Virginia school district considers ban on cross-dressing

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    Feb 11, 2012 12:59 AM GMT
    http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/02/10/10374850-virginia-school-district-considers-ban-on-cross-dressing
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    Feb 11, 2012 1:53 AM GMT
    Virginia just isn't making good news lately, eh?

    Well, Suffolk borders North Carolina. I imagine many people in that part of the state aren't so crazy about that sort of thing.
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    Feb 11, 2012 2:37 AM GMT
    Why is it an issue in the first place?

    I wish schools would go back to actually teaching kids.
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    Feb 11, 2012 2:45 AM GMT
    Sigh.

    I used to work in Suffolk and i'm not surprised. I'd like to say it doesn't represent the views of most people there.... but yeah it prob does. Trans people are almost invisible there.
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    Feb 11, 2012 4:02 AM GMT
    JackNWNJ saidWhy is it an issue in the first place?

    I wish schools would go back to actually teaching kids.
    Regardless of what gender they dress as.
  • LJay

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    Feb 11, 2012 7:15 AM GMT
    Adam, Suffolk strikes me as the kind of place where a guy in tight jeans might be seen as cross dressing.
  • Syphon

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    Feb 11, 2012 7:52 AM GMT
    Well if they're going to enforce this, then all the females should be forced to wear dresses or skirts at all times. icon_rolleyes.gif
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    Feb 11, 2012 8:22 AM GMT
    For those making blanket judgements about the area: please understand that Suffolk is the least populated and least developed of the "7 cities" (the core cities of Hampton Roads, the US's 36th largest metropolitan area) and its demographic does not reflect this part of the state on a whole. I grew up in Virginia Beach, and guys were wearing skirts to school back in the nineties in the VBPS when I was a student. I have a trans friend who went to public school in Norfolk as well. Suffolk is just the area that hasn't caught up so to speak, so don't give "that part of the state" a bad rap based on this.

    Also, not too far south in North Carolina... That's the Research Triangle. Raleigh, Durham, & Chapel Hill.... Duke & UNC.
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    Feb 11, 2012 8:33 AM GMT
    JackNWNJ saidWhy is it an issue in the first place?

    I wish schools would go back to actually teaching kids.


    The first thing they need to do then, is to get rid of all the left wing fundamentalist teachers, who only want to push their political agenda; on young burgeoning minds.
  • hebrewman

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    Feb 11, 2012 5:04 PM GMT
    Art_Deco saidhttp://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/02/10/10374850-virginia-school-district-considers-ban-on-cross-dressing


    this really does not surprise me considering the ass hole governor and the way he's running things. i'm embarrassed to be a native born virginian. for a group that wants to keep government out of peoples lives, they sure as hell want to steam roll over any freedom of expression. nothing like turning the clock back to the 1950's. mcdonnell is such a prick. and his attorney general is not much better either.
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    Feb 11, 2012 5:39 PM GMT
    They want to stop ladies wearing jeans? About time. Girls should wear girly clothes at all times, which means a long skirt (modest and below the knee) and a parasol to protect their fair skin white from the sunlight (this is not true for dark women who will be working in the fields anyway). They should also wear sensible, but feminine, shoes. No sneakers or bisexual shoes, but nothing immoral, such as high heels.

    They should dress like this

    modest%2Bdresses.jpg

    Or this

    costume2.jpg
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    Feb 11, 2012 5:49 PM GMT
    Lostboy saidThey want to stop ladies wearing jeans? About time. Girls should wear girly clothes at all times, which means a long skirt (modest and below the knee) and a parasol to protect their fair skin white from the sunlight (this is not true for dark women who will be working in the fields anyway). They should also wear sensible, but feminine, shoes. No sneakers or bisexual shoes, but nothing immoral, such as high heels.

    They should dress like this

    modest%2Bdresses.jpg

    />
    Or this:
    la%20times%20will%20polygamist%20chic%20
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    Feb 11, 2012 9:21 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said"Colonel" Deco who created this topic is probably the king of all generalizations, as he's stated that Muslims shouldn't be allowed in the USA and just this week he's portrayed all people who live in New York as uncaring!

    First, you can drop the quotes around my retired rank. If you don't wanna use it then fine (I certainly don't care to have it demeaned by you anyway). But if you must use it then treat at least the rank with respect, even if you can't manage it with me and with other RJers here.

    Second, I have apologized and retracted that 2-year-old Muslim remark, but you are becoming quite a laughing stock with your pathetic attempts to insert it into every topic involving me. I expect to see you using it again next time I mention my favorite restaurant.

    I made a post not a month ago about New York City, repeating once again how pleased I was during a 2005 2-week stay there, to find everyone so polite and nice. Perhaps you missed where I was astonished that even women were getting up to give me their subway seats, because I have a cane, something I don't experience in other cities. (And BTW, I always declined their offers)

    So as usual you're just flat out lying when you write that I portray "all" people in New York as uncaring. Or are you projecting some of your own notorious generalizing onto me? icon_lol.gif
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    Feb 11, 2012 9:31 PM GMT
    Lostboy saidThey want to stop ladies wearing jeans? About time. Girls should wear girly clothes at all times, which means a long skirt (modest and below the knee) and a parasol to protect their fair skin white from the sunlight (this is not true for dark women who will be working in the fields anyway). They should also wear sensible, but feminine, shoes. No sneakers or bisexual shoes, but nothing immoral, such as high heels.

    They should dress like this

    modest%2Bdresses.jpg

    Or this

    costume2.jpg


    There are plenty of Mennonite communities in the Shenandoah Valley and parts of Appalachia. Surely the women there are kept to their moral standards!
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    Feb 11, 2012 9:52 PM GMT
    I know this won't be popular, but I agree with the ban. Guys should be dressing like guys, and girls should be dressing like girls.
    Personally if these public schools would go to uniforms and have it stated that girls are expected to wear skirts, and guys pants PERIOD....we wouldn't have this issue.
    We wore uniforms from the day we entered school at age 5, until we graduated HS. It brought cohesion to the class, and pride of how one looks.
    (And NO, not religious schools)

    Tristan
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    Feb 11, 2012 9:59 PM GMT
    you don´t seem to understand.

    I don´t think you understand anything and seem to have gained little from being gay

    Ideally you would go away and think very seriously about heteronormativity and the account of the basis of knowledge that you give, but I don´t think you´ll even understand what I just said, let alone be capable of coming to coherent conclusions about it.
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    Feb 11, 2012 10:08 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    Lostboy saidyou don´t seem to understand.

    I don´t think you understand anything and seem to have gained little from being gay

    Ideally you would go away and think very seriously about heteronormativity and the account of the basis of knowledge that you give, but I don´t think you´ll even understand what I just said, let alone be capable of coming to coherent conclusions about it.


    Lost "boy" isn't a "boy" at all - 35 and single all these years he's been on RJ. He is however, quite "lost" when it comes to knowing how to conduct a civil conversation with someone.


    lol, SB with your holier-than-lostboy example of civility towards Art, right?

    icon_lol.gif
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    Feb 11, 2012 10:12 PM GMT
    musclefetish1 saidI know this won't be popular, but I agree with the ban. Guys should be dressing like guys, and girls should be dressing like girls.
    Personally if these public schools would go to uniforms and have it stated that girls are expected to wear skirts, and guys pants PERIOD....we wouldn't have this issue.
    We wore uniforms from the day we entered school at age 5, until we graduated HS. It brought cohesion to the class, and pride of how one looks.
    (And NO, not religious schools)

    Tristan


    It's more than telling them they should wear uniforms. That would be fine if it was ALL the children but its only the people who are struggling with their gender. The school is telling them whats normal and implying that anything else is wrong.

    They should be teaching tolerance, not ignorance.
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    Feb 11, 2012 10:20 PM GMT
    meninlove said
    southbeach1500 said
    Lostboy saidyou don´t seem to understand.

    I don´t think you understand anything and seem to have gained little from being gay

    Ideally you would go away and think very seriously about heteronormativity and the account of the basis of knowledge that you give, but I don´t think you´ll even understand what I just said, let alone be capable of coming to coherent conclusions about it.


    Lost "boy" isn't a "boy" at all - 35 and single all these years he's been on RJ. He is however, quite "lost" when it comes to knowing how to conduct a civil conversation with someone.


    lol, SB with your holier-than-lostboy example of civility towards Art, right?

    icon_lol.gif
    inorite icon_rolleyes.gificon_rolleyes.gificon_rolleyes.gificon_rolleyes.gif
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    Feb 11, 2012 10:51 PM GMT
    adam228 said
    musclefetish1 saidI know this won't be popular, but I agree with the ban. Guys should be dressing like guys, and girls should be dressing like girls.
    Personally if these public schools would go to uniforms and have it stated that girls are expected to wear skirts, and guys pants PERIOD....we wouldn't have this issue.
    We wore uniforms from the day we entered school at age 5, until we graduated HS. It brought cohesion to the class, and pride of how one looks.
    (And NO, not religious schools)

    Tristan


    It's more than telling them they should wear uniforms. That would be fine if it was ALL the children but its only the people who are struggling with their gender. The school is telling them whats normal and implying that anything else is wrong.

    They should be teaching tolerance, not ignorance.


    This is where I have a problem with this. I don't think it is normal for boys to wear girl's clothing or visa-versa (spelling?).
    All this does it just bring more attention/abuse to the student from both peers and society at large. Plus this does the Gay community no service.

    The general public is predjudiced enough against Gays and lesbians. This whole cross-dressing/cross gender nonsense just fuels the fire. It makes it harder for the Gay community at large to advance in the political arena, and gain more positive social acceptance.
    And we, unfortunately, need as much of the str8 community's political backing as we can get. icon_rolleyes.gif

    Tristan
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    Feb 11, 2012 10:54 PM GMT
    Lostboy saidThey want to stop ladies wearing jeans? About time. Girls should wear girly clothes at all times, which means a long skirt (modest and below the knee) and a parasol to protect their fair skin white from the sunlight (this is not true for dark women who will be working in the fields anyway).
    kindly explain urselves pls, i dont understand de above statement nd will like it to clearified to me inorder not to distort wat u actually wish to say. Especially the sentence in de bracket.
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    Feb 11, 2012 10:59 PM GMT
    Samuelsam said
    Lostboy saidThey want to stop ladies wearing jeans? About time. Girls should wear girly clothes at all times, which means a long skirt (modest and below the knee) and a parasol to protect their fair skin white from the sunlight (this is not true for dark women who will be working in the fields anyway).
    kindly explain urselves pls, i dont understand de above statement nd will like it to clearified to me inorder not to distort wat u actually wish to say. Especially the sentence in de bracket.


    he's being sarcastic, Samuel, and ironic w/ a touch of the sardonic mocking those who attempt 2 legislate/bind free expression and free will.
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    Feb 11, 2012 11:03 PM GMT
    musclefetish1 said


    This is where I have a problem with this. I don't think it is normal for boys to wear girl's clothing or visa-versa (spelling?).
    All this does it just bring more attention/abuse to the student from both peers and society at large. Plus this does the Gay community no service.

    The general public is predjudiced enough against Gays and lesbians. This whole cross-dressing/cross gender nonsense just fuels the fire. It makes it harder for the Gay community at large to advance in the political arena, and gain more positive social acceptance.
    And we, unfortunately, need as much of the str8 community's political backing as we can get. icon_rolleyes.gif

    Tristan



    It's not really "normal" to be gay by societies standards. I used to have your same type of thinking, but then I met some trans kids and adults and its pretty clear to me that they aren't just dressing as another gender because they want attention. They feel its the way they are supposed to be just as strongly as I feel that I'm supposed to be gay. To deny them is to deny us all imo.

    Yeah, we need the political backing of straight people to get our cause through but whats the point if the cost is going to be us conforming to their standards.
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    Feb 11, 2012 11:05 PM GMT
    musclefetish1 said
    adam228 said
    musclefetish1 saidI know this won't be popular, but I agree with the ban. Guys should be dressing like guys, and girls should be dressing like girls.
    Personally if these public schools would go to uniforms and have it stated that girls are expected to wear skirts, and guys pants PERIOD....we wouldn't have this issue.
    We wore uniforms from the day we entered school at age 5, until we graduated HS. It brought cohesion to the class, and pride of how one looks.
    (And NO, not religious schools)

    Tristan


    It's more than telling them they should wear uniforms. That would be fine if it was ALL the children but its only the people who are struggling with their gender. The school is telling them whats normal and implying that anything else is wrong.

    They should be teaching tolerance, not ignorance.


    This is where I have a problem with this. I don't think it is normal for boys to wear girl's clothing or visa-versa (spelling?).
    All this does it just bring more attention/abuse to the student from both peers and society at large. Plus this does the Gay community no service.

    The general public is predjudiced enough against Gays and lesbians. This whole cross-dressing/cross gender nonsense just fuels the fire. It makes it harder for the Gay community at large, to advance in political and social acceptance. And we, unfortunately, need as much of the str8 community's political backing as we can get.

    Tristan


    Tristan,

    Respectfully, I think you're confusing the cause and effect here. Anti-gay rhetoric and activity is based in enforcement of a gender binary; sexism is the root of homophobia. To be gay is seen by many as abnormal because it is a directing of the male sex drive toward males - the "wrong" gender of the two that are enforced. Think about the extreme case of a world that doesn't give a shit about gender - the concept of being "gay" becomes essentially meaningless. "Cross"-dressing students (see how easily we accept the concept that there are two genders and clothes that go with each in just that one prefix?) make people uncomfortable because they are fucking the gender paradigm, much the way that gayness fucks it. The fact that it brings attention and abuse to gender-variant kids is not the fault of those kids for existing as they are, but the culture for making such a BFD of what kind of clothing a human is wearing.

    I find your argument that gender-variant people fighting for their rights makes it harder for the gay community to advance to be very much like that of the "Uncle Toms" of the Black civil rights movement. Needing the straight community's support should not encourage us to throw our GLBT brethren under the bus just so we don't have to sit in the back of it, IMO.
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    Feb 11, 2012 11:07 PM GMT
    adam228 said
    musclefetish1 said


    This is where I have a problem with this. I don't think it is normal for boys to wear girl's clothing or visa-versa (spelling?).
    All this does it just bring more attention/abuse to the student from both peers and society at large. Plus this does the Gay community no service.

    The general public is predjudiced enough against Gays and lesbians. This whole cross-dressing/cross gender nonsense just fuels the fire. It makes it harder for the Gay community at large to advance in the political arena, and gain more positive social acceptance.
    And we, unfortunately, need as much of the str8 community's political backing as we can get. icon_rolleyes.gif

    Tristan



    It's not really "normal" to be gay by societies standards. I used to have your same type of thinking, but then I met some trans kids and adults and its pretty clear to me that they aren't just dressing as another gender because they want attention. They feel its the way they are supposed to be just as strongly as I feel that I'm supposed to be gay. To deny them is to deny us all imo.

    Yeah, we need the political backing of straight people to get our cause through but whats the point if the cost is going to be us conforming to their standards.


    "To deny them is to deny us all"
    I see your point. icon_wink.gif
    Thanks for the civility.
    Tristan