Why is no one speaking out about the rise in raw sex?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 19, 2012 1:47 PM GMT
    Why is safe(r) sex considered a taboo subject, and why do people bareback or have other unsafe sex with untrusted partners? I've been with guys who say they're neg (ALWAYS have the conversation before you get to business, folks) yet they are more than willing to swallow (at the very least.)

    If you have a trusted partner, this doesn't really apply since y'all know each other and each other's status/results. But, like... why don't more people speak up against random barebacking? HIV is a big thing in the Pacific Northwest, yet the gay community seems to be trying to keep the raw sex craze out of the spotlight instead of weeding it out.
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    Apr 19, 2012 1:53 PM GMT
    I dunno, I speak up for safe sex and against barebacking all the time. Including when I lived in Seattle. And so did my mentor, who still lives there, who used to be a contributor and editor of the SGN (Seattle Gay News).
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    Apr 19, 2012 1:57 PM GMT
    Ok, I'll bite.

    However, what I find stranger, is that people seem more concerned with HIV than the plethora of other STIs; just because someone is 'Clean and Neg' doesn't mean you should be gobbling up his load when he sprays it on your face. icon_rolleyes.gif

    Protect yourself, first and foremost.
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    Apr 19, 2012 1:59 PM GMT
    None of the guys I've been with wanted to swallow or have cum in their mouth at all, and neither do I. I always use condoms too when fucking. I would be REALLY angry if I was with a guy and somehow got an STD. Like probably kick the shit out of him. However some people aren't so concerned with STDs and HIV and don't use condoms and swallow cum, which I think is really dumb if you are sleeping with different guys.

    If you aren't in a monogamous relationship SAFE sex is crucial. It doesn't feel as good, no arguement there, but you could be sacrificing a minimal amount of pleasure and avoiding a monumental amount of pain. I might be biased though, I just like buying magnums hahaha
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    Apr 19, 2012 2:52 PM GMT
    I have known a couple of HIV+ guys in my life who have insisted that they could only have become infected through oral sex. One is a really good friend, the other became a well known poz political leader. I believe them. I take calculated risks in my own life, but I don't believe that oral sex is completely safe and conduct myself accordingly.
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    Apr 19, 2012 2:53 PM GMT
    AMoonHawk saidGo to your local HIV organization and get the facts. There have been absolutely no cases reported for swallowing. As a matter of fact it is suggested that if you are going to give head to the point of climax, that you do swallow all and quickly as your mouth can contain sores from brushing or eating etc. which can provide an open wound for HIV to enter, so never hold cum in your mouth. And of course safer sex would be to give head with a condom. You are absolutely correct that bare backing is a very high risk transmission sexual activity. HIV dies fairly quickly if exposed to air, but can be transported into the body where where is no air and any sort of open wound. This is why the anus is such a high risk sexual activity. the vascular system is fairly exposed in the anus and can be easily torn by irritation giving HIV an open path into the body.


    This.

    In fact it is actually considered "safer" to swallow or spit, but don't let it sit.

    Oh, and anyone thinking that their "monogamous" relationship will protect them...hmm, well I guess that is a risk you are willing to take.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 19, 2012 2:59 PM GMT
    once hooked up with a guy who wanted an oral condom..
    i was like, screw you im better off with a dong!
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    Apr 19, 2012 3:00 PM GMT
    I don't like giving blowies enough to risk the hiv.

    That said, I'll go raw with a boyfriend. You're never completely safe... but part of being in love with someone is trusting them with precious parts of you.
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    Apr 19, 2012 3:00 PM GMT
    Larkin saidI don't like giving blowies enough to risk the hiv.


    Wait...really?
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    Apr 19, 2012 3:02 PM GMT
    7Famark said
    Larkin saidI don't like giving blowies enough to risk the hiv.


    Wait...really?


    I don't fantasize about blowing guys... I mean, I'll suck a boyfriend's cock like I'm starving to death, but only because it's his, not because it's a cock.
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    Apr 19, 2012 3:03 PM GMT
    Larkin said
    7Famark said
    Larkin saidI don't like giving blowies enough to risk the hiv.


    Wait...really?


    I don't fantasize about blowing guys... I mean, I'll suck a boyfriend's cock like I'm starving to death, but only because it's his, not because it's a cock.


    Well, no...I don't really like giving them either, they don't call it a job for no reason...I'm just surprised that HIV is the reason...there have been very, very, very few documented cases of receptive oral transmission, and the ones that have been documented have been heavily "questioned"
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    Apr 19, 2012 3:16 PM GMT
    When the most vanilla porn site in town, Sean Cody, started doing bareback porn a few months ago, it sorta seemed like a turning point in the whole bareback controversy.

    Safe sex lost. icon_sad.gif
  • zackmorrisfan...

    Posts: 300

    Apr 19, 2012 3:21 PM GMT
    endo saidWhen the most vanilla porn site in town, Sean Cody, started doing bareback porn a few months ago, it sorta seemed like a turning point in the whole bareback controversy.

    Safe sex lost. icon_sad.gif


    It seems as though the condom is coming off in a lot of mainstream gay pornography. Perhaps this is helping to normalize unprotected sex or even glamorize it.
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    Apr 19, 2012 3:33 PM GMT
    Quoted this once in the HIV subthread, but here you go if you're curious. I do not know the validity of the rough estimates. I'm not sure if I truly believe the infection rates (I would think they would be higher). Anal receptive is the most dangerous.

    http://www.medhelp.org/posts/HIV-Prevention/window-period---is-this-legit/show/697396


    1) The likelihood of a sexual partner having HIV
    Heteroexual encounters this would range from
    1/100 to 5/100
    Homosexual encounters this would range from
    1/100 to 15/100
    Known HIV+ partners the variable is
    1/1

    2) The likelihood that a single unprotected act results in
    infection
    Vaginal (Male)
    1/2000
    Vaginal (Female)
    1/1000
    Anal (receptive M/F)
    1/200
    Anal (Top M/F)
    1/1500
    Male Oral Sex (Giving)
    1/10000
    Everything Else
    0

    3) The chance an HIV antibody test fails to pick up an
    infection at a given post-exposure time point
    3 Week -ve
    1/2
    6 Week -ve
    1/20
    12 Week -ve
    1/200
    24 Week -ve
    1/1000

    Calculate your risk; take each of these factors and multiply them together;

    A male having unprotected, vaginal sex, once, with a female from a low risk group with a 6 week -ve test has the following risk profile;

    HIV+ partner Vaginal Sex 6 Week -ve
    1/100 * 1/2000 * 1/20 = 1/4,000,000 "

    A male having unprotected, receptive anal sex, 5 times with a male, who is known to be HIV +ve, and a 6 week -ve test, has the following risk profile;

    HIV+ partner Anal Sex 6 Week -ve
    1/1 * 5/200 * 1/20 = 1/800

    i.e. a one in 800 chance of still being infected (quite high) a further 12 week test would change this to being 1 in 8,000 and a six month test to 1 in 40,000.

    There is a big difference in having a 1 in 4 million risk profile compared to a 1 in 800 risk profile. This is why there are "REAL" risks as opposed to "real" risks and, also why, doctors may advise some people to test out to 3 or 6 months.

    You must decide for yourself where the certainty cut off is for you and what your Window period will be.
  • BlackBeltGuy

    Posts: 2609

    Apr 19, 2012 3:42 PM GMT
    endo saidWhen the most vanilla porn site in town, Sean Cody, started doing bareback porn a few months ago, it sorta seemed like a turning point in the whole bareback controversy.

    Safe sex lost. icon_sad.gif


    They left LA a few months ago, there is a new law with bare backing and the porno industry and it is not allowed to be shot in the porn industry in LA county.

    They (sean cody and some others) packed up and moved to Las Vegas.
    they can shoot BB porn there

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 19, 2012 3:47 PM GMT
    Blackbeltguy said
    endo saidWhen the most vanilla porn site in town, Sean Cody, started doing bareback porn a few months ago, it sorta seemed like a turning point in the whole bareback controversy.

    Safe sex lost. icon_sad.gif


    They left LA a few months ago, there is a new law with bare backing and the porno industry and it is not allowed to be shot in the porn industry in LA county.

    They (sean cody and some others) packed up and moved to Las Vegas.
    they can shoot BB porn there



    I'm pretty sure Sean Cody is in San Diego. Many of their videos feature footage shot in Balboa Park.

    When I said "in town" though, I didn't mean literally in any specific town.
  • BlackRussian1...

    Posts: 323

    Apr 19, 2012 4:15 PM GMT
    BB seems to be an unfortunate blow-back from decades of safe sex talk and emphasis on condom usage (i.e. condom fatigue). Though it's beyond the scope of what the OP is asking about, the "safer sex" talk has never really been honest about the (shall we call it) death urge or general recklessness that gives fucking its zing (there's a reason Eros and Thanatos are together), preferring to pretend that the "darker" part of fucking doesn't exist. This is disingenuous. I personally find it troubling that "raw" is so casual now and ubiquitous but I can see why.
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    Apr 19, 2012 4:18 PM GMT
    I enjoy bareback only with a bf that I enjoy. But I don't see how anyone can bareback with a stranger. What if they have STDs or worse?
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    Apr 19, 2012 4:31 PM GMT
    Gym_bull saidI enjoy bareback only with a bf that I enjoy. But I don't see how anyone can bareback with a stranger. What if they have STDs or worse?


    what if you're BF is cheating on u and gets an STD?
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    Apr 19, 2012 4:35 PM GMT
    Gym_bull saidI enjoy bareback only with a bf that I enjoy. But I don't see how anyone can bareback with a stranger. What if they have STDs or worse?


    Yeah, what if they're *shudder* poor.
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    Apr 19, 2012 4:39 PM GMT
    dudewithabeard saidOk to have unprotected sex with a "Trusted partner" now that that's funny and incredibly sad at the same time.


    Basically, assume that every guy you meet is positive and undiagnosed. Guys who tell you they are positive are typically safer than the rest as you can then assume that they have the virus under control.

  • metta

    Posts: 39078

    Apr 19, 2012 4:40 PM GMT
    In regards to those stats above.....they are going to vary a lot depending where you live. If you live in a major metropolitan area, such as DC, NYC, LA, Chicago,San Francisco, etc., the stats get much higher.
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    Apr 19, 2012 4:42 PM GMT
    klassik said
    Gym_bull saidI enjoy bareback only with a bf that I enjoy. But I don't see how anyone can bareback with a stranger. What if they have STDs or worse?


    what if you're BF is cheating on u and gets an STD?


    What if your boyfriend murders you?
  • Import

    Posts: 7188

    Apr 19, 2012 4:43 PM GMT
    the war on safe sex has begun!!!!

    fuck condoms. they're evil and for sinners!
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    Apr 19, 2012 4:43 PM GMT
    Larkin said
    klassik said
    Gym_bull saidI enjoy bareback only with a bf that I enjoy. But I don't see how anyone can bareback with a stranger. What if they have STDs or worse?


    what if you're BF is cheating on u and gets an STD?


    What if your boyfriend murders you?


    Then you donĀ“t have to live with the effects very long.