The Fight Begins to Legalize Gay Marriage in Washington State.

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    Nov 13, 2011 6:59 PM GMT
    http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2016755891_gaymarriage13m.html
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    Nov 13, 2011 7:39 PM GMT
    RobertF64 saidhttp://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2016755891_gaymarriage13m.html
    "I'd give them a 50-50 chance," said state Sen. Dan Swecker, R-Rochester, a leading legislative opponent of gay marriage.

    "My goal isn't to demonize anybody, but my assertion is we're all better off if we preserve marriage in its traditional form," Swecker said. "At what point does the institution of one man and one woman become eroded to the point where all kinds of other alternatives exist?"


    What kind of a moron ......? Never mind, its the "R" behind his name.
  • turtleneckjoc...

    Posts: 4685

    Nov 14, 2011 12:29 AM GMT
    TropicalMark said
    RobertF64 saidhttp://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2016755891_gaymarriage13m.html
    "I'd give them a 50-50 chance," said state Sen. Dan Swecker, R-Rochester, a leading legislative opponent of gay marriage.

    "My goal isn't to demonize anybody, but my assertion is we're all better off if we preserve marriage in its traditional form," Swecker said. "At what point does the institution of one man and one woman become eroded to the point where all kinds of other alternatives exist?"


    What kind of a moron ......? Never mind, its the "R" behind his name.


    Agreed. Republicans have answers for everything, don't they? Shame their opinions are so neanderthal and just plain wrong and out of touch.

    He probably made that statement while fondling a pig......
  • tazzari

    Posts: 2937

    Nov 14, 2011 4:49 PM GMT
    "My goal isn't to demonize anybody, but my assertion is we're all better off if we preserve marriage in its traditional form," Swecker said.

    How? Why? Most of us learned in Middle School that you have to support a statement with some facts and evidence. An unsupported statement it opinion, not argument.

    "At what point does the institution of one man and one woman become eroded to the point where all kinds of other alternatives exist?"

    That's easy - when people realize that a) it's none of their business, and b) it doesn't matter, and c) women are no longer viewed by reactionaries as property.

    Happily, dinosaur-like species that are unable to adept tend to die out; Mr. Swecker and his ilkqualify for early extinction.
  • Cutlass

    Posts: 426

    Nov 17, 2011 8:23 AM GMT
    I hope this matter is settled in the legislature, where it belongs, because the Democrats are the majority in both branches of the legislature. However, there are always a few conservative Democrats. If it's put to a vote to the public, then the chances of winning become slimmer. I can't recall that we've ever one when the the issue has been put to the voters.
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    Nov 18, 2011 5:06 PM GMT
    Cutlass saidI hope this matter is settled in the legislature, where it belongs, because the Democrats are the majority in both branches of the legislature. However, there are always a few conservative Democrats. If it's put to a vote to the public, then the chances of winning become slimmer. I can't recall that we've ever one when the the issue has been put to the voters.

    I like to think we'd have a fair chance with voters. If Prop 1125(road toll initiative) was any indication, most of them live on the West Coast anyway.

    I'm confident major employers in Washington State will help fund a fight against a proposition to outlaw gay marriage and it will be up to the bigots/religious groups to fund the other side. It will be an expensive battle for both sides.


    In California...

    http://www.sfexaminer.com/local/2011/11/prop-8-ruling-reignites-same-sex-marriage-fight

    What is interesting is Doug Manchester, the hotel owner and insanely wealthy guy who faced a boycott of his "Grand Hyatt" hotel after his financial support of Prop 8 was revealed....just purchased the only newspaper in San Diego.
    The Union-Tribune. http://www.signonsandiego.com

    I'm struggling to find a mention of the recent Prop 8 ruling on their website. Hmm...
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Nov 18, 2011 5:30 PM GMT
    RobertF64 said
    I'm confident major employers in Washington State will help fund a fight against a proposition to outlaw gay marriage and it will be up to the bigots/religious groups to fund the other side. It will be an expensive battle for both sides.


    Good point. I was thinking just the same with the question of what role will Microsoft's employees play in this.
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    Nov 18, 2011 5:34 PM GMT
    coolarmydude said
    RobertF64 said
    I'm confident major employers in Washington State will help fund a fight against a proposition to outlaw gay marriage and it will be up to the bigots/religious groups to fund the other side. It will be an expensive battle for both sides.


    Good point. I was thinking just the same with the question of what role will Microsoft's employees play in this.

    Here's a list. http://seattle.about.com/od/largecompanies/a/topseattleemployers.htm
    The boycott possibilities are endless... B-)
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    Nov 18, 2011 5:45 PM GMT
    RobertF64 said
    I like to think we'd have a fair chance with voters. If Prop 1125(road toll initiative) was any indication, most of them live on the West Coast anyway.




    I think many of the votes to ban or repeal gay marriage would be different if it were put on the ballot today. California 52% in 2008 (repeal), Maine 53% in 2008 (repeal), Oregon 56% in 2004 (ban), Michigan 57% in 2004 (ban), Wisconsin 57% in 2006 (ban). There has been a shift in attitude among Americans on the issue over the last few years and it doesn't take a huge shift for the votes in those states to go differently. Too bad we can't do it all over again. It is, of course, more difficult to get rid of the ban once it is already in place. Some states were also much higher than these states- like Mississippi where the ban passed by 86% in 2006, Texas 76% in 2005, Georgia 77% in 2006.
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14351

    Nov 20, 2011 7:57 PM GMT
    Doesn't the State of Washington already have civil unions on its booksicon_question.gif If so, than if the people of Washington have seen that gay couples are a threat to nothing, hopefully they will overwhelmingly support gay marriage and tell the primitive minded, evangelical right wingers to go fuck themselves.
  • Rush_

    Posts: 402

    Nov 20, 2011 8:19 PM GMT
    roadbikeRob saidDoesn't the State of Washington already have civil unions on its booksicon_question.gif If so, than if the people of Washington have seen that gay couples are a threat to nothing, hopefully they will overwhelmingly support gay marriage and tell the primitive minded, evangelical right wingers to go fuck themselves.


    We have the "everything but marriage" civil unions law here. Unfortunately, the east side of the state, where I reside, isn't so...progressive. In fact, a good chunk of it is just caught in the dark ages still. Cities like Spokane tend to be more "retirement" cities, and the older crowd (especially here) just don't always support what they don't understand/talk about and instead do what their pastor tells them to. And yes, I will say it now, pastors over in this area do have political sway. Shouldn't, but they do...

    Fortunately, the population is mostly on the coast which does vote liberal, so there's a good chance even if it comes to a popular vote because of that icon_twisted.gif
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14351

    Nov 20, 2011 8:35 PM GMT
    Obviously the lunatic asylum door was left opened because jpBITCHva is freely commenting on RJ forums again. Time to lock that man up for good. We could also put Texas Gov. Rick Perry in the same room with ol' BITCHva, they would make perfect roomates.
  • Cutlass

    Posts: 426

    Nov 21, 2011 4:51 AM GMT
    RobertF64 said
    Cutlass saidI hope this matter is settled in the legislature, where it belongs, because the Democrats are the majority in both branches of the legislature. However, there are always a few conservative Democrats. If it's put to a vote to the public, then the chances of winning become slimmer. I can't recall that we've ever one when the the issue has been put to the voters.

    I like to think we'd have a fair chance with voters. If Prop 1125(road toll initiative) was any indication, most of them live on the West Coast anyway.

    I'm confident major employers in Washington State will help fund a fight against a proposition to outlaw gay marriage and it will be up to the bigots/religious groups to fund the other side. It will be an expensive battle for both sides.


    In California...

    http://www.sfexaminer.com/local/2011/11/prop-8-ruling-reignites-same-sex-marriage-fight

    What is interesting is Doug Manchester, the hotel owner and insanely wealthy guy who faced a boycott of his "Grand Hyatt" hotel after his financial support of Prop 8 was revealed....just purchased the only newspaper in San Diego.
    The Union-Tribune. http://www.signonsandiego.com

    I'm struggling to find a mention of the recent Prop 8 ruling on their website. Hmm...


    Yes, I read the news article that Manchester, the right wing donor to Prop 8, has purchased the San Diego Union-Tribune, the city's only paper. This can portend trouble and difficulty for gays there. I had a female acquaintance who lived there (but doesn't any longer) who said that the city is very conservative with a lot of older navy/retired people, and it may take several decades for the younger generation to outvote the elders and bring San Diego at least into the 20th century.
    By the way, I would presume that the two gay candidates for mayor of San Diego didn't make much headway in the recent voting. How did it turn out? Does anyone know?
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    Nov 21, 2011 8:01 AM GMT
    Cutlass said

    Yes, I read the news article that Manchester, the right wing donor to Prop 8, has purchased the San Diego Union-Tribune, the city's only paper. This can portend trouble and difficulty for gays there. I had a female acquaintance who lived there (but doesn't any longer) who said that the city is very conservative with a lot of older navy/retired people, and it may take several decades for the younger generation to outvote the elders and bring San Diego at least into the 20th century.
    By the way, I would presume that the two gay candidates for mayor of San Diego didn't make much headway in the recent voting. How did it turn out? Does anyone know?


    I'm trying not to think about the website this is on. But...
    http://www.christianpost.com/news/2-gay-gop-candidates-in-san-diego-mayoral-race-57684/
    Mayor elections are next year.
    http://www.kpbs.org/news/2011/jun/23/draw-san-diego-mayors-race/

    Former City Manager Jack McGrory said the strong mayor is much more than a figurehead. He or she will have to manage a large, complex organization.And he said past mayors haven’t been great at that.

    I don't have fond memories of living there. But, for the sake of my friends I left behind, if they're smart... I believe the size of the job calls for current district attorney Bonnie Dumanis. But, I have to confess my issue with Dmaio at this point is his age and experience.
  • Cutlass

    Posts: 426

    Dec 12, 2011 4:29 AM GMT
    State Senator Dan Swecker, Republican of Rochester, WA, wrote an article in the Seattle Times arguing for letting the voters decide the issue of same sex marriages. He wrote: " I believe they should put the question to a public vote in the form of a referendum to the people.....this decision--it supporters believe it can't wait--should be in the hands of the people whose culture will be affected for generations to come. Let's give them that chance."
    So he'll be pushing in the legislature to put the issue before the voters. If only it could be decided in the legislature, where Democrats are the majority in both houses. They are elected to represent the will of the people. If it comes to a vote, I'm a bit pessimistic and think we in favor of gay marriage are still not the majority and our time, efforts and money will be for naught.
  • johndubuque

    Posts: 319

    Dec 12, 2011 4:42 AM GMT
    Cutlass saidI hope this matter is settled in the legislature, where it belongs, because the Democrats are the majority in both branches of the legislature. However, there are always a few conservative Democrats. If it's put to a vote to the public, then the chances of winning become slimmer. I can't recall that we've ever one when the the issue has been put to the voters.


    There is a good chance that this will change. In Minnesota there will be a vote next year on adding an amendment to the state constitution banning same sex marriage. It is quite possible it will be defeated...I have faith in the good people of Minnesota, my second favorite state icon_smile.gif
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    Dec 12, 2011 5:14 AM GMT
    johndubuque said
    Cutlass saidI hope this matter is settled in the legislature, where it belongs, because the Democrats are the majority in both branches of the legislature. However, there are always a few conservative Democrats. If it's put to a vote to the public, then the chances of winning become slimmer. I can't recall that we've ever one when the the issue has been put to the voters.


    There is a good chance that this will change. In Minnesota there will be a vote next year on adding an amendment to the state constitution banning same sex marriage. It is quite possible it will be defeated...I have faith in the good people of Minnesota, my second favorite state icon_smile.gif


    I think it is likely that the proposal will fail. You can make a comparison to Michigan, another Midwestern sate. Michigan passed Proposal 2 to ban gay marriage by 58.6% in 2004. A January 2011 poll showed support then for the proposal had fallen to 50%, still enough to just pass it at that time but since the numbers were moving in the right direction, who knows what would happen if the vote could have been held again in November 2012.
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    Dec 12, 2011 5:21 AM GMT
    The title of this thread is misleading. The fight isn't beginning. It's continuing. Even the linked article says this is the final step to legalize gay marriage. Feh...I guess you could say that the fight for the final round or battle is beginning.
  • Cutlass

    Posts: 426

    Dec 14, 2011 2:11 AM GMT
    Iceblink said
    johndubuque said
    Cutlass saidI hope this matter is settled in the legislature, where it belongs, because the Democrats are the majority in both branches of the legislature. However, there are always a few conservative Democrats. If it's put to a vote to the public, then the chances of winning become slimmer. I can't recall that we've ever one when the the issue has been put to the voters.


    There is a good chance that this will change. In Minnesota there will be a vote next year on adding an amendment to the state constitution banning same sex marriage. It is quite possible it will be defeated...I have faith in the good people of Minnesota, my second favorite state icon_smile.gif


    I think it is likely that the proposal will fail. You can make a comparison to Michigan, another Midwestern sate. Michigan passed Proposal 2 to ban gay marriage by 58.6% in 2004. A January 2011 poll showed support then for the proposal had fallen to 50%, still enough to just pass it at that time but since the numbers were moving in the right direction, who knows what would happen if the vote could have been held again in November 2012.


    I too am a bit concerned that our efforts in Minnesota will fail. So far, as far as I know, when the issue is presented to the voters, we lose. All polls indicate that we are gaining ground, and new, younger voters, who will soon replace the older, dying, conservative ones, are in favor of same sex marriage. The archbishop of Minnesota has urged the parishes to form committees to support the ban on gay marriages, and a spokesman for the church said they were going to marshal all their forces to see that Minnesota bans same sex marriages.
    In California, friends said they were confident that Californians would vote in favor of gay marriages. But when the mormon church stuck its nose (and money) into the issue, the proposition lost. Money does make a difference.