Why we pay taxes

  • tazzari

    Posts: 2937

    Nov 15, 2011 1:17 AM GMT
    I found this in today’s Oregonian, and posted it deep in one of Christian34’s threads, but I think it’s worth a wider audience.

    “… In the plain words of Elizabeth Warren: "There is nobody in this country who got rich on his own -- nobody. You built a factory out there? Good for you. But I want to be clear. You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for. You hired workers the rest of us paid to educate. You were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for."

    ”All of that is true -- although I need to point out that in the past 34 years I paid plenty to support those services, too. But the real point is that in our rush to criticize around the edges, we forget how basic and essential most government services are, and how crippled we would be without them. While we can still find the rude DMV clerk or the teacher who shouldn't be teaching, the bigger story is that we find dedicated and hardworking teachers and public servants everywhere we look. And our state government functions -- imperfectly, yes, but it functions.

    ”I started my company when I was 23, and as the company grew, I literally did build a factory. So Warren seemed to be addressing me directly with these words, "Now look. You built a factory and it turned into something terrific, or a great idea. God bless! Keep a big hunk of it. But part of the underlying social contract is, you take a hunk of that and pay forward for the next kid who comes along."

    ”We hear a lot these days from people who call themselves "patriots" but whose core messages focus on reducing, if not eliminating, both government and taxes. But like it or not, a civil society demands real patriotism, and that is defined not just by freedom, but by responsibility, sacrifice -- and paying taxes, too. “

    Jim Kelly founded Rejuvenation Inc. He lives in Kimberly.

    For the full essay, see: [url] http://www.oregonlive.com/opinion/index.ssf/2011/11/government_and_civic_duty_why.html
    [/url]
  • GQjock

    Posts: 11649

    Nov 15, 2011 1:24 AM GMT
    "There is nobody in this country who got rich on his own -- nobody. You built a factory out there? Good for you. But I want to be clear. You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for. You hired workers the rest of us paid to educate. You were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for."

    That needs to be emblazoned
    on a Plaque somewhere
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    Nov 15, 2011 1:37 AM GMT
    GQjock said "There is nobody in this country who got rich on his own -- nobody. You built a factory out there? Good for you. But I want to be clear. You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for. You hired workers the rest of us paid to educate. You were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for."

    That needs to be emblazoned
    on a Plaque somewhere


    Amen!
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    Nov 15, 2011 1:56 AM GMT
    I think a lot of people, myself included, would not be so opposed to taxes if the money was spent wisely and not just pissed away. Think about all of the taxes we pay. Federal income tax, payroll tax, Medicare tax, state/local/school income taxes, property taxes, sales tax, gasoline tax, excise tax on communications services (look at your cable/internet/cell phone bills), and other taxes I am probably forgetting. And for many of these government services, there are fees involved, such as at the DMV. And now a bunch of halfwits want to implement VATs. Go ahead and raise taxes on corporations; they're just going to pass those costs onto consumers!

    I'm tired of being made out to be an asshole or unpatriotic when I resist more or higher taxes. It's time all levels of government learn to live within their means. I'm tapped out.
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    Nov 15, 2011 2:00 AM GMT
    PowerFade saidI think a lot of people, myself included, would not be so opposed to taxes if the money was spent wisely and not just pissed away. Think about all of the taxes we pay. Federal income tax, payroll tax, Medicare tax, state/local/school income taxes, property taxes, sales tax, gasoline tax, excise tax on communications services (look at your cable/internet/cell phone bills), and other taxes I am probably forgetting. And for many of these government services, there are fees involved, such as at the DMV. And now a bunch of halfwits want to implement VATs. Go ahead and raise taxes on corporations; they're just going to pass those costs onto consumers!

    I'm tired of being made out to be an asshole or unpatriotic when I resist more or higher taxes. It's time all levels of government learn to live within their means. I'm tapped out.


    Well Said.
  • GQjock

    Posts: 11649

    Nov 15, 2011 2:07 AM GMT
    I'm tired of being made out to be an asshole or unpatriotic when I resist more or higher taxes. It's time all levels of government learn to live within their means. I'm tapped out.

    Err ... dude?

    There really hasn't been any raise in Federal taxes in like forever
    So ... ummm your resisting is causing you some real undue stress ..... maybe like you should do some Yoga or somethin'?
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    Nov 15, 2011 2:10 AM GMT
    GQjock said

    Err ... dude?

    There really hasn't been any raise in Federal taxes in like forever
    So ... ummm your resisting is causing you some real undue stress ..... maybe like you should do some Yoga or somethin'?


    Yeah, dude, but I wasn't like talking about just at the federal level. Ya know?
  • GQjock

    Posts: 11649

    Nov 15, 2011 2:10 AM GMT
    southbeach1500 saidAnd what of the 47% of households in the USA that pay ZERO in Federal income taxes?

    And NO, they are not all wallowing in poverty. Most could certainly cough up a thousand dollars a year to pay "their fair share."



    LOL ... Holy Crap SB........
    Not Wallowing in Poverty .... Oh how KIND of you

    What say you to some REAL WALLOWING
    Like the 1% who have been given the keys to the treasury over the last ten years
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    Nov 15, 2011 2:58 AM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    GQjock said
    southbeach1500 saidAnd what of the 47% of households in the USA that pay ZERO in Federal income taxes?

    And NO, they are not all wallowing in poverty. Most could certainly cough up a thousand dollars a year to pay "their fair share."



    LOL ... Holy Crap SB........
    Not Wallowing in Poverty .... Oh how KIND of you

    What say you to some REAL WALLOWING
    Like the 1% who have been given the keys to the treasury over the last ten years


    As a member of the hated 1%, I can testify that nobody has given me any keys to any treasury.


    Apparently, SB missed this part: "You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for. You hired workers the rest of us paid to educate. You were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for." Or else he would realize that his little internet business could not exist without all the infrastructure we paid for.

    If you made a killing, good for you. You're now paying the lowest tax rates in 70 years, so shut the fuck up about a measly 3% increase, you greedy bitch.
  • GQjock

    Posts: 11649

    Nov 15, 2011 4:22 AM GMT
    this-baby-has-a-message-from-the-99-full
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    Nov 15, 2011 4:46 AM GMT
    southbeach1500 saidAnd what of the 47% of households in the USA that pay ZERO in Federal income taxes?



    They dont exist.. sorry.. but there is NO one in this country that doesn't pay any "federal taxes".. no one.

    Try and prove me wrong and I'll prove you wrong. icon_wink.gif
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    Nov 15, 2011 4:51 AM GMT
    PowerFade saidI think a lot of people, myself included, would not be so opposed to taxes if the money was spent wisely and not just pissed away. Think about all of the taxes we pay. Federal income tax, payroll tax, Medicare tax, state/local/school income taxes, property taxes, sales tax, gasoline tax, excise tax on communications services (look at your cable/internet/cell phone bills), and other taxes I am probably forgetting. And for many of these government services, there are fees involved, such as at the DMV. And now a bunch of halfwits want to implement VATs. Go ahead and raise taxes on corporations; they're just going to pass those costs onto consumers!

    I'm tired of being made out to be an asshole or unpatriotic when I resist more or higher taxes. It's time all levels of government learn to live within their means. I'm tapped out.
    Then you might want to tell your congressional leaders to end the corporate subsidies.. and quit with the cronyism, backroom deals, pay raises for themselves, make em pay for their healthcare, drive their own cars, pay for their own food, housing and 'expense' accounts, lavish parties, credit card usage, payments in kind for lobbyists.. etc etc etc..

    And I mean the REPUBS too... NONE of them are innocent, none.
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    Nov 15, 2011 5:23 AM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    Christian73 said
    Apparently, SB missed this part: "You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for. You hired workers the rest of us paid to educate. You were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for." Or else he would realize that his little internet business could not exist without all the infrastructure we paid for.

    If you made a killing, good for you. You're now paying the lowest tax rates in 70 years, so shut the fuck up about a measly 3% increase, you greedy bitch.


    Hostile, hostile, hostile! Well, that's the liberal way! icon_razz.gif

    I pay Federal income taxes - something that 47% of households in the USA don't do, yet they still benefit from those same roads, and those same schools.

    As for police and fire - those are paid for at the state and local level. And I pay those taxes too. And those who live in my state and town who don't pay state and local taxes also benefit from the same police force and fire department.

    So this whole Elizabeth Warren nuttiness is just that - nuttiness, which is why it resonates so well with you and the rest of the liberals.


    I love it. You're SO afraid of Warren and her message. Well, I guarantee you she's going to be the next Senator from MA.

    And, yes, you pay those taxes, as do the rest of us. But a good many of us who have been successful in life our grateful and pay out taxes to help the rest of our community, both locally and nationally.

    The reality of us it is that you can either pay your taxes or deal with the rioters who will make OWS look like Sunday school because that's where the economic policies you support have driven this country.