I feel like a bloody freak

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 08, 2012 1:51 PM GMT
    Hi guys

    It's been about two years since I came out as gay and as a response , I still feel like a bit of a freak or a misfit even as a gay guy.

    I'm a reasonably handsome guy I think, have not too much trouble meeting guys in general and stuff but a fall out of an evangelical environment and the anxiety and repression of that time is that I feel like a backslider, a perverted heathen who " fulfills the lusts of the flesh ".

    Add to that readjustment the fact that I'm not only still grieving the head fuck of my church background but still in a bad place regarding my mums death.

    I just feel like in some way I'm a terrible person and even rebuilding friendships as a gay man has been very very tough .

    I need serious advice because I need to be able to work through this issue.

    I know there's no quick fix but all the discrimination gay guys get from church and life in general can be so wounding and even in the gay scene I feel like a bit of a misfit because of the ex gay shit I had to deal with . I battle with such loneliness and find a lot of gay men don't want to be friends unless thru can fuck you etc. I've gone down the hook up route and it just makes you feel more worthless and cheap .
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    May 08, 2012 3:19 PM GMT
    Have you ever consider the possibility that church and religion are one big bullshit story?

    Most kids get religion drilled into their heads long before their reasoning and critical thinking skills are developed. It's done this way to keep the pews filed long after the person has gained the mental facilities to defeat religion. Religions have had hundreds, thousands of years to perfect their indoctrination methods. Your mother was just as much a victim as you are. It's too late for her, but not for you.

    Right now, you're trying to make sense of yourself in relation to spiritual and cultural matters. The problem is, the church doesn't care about your happiness or peace of mind, or even what is true. They may claim this...but trying to apply logic and reason to anything while keeping up religious premises...is a fruitless task. You could spend years and lots of money in this quest, but end up an unhappy old man. There is nothing wrong with being gay...that's a big lie religion has sold for years. So, my advice is to make the dramatic break and walk away from religion.

    Explore one of these books. I've read Sam Harris and George Smith. Also not on the list is Ayn Rand's "The Virtue of Shelfishnss."

    http://www.booktalk.org/atheism-books.html
  • DesireIron

    Posts: 426

    May 08, 2012 4:54 PM GMT
    Fun way to get over religion:
    http://religiousragings.tumblr.com/archive
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    May 08, 2012 5:07 PM GMT
    White4DarkerFL saidHave you ever consider the possibility that church and religion are one big bullshit story?

    Most kids get religion drilled into their heads long before their reasoning and critical thinking skills are developed. It's done this way to keep the pews filed long after the person has gained the mental facilities to defeat religion. Religions have had hundreds, thousands of years to perfect their indoctrination methods. Your mother was just as much a victim as you are. It's too late for her, but not for you.

    Right now, you're trying to make sense of yourself in relation to spiritual and cultural matters. The problem is, the church doesn't care about your happiness or peace of mind, or even what is true. They may claim this...but trying to apply logic and reason to anything while keeping up religious premises...is a fruitless task. You could spend years and lots of money in this quest, but end up an unhappy old man. There is nothing wrong with being gay...that's a big lie religion has sold for years. So, my advice is to make the dramatic break and walk away from religion.

    Explore one of these books. I've read Sam Harris and George Smith. Also not on the list is Ayn Rand's "The Virtue of Shelfishnss."

    http://www.booktalk.org/atheism-books.html
    This*^&
    You should make an effort surround yourself with peers who have gone through what you have, and are happier and better for it. It will be no short order but anything of value in this life takes work. Don't put yourself cause others do. Love yourself. You too deserve happiness, are beautiful and have a place in this world! Hope you find those misplaced seeds of happiness! HUGS*** :')
  • DesireIron

    Posts: 426

    May 08, 2012 5:20 PM GMT
    " a perverted heathen who " fulfills the lusts of the flesh "."

    I'd like to fulfill my lusts of the flesh with you. icon_wink.gif
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    May 08, 2012 5:25 PM GMT
    [quote][cite]DesireIron said[/cite]" a perverted heathen who " fulfills the lusts of the flesh "."

    I'd like to fulfill my lusts of the flesh with you. icon_wink.gif[/quote

    I'm a practicing homosexual, as I was raised to call them (and shun them). I laugh about it now...but it still hurts deep inside after years of being in religion.
  • neosyllogy

    Posts: 1714

    May 08, 2012 5:35 PM GMT
    DesireIron saidFun way to get over religion:
    http://religiousragings.tumblr.com/archive


    Pretty much everything I read when I went looking through the stuff on that site right now was bs. I'm not religious, but I appreciate an intelligent comment on the issue, not just a comment that's not religious. That dude is dumb as shit.
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    May 08, 2012 5:45 PM GMT
    Sorry to hear you are having such a rough time. You are going through two colossal life changes, either one of which on their own could be overwhelming to deal with.

    Perhaps a little time with a counselor or support group where you can share your thoughts and feelings in an open, non-judgmental environment could help.

    Another suggestion might be to attend a welcoming congregation and experience God in a new light. This may not be your final destination belief-wise, but it might be a good bridge for you while you sort things out.

    That's really all I have to share and I hope it's helpful. Good luck.
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    May 08, 2012 5:56 PM GMT
    The bottom line is that you need to snap out of it. You see yourself as a freak, so you're going to feel like a freak. That's your reality. Not trying to be harsh by saying it, but it's true. You are who you truly believe you are. The only way to change it is to envision who you want to be, believe it and be feel joy about it. Then what you convey outwardly will change what you attract.

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    May 08, 2012 6:17 PM GMT
    There's no quick fix. I came from an evangelical background, so I completely know what you're going through there. I still have some struggles in that area myself. If you need to chat, please feel free to message me.
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    May 08, 2012 7:44 PM GMT
    You have many friends in the community who would gladly give you a shoulder to lean or cry on.Our deepest sympathy on the loss of your mother.That is very difficult at any age.Coming out is different for everyone.I have been doing it slowly over 10 year and aam now in a committed relationship with the man of my dreams.My mom and friends know now.You reach an age when you have to tell people this is me and if you dont like it go scratch your ass.I am at that time in my life.Feel free to say hi!Ryan and Ruben
  • NOVRDRV

    Posts: 14

    May 08, 2012 7:59 PM GMT
    I've been through this... And I struggled with it for many years. At the end, I let my reasoning mind take over. Religion is bullshit. Fundie christianity is double bullshit.

    What helped me was just to remind myself of the things that I knew disproved my former religion, that just didn't make sense. Noah's ark? Impossible to get two of every kind of animal we know about in that little boat(the Bible give the precise dimensions)--and there wouldn't be enough genetic variation to continue the species onboard.

    Evolution? Never learned about it in fundie christian school, but studying it helped me understand a new worldview.

    Adam and eve? See note on genetic variation above.

    These are just a few examples, but start looking for them. They'll make you feel better.

    This is going to haunt you for years, but, just know, you aren't alone. A lot of us have gone through exactly what you are going through right now. It's like dying inside while all those years of programming unravel. But you will get through it. And you'll be better for it.

    If possible, get the hell out of wherever you are, and start again somewhere new. Leave the old identitiy behind, and take joy in the fact that you can now live your life without religious deception. And pray, if it suits you. God still listens, and he's bigger than the God they claim to worship.

    Best
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    May 08, 2012 8:04 PM GMT
    yourname8000 saidSorry to post this again so quickly, guys, but if it was missed previously, perhaps it will provide some perspective. You're a good guy, blactor....glad to see you posting again.

    tumblr_m3kcy6xxti1qh9iuvo1_1280.jpg


    Totally appropriate for the topic at hand!
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    May 11, 2012 5:49 AM GMT
    blactor saidHi guys

    It's been about two years since I came out as gay and as a response , I still feel like a bit of a freak or a misfit even as a gay guy.
    More proof that gays are no different from straights. icon_biggrin.gif
  • Tritimium

    Posts: 261

    May 11, 2012 5:56 AM GMT
    Sorry to hear about all the trouble you're going through.

    I would recommend doing some reading on "limiting beliefs"; "low self-esteem" and, importantly, "toxic shame" and see if any of that strikes a chord.

    First - try to separate your mum's death from your church background issues, since grieving over a death can naturally take a long time and is nothing to feel bad about.

    As for the church background, you need to try to examine each of the beliefs it has instilled in you, separate the helpful ones and the not-so-helpful ones, and neutralise the latter so that they no longer influence you.

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    May 11, 2012 5:58 AM GMT


    You and several million others......icon_idea.gif

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    May 11, 2012 6:13 AM GMT
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    May 13, 2012 2:17 PM GMT
    NOVRDRV saidI've been through this... And I struggled with it for many years. At the end, I let my reasoning mind take over. Religion is bullshit. Fundie christianity is double bullshit.

    What helped me was just to remind myself of the things that I knew disproved my former religion, that just didn't make sense. Noah's ark? Impossible to get two of every kind of animal we know about in that little boat(the Bible give the precise dimensions)--and there wouldn't be enough genetic variation to continue the species onboard.

    Evolution? Never learned about it in fundie christian school, but studying it helped me understand a new worldview.

    Adam and eve? See note on genetic variation above.

    These are just a few examples, but start looking for them. They'll make you feel better.

    This is going to haunt you for years, but, just know, you aren't alone. A lot of us have gone through exactly what you are going through right now. It's like dying inside while all those years of programming unravel. But you will get through it. And you'll be better for it.

    If possible, get the hell out of wherever you are, and start again somewhere new. Leave the old identitiy behind, and take joy in the fact that you can now live your life without religious deception. And pray, if it suits you. God still listens, and he's bigger than the God they claim to worship.

    Best
    This is a wonderful post! Please take his advice!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 13, 2012 3:26 PM GMT
    DISCLAIMER: THIS RESPONSE TO BLACTOR IS PERSONAL, YET I AM SHARING TO BENEFIT OTHERS WHO MAY BE FEELING CONFLICTED. THE OPINIONS AND EXPERIENCES I SHARE ARE MY OWN, AND WITH THE INTENT OF HELPING ANOTHER HUMAN BEING FIND HIS HAPPINESS. IF YOU ARE OFFENDED BY MONOTHEISTIC SPIRITUALITY, DO YOURSELF A FAVOR AND READ NO FURTHER.











    My comments to blactor in Lavendar

    blactor saidHi guys

    Hi blactor!

    It's been about two years since I came out as gay and as a response , I still feel like a bit of a freak or a misfit even as a gay guy.

    I've been gay now for 32 years, and at first for me it was very freeing yet at the same time I knew that I was not a welcome minority in South Florida. Not only did I look different, but now I was sexually different. It took a few years for me to feel comfortable and proud "in my own skin". Going to a therapist helped. Volunteering in the LGBT community helped. Going to a Metropolitan Community Church helped. I knew I was one of God's children even after the Catholic Church told me I was going to hell. I just didn't buy the lie. By doing all of the above, I found self-acceptance, acceptance from others, and community.

    I'm a reasonably handsome guy I think, have not too much trouble meeting guys in general and stuff but a fall out of an evangelical environment and the anxiety and repression of that time is that I feel like a backslider, a perverted heathen who " fulfills the lusts of the flesh ".

    Yes, you are very handsome. I'd do you! ;-) Seriously, though, I also know how you feel. There have been times when I have just thrown myself into sexual abandon and felt like a dirty piece of meat afterwards. Sometimes that feeling felt like I had "sold myself short" and was a let down for the God whom I love. Sometimes I really enjoyed feeling like a dirty piece of meat. It may seem odd, but once you really love yourself and have a strong, personal relationship with the Higher Power of your choice, you can be a "freak" on occasion and it's ok. God will still love you even if you think that what you've chosen to do would not be what God would "prefer". Don't forget, God gave us "free will" to enjoy our human experience. God also gave us our free will to love God, if we choose. That's what makes the gift of free will so beautiful. In my view, God feels loved when we choose to love God because that choice is not forced.

    Add to that readjustment the fact that I'm not only still grieving the head fuck of my church background but still in a bad place regarding my mums death.

    I'm sorry to hear of your loss. Here's a story from Dan Savage's life about the passing of his mother and his experience with the church. It might help you to reconcile what you may be feeling. http://youtu.be/ADDo5PT_ToI

    I just feel like in some way I'm a terrible person and even rebuilding friendships as a gay man has been very very tough .

    I need serious advice because I need to be able to work through this issue.

    Your desire to work this issue through is "hope". Seek and you shall find. I did, and I did. Today, despite what life sends my way I can be happy in the moment, just for today.

    I know there's no quick fix but all the discrimination gay guys get from church and life in general can be so wounding and even in the gay scene I feel like a bit of a misfit because of the ex gay shit I had to deal with . I battle with such loneliness and find a lot of gay men don't want to be friends unless thru can fuck you etc. I've gone down the hook up route and it just makes you feel more worthless and cheap .

    Consider going to a Metropolitan Community Church (MCC) in your area. Try visiting a few different ones if there is more than one in driving distance. Each church community has a different character. Find one which "feels good".

    Being gay does not have to be lonely. Abstracting this challenge up one level, being human doesn't have to be lonely. From my own experience, I've found LGBT community and friendship by going to Meetups, taking part in team sporting teams, game nights, MCC churches, and by volunteering through LGBT organizations. Bars are also a place to meet people, but just remember that people there are drinking and my be on other substances. Bars may not be the best example of "healthy" gay community. Bars are entertainment and can be quite a "circus".




    Here's another video of Terry and Dan Savage. It's an "It Gets Better" video targeted to a 13-14 year old who is just coming out. But their message is valuable to any man or woman who is coming out and feels the burden of finding themselves in a very changed life. http://youtu.be/7IcVyvg2Qlo

    blactor, I don't know what experiences you've had in your life, if you're a minority who has experienced discrimination or prejudice for some other dimension of your life, but now you're a minority. Albeit from the look of your picture, you're dimension of diversity which makes you a minority is "invisible". When you're an "invisible" minority, people may say things which hurt because they don't realize that you're the butt of their bigotry. Those can be some of the toughest moments to live through. Depending upon the situation, you can either choose to remain silent, walk away, or stand your ground and call out the bullshit. I too have lived through these moments. They are moments when, despite the pain, you can show character.

    I pray that you find comfort "in your own skin" the way I have. I feel confident, proud, and a useful and loved servant of my Higher Power whom I choose to call God. I hope that you can find this same place in your life.

    Aloha and Be Well!

    Alan
  • CuriousJockAZ

    Posts: 19129

    May 14, 2012 4:17 PM GMT
    From the thread title, I thought this was another thread about MuscleFetishes nose bleeds icon_eek.gif

    http://www.realjock.com/gayforums/2365901
  • metta

    Posts: 39108

    May 14, 2012 4:58 PM GMT
    Coming Out of Shame : Transforming Gay and Lesbian Lives

    http://www.amazon.com/Coming-Out-Shame-Transforming-Lesbian/dp/0385477961/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1337014648&sr=8-1
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    May 14, 2012 5:09 PM GMT
    Blactor, you're a lovely guy and we've had some nice conversations in the past.

    I know that your crazy church and the ex-gay movement really screwed you over, but this post doesn't sound like you've moved on that much from where you were over a year ago.

    You need to learn to love yourself. There is no outward reason why you shouldn't be able to - you're attractive, talented, intelligent and personable. You are most certainly NOT a terrible person or a bloody freak.

    I believe strongly that you will feel like less of a misfit when you learn to appreciate yourself more - and once you begin to lose the air of shame and low self esteem, you will be more attractive to the kind of guys who you want.

    We can be supportive here, but you probably need more help than can reasonably be given on an internet forum, so please find a good support group and/or counselor.

    In the meantime, if hooking up leaves you feeling bad, then don't hook up! And if you give in and decide to do it occasionally, don't feel bad about yourself. We all have needs, it's not like you've failed some crucial test.

    Hugs.
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    May 17, 2012 12:46 PM GMT
    Guys,

    Sorry for being so slow to reply.

    Thank you ALL for the replies.

    In general, I think the loss of my mum has messed me up more but I'm in the process right now of attending a support group based on The Velvet Rage and also The Hoffman process.

    I think it's the shame heaped on by the ex gay movement which is the biggest hurdle.

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    May 17, 2012 12:56 PM GMT
    blactor saidGuys,

    Sorry for being so slow to reply.

    Thank you ALL for the replies.

    In general, I think the loss of my mum has messed me up more but I'm in the process right now of attending a support group based on The Velvet Rage and also The Hoffman process.

    I think it's the shame heaped on by the ex gay movement which is the biggest hurdle.

    My dear blactor: your use of the word "shame" is the perfect reason why we have Gay PRIDES, the existence of which many gays themselves question. It's because too many gays still have shame about who they are, when in fact they should have pride in themselves.

    I lived most of my life straight, out of ignorant denial and compliance with social norms. I did some things back then then which I suppose should make me proud, mostly in the US military.

    But instead, I'm most proud about being gay and out today. For one thing it makes me special, unique, not ordinary. Second, it tells me I still have my military courage, though now applied in a different civilian way, to be out, defiant & proud.

    Being gay is the greatest gift I ever had. It may be your greatest gift, too, once you learn how to accept it, and use it. But if you're gay you're gay, that's a given. Whether that makes you a victim or a victor in life is up to you. icon_biggrin.gif
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    May 17, 2012 6:14 PM GMT
    JPtheBITCH said
    bluey2223 saidI'm a practicing homosexual

    For God's sake, man, ain't you through practicing yet? How long does it take to get it right?
    The same amount of time that it takes a "practicing" doctor to get it right.