Germans Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform. Not even conservatives question the system, which businesspeople say gives Europe's largest economy a competitive advantage.

  • metta

    Posts: 39130

    May 14, 2012 4:07 PM GMT


    Germans Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform

    http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/german-attitude-toward-barack-obama-s-healthcare-reform-a-832002.html
  • nanidesukedo

    Posts: 1036

    May 14, 2012 4:18 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    metta8 said

    Germans Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform


    Because Germans don't understand the U.S. Constitution. In it, there is nothing that empowers the Federal government to force citizens to purchase a good or service from a private entity.

    So it is quite reasonable why "Germans Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform" - and also quite reasonable why most of the membership on RJ "Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform" either.


    Because strict adherence to the constitution since the day it was written with no amendments or changes is absolutely the best policy! hell yea!
  • nanidesukedo

    Posts: 1036

    May 14, 2012 4:29 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    nanidesukedo said
    southbeach1500 said
    metta8 said

    Germans Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform


    Because Germans don't understand the U.S. Constitution. In it, there is nothing that empowers the Federal government to force citizens to purchase a good or service from a private entity.

    So it is quite reasonable why "Germans Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform" - and also quite reasonable why most of the membership on RJ "Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform" either.


    Because strict adherence to the constitution since the day it was written with no amendments or changes is absolutely the best policy! hell yea!


    Thanks for proving my point that most of the RJ membership doesn't understand the U.S. Constitution. To embrace the Constitution is to also embrace the mechanism for adding Amendments to the Constitution.

    But in typical scatterbrained liberal "thinking" you've somehow got your "reasoning" on that all muddled.


    I see you're angry and resorting to ad hominem attacks. So that's how it feels to be on the losing side of history, constantly?
  • nanidesukedo

    Posts: 1036

    May 14, 2012 4:42 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    nanidesukedo said
    southbeach1500 said
    nanidesukedo said
    southbeach1500 said
    metta8 said

    Germans Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform


    Because Germans don't understand the U.S. Constitution. In it, there is nothing that empowers the Federal government to force citizens to purchase a good or service from a private entity.

    So it is quite reasonable why "Germans Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform" - and also quite reasonable why most of the membership on RJ "Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform" either.


    Because strict adherence to the constitution since the day it was written with no amendments or changes is absolutely the best policy! hell yea!


    Thanks for proving my point that most of the RJ membership doesn't understand the U.S. Constitution. To embrace the Constitution is to also embrace the mechanism for adding Amendments to the Constitution.

    But in typical scatterbrained liberal "thinking" you've somehow got your "reasoning" on that all muddled.


    I see you're angry and resorting to ad hominem attacks. So that's how it feels to be on the losing side of history, constantly?


    It's a completely factual assessment.


    Here's another one: By your reasoning, if slavery were written into the constitution today, as long as it went through the right process, it would be perfectly fine. No bitching or moaning allowed. You have no moral guidance of right or wrong - just strict interpretation of a written document.
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    May 14, 2012 4:45 PM GMT
    There are many differences between the US and Germany leading to difficulties in understanding aspects of our societies. For example, Germans have their Ladenschlussgesetz, or store closing laws, which regulate the business hours of most stores. In the past the hours applied to the entire country. Now each state can set the hours. Makes perfect sense to most Germans, makes no sense to most Americans.
  • tazzari

    Posts: 2937

    May 14, 2012 4:47 PM GMT
    Germans Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform


    Neither can I.
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    May 14, 2012 5:01 PM GMT
    JPtheBITCH said
    southbeach1500 said
    metta8 said

    Germans Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform


    Because Germans don't understand the U.S. Constitution. In it, there is nothing that empowers the Federal government to force citizens to purchase a good or service from a private entity.

    So it is quite reasonable why "Germans Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform" - and also quite reasonable why most of the membership on RJ "Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform" either.

    Oh you mean the healthcare system proposed and promoted for years by the Heritage Foundation, the most conservative think tank in Washington.

    I guarantee that if it had been proposed by a Republican, mandates and all, it would have been received as brilliant, far-seeing, and Just What America Needs.


    This!
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    May 14, 2012 5:21 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    tazzari saidGermans Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform


    Neither can I.



    Well, you can remedy that situation by studying the U.S. Constitution.


    SB - You know less about the Constitution than your average German.
  • nanidesukedo

    Posts: 1036

    May 14, 2012 5:30 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 said
    Christian73 said
    southbeach1500 said
    tazzari saidGermans Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform


    Neither can I.



    Well, you can remedy that situation by studying the U.S. Constitution.


    SB - You know less about the Constitution than your average German.


    What a childish comment.


    It's a completely factual assessment (Christian's comment).
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    May 14, 2012 7:50 PM GMT
    nanidesukedo said
    southbeach1500 said
    Christian73 said
    southbeach1500 said
    tazzari saidGermans Can't Fathom US Aversion to Obama's Healthcare Reform


    Neither can I.



    Well, you can remedy that situation by studying the U.S. Constitution.


    SB - You know less about the Constitution than your average German.


    What a childish comment.


    It's a completely factual assessment (Christian's comment).
    You bet your ass it is!
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    May 14, 2012 10:30 PM GMT
    That's Germany for you. Since Bismarck the conservatives there have essentially adopted the socialist agenda on all major social issues. Nazism was just a logical consequence of this trend...
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    May 14, 2012 11:03 PM GMT
    Radamisto saidThat's Germany for you. Since Bismarck the conservatives there have essentially adopted the socialist agenda on all major social issues. Nazism was just a logical consequence of this trend...


    German culture in this respect is markedly different from our own.

    As Radamisto mentioned Bismarck, he was one of the founding fathers of the concept of the "welfare state", and despite his otherwise extremely conservative outlook on things (in the sense that he thought first and foremost of in terms of his status as a Junker and secondly in the sense as a citizen of the German Empire)... he saw social welfare reforms as a means to maintain control over the masses, and used his social constructions as a counterweight against the growing threat of Socialism, Marxism, and Anarchism.

    Threats, which in the view of his time, were very real as the SDP (Social Democratic Party) and the forerunners of the KPD (German Communist Party) asserted that they would bring about the end of the three-tier class voting system (Dreiklassenwahlrecht) in Germany (roughly: peasants, workers, and landed gentry+business magnates) as well as bring about social justice and to some greater degree, wealth redistribution for all Germans.

    Bismarck's plan worked to offset some of the appeal of the Socialists to the working and peasant classes by providing them with welfare, a pension system, and some other state programmes that would solidify the power of the Prussian-led federated German Empire until its collapse in 1918 and subsequent surrender to the Allies in 1918.

    While the Weimar Republic that followed was far more liberalized, it too, tended to lean toward a more authoritarian model - the Junker nobles still maintained a LOT of power, along with their hands being married to, and tightly interwoven with the capitalists of that era (Krupp, Germaniawerft, ABB, Daimler-Benz, und so weiter...)

    The German national character is largely informed by the influence of a strong and nearly omnipresent central state, and German culture is by its nature very receptive to a more authoritarian lean than Americans have been willing to accept over themselves until very recently.
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    May 15, 2012 5:04 AM GMT
    JPtheBITCH said
    Radamisto saidThat's Germany for you. Since Bismarck the conservatives there have essentially adopted the socialist agenda on all major social issues. Nazism was just a logical consequence of this trend...

    Nazism had nothing to do with socialism. Nazism is fascism, which apparently you approve of.


    Nazism = national socialism. A merger of the socialist and nationalist ideologies. As for me, I'm an anarcho-capitalist.
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    May 15, 2012 3:04 PM GMT
    JPtheBITCH said
    Radamisto said
    JPtheBITCH said
    Radamisto saidThat's Germany for you. Since Bismarck the conservatives there have essentially adopted the socialist agenda on all major social issues. Nazism was just a logical consequence of this trend...

    Nazism had nothing to do with socialism. Nazism is fascism, which apparently you approve of.


    Nazism = national socialism. A merger of the socialist and nationalist ideologies. As for me, I'm an anarcho-capitalist.

    Sigh. I know it's a right-wing fantasy.
    But here's the historical truth: Hitler didn't invent the label "national socialist'. He and his followers staged a coup inside a previously-existing National Sociialist party, with the intent of using it as a vehicle to obtain power. Obviously, they were successful. But after Hitler took over the party, nothing of its socialist character remained. Nazism was classically totalitarian, corporatist and anti-labor, almost exactly the same recipe as Mussolini's party,except with the addition of race hatred.

    I know why the right tries to deny it; it's a terrible legacy. But it's yours, so fucking own it.


    He can't because his ass would have been in the camps. icon_rolleyes.gif