Why am I so angry?

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    Oct 07, 2011 4:54 AM GMT
    You guys ever feel this way?

    I think I have a lot of anger pent up inside. I know that I am not a very patient person and I like things to happen immediately. But today my mom called me and she frankly told me that my attitude needs to change. I suppose she is right. But how do you change your temper? It's so deeply ingrained in our personality. I can't seem to change the way I think, or rather, react to a certain thing that certain someone says.

    It's been making me feel very trapped. I think it might be the fact that I don't feel confident enough about myself in the things that I do. But then compared to my colleagues I am superior to them in terms of skills.

    How do I increase my social grace in person? Maybe I should be less abrasive and more empathetic? The problem of being nice is that I can walked all over, and I am so sick of that. I don't like being taken advantage of. I get hurt every single fucking time!
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    Oct 07, 2011 4:59 AM GMT
    Really....

    be nice, stand up for what you believe, and get the post out from up your ass....your 25, and live in Hawaii.... icon_lol.gificon_lol.gif
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    Oct 07, 2011 6:50 AM GMT
    .......I guess as your gay brother I should answer this.


    It sounds to me like you haven't mastered the difference between kindness and what we'll call enlightened self interest (ESI.)

    Kindness is when you behave in a way that positively affects other people because you expect that your actions will have a positive influence on those people. A key component of pure kindness is that you be satisfied purely by the result that your actions have on the life of those people.

    ESI is related to kindness but it is not pure kindness because it hinges on some expectation of reciprocity. You expect that if you do something kind for someone, you expect something back. It could be anything from love, to returned favors, loyalty or simple appreciation.

    To the extent that you expect these things in exchange for any nice thing that you do, you leave yourself open to being hurt because you have created an expectation vacuum that has to be filled by something esoteric (usually another person.) An example might be

    I shared my cupcake with todd because I saw that todd was hungry.

    The next day todd has a cupcake but does not offer to share it with me, and so I feel betrayed, taken advantage of etc.

    If you gave todd the cupcake as an act of kindness (purely for the effect that it would have on him and how it would improve his situation)....it would actually be impossible for todds lack of reciprocity to hurt your feelings. Whenever you do something out of kindness, there is no possibillity for you to be hurt as a result.

    The majority of human actions are not acts of kindness, but acts of ESI. When you shift your acts over to the realm of kindness you will being to be able to foster very good relationships with people because you will not expect reciprocity unless the other party consistently behaves in a way that makes it possible to do so.

    Practice kindness long enough and you will begin to fuse the benefits of ESI into kindness because you will be able to control more of your environment than you otherwise could. And often kindness yields greater rewards than ESI
    I'll give an example.


    Since I was a freshman I have been mentoring a kid in a really bad school system. When I met him he had no goals, had no intention of going to college or something of equal merit. He was also incredibly homophobic. Midway into our interaction he discovered I was gay and gave me shit about it for a very long time. If I had been helping him for the sake of ESI I would have been upset that I was wasting all this energy on someone who hated my guts.

    We had a very tense relationship, but in the end, instead of becoming some jobless unsatisfied man after highschool, I coached him through his SATs and college admissions process, helped him write all his essays, etc. (his college placement counselor was shit.) He now goes to one of the top 25 colleges in the country (at least according to US news) and has a really really bright future.

    He called me a few weeks ago, and told me that he love me, and beyond that explained how sorry he was for all the times he made fun of me or called me a faggot. I'm not sure but i think he may have even been crying.icon_eek.gif

    I never in a thousand years expected him to be okay with me being gay, I never expected him to get over that. But ironically, the fact that I expect anything from the guy allowed me to help him in the short term, and eventually led to him questioning his homophobic upbringing.

    I was never dissapointed in him for hating me for being gay because my mission wasn't to make him like me, it was to make sure he had a shot at the future to which he was entitled. If I had given up because I wasn't getting what I wanted, he would still be a raging homophobe. So in the end, my kind act brought me more intrinsic happiness than ESI could have, AND GAVE ME A GREATER PERSONAL RETURN than the ESI route would have.

    Once you can do things out of kindness you achieve a level of power over yourself and other people that quite astonishing. I try to be kind to people until they prove that they are worthy of me expecting reciprocity of them. It helps a lot with managing anger.

    Whatever you hate about your life or the world, you can attack it but only if you can shift your ESI driven interactions into ones derived from a place of actual kindness. Most of the best decisions I ever made in my life were the ones that had no obvious return.

    Even by commenting on your thread I am trying to exercise kindness over ESI because kindness says (waimea deserves the support of another gay man regardless) and ESI says (you no longer want anything from waimea and therefor have no reason to want to share any knowledge/experiences that may be of help to him.)

    In short, master expectation, and seek to do things from a place of kindness, and all reciprocity becomes an unexpected gift. In this way you will see a lot more net gains in your interactions than net losses because you are not so personally invested in every "nice" thing that you do.
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    Oct 07, 2011 7:11 AM GMT
    hairyandym saidReally....

    be nice, stand up for what you believe, and get the post out from up your ass....your 25, and live in Hawaii.... icon_lol.gificon_lol.gif

    umm Anaheim
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    Oct 07, 2011 7:46 AM GMT
    I should have written that post differently. I wish I didn't have such a hard time expressing myself.
  • Ironman4U

    Posts: 738

    Oct 07, 2011 11:47 AM GMT
    As deeply ingrained as anger is in you, it can be changed. You are not stuck in this pattern of anger if you choose not to be. And yes, it is a choice.

    Anger, along with other negative emotions, produce negative energy. And while you might be directing your anger outward, it is impacting you as much or more than it is the ones with whom you are angry. That means, being angry towards others will actually harm you more in the long run.

    Is is worth it? Why are you letting something or someone anger you so much? Why are you holding onto the negative energy?

    My ex-wife used to be able to push my buttons. I would get so angry my blood would boil. After repeating this pattern enough, I realized that the anger wasn't good for me or my situation and so I refused to give her that level of control and influence over me ever again. In other words, I made a different "choice." You can too.

    I would recommend the book, The Power of Now by Eckhart Tolle. You can check it out at the library. It has an interesting perspective on negative emotions like anger that may help you move past it.
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    Oct 07, 2011 11:49 AM GMT
    Anger is a subcategory of fear.
  • Bigolbear

    Posts: 528

    Oct 07, 2011 4:13 PM GMT
    dekiruman said.......I guess as your gay brother I should answer this.


    It sounds to me like you haven't mastered the difference between kindness and what we'll call enlightened self interest (ESI.)



    +1,000,000
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    Oct 07, 2011 4:24 PM GMT
    I think you should see a counselor, more specifically one who specializes in hypnotherapy or techniques that work against stress and PTSD (Post Traumatic Stress Disorder). Now that says nothing against you personally as most people who get recommended this think they have heavy issues. That couldn't be further from the truth.

    But there are things inside of us that a professional who works with the mind can try to help out with. It could even be effective chatting with someone about it. Whatever you decide, I wish you well. It's definitely a situation not many people can understand or take seriously. icon_biggrin.gif
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    Oct 07, 2011 4:26 PM GMT
    People are dickheads and anger is just another way of dealing with them
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    Oct 07, 2011 4:32 PM GMT
    dekiruman said

    The majority of human actions are not acts of kindness, but acts of ESI. When you shift your acts over to the realm of kindness you will being to be able to foster very good relationships with people because you will not expect reciprocity unless the other party consistently behaves in a way that makes it possible to do so.

    Practice kindness long enough and you will begin to fuse the benefits of ESI into kindness because you will be able to control more of your environment than you otherwise could. And often kindness yields greater rewards than ESI....

    [example of Deki being awesome towards a previously troubled kid]



    Hmm, the more I read your posts/find out about you, the more that I like you. You impress me sometimes, and that is no easy feat tbh....Not, in, the, slightest. Kudos to being awesome =]

    flirt.gif?t=1317959840
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    Oct 07, 2011 4:33 PM GMT
    Step 1, stop talking to your mother.
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    Oct 07, 2011 4:38 PM GMT
    Edward22 saidPeople are dickheads and anger is just another way of dealing with them


    See: Pychological Defence Mechanism

    http://www.simplypsychology.org/defence-mechanisms.html

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    Oct 07, 2011 4:45 PM GMT
    waimea saidYou guys ever feel this way?

    I think I have a lot of anger pent up inside. I know that I am not a very patient person and I like things to happen immediately. But today my mom called me and she frankly told me that my attitude needs to change. I suppose she is right. But how do you change your temper? It's so deeply ingrained in our personality. I can't seem to change the way I think, or rather, react to a certain thing that certain someone says.

    It's been making me feel very trapped. I think it might be the fact that I don't feel confident enough about myself in the things that I do. But then compared to my colleagues I am superior to them in terms of skills.

    How do I increase my social grace in person? Maybe I should be less abrasive and more empathetic? The problem of being nice is that I can walked all over, and I am so sick of that. I don't like being taken advantage of. I get hurt every single fucking time!


    Before you think to blame yourself, take into account cultural differences.

    People told me I was an angry person when I was in California and I thought that they were all just passive. Now that I've moved to New York the only people who say I'm angry are the transplants from outside New York. All the NYC natives think I'm normal. In fact when I shout at ambulances or drunken Puerto Ricans nearby for waking me up in the middle of the night, I feel at home as I usually hear other people do the exact same thing. In LA this would probably be considered "rude." But in NYC it's normal.

    You don't have to necessarily "change" your attitude, especially over night. It's really frustrating when people tell you to change and then give you no directions. They don't understand how you feel because either their brain chemistry and neural wiring just is just not set up the way yours is, or they have no reason to be upset because their life is just great, or they're just stupid in general. icon_cool.gif

    You could be angry for a variety of reasons and interactions. So finding the source of your anger would be the first step to being able to mollify yourself. Maybe noting what pisses you off will help. Maybe you don't like your job? Where you life? Depressed in general?

    Just being nice hasn't worked for me, so I get it if you try it out and it's not for you either. People are fake nice especially in California. So when you make an effort to be nice they exploit both your genial personality and "positive attitudes" in general by manipulating you to get what they want from you.
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    Oct 07, 2011 4:47 PM GMT
    JackNWNJ saidAnger is a subcategory of fear.


    Anger is also a subcategory of frustration. For example, I'm frustrated that your post is mentally retarded.
  • masculumpedes

    Posts: 5549

    Oct 07, 2011 4:49 PM GMT
    Low self-esteem? icon_confused.gif
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    Oct 07, 2011 7:56 PM GMT
    waimea saidYou guys ever feel this way?

    I think I have a lot of anger pent up inside. I know that I am not a very patient person and I like things to happen immediately. But today my mom called me and she frankly told me that my attitude needs to change. I suppose she is right. But how do you change your temper? It's so deeply ingrained in our personality. I can't seem to change the way I think, or rather, react to a certain thing that certain someone says.

    It's been making me feel very trapped. I think it might be the fact that I don't feel confident enough about myself in the things that I do. But then compared to my colleagues I am superior to them in terms of skills.

    How do I increase my social grace in person? Maybe I should be less abrasive and more empathetic? The problem of being nice is that I can walked all over, and I am so sick of that. I don't like being taken advantage of. I get hurt every single fucking time!


    How much are you working out?I'm thinking you could have higher levels of testosterone ..thats going to make some people more aggressive and pissed off.And also very very horny.
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    Oct 07, 2011 10:48 PM GMT
    vanfreak said
    waimea saidYou guys ever feel this way?

    I think I have a lot of anger pent up inside. I know that I am not a very patient person and I like things to happen immediately. But today my mom called me and she frankly told me that my attitude needs to change. I suppose she is right. But how do you change your temper? It's so deeply ingrained in our personality. I can't seem to change the way I think, or rather, react to a certain thing that certain someone says.

    It's been making me feel very trapped. I think it might be the fact that I don't feel confident enough about myself in the things that I do. But then compared to my colleagues I am superior to them in terms of skills.

    How do I increase my social grace in person? Maybe I should be less abrasive and more empathetic? The problem of being nice is that I can walked all over, and I am so sick of that. I don't like being taken advantage of. I get hurt every single fucking time!


    How much are you working out?I'm thinking you could have higher levels of testosterone ..thats going to make some people more aggressive and pissed off.And also very very horny.

    I am working out about 4-5 times a week 2-3 times are weights. Does that sound too much? I don't think so.
    Is there a way to sublimate that anger?
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    Oct 07, 2011 10:50 PM GMT
    I didn't read this thread. Once I saw it was waimea I know why he is angry. He is in love with me, a fellow bottom. That's enough to drive a man insane.
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    Oct 07, 2011 10:57 PM GMT
    waimea saidYou guys ever feel this way?

    I think I have a lot of anger pent up inside. I know that I am not a very patient person and I like things to happen immediately. But today my mom called me and she frankly told me that my attitude needs to change. I suppose she is right. But how do you change your temper? It's so deeply ingrained in our personality. I can't seem to change the way I think, or rather, react to a certain thing that certain someone says.

    It's been making me feel very trapped. I think it might be the fact that I don't feel confident enough about myself in the things that I do. But then compared to my colleagues I am superior to them in terms of skills.

    How do I increase my social grace in person? Maybe I should be less abrasive and more empathetic? The problem of being nice is that I can walked all over, and I am so sick of that. I don't like being taken advantage of. I get hurt every single fucking time!



    I, personally, have not seen much evidence that anything is "so deeply ingrained in our personality." As someone who did a 180 from super-conservative, celibate evangelical to...well, whatever I am now (not conservative or evangelical), I know this first hand. Interestingly, a pastor once told me the following, and I think it is pertinent to your question:

    "Your 'personality' is a set of behaviors and patters that help you get what you want out of life."
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    Oct 07, 2011 11:04 PM GMT
    jprichva saidBeyond the anger, you describe yourself as having not much empathy. Lacking empathy is one of the key indicators of narcissism. How can it possibly matter how others are feeling when it's all about you?

    So. First you have to make a conscious effort to make it NOT all about you. How? You have to force yourself to ask the people around you how they're feeling, what they're thinking. Then you actually have to listen and react to what you're being told. It is not enough just to hear, you must listen. Hearing is when someone allows you to ramble on and on but all the while they're really planning the next thing they intend to say. If you're listening you can't do that, because the next thing you're going to say is a direct outgrowth of what you've just been told.


    The problem is that I WAS empathetic before to people'e feelings and such, but everytime I would feel that I am completely drained when people tell me about their problems. So this is what makes me somewhat antisocial because when I interact with people, and they tell me about their problems, and if I open myself to them, all I would feel is their pain, their agony, and I don't want that. I am a fairly sensitive person and I tend to take things in a personal level. I would literally play and replay things in my mind and dwell on it. Which is what lead me to armor myself up and put up the facade of being grumpy. I would like to think myself as a pretty nice person icon_cry.gif

    The problem is that, nobody really likes me in real life I think icon_cry.gif
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    Oct 07, 2011 11:05 PM GMT
    RedheadedRy said
    waimea saidYou guys ever feel this way?

    I think I have a lot of anger pent up inside. I know that I am not a very patient person and I like things to happen immediately. But today my mom called me and she frankly told me that my attitude needs to change. I suppose she is right. But how do you change your temper? It's so deeply ingrained in our personality. I can't seem to change the way I think, or rather, react to a certain thing that certain someone says.

    It's been making me feel very trapped. I think it might be the fact that I don't feel confident enough about myself in the things that I do. But then compared to my colleagues I am superior to them in terms of skills.

    How do I increase my social grace in person? Maybe I should be less abrasive and more empathetic? The problem of being nice is that I can walked all over, and I am so sick of that. I don't like being taken advantage of. I get hurt every single fucking time!



    I, personally, have not seen much evidence that anything is "so deeply ingrained in our personality." As someone who did a 180 from super-conservative, celibate evangelical to...well, whatever I am now (not conservative or evangelical), I know this first hand. Interestingly, a pastor once told me the following, and I think it is pertinent to your question:

    "Your 'personality' is a set of behaviors and patters that help you get what you want out of life."


    Maybe that's my deepest problem. I dunno what the F I want out of life. icon_sad.gif
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    Oct 07, 2011 11:07 PM GMT
    jprichva said
    waimea said The problem is that, nobody really likes me in real life I think icon_cry.gif

    Here's a simple insight: When a person is liked by others, it means that he makes people around him feel good.

    I do make people laugh...but I am Mr. grumpypants. Maybe I should smile more icon_smile.gif
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    Oct 07, 2011 11:09 PM GMT
    dekiruman said.......I guess as your gay brother I should answer this.


    It sounds to me like you haven't mastered the difference between kindness and what we'll call enlightened self interest (ESI.)

    Kindness is when you behave in a way that positively affects other people because you expect that your actions will have a positive influence on those people. A key component of pure kindness is that you be satisfied purely by the result that your actions have on the life of those people.

    ESI is related to kindness but it is not pure kindness because it hinges on some expectation of reciprocity. You expect that if you do something kind for someone, you expect something back. It could be anything from love, to returned favors, loyalty or simple appreciation.

    To the extent that you expect these things in exchange for any nice thing that you do, you leave yourself open to being hurt because you have created an expectation vacuum that has to be filled by something esoteric (usually another person.) An example might be

    I shared my cupcake with todd because I saw that todd was hungry.

    The next day todd has a cupcake but does not offer to share it with me, and so I feel betrayed, taken advantage of etc.

    If you gave todd the cupcake as an act of kindness (purely for the effect that it would have on him and how it would improve his situation)....it would actually be impossible for todds lack of reciprocity to hurt your feelings. Whenever you do something out of kindness, there is no possibillity for you to be hurt as a result.

    The majority of human actions are not acts of kindness, but acts of ESI. When you shift your acts over to the realm of kindness you will being to be able to foster very good relationships with people because you will not expect reciprocity unless the other party consistently behaves in a way that makes it possible to do so.

    Practice kindness long enough and you will begin to fuse the benefits of ESI into kindness because you will be able to control more of your environment than you otherwise could. And often kindness yields greater rewards than ESI
    I'll give an example.


    Since I was a freshman I have been mentoring a kid in a really bad school system. When I met him he had no goals, had no intention of going to college or something of equal merit. He was also incredibly homophobic. Midway into our interaction he discovered I was gay and gave me shit about it for a very long time. If I had been helping him for the sake of ESI I would have been upset that I was wasting all this energy on someone who hated my guts.

    We had a very tense relationship, but in the end, instead of becoming some jobless unsatisfied man after highschool, I coached him through his SATs and college admissions process, helped him write all his essays, etc. (his college placement counselor was shit.) He now goes to one of the top 25 colleges in the country (at least according to US news) and has a really really bright future.

    He called me a few weeks ago, and told me that he love me, and beyond that explained how sorry he was for all the times he made fun of me or called me a faggot. I'm not sure but i think he may have even been crying.icon_eek.gif

    I never in a thousand years expected him to be okay with me being gay, I never expected him to get over that. But ironically, the fact that I expect anything from the guy allowed me to help him in the short term, and eventually led to him questioning his homophobic upbringing.

    I was never dissapointed in him for hating me for being gay because my mission wasn't to make him like me, it was to make sure he had a shot at the future to which he was entitled. If I had given up because I wasn't getting what I wanted, he would still be a raging homophobe. So in the end, my kind act brought me more intrinsic happiness than ESI could have, AND GAVE ME A GREATER PERSONAL RETURN than the ESI route would have.

    Once you can do things out of kindness you achieve a level of power over yourself and other people that quite astonishing. I try to be kind to people until they prove that they are worthy of me expecting reciprocity of them. It helps a lot with managing anger.

    Whatever you hate about your life or the world, you can attack it but only if you can shift your ESI driven interactions into ones derived from a place of actual kindness. Most of the best decisions I ever made in my life were the ones that had no obvious return.

    Even by commenting on your thread I am trying to exercise kindness over ESI because kindness says (waimea deserves the support of another gay man regardless) and ESI says (you no longer want anything from waimea and therefor have no reason to want to share any knowledge/experiences that may be of help to him.)

    In short, master expectation, and seek to do things from a place of kindness, and all reciprocity becomes an unexpected gift. In this way you will see a lot more net gains in your interactions than net losses because you are not so personally invested in every "nice" thing that you do.


    Marry me.
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    Oct 07, 2011 11:17 PM GMT
    Great question (OP). I have a lot of anger too and attributed it to my testosterone. I take it out on my body during my workouts and by watching football. I did some research and came across this article and think it hits home with me. It may apply to you.

    http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/anger-in-the-age-entitlement/200901/anger-problems-smokescreen-fear-shame-phobia

    http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/anger-in-the-age-entitlement/200901/anger-problems-smokescreen-fear-shame-phobia