• Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 27, 2012 10:39 PM GMT
    If you make a move on your straight friend, it could lead to a very very bad outcome, such as assault, battery or even in some cases manslaughter.This you already know this. What is interesting is in the legal courts, the defendant can use the defense of "gay panic defense" argument which states this:
    "A defendant using the gay panic defense claims that he or she acted in a state of violent temporary insanity because of a little-known psychiatric condition called homosexual panic. Trans panic is a similar defense applied towards cases where the victim is a transgender or intersex person. In the gay panic defense, the defendant claims that they have been the object of homosexual romantic or sexual advances. The defendant finds the advances so offensive and frightening that it brings on a psychotic state characterized by unusual violence."
    With that defense, even in 2010, the defendant can lessen the jail sentence, reducing the degree of murder to second degree manslaughter. As ridiculous as it sounds, if the defendant can prove that you somehow harbor sexual attraction towards the defendant such as making sexual advances on him/her, the defendant has a legal argument.

    Read here the case of Edward Aruajo, who was killed by four men based on sexual and gender orientation. All the men were not committed of murder but of a lesser degree second degree manslaughter.


    Murder of Gwen Araujo

    Gwen Araujo (February 24, 1985 – October 3, 2002), born Edward Araujo, Jr., was an American teenage pre-operative transgender woman who was murdered in Newark, California. She was killed by four men, two of whom she had been sexually intimate with, who beat and strangled her after discovering she was transgender. Two of the defendants were convicted of second-degree murder, but not convicted on the requested hate crime enhancements. The other two defendants pleaded guilty or no contest to voluntary manslaughter. In at least one of the trials, a trans panic defense–an extension of the gay panic defense–was employed.
    The crime received widespread national and international attention and prompted some authors to write about the bearing of homophobia and transphobia on Araujo's murder, along with questioning whether transgender people were being represented fairly and accurately in both mass media and the criminal justice system. Reaction to the case was an impetus for law reform movements in several states. The events, including both criminal trials, have been portrayed in a television movie, A Girl Like Me: The Gwen Araujo Story. The murder was regularly compared to the Matthew Shepard and Brandon Teena case and was a rallying cause for the transgender and ultimately the larger LGBT communities.

    Witness account of the circumstances of her death

    Araujo, who was going by the name of Gwen Amber Rose Araujo at the time, met Michael Magidson, Jose Merél, Jaron Nabors, and Jason Cazares in the summer of 2002. She was reported to have engaged in oral sex with Magidson and anal sex with Merél. She claimed to be menstruating and during sex would push her partners' hands away from her private area to prevent them from discovering that she had male sex organs. On October 3, 2002, she attended a party at a house rented by Merél and his brother, Paul Merél. Also in attendance at the party were Magidson, Jose Merél, Nabors, Cazares, Paul Merél, Paul Merél's girlfriend Nicole Brown, and Emmanual Merél.
    At the party on October 3, 2002 she was discovered, by forced inspection (conducted by Brown), to have male sex organs, following which the men with whom she had sexual relations with became violent. Magidson put Araujo in a chokehold. Later, he punched Araujo in the face and began to choke her, but was pulled off by others. At some point after that, Paul Merél, Emmanuel Merél, and Brown left the house. Jose Merél struck Araujo in the head with a can of food and a frying pan. Nabors and Cazares left in Magidson's truck to go to Cazares's house to get shovels and a pickaxe.
    When Nabors and Cazares returned, Araujo was still conscious and sitting on the couch. At some point, the assault resumed. Magidson kneed Araujo in the head against the living room wall, rendering her unconscious. Cazares kicked Araujo. After this, Araujo was taken to the garage of the home. Nabors testified that Magidson strangled her with a rope and that Cazares struck her with a shovel, but Magidson testified that it was Nabors who strangled Araujo and struck her with the shovel, and Cazares testified that he never struck her and did not see Araujo die. Most accounts have Merél cleaning blood out of the carpet at the time that she was strangled.[citation needed] Araujo was then hog-tied, wrapped in a blanket, and placed in the bed of a pick-up truck. They then drove Araujo's body four hours away and buried her near the Sierra Nevada mountains. Araujo's disappearance and murder went unreported for days. It is not clear at what point during this sequence of events Araujo's death occurred. However, the autopsy showed that she died from strangulation associated with blunt force trauma to the head.

    The partygoers did not report the crime and the assailants said nothing to anyone about the murder. Two days after Araujo's death, a friend of Jaron Nabors described him as appearing distraught. Nabors, one of the four attackers, led authorities to the grave site in "exchange for his guilty plea to voluntary manslaughter and a promise to testify at the trial."
    Alameda County Sheriff's Office dispatched four crime scene investigators and two detectives to recover the body from the grave site. The four accused of the murder were: Michael Magidson, 22; Jaron Nabors, 19; José Merél, 22; and Paul Merél, Jose's older brother. Paul Merél was quickly released because his girlfriend came forward to the police telling them that Paul had left that night with her. Paul Merél and his girlfriend were never charged and became witnesses for the prosecution. Jason Cazares was arrested over a month after the other defendants, and only after Nabors implicated Cazares in a letter to Nabors' girlfriend, explaining how he (Nabors) wasn't involved in the killing.[citation needed] Nabors later testified against the other three in a deal with the DA for a lesser charge of manslaughter and an 11-year prison sentence after police monitored a telephone conversation between Nabors and his girlfriend, Delores Ojeda.



  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 27, 2012 10:41 PM GMT
    And if that isn't a practical enough reason, consider also that straight guys aren't worth the effort in the first place. #TeamGay
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 27, 2012 10:50 PM GMT
    Even thought Edward case is a transgender case, the argument is still valid for gay men who make sexual advances on their "straight" friends.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 28, 2012 3:46 AM GMT
    Really complicated. In this case, its unusual, but in most same sex bromances, friends who care about their circle and their friends are unlikely do do anything worse than avoid that friend or reserve judgement to a curiosity at first, or a flattery, or a running joke for a bit. It is all how you approah and communicate what it means, that will determine the immediate outcome but not the later one. Most objects probably wouldn't care in a social netwrok of friends who are tight,because others opinions matter too. If you make a move on someone alone in a car you probably will get met with some resistance or even force but likely the guy probably won't care, might be even flattered, or for a while uncomfortable, depending if he is a member of the social circle, If he is not, he might just decide to take a different way to class or work and avoid it.

    Courage AND social tact especially amongst peers are what is changing our society as we speak. Of course there will always be those will carry some insecurities about it, Who, how, where, and when you decide to come clean to someone you are friends with determines the outcome.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 28, 2012 4:31 AM GMT
    Just wait a minute.

    "Making a move" on a straight friend is VERY, VERY DIFFERENT than lying about your gender, performing sexual acts with straight men, then these straight men facing the humiliation of having had sex with a man, in front of a bunch of people. I'm not saying that I agree with the lesser punishment, but the title of your thread, and your commentary do not coincide with the judicial example provided.

    Not saying I agree with the lesser punishment in the Araujo case, but I absolutely cannot see a judge's or jury's agreeance to a lesser charge if a known gay man simply makes a move on a straight man, and the straight man violently murders the gay man.

    And what you say in your commentary doesn't correlate to the actual story you attached. Two of the defendants were convicted of second degree murder, not second degree manslaughter. Second degree murder confirms no premeditation, which in this case, it appears to be true. The other two defendants were convicted of manslaughter primarily because they pleaded guilty and one of them assisted the police in the investigation. That's called a plea bargain.
  • NashRugger

    Posts: 1089

    May 28, 2012 4:36 AM GMT
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    May 28, 2012 4:38 AM GMT

    Yeah, that's right. SHUT UP! LOL
  • calibro

    Posts: 8888

    May 28, 2012 7:33 AM GMT
    so don't hit on a straight guy because you might be transgendered and get killed? that doesn't even make limited sense.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 28, 2012 7:51 AM GMT
    Yeah because I totally think my friends are going to kill me. This makes sense. I'm going to just cut to the chase and kill every attractive straight male friend I have
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 28, 2012 7:52 AM GMT
    Your friends beating you to death for coming onto them is a hugely irrational fear.

    Instead how about you respect their sexual preference and find a guy who can actually reciprocate your feelings.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 28, 2012 8:02 AM GMT
    Dont know about the rest of you but I get kissed by my straight friends and mates more than me kissing them.

  • kiwi_nomad

    Posts: 317

    May 28, 2012 8:08 AM GMT
    The Tom and Shane story is so sad and tragic icon_sad.gif Feel really bad for Shane.
  • beaujangle

    Posts: 1728

    May 28, 2012 11:29 AM GMT


    On this vid, thanks very much for sharing. Sorry I know I'm sidetracking from this thread. Indeed, I feel very sad & touched watching this. What I wish to say is that in times of bereavement, on a postive note, it's lovely to have fond memories of those good times. Yes, it's very cute. Sad & yet lovely
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 28, 2012 3:46 PM GMT
    I know right? so sweet!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 28, 2012 4:08 PM GMT
    calibro saidso don't hit on a straight guy because you might be transgendered and get killed? that doesn't even make limited sense.

    This. What does making a move on a friend you have a lot of history with have anything to do with any of the examples you mentioned? All of the stories you cited are cases where guys presented themselves as girls in order to deceive and seduce men who believed they were women. The beatings afterwards were wrong but misrepresenting yourself so a guy would do what he would otherwise not do is also wrong.
  • Burke36

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    May 28, 2012 4:08 PM GMT
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 28, 2012 4:20 PM GMT
    Okay, everyone keeps harping on the fact that what does it have to do with gay men. This maybe an extreme case but all I am saying is making sexual advances on someone with a different sexual orientation from yours is not right. Give the right circumstances, even in 2012, it can lead to bad outcomes. That is all. Geez!

    I don't walk around fearing that homophobic straight prick is going to ambush me but I'm still respectful of those with a different sexual orientation than mine

    To be honest, I'm sick of hearing people say, "Oh I don't know what to do with this straight guy...."

    My answer "nothing, leave him alone"

    I'm a bit sick of this Gay obsession with straight guys. Learn to love yourself and respect others. There are plenty of gay MEN. If I hear one more, "SEDUCING A STRAIGHT GUY", I'm gonna pop myself.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    May 28, 2012 4:24 PM GMT
    Sad but true. I have hit on my straight friends (9/10 times I'm drunk) and they're all like "thanks for the compliment...?" and move on, in spite of an awkward situation.