talk ourselves into a deeper recession. Wise words. Thre is no sense in being dewy eyd about it, but the lack of confidence is often quoted as a major factor in slow recovery. A positive attitude could do a lot.
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    Oct 05, 2011 2:59 PM GMT
    LJay saidOn the radio yesterday, someone said that if we weren't careful we were going to talk ourselves into a deeper recession. Wise words. Thre is no sense in being dewy eyd about it, but the lack of confidence is often quoted as a major factor in slow recovery. A positive attitude could do a lot.


    Very true. It has worked before. Perhaps not to huge effect, but its a step in the right direction.
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    Oct 05, 2011 3:01 PM GMT
    I say, whatever is gonna happen, let it happen. I'm prepared no matter which way the wind starts blowing.
  • CuriousJockAZ

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    Oct 05, 2011 3:10 PM GMT
    I know in the Real Estate business, the media is playing a huge part in keeping the market from recovering. They focus on the gloom and doom, and rarely report on the glimmers of positive stuff going on to give people hope and a more positive outlook.
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    Oct 05, 2011 3:11 PM GMT
    mikeinslc saidI understand that we need to be realistic, but how are things going to progress when there is nothing it seems but criticism criticism criticism and no real action being taken to resolve things?

    Getting out of a depression usually means looking beyond the things that are making you depressed.


    Consumer sentiment is usually considered a metric of economic activity, not necessarily a root cause.

    See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_confidence for the basics.

    That said, once a recession begins, consumer sentiment is often a critical component of consumer behavior, and does, in fact, have effects.

    See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recession for the basics.

    So while your formulation is excessively simplistic (as it implies that all we have do to is make those pesky pessimists into optimists and we'll be fine -- just like all we have to do for those pesky depressed people is just "make them optimistic"), and sounds like something Perry or Bachmann might opine at a Republican presidential debate, it does touch on a real, and rather complex relationship between economic activity and consumer sentiment.

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    Oct 05, 2011 3:16 PM GMT
    CuriousJockAZ saidI know in the Real Estate business, the media is playing a huge part in keeping the market from recovering. They focus on the gloom and doom, and rarely report on the glimmers of positive stuff going on to give people hope and a more positive outlook.

    Amen. I thought that the first time around.
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    Oct 05, 2011 4:14 PM GMT
    TerraFirma said
    CuriousJockAZ saidI know in the Real Estate business, the media is playing a huge part in keeping the market from recovering. They focus on the gloom and doom, and rarely report on the glimmers of positive stuff going on to give people hope and a more positive outlook.

    Amen. I thought that the first time around.





    The government halted the recovery last year by issuing bible thick loan requirements when only one sentence was required ( 3 times your income as it was back in the day) . The bail out was welfare for the rich without any requirement for it to trickle down . It was the biggest blunder in US history.
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    Oct 05, 2011 4:23 PM GMT
    hawkeye7 saidNo, republicans are ........they do not seem to understand that in their desire for the President to fail, we all fail.
    It is really very sad that the greatest nation on earth cannot fix its schools or repair its bridges.


    Maybe you're not "the greatest nation on earth" then icon_rolleyes.gif
  • hawkeye7

    Posts: 565

    Oct 05, 2011 4:39 PM GMT
    Dallasfan824 said
    hawkeye7 saidNo, republicans are ........they do not seem to understand that in their desire for the President to fail, we all fail.
    It is really very sad that the greatest nation on earth cannot fix its schools or repair its bridges.


    Assisted by democrats with a strong desire to raise taxes, take money out of the economy to throw at a system incapable of fixing those problems.


    I agree.........We can't fight wars and pay for a politally motivated drug progam if we are not going to pay for them. One way or another we have got to pay for it. We have already spent the money, now we must pay for it, and cutting all the spending will never pay for it. We did it and we gotta pay for it.
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    Oct 05, 2011 5:08 PM GMT
    Alpha13 said
    TerraFirma said
    CuriousJockAZ saidI know in the Real Estate business, the media is playing a huge part in keeping the market from recovering. They focus on the gloom and doom, and rarely report on the glimmers of positive stuff going on to give people hope and a more positive outlook.

    Amen. I thought that the first time around.





    The government halted the recovery last year by issuing bible thick loan requirements when only one sentence was required ( 3 times your income as it was back in the day) . The bail out was welfare for the rich without any requirement for it to trickle down . It was the biggest blunder in US history.


    +100 !
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    Oct 05, 2011 5:17 PM GMT
    hawkeye7 said
    Dallasfan824 said
    hawkeye7 saidNo, republicans are ........they do not seem to understand that in their desire for the President to fail, we all fail.
    It is really very sad that the greatest nation on earth cannot fix its schools or repair its bridges.


    Assisted by democrats with a strong desire to raise taxes, take money out of the economy to throw at a system incapable of fixing those problems.


    I agree.........We can't fight wars and pay for a politally motivated drug progam if we are not going to pay for them. One way or another we have got to pay for it. We have already spent the money, now we must pay for it, and cutting all the spending will never pay for it. We did it and we gotta pay for it.


    Agreed. The issue is who is "we". That is the part that is unresolved.
  • LJay

    Posts: 11612

    Oct 05, 2011 6:16 PM GMT
    They are after the diaresis, Trollileo. He just got tired of typing.

  • FRE0

    Posts: 4865

    Oct 07, 2011 3:08 AM GMT
    I'm sure that pessimism is a contributing factor, but it would be a mistake to blame only one factor; economics is more complicated than that.

    Actually, the problems is insufficient aggregate demand, but that itself is composed of more than one factor. Obviously people who are not employed reduce aggregate demand. People who are pessimistic about the future reduce aggregate demand. People who are heavily in debt and paying it down reduce aggregate demand. When city and state governments lay off teachers, they are reducing aggregate demand. Attempts to balance the federal budget only by reducing expenditure reduce aggregate demand.

    Increasing taxes on the very wealthy will have little or no direct effect, but it would enable the federal government to spend in such a way that aggregate demand would be increased.
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    Oct 07, 2011 3:10 AM GMT
    hawkeye7 saidNo, republicans are ........they do not seem to understand that in their desire for the President to fail, we all fail.
    It is really very sad that the greatest nation on earth cannot fix its schools or repair its bridges.
    331iwr7.jpg
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    Oct 07, 2011 3:42 AM GMT
    Nope. The economic downturn is not just all in our heads.

    Obama is still hoping that is true. Notice that today he gave another campaign speech, I mean press conference - an attempt to get ahead tomorrow's (today's) jobs report.

    There is little else he can do. He is rudderless.
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    Oct 07, 2011 3:49 AM GMT
    Yes blame the recession on pessimistic people. Not anything logical or tangible. Did you know that the Stock Market crash in 1929 actually happened because too many people said "I didn't like the 20s." Yeah, fate sure showed them and they sure missed those flapper 1920s when the depression took away their 1930s!

    mikeinslc said
    Getting out of a depression usually means looking beyond the things that are making you depressed.


    Yes and getting out of the bath tub usually means looking beyond the things that are making you stay inside the bath tub.

    Way to go for pointing out the most obvious and least helpful facts in every day life.

    Do you know why I find your threads insincere and annoying? Because you're White, you live in Utah, and everyone on your hotlist is White.
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    Oct 07, 2011 4:02 AM GMT
    JB82 saidDo you know why I find your threads insincere and annoying? Because you're White, you live in Utah, and everyone on your hotlist is White.
    10z65cj.jpg
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    Oct 07, 2011 4:44 AM GMT
    This is not an ordinary cyclical recession so I do not think pessimism is a key factor. The US of A needs structural adjustment to the economy that will result in more manufacturing of high value goods at competitive cost in a sustainable way - this will have a positive effect on other economic sectors. Some of the things that this calls for are a higher savings rate; much greater public and private investment in infrastructure of all kinds (including telecomunications); much greater investment in education emphasising mathematics, the sciences and languages and starting at pre-school; reduction of health care costs; recognising that allowing the public policy agenda to be set by big business only (including big finance) is the antithesis of free markets and free enterprise. The capital existing and the income generated in America needs to be more diffuse than its prevailing socio-economic concentration. A virtual cultural shift that may be generational is what is required - there is no quick fix and we cannot beg, borrow or steal our way out of this recession. We can do it though - I am the eternal optimist.
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    Oct 07, 2011 4:52 AM GMT
    Tazo995 said
    hawkeye7 saidNo, republicans are ........they do not seem to understand that in their desire for the President to fail, we all fail.
    It is really very sad that the greatest nation on earth cannot fix its schools or repair its bridges.


    Maybe you're not "the greatest nation on earth" then icon_rolleyes.gif


    Point taken Thomas.