National anthems and patriotism for the left

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    Dec 28, 2011 2:56 AM GMT
    The National Anthem of the Soviet Union, with English subtitles.


    The words of the US national anthem, with music of the Soviet national anthem


    The Soviet national anthem with words updated for the current US President
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    Dec 28, 2011 2:58 AM GMT
    socalfitness saidThe National Anthem of the Soviet Union, with English subtitles.


    The words of the US national anthem, with music of the Soviet national anthem


    The Soviet national anthem with words updated for the current US President


    On that note, not sure if you knew who wrote the American pledge of allegiance and why it was written.
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    Dec 28, 2011 3:04 AM GMT
    riddler78 said
    On that note, not sure if you knew who wrote the American pledge of allegiance and why it was written.
    Oh the HORROR that it was a SOCIALIST that wrote it!
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    Dec 28, 2011 3:19 AM GMT
    This irrational anti-Obama hysteria is just ridiculous.
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    Dec 28, 2011 3:32 AM GMT
    This is so tedious.
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    Dec 28, 2011 3:34 AM GMT
    TropicalMark said
    riddler78 said
    On that note, not sure if you knew who wrote the American pledge of allegiance and why it was written.
    Oh the HORROR that it was a SOCIALIST that wrote it!


    Quite true. Fascism runs deep amongst socialists apparently.
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    Dec 28, 2011 3:46 AM GMT
    riddler78 said
    TropicalMark said
    riddler78 said
    On that note, not sure if you knew who wrote the American pledge of allegiance and why it was written.
    Oh the HORROR that it was a SOCIALIST that wrote it!


    Quite true. Fascism runs deep amongst socialists apparently.


    Equally tedious for someone in a socialist country who benefits from said policies to constantly bitch and whine about them. If you dislike socialism, why not move to a country more to your liking? Say The Congo?
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    Dec 28, 2011 3:50 AM GMT
    Not sure what the point of the OP is.

    Obama is not a socialist, if only he was! Then he would have the confidence to get so many progressive things accomplished, and wouldn't moderate himself to seem mainstream. How silly that the right sees him as "too radical" when he is not radical at all.

    The Soviet Union under Stalin and post-Stalin, was not socialist....because socialism is a society where the workers democratically control the means of production, in the USSR it was a bureaucracy of a totalitarian dictatorship controlling the means of production. This is called "state capitalism".

    But on the subject of America themed music, Woody Guthrie wrote "This Land is Your Land" and he was a socialist.

    Other notable socialists: Albert Einstein, Martin Luther King, Helen Keller. Well respected people, but few people know their politics were so radical. And their socialist leanings were borne out of their love for their fellow human beings and their desire for a free and equal society.

    And proof that many Americans simply do not buy into McCarthyist BS:

    -hg_cxvgaugmwblhj7jpyg.gif

  • JP85257

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    Dec 28, 2011 3:57 AM GMT
    Stan904 saidNot sure what the point of the OP is.

    Obama is not a socialist, if only he was! Then he would have the confidence to get so many progressive things accomplished, and wouldn't moderate himself to seem mainstream. How silly that the right sees him as "too radical" when he is not radical at all.

    The Soviet Union under Stalin and post-Stalin, was not socialist....because socialism is a society where the workers democratically control the means of production, in the USSR it was a bureaucracy of a totalitarian dictatorship controlling the means of production. This is called "state capitalism".

    But on the subject of America themed music, Woody Guthrie wrote "This Land is Your Land" and he was a socialist.

    Other notable socialists: Albert Einstein, Martin Luther King, Helen Keller. Well respected people, but few people know their politics were so radical. And their socialist leanings were borne out of their love for their fellow human beings and their desire for a free and equal society.

    And proof that many Americans simply do not buy into McCarthyist BS:

    -hg_cxvgaugmwblhj7jpyg.gif


    Im sure that since 2010 the numbers have changed.
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    Dec 28, 2011 4:04 AM GMT
    True socialism would be a great thing. It would be as close to perfection short of heaven actually.

    Except for that one tiny, teensy little factor:

    Human nature.

    Especially that individualist streak that seems to be well-cultivated in American culture.

    It is human nature unfortunately, to wants the best things for one's self.

    Why be content living in a mud hut, or a 60-unit apartment building poured from concrete like the other 400 buildings exactly like it, and with using only one government-owned brand of toothpaste, mouthwash, and television to get things done, if you have the ability to do better on your own hook, or better still, with the resources of people willing to trust you with their capital (ooops! a dirty birdy I am for trotting that word out!!) with the hopes of making a profit on your talent?

    And socialism will ALWAYS fail, and become some horribly malfunctional shadow of what it could have beenm as long as the system is run by faulty humans who in the long run, have only their immediate interests in mind.

    Because that Politburo, that Production Commune, and that Co-Op Farm will have certain talented people on it, much like the pigs on the Animal Farm, who will take advantage of trusting and/or ignorant people to carve out for themselves a niche of power, by which they will grow arrogant and non-productive over time.
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    Dec 28, 2011 4:18 AM GMT
    Stan904 saidObama is not a socialist, if only he was!
    See the link for the explanation of Obama as a socialist defined by the West European political parties and politicians that label themselves "socialist". This differs from the classic socialism of Marx and Engels in terms of methods used.
    http://www.realjock.com/gayforums/1981422/

    Stan904 saidThe Soviet Union under Stalin and post-Stalin, was not socialist....because socialism is a society where the workers democratically control the means of production, in the USSR it was a bureaucracy of a totalitarian dictatorship controlling the means of production.
    Not correct. Socialism has only existed in a democratic environment under limited situations, such as in the Oneida colony in New York or on kibbutzes in Israel. Limited forms of socialism have existed in Scandinavia, but these countries are characterized by abundant national resources relative to a fairly sparse population. Generally, on a national level, socialism requires a totalitarian government to force compliance.
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    Dec 28, 2011 4:27 AM GMT
    Well, technically speaking, the Soviet anthem still exists. Russia's current national anthem is the same melody as the old Soviet one but with different lyrics. It was reinstated in 2001 (albeit not without controversy).
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    Dec 28, 2011 4:39 AM GMT
    AlphaTrigger saidTrue socialism would be a great thing. It would be as close to perfection short of heaven actually.

    Except for that one tiny, teensy little factor:

    Human nature.

    Especially that individualist streak that seems to be well-cultivated in American culture.

    It is human nature unfortunately, to wants the best things for one's self.

    Why be content living in a mud hut, or a 60-unit apartment building poured from concrete like the other 400 buildings exactly like it,

    And explain how this does not happen in capitalism? do you think poverty does not exist?

    Socialism is not about poverty, because it is about uplifting the condition of everyone....it is a progressive stage of society just as capitalism is a step above feudalism, socialism is a step above capitalism and capitalism's evolution into socialism is not an impossible dream, it's simply inevitable....yes, few people are proud to identify with a "fringe" ideology such as socialism, but ideas which were once radical are taken for granted today as normal today...

    And if capitalism is not destroyed by revolution and socialist ideas never become popular, it is likely to evolve into socialism anyway, because a future technological society pursuing development of robotics and other technologies is likely to evolve past the need for human labor, currency and markets. In such a society, people would not need to work, commodities would be freely available (production would be high and there would be an abundance of goods).

    In fact, a capitalist economy is incompatible with automation, for one reason, human labor is necessary for capitalism to function as an economic system. The only system that is compatible with the general use of robots as labor, is a socialist society.

    http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2008/10/robot-lovers-an/
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    Dec 28, 2011 4:59 AM GMT
    pocketnico saidWell, technically speaking, the Soviet anthem still exists. Russia's current national anthem is the same melody as the old Soviet one but with different lyrics. It was reinstated in 2001 (albeit not without controversy).

    Yup, that was Putin's doing, if I recall correctly. There was some good old nostalgia for the good old СССР. I intentionally chose the Soviet version. Although the left does not embrace Communism, as the Soviet version mentions, I thought overall they would be more comfortable with this version.
  • JP85257

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    Dec 28, 2011 5:25 AM GMT
    Needs to be shared every time a socialism thread pops up.
    "The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money. ”

    ― Margaret Thatcher
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    Dec 28, 2011 12:40 PM GMT
    Exactly what was the point of the origional post? Since the Lighthouse Act of 1796 which, signed by President Washington, and which nationalized the privately held lighthouses and buoys in the country, to the Tariff Act of 1789, again signed by President Washington, this nation has always had a mixed economy. The transcontinental railroad, the various homestead acts, the Panama Canal, the great water projects of the 1930's, the interstate highway system, even the common flu shot, these are all things the govt. does or pays for because the private sector can't or won't do them yet they are essential for the nation.

    Keep in mind that with the exception of slavery, the Constitution is silent on what economicy system the United States will have. That being said, the Founders saw a place for a role for the Federal govt in, as Jefferson said in his second inaugural address, the Federal govt. has a role in"...canals, roads, arts, manufactures, education, and other great objects within each State" And this from a President who unlike Washington who wanted a strong Federal government, wanted a weak Federal government. Of course he said in times of peace, yet since Clinton, we have been at war.
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    Dec 28, 2011 4:55 PM GMT
    Unfortunately, socals mental capacity doesnt allow him to completely understand a complex, multifaceted concept like socialism. The more educated posters on RJ will just have to endure his repeated posts and sad attempts to understand the topic.
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    Dec 28, 2011 5:02 PM GMT
    catfish5 saidUnfortunately, socals mental capacity doesnt allow him to completely understand a complex, multifaceted concept like socialism. The more educated posters on RJ will just have to endure his repeated posts and sad attempts to understand the topic.

    Normally I complete ignore you, but too amusing. Your messages and threads lie at the bottom of the barrel in terms of being content free. Even when a thread has some semblance of a serious discussion, when you join in, anyone with even a somewhat below average IQ would be embarrassed with what you write. The only time you sounded intelligent was when you copied a message of mine and used the words. hehe Maybe you might do that with messages from other guys so you don't continue to sound like a total idiot.
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    Dec 28, 2011 5:05 PM GMT
    socalfitness said
    catfish5 saidUnfortunately, socals mental capacity doesnt allow him to completely understand a complex, multifaceted concept like socialism. The more educated posters on RJ will just have to endure his repeated posts and sad attempts to understand the topic.

    Normally I complete ignore you, but too amusing. Your messages and threads lie at the bottom of the barrel in terms of being content free. Even when a thread has some semblance of a serious discussion, when you join in, anyone with even a somewhat below average IQ would be embarrassed with what you write. The only time you sounded intelligent was when you copied a message of mine and used the words. hehe Maybe you might do that with messages from other guys so you don't continue to sound like a total idiot.


    It must be tough reaching your golden years and becoming a withering shell of your former self. Especially not realizing that dementia has set in. So sad.
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    Dec 28, 2011 5:11 PM GMT
    Two can play this game, except I give reasons.

    Conservatives repeatedly use wars and scapegoat the same groups of people (homoxesuals, liberals, intellectuals, immigrants, the poor and minorities, etc,) to stir up anger and deflect attention from a declining standard of living...as done by the Nazis.

    So when gay conservatives march, they (unwittingly) march to this...

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    Dec 28, 2011 5:45 PM GMT
    catfish5 saidIt must be tough reaching your golden years and becoming a withering shell of your former self. Especially not realizing that dementia has set in. So sad.

    Actually I'm in great shape. Go to the gym, do serious weights and some cardio. I do have to work harder than when I was younger. Some of the guys I work out with on occasion are much younger, in one case mid 20s, in excellent shape, and it keeps me motivated and energized. Thanks for the concern though.

    catfish5 saidUnfortunately, socals mental capacity doesnt allow him to completely understand a complex, multifaceted concept like socialism. The more educated posters on RJ will just have to endure his repeated posts and sad attempts to understand the topic.

    Never seen you explain socialism, or how it is "complex, multifaceted". Did you borrow that from another member? Do you know what it means?

    Speaking of "more educated posters", because RJ does have members with different degrees, maybe you might start a thread to explain if your undergraduate degree adequately prepared you for your line of work. Perhaps your graduate degree helped instill the finer points of your profession. Did it give you insight into the ramifications of being a human petri dish, collecting all kinds of stuff? Perhaps insight as to the impact on life expectancy? But then again, perhaps life achievements can be measured not by years lived or other accomplishments, but by the number of different clients. Share your education. I'm sure that thread will give you the attention you so desperately crave.
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    Dec 28, 2011 6:03 PM GMT
    Sorry guys. I know we have an unwritten rule not to engage discussing complex issues with the old, infirm, and demented, but i couldnt resist.

    My recommendation: Keep the previous posters mental deficits in mind when reading his posts. Dont take him seriously. But engage him on benign topics he can grasp to help him feel more relevant.
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    Dec 28, 2011 9:41 PM GMT
    @Stan904:

    I won't make any claim that capitalism is perfect, because it isn't.

    Poverty exists in both socialist and in capitalist societies, and also in mixed economies such as what we have in the USA.

    Under socialism, everyone but those who are "in good standing with the party" (that is, party apparatchiks) will have a generally lessened amount of wealth and well-being and decreased access to any competing/better services.

    Under capitalism, poverty can be more severe, and wealth inequity more imbalanced ... but is not as pervasive among the general population. And societies that more closely embrace a free market will generally have better service offerings and competing price ranges.

    But as I said, not everyone will be convinced to freely give up their individual rights to provide for themselves as they deem best, nor will everyone freely give up a free market ... without a revolution.

    A revolution that would be necessity, for those who "have" to give to the "have-nots", which is really nothing more than "armed robbery", than "consent of the governed"
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    Dec 29, 2011 1:23 AM GMT
    Which is more amusing:

    An autolobotomy with a pick axe?

    Or SoCalfitness's attempts to be funny?

    Is he actually a Vogon?
  • conservativej...

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    Dec 29, 2011 1:30 AM GMT
    The last video is tops SoCal. Obama the Socialist. All hail the Hollow King.