Lets say Obama has won. What's next.....

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    Jun 01, 2008 1:46 PM GMT
    Given what he has said, what do you think things will be like in the US in 4 years.
    Will we still be at war ? Will Americans feel/be safer?
    What will the economy be like and what will he have done about it...and so on.
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    Jun 01, 2008 1:58 PM GMT
    If Obama wins not much will likely change at least initially. The US will likely still be in Iraq, globalization and the industrialization of China, India, and other developing countries will continue.

    The US, although still the world's largest economy and the most powerful militarily, will have to find ways of adopting to a world where other countries are rivaling it in importance.

    As for Americans feeling safer, that will partially depend on the media and people's understanding of what they are watching. The media increases the level of paranoia and fear in order to increase ratings, and not just in the area of terrorism, but also crime, health concerns, etc.. Fear sells to put it bluntly. The same techniques are used in Canada.
  • Timbales

    Posts: 13993

    Jun 01, 2008 2:07 PM GMT
    The Democrats will lose control of the Senate in the next elections.
  • HndsmKansan

    Posts: 16311

    Jun 01, 2008 2:13 PM GMT
    I think Tim has a good idea. At this moment I have very little faith that Obama will be any more than a "learner" in the next 4 years during a period of time we need someone who has some crediblity. I think there will be mistakes and the elections of 2010 will prove to be remarkably fruitful for the Republicans.

    Perhaps my views will change between now and November, but at this time I have little encouragement to heartly support Obama.
  • Koaa2

    Posts: 1556

    Jun 01, 2008 2:21 PM GMT
    I think it will be very difficult for anyone taking over. Bush has turned this country into a nightmare with few friends or allies willing to support us. Our economy sucks and oil is reeking havoc around the world, what did anyone expect electing a totally oil dominated administration?

    I just hope that any Democrat who is elected is given the chance to change things around, it will take more than 4 years.
  • HndsmKansan

    Posts: 16311

    Jun 01, 2008 3:40 PM GMT
    For me there really is two means of evaluation (at this moment). I say that because as we move through the summer, I may become more at ease with Obama and some of what I say here will need to be restated.

    First are the individual candidates, Obama and McCain.
    Forget their political views, I'd probably be more inclined to vote for McCain, without any hesitation.
    He's seasoned, he'd been there, I know and appreciate his experience and his empathy. Obama hasn't been there, plain and simple.

    Secondly are the political views, what they stand for and the direction of the country. I'm a democrat, we have got to change course and McCain (even if he wanted to, would be at war with the right)... and Obama
    is a democrat and I agree with many of his views, just
    think we should have a different candidate.

    Unlike Muchmorethanmuscle, I don't care at all that he is black, white, hispanic or what....

    So for me at this point, I'd vote for Obama, as I have said previously, but would do so because of position, not because of my views of him, his candidacy at this time or him personally.

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    Jun 01, 2008 3:44 PM GMT
    ...a street party?
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    Jun 01, 2008 4:48 PM GMT
    muchmorethanmuscle saidThis pastor is from the south side of Chicago.

    Like the late Minnie Ripertonicon_cool.gif
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    Jun 01, 2008 5:52 PM GMT
    Obama won? Okay, you can expect terrorist voting from people who harbor more dislike for Obama than they do support for McCain. A few votes for an alternative candidate, like I'm going to do, so I can still get my vote in for an unlisted nominee, and not for the lesser of two "evils". And you can expect Obama and McCain to take their boxing gloves off and everyone should keep their eyes open for shots below the belt, that somehow we'll find ourselves "allowing".

    :S
  • yogadudeSEATT...

    Posts: 373

    Jun 01, 2008 6:19 PM GMT
    When Obama wins a major paradigm shift is going to occur in this country and around the world. Fear is no longer going to be our decision maker. Consciousness will be elevated because of the sheer vastness of change that a black man as leader of the free world represents. Of course there will be still be problems. But new approaches and new dreams will also emerge. It's going to be a new era for mankind and the planet.
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    Jun 01, 2008 6:37 PM GMT
    Timberoo saidThe Democrats will lose control of the Senate in the next elections.


    Um, doesn't look likely. The current count is that the Dems will pick up at least six seats to 56-44, and possibly more. Hard to lose that margin in one election.
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    Jun 01, 2008 6:50 PM GMT
    cosmicjewboy saidWhen Obama wins a major paradigm shift is going to occur in this country and around the world.


    I agree. Consider the effect it would have when other nations see us moving from the village idiot of the global village to someone with the intellectual credentials of Obama...from a president who is ridiculed for his verbal fumbling to one who inspires the country with his speeches...from a president who was the complacent son of WASP privilege through Andover and Yale and Harvard, to someone who comes much closer to representing the racial complexity, work ethic, and moral conviction of Americans in general...and from the perpetrator of the Iraq war to one of its staunch opponents.

    I think just the fact of his election would go a long way to restoring our international reputation, to say nothing (yet) of what he might accomplish once elected. At first it would be largely a symbolic change, but even as such it would have concrete and wide-ranging effects.
  • darkeyedresol...

    Posts: 171

    Jun 01, 2008 7:10 PM GMT
    There is only going to be a shift if he can get something done, Obama is going to have a lot to do. If he fails in the eyes of the public then Republicans will most likely pick up seats in 2010 and possibly win the presidency back in 2012. I really don't see why I should believe all this change rhetoric when most reformer canidates, besides FDR and Regean, actually get very little reform done. Clinton came in with a reform and idealist agenda...that got blown to hell, same thing with Carter; most outsider presidents have trouble dealing with the workings of Congress in their first year or so. One of the reasons why I wanted Hillary to win was because she did not need to learn how to use all the levers of government and could just start working on day one.

    The guy is a blank slate, people make him into whatever they want him to be. I don't get what's so special about him, he is just as willing to do whatever it takes to get ahead.

    We will still be at War, Obama is not going to change that...unless he plans to just pull units out regardless of whats going on.

    Most Americans feel safe as it is, we haven't had another terrorist attack...and its a rather low voting priority.

    He has no economic record so who knows
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    Jun 01, 2008 7:26 PM GMT
    He'll move forward with a progressive agenda. He may get nothing done, but at least we'll have someone open to new ideas, to progressive values, and not the corporate money-making-for-my-buddies war mongering of the last 8 years.

    Lord, I can't imagine people voting for Captain Meltyface after he and Obama have a few debates. The difference in tone, thoughtfulness, etc will clearly set them apart.
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    Jun 01, 2008 7:49 PM GMT
    Obama will come and go and Fox broadcasting will still dictate popular opinion while predicting the impending end of the world and commenting on the general moral depredation of society
  • GQjock

    Posts: 11649

    Jun 01, 2008 7:54 PM GMT
    You mean after all the drunken parties?

    It will be a complete and utter paradigm shift in how we do business, politics and diplomacy in this country

    We will be viewed differently by the world
    for one
    is it going to be a bed of roses? No
    But it sure as hell is gonna be different than the hell hole we're in now
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    Jun 01, 2008 8:17 PM GMT
    muchmorethanmuscle saidOne thing I've noticed with Obama is how a lot of young females (mostly of them black themselves) refer to Obama as a sex symbol. In all my years I've never heard of a president referred to in this way. I've seen this happen several times on TV. I think it's a complete and utter lack of respect toward Obama and I think it makes Americans look bad to make any lewd inferences about our potential president. Let's pray that these tawdry females vote for whomever they do for the right reasons.

    To be honest, I don't think this country is ready for a black president. Please don't jump on my back about this you guys, just look at the whole incident with his pastor. It was racially motivated and to hear a man of the cloth take God's name in vain to me is a prelude to unnecessary antics for the future. Just listening back to Rev. Wright's speech and noting the roars of response in the church reeks of potential rioting, all racially motivated. This would not have happened if Obama were white. Perhaps Rev. Wright felt that he would get Obama's support after "Damning America" which eventually backfired.
    With all the repressed anger that a lot of folks have in this country that revolves around racism, I simply feel that there is so much more to focus on that is a lot more important. Like the economy, the war and how it's depleting us on so many levels, unemployment, global warming and yes -terrorism.


    So when will the country be ready? Was America (in general) ready for the civil rights movement in the 60's? I doubt it! The fact of the matter is that regardeless of what we would all like to think the majority of people are, in many ways, content with maintaining the staus quo (as exemplified by what DJBens said a while back), especially if it appeals to their agenda. And if words of discontent are expressed towards current ideals, then that is usually the extent of their willingness to seek change....i.e. people will talk the good talk but never walk the walk!

    Sometimes the best way to elicit change is by simply not waiting for the "best moment possible." There will never be a time where general sociopolitical issues do not plague our society (when some are rectified other arise...that's how a societies tend to operate).

    Why not challenge widely held stereotypes by using such issues, you mention, as a catalyst for dealing with those stereotypes? I definitely do not want to give people the idea that I am a bitter black male, but I feel like I have lived long enough to recognize BS when I hear it (not refering to you at all). If Barack is successful in placing this country back on a path of overall progression (fiscally, socially, politically, etc...) it is possible he may positively influence those who assume he, as a black man, will only look out for the best interest of "his own kind" or assume he (as a black man) is incapable of effectively taking on such a role.

    In the mean time all we can do is wait and see

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    Jun 01, 2008 9:01 PM GMT
    ...The same thing that will happen if Hillary or McCain win the Presidency...

    He will be President.
    He will make decisions.
    Some the public will like.
    Some the public will question.
    Some the public will hate.

    If he is a good/remotely functional (a la GWB) President, then he will go on for 4 more years. If not he will be voted out and someone else will take his place.

    Why speculate over someone when they are not even in a position of power yet...and lets remember, just because someone says things in a primary, does not mean that will be the case when someone is in office.

    Think about CEO'S at Merrill, Bear, UBS, etc - they told their prospective hiring parties, shareholders, board members, etc. that they would make tons of money for their firms for the long term - and look what happened....While you can not fully blame the figurehead all the time, it is the same concept - the people they led gave these individuals a chance and they failed...then they found new leaders from other organizations who will either succeed or fail...it's a process guys and you will never know what will happen until you are truly in the seat of power.
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    Jun 02, 2008 12:23 AM GMT
    I've been tending to stay away from the forums on this site, but I think this is a really nice choice of topic.

    I think people tend to overstate the immediate powers of the president. If Obama did win, I would suspect we would gradually heal some of the strained relations we currently have with other countries -- Europe in particular. (Hell, any of the three candidates would be an improvement). I rather like Obama's articulate, dignified nature.

    A great part of the economy is also just a market cycle: you can't stop the winter, you just need to insulate your house. Frankly, I think we still -need- a major correction. It's simply not sustainable to have an economy where it's normal for eight year old kids to have iPods and cell phones. And, for that matter, I tire of hearing grown adults complain about their credit card debt while talking on their brand new iPhone in brand new clothes. I'm no fan of Bush, but he didn't singlehandedly cause the current economy crisis. There are a lot of factors in play, and even if Obama were to stuff his cabinet full of economic geniuses, it wouldn't be a panacea. It's going to be tough for a while, regardless of who is in office.

    I have issues with all the candidates because I don't think there is any way to gracefully exit Iraq. We're either stuck there forever, or we pull out and anyone (civilians as well as government officials) who has cooperated with us would probably end up in alleys with their throats slit. It's sad, but a really complex situation, and a ham-fisted exit would cause even more damage than our ham-fisted entry. While I strongly believe that Obama would be a better diplomat, I think he is the other extreme from Bush: instead of a warmonger, we'd get an appeaser. That's not necessarily better in the long run... So overall, I think a mixed bag.
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    Jun 02, 2008 12:23 AM GMT
    muchmorethanmuscle said[quote][cite]NNJfitandbi said[/cite]

    Um . . . this is an argument that has often been used to degrade women, and particularly to make the point that women haven't earned the right to vote.

    As for sex symbol, what do you consider the "boxers or briefs" issue with Bill Clinton in 1992 or the obsession with the curvature of his penis? [quote]

    You are referencing incidences with Bill Clinton that happened after he was elected as president. My point was I hope that these women don't let their votes be influenced simply because they find a candidate to be "FYYYYNE" or sexy. I'm not sexist in the slightest. As a matter of fact, I get along better with woman than I do with men. If gay men were drooling over how attractive they found Obama then I would wonder if their lusty yearnings were affecting their voting process as well.

    Having extra marital affairs really isn't my business unless if it involves me directly. What happened with Bill and JFK were careless actions but I think they have a right to handle it privately just like any of you here do if you were to find yourself in the same situation. Many marriages don't work but just because they are public figures doesn't mean we can't allow them their dignity.



    just to drop my two cents... i dont think that there will be THAT many women who vote for him because he is a sex symbol. If they do, i think their numbers will be minimal. I think at the end of the day, the women who vote for him will vote for him for the same reasons so many already have, they simply believe in the most.
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    Jun 02, 2008 12:49 AM GMT
    Well for one I hope that given his recent statements Obama wouldn't jump on the gravy train to government fuel programs. I'm kinda shocked he didn't go with the popular mantra of offering tax breaks on gasoline to get votes.

    Otherwise I don't see much else changing in the world. Iraq, gay marriage, abortion, WMD's, and torture will be back burner issues in a few years anyways. Resources, energy, and healthcare are going to become the major issues. Most of the world is ill prepared for the future. What its going to come down to is a new war of words over responsibility and freedoms. It will be personal liberty vs the greater good.

    I'm sadly predicting an eventual slow victory for the "greater good" camp.
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    Jun 02, 2008 1:11 AM GMT
    muchmorethanmuscle said[quote][cite]orthojock said[/cite][quote][cite]

    So when will the country be ready? Was America (in general) ready for the civil rights movement in the 60's? I doubt it!


    Look, I like Obama. I have nothing against him at all. If he wins I hope I am dead wrong and that he pulls us back up or at least gets us started on the right track. That's all I think any of us can realistically expect from any candidate that will win for his/her first term. It's going to take some time to pull things back together.

    Notice how I didn't make any mention of Obama's lack of ability. I said I don't think the country is ready meaning the people themselves. Years ago Chicago had a black mayor who unfortunately died of a massive heart attack. During his term as mayor, there was a noticeable change within the black community and it wasn't for the better. Once a black man was in power it created this almost false sense of entitlement among the black community. I hate to have to spell it out. You guys know what I'm talking about but I'll be labeled as the bad guy because I'm the only one who will mention it.
    I took the incident as a warning sign. That was a hostile display to me which could lead to bigger problems. We don't need anymore problems. Even Obama is disassociating himself from Rev. Wright. [/quote]


    ....I am scratching my head here....and I am actually having a problem formulating an argument to that - not because when a black person gets into power, that those around him get "uppity" (ie - "false sense of entitlement") but because you are basing a predjudice against Obama on a situation that had absolutely nothing to do with him.

    That would be like me saying because there was a white mayor in charge of Newark during the 1967 race riot which caused a majority of the white population to "flight" from the area to towns like Kearny and Harrison, I am not going to vote for Jon Corzine because he's white and I am going to want to cause a riot in Downtown Jersey City if elected.

    icon_eek.gif

    You honestly have generalized an ENTIRE race of people by this statement as you are saying that black leaders give black people a sense of entitlement....I am floored by the ignorance of your idea and please please please let me know if I read what you are saying incorrectly.

    Floored.
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    Jun 02, 2008 1:59 AM GMT
    muchmorethanmuscle said[quote][cite]orthojock said[/cite][quote][cite]

    So when will the country be ready? Was America (in general) ready for the civil rights movement in the 60's? I doubt it!


    Look, I like Obama. I have nothing against him at all. If he wins I hope I am dead wrong and that he pulls us back up or at least gets us started on the right track. That's all I think any of us can realistically expect from any candidate that will win for his/her first term. It's going to take some time to pull things back together.

    Notice how I didn't make any mention of Obama's lack of ability. I said I don't think the country is ready meaning the people themselves. Years ago Chicago had a black mayor who unfortunately died of a massive heart attack. During his term as mayor, there was a noticeable change within the black community and it wasn't for the better. Once a black man was in power it created this almost false sense of entitlement among the black community. I hate to have to spell it out. You guys know what I'm talking about but I'll be labeled as the bad guy because I'm the only one who will mention it.
    I took the incident as a warning sign. That was a hostile display to me which could lead to bigger problems. We don't need anymore problems. Even Obama is disassociating himself from Rev. Wright. [/quote]


    Unfortunately your analogy using the mayor falls apart b/c there have been several black mayors in major cities across the US who have managed to be successful and were not subject to a "sense of entitlement" (at least one they gave into) from the black community.

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    Jun 02, 2008 2:20 AM GMT
    I am not sure I want try to be real specific about where the country will be etc. But I do believe Barack Obama is different (in a good way) from the current establishment, a man of integrity, moderate and liberal at the same time, patient, tolerant, etc.

    That being said I think he will be inheriting a very screwed up state of things. I think the real effect though will be that his very election signals that the American people themselves are ready for change, and that enthusiasm it self will help give our country a "boost" I think also he will be a "kinder" face in the eyes of the world.

    BTW, I hope he picks Richardson as a running mate. His previous experience would complement Obama well I think.
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    Jun 09, 2008 2:04 PM GMT
    I think Michelle will prove to be more controversial than Reverend Wright. Watch out, I think Hillary may still be the Democratic Nominee.