Super Cool New H2O Discovered

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    Nov 12, 2011 6:03 AM GMT
    http://news.discovery.com/earth/new-water-super-cool-below-zero-111111.html#mkcpgn=fbdsc6

    Besides vapor, ice and liquid, a fourth form of water may exist, but don't worry, Kurt Vonnegut fans, it's not ice-nine, the dangerous, solid at room temperature substance from the book Cat's Cradle. Unlike the fictional ice-nine, which melted at 114 degrees Fahrenheit, this new form of H2O likes it cold, about 54 degrees below zero Fahrenheit.

    Liquid water usually freezes into ice at 32 Fahrenheit, but under the right conditions, like the high pressure at the bottom of the ocean, water stays liquid below 32 Fahrenheit.

    Water's fourth form, or phase, may be a liquid with some of the properties of both ice and regular liquid water. But laboratory equipment isn't sensitive enough to observe the rapid transformation from regular liquid water to the fourth form.

    Researchers Pradeep Kumar and H. Eugene Stanley used a computer simulation to model the elusive liquid. They found that at about 54 degrees below zero Fahrenheit, the local structure of water seems to become extremely ordered, like ice, while undergoing sharp but continuous structural changes and remaining liquid.

    Oddly, at this temperature the water also became more conductive of heat, the opposite of what happens with regular liquid water and ice, as anyone living in an igloo will tell you.

    The strange behavior of water at low temperatures is what led Stanley and Kumar to believe that their results support the idea that water has a fourth phase.
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    Nov 12, 2011 7:35 AM GMT
    The first few sentences draw you, but then you realize it's way too obtuse to hold your interest.
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    Nov 12, 2011 7:40 AM GMT
    Ariodante saidThe first few sentences draw you, but then you realize it's way too obtuse to hold your interest.


    wha? it wasn't that confusing.
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    Nov 12, 2011 7:44 AM GMT
    super cooled water is what is thought to have brought down Air France 447 - not sure why this is making news right now this isn't really new...
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    Nov 12, 2011 7:53 AM GMT
    RoadsterRacer87 said
    Ariodante saidThe first few sentences draw you, but then you realize it's way too obtuse to hold your interest.


    wha? it wasn't that confusing.


    I said obtuse, not confusing. This new state of water only exists fleetingly in super-specific conditions and the variants of it are barely detectable and only at the molecular level.
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    Nov 12, 2011 7:55 AM GMT
    Ariodante said
    RoadsterRacer87 said
    Ariodante saidThe first few sentences draw you, but then you realize it's way too obtuse to hold your interest.


    wha? it wasn't that confusing.


    I said obtuse, not confusing. This new state of water only exists fleetingly in super-specific conditions and the variants of it are barely detectable and only at the molecular level.


    ah
  • DrewT

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    Nov 12, 2011 8:12 AM GMT
    Ariodante said
    RoadsterRacer87 said
    Ariodante saidThe first few sentences draw you, but then you realize it's way too obtuse to hold your interest.


    wha? it wasn't that confusing.


    I said obtuse, not confusing. This new state of water only exists fleetingly in super-specific conditions and the variants of it are barely detectable and only at the molecular level.


    and it doesn't mention bacon.
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    Nov 12, 2011 8:19 AM GMT
    letsgo84 said I'm just irritated by the sensationalism of popular science blog reporters.


    I wager the scientific community as a whole have some degree of pressure on them (understandably from sources ultimately connected to their funding) to distill their costly research into popularly-digestible sound bytes that the common denominator can grasp....which most times end up coming as "SUPER RAD SPACE AGE NEW ALIEN WATER STATE JUST DISCOVERED MAN!!!"
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    Nov 12, 2011 8:19 AM GMT
    Hmm sounds like that one point where H2O is all three forms at once. I forgot what it's called but it is hypothesized that there is a temperature which H2O must cross in order to become a solid or vapor or reverse a liquid and they say that at that point H2O is all three forms at once. Pretty neat. Wonder if that is that temperature.
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    Nov 12, 2011 8:52 AM GMT
    likewatuc saidHmm sounds like that one point where H2O is all three forms at once. I forgot what it's called but it is hypothesized that there is a temperature which H2O must cross in order to become a solid or vapor or reverse a liquid and they say that at that point H2O is all three forms at once. Pretty neat. Wonder if that is that temperature.


    The triple point? That exists for all materials that can go through phase changes at the right temperature and pressure.
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    Nov 12, 2011 9:12 AM GMT
    samtr87 said
    likewatuc saidHmm sounds like that one point where H2O is all three forms at once. I forgot what it's called but it is hypothesized that there is a temperature which H2O must cross in order to become a solid or vapor or reverse a liquid and they say that at that point H2O is all three forms at once. Pretty neat. Wonder if that is that temperature.


    The triple point? That exists for all materials that can go through phase changes at the right temperature and pressure.


    There you go. I was gonna say elements but stuck to H2O cause yeah I was unsure. Thank you. icon_smile.gif
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    Nov 30, 2011 2:28 AM GMT
    Shinra_Tensei saidhopefully this scientific discovery will lead to something important..........what are its implications for water based lube?


    no but it might be able to lead to new forms of water for ingestion for military purposes, hence water in the desert could be carried in easily more quantitative gel like form.
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    Nov 30, 2011 8:51 AM GMT
    The_Dollarwine said
    Shinra_Tensei saidhopefully this scientific discovery will lead to something important..........what are its implications for water based lube?


    no but it might be able to lead to new forms of water for ingestion for military purposes, hence water in the desert could be carried in easily more quantitative gel like form.

    Like a gel you can hold in your hand?

    That would be AWESOME. You could have water balloon fights without the balloons.

    435805-Royalty-Free-RF-Clipart-Illustrat
  • LJay

    Posts: 11612

    Nov 30, 2011 9:10 AM GMT
    Most interesting.

    I'm thirsty.
  • Twenty_Someth...

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    Nov 30, 2011 9:33 AM GMT
    It's not really a fourth phase of water... All substances when subjected to extremely high pressures and/or temperatures that approach absolute zero transition into a series of exotic states of matter known collectively known as degenerate matter. Quantum mechanics gets all funky at the extremes which is awesome because it shows just how mysterious the universe really is!

    Ex: Near absolute zero super-fluids can be achieved. The molecules lose so much energy that they can flow over each other with no viscosity! A super-liquid of fixed volume will literally form a film and climb out of a beaker until it has spread itself out completely thin.

    Stars at the end of their life cycles are pretty interesting too! White dwarfs and neutron stars are thought to have the same high pressure conditions that can bend the properties of normal phases of matter as a result of using up all of their fusion fuel over time. icon_biggrin.gif