Does this punishment fit the "crime"?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 05, 2008 9:32 PM GMT
    http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2008/06/05/hult.confederate.flag.kare

    As I have stated elsewhere on these threads, when confronted with a situation that may be offensive to others, I try to put it into a "gay" context to see how I would feel.

    I am trying to translate this incident into a gay context and see if I would agree with the punishment. I really cant find a situation perpetrated to this limited degree as in this incident that would warrant such a punishment.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 05, 2008 9:40 PM GMT
    Substitute the Confederate Flag with a Rainbow Flag. Freedom of expression should be protected. They should not be punished at all by the school.

    This is going to cause even more racial tension and animosity for a long time to come.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 05, 2008 9:57 PM GMT
    John43620 saidSubstitute the Confederate Flag with a Rainbow Flag. Freedom of expression should be protected. They should not be punished at all by the school.

    This is going to cause even more racial tension and animosity for a long time to come.



    Ok, a rainbow flag would be a positive symbol to me and not elicit a possible negative reaction.

    What would be a "anti-gay" action of similar degree and should it require a ban from graduation ceremonies?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 06, 2008 6:32 AM GMT
    Our courts have upheld a school's prerogative to limit expression that they deem contrary to, well, the school.

    I think when a person reaches the age of majority, they're expected to have the maturity and tools to deal with hate, contrary points of view, freedom and its responsibilities. As a minor, parents have been reluctant to allow their child to be exposed when the child may not be able to make informed, mature decisions.

    So, KKK on the school grounds: not allowed. Black Panthers: not allowed. Bible groups: not allowed (although this one slips through from time to time).

    I'd back the school on this one. Come college I'd say it's a different story.
  • Barricade

    Posts: 457

    Jun 06, 2008 3:44 PM GMT
    The story didn't say anything about the incident sparking anything among the students. Kinda harsh to not allow them to graduate. Why not a suspension or detention. It's funny though the "history" of the confederate army/flag is always an argument of the person/s waiving the flag and they couldn't possibly see it becoming more than just showing "rebellion" . I see that flag on a regular basis, whether on a hat or a shirt or a truck. So I guess I wouldn't have really paid attention to them just having it on their trucks. Seems like such a minor story to have on CNN.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 06, 2008 6:06 PM GMT
    The flag is ambiguous, and means different things to different people. To me, when I see it I think Southern states, rednecks, and rebellion, and none of them negatively.

    It's undeniable that the flag stood for a nation that wanted to perpetuate slavery, and there is no way of dismissing that. Anyone with half a brain should consider the reaction of others to such a symbol. The students waved/carried the flags to affect a reaction, and they got one. /shrug

    Maybe next time they'll put a little more empathy and forethought into their actions.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 06, 2008 7:20 PM GMT
    Caslon:

    Would you think that high school age supporters of Fred Phelps waiving signs supporting his rhetoric from the back of their pick up truck might be similar enough and anti-gay. How does that fit into your thinking?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 06, 2008 7:24 PM GMT
    rigsby saidCaslon:

    Would you think that high school age supporters of Fred Phelps waiving signs supporting his rhetoric from the back of their pick up truck might be similar enough and anti-gay. How does that fit into your thinking?


    That's good.

    Now how would I feel? I think I would feel that they should be told to stop their hate speech. But I wouldnt say that they couldnt participate in the graduation ceremonies.

    Would you?

    Now if they did it during the ceremonies and disrupted them, that would be different story.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 06, 2008 7:38 PM GMT
    I've always hated hypotheticals. I'm approaching your two questions/situations in reverse order. Why should the correctness of the punishment vary depending on where the hate speech occurs? (i.e., the parking lot or the graduation ceremony itself).

    Would I stop them from participating in the graduation? I think some punishment other than just stopping the speech should occur. Since they're graduating, what more punishment is available? They are still getting their diplomas, they just don't have to suffer through that unbearable exercise and listen to those stuffy speeches. Are you sure they're really being punished?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
    Log in to view his profile

    Jun 07, 2008 12:39 AM GMT
    rigsby said They are still getting their diplomas, they just don't have to suffer through that unbearable exercise and listen to those stuffy speeches. Are you sure they're really being punished?


    It's a transition point in life, hence it's celebration, that many people hold very dearly.