Testosterone (and other supplements)

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jul 04, 2012 6:52 PM GMT
    So, a year ago, a GNC guy tried to pitch me a testosterone enhancer supplement, and while I couldn't afford it, the idea's been stuck in my mind ever since. I hear a lot about older men benefiting from testosterone therapy, and about body builders and fitness models using this kinda stuff. But I know nothing about it and was curious what you all know?

    Is it safe/healthy? efficacious in packing on lean muscle and boosting libido?
    are there side effects revolving around acne breakouts and mood swings? my skin is already prone to breakouts so that has me apprehensive...
    if worth adding to my handful of supplements and vitamins every day, which brand is best?
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    Jul 04, 2012 8:01 PM GMT
    You are way too young to worry about your testosterone levels. If your levels are low than it may be a sign of a more serious health problem. You certainly don't look like you are losing muscle mass and if you have a normal sex drive I seriously doubt your levels need to be adjusted.
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    Jul 04, 2012 8:03 PM GMT
    I can only repeat what my Doc told me earlier this year: Once you start taking extra testosterone your body will produce less of its own.
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    Jul 04, 2012 8:06 PM GMT
    What are your goals that you desire to see from the potential use? What you desire to gain is going to decide the outcome of not only whether you should or shouldn't use them, but what kind to use as well.

    You're young enough to where you shouldn't yet be having a natural decline in your normal testosterone levels. Keep in mind that any corticosteroid will cause your brain chemistry to change slightly, and you will stop producing as much testosterone on your own...dependent on how much you inject and/or use as a cream/gel.

    Either way you decide to go, it would be VERY wise to have your own levels tested as you talk about it to a health professional first. There are so many potential side effects from continued use of artificial steroids, so tread lightly!
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    Jul 04, 2012 8:47 PM GMT
    Over the counter "testosterone enhancers" are junk. Save your money. If you believe that you actually have low testosterone, then see a doctor. And he'll prescribe the real deal for you, if needed.
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    Jul 04, 2012 9:28 PM GMT
    You won't need it until you're like 40 years old. I know you're tempted to use it but it's not the best idea.

    OK if you REALLY want to use it you should only think about cycling it, like 3 months in a year during your bulking phase.
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    Jul 04, 2012 10:56 PM GMT
    When you do see your doctor..make shure he does more than a blood test..if you have males in family tree that have had prostate cancer..(like me)..careful with this stuff..icon_biggrin.gif
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    Jul 04, 2012 11:17 PM GMT
    Stay away from unnatural intake of natural body hormones please... >_>
  • ac416

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    Jul 04, 2012 11:37 PM GMT
    Don't think it was in my head but when I tool Tribulus before I felt like it worked and it's a cheap testorone boost you may want to try that is supposed to have limited side effects
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    Jul 04, 2012 11:43 PM GMT
    what about this? opinions?

    http://www.saveonsupplements.com/halotest25.html
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    Jul 04, 2012 11:46 PM GMT
    OP, you're already hot, you don't need more supps
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    Jul 04, 2012 11:46 PM GMT
    czarodziej saidIs it safe/healthy? efficacious in packing on lean muscle and boosting libido?
    are there side effects revolving around acne breakouts and mood swings? my skin is already prone to breakouts so that has me apprehensive...
    if worth adding to my handful of supplements and vitamins every day, which brand is best?


    Test boosters are not worth it for two reasons.

    1) They're not terribly effective. In order to be legal and widely available, as with most drugs, the FDA has stripped out most of their efficacy.
    2) In order to be effective at all, they need to be processed by your liver. The strain on your liver from breaking down the hormone precursors into useable hormones is pretty high and not worth the damage.

    If you want a boost in testosterone, the easiest and cleanest way is just to get a vial of testosterone.

    The weak-tea over the counter stuff at GNC is otherwise pretty safe only because it's pretty ineffective. The real stuff is safe as long as you have done your research and dose in moderation. It will definitely increase your strength and libido. Side effects are generally mild if, as I already said, you dose moderately.
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    Jul 05, 2012 12:12 AM GMT
    ha thanks firebrand. always a work in progress..

    vial of testosterone?





    and maybe I should create a separate thread for this, but can you guys critique my supplement choices? I use all GNC cause i'm a sucker for marketing lol, but it costs fortune (about $200/month!)

    I take (all from GNC)
    the Sport Vita Multipacks (multivitamins),
    Jack3d as a preworkout,
    Wheybolic protein powder,
    their Amplified Creatine,
    Oxyelite Pro,

    a good calcium supplement, and a good molecularly distilled omega3 fish oil supplement.

    Its a real fistful every morning icon_wink.gif
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    Jul 05, 2012 12:17 AM GMT
    Testosterone Propionate most likely.

    Basically a steroid icon_razz.gif
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    Jul 05, 2012 12:34 AM GMT
    czarodziej saidha thanks firebrand. always a work in progress..

    vial of testosterone?





    and maybe I should create a separate thread for this, but can you guys critique my supplement choices? I use all GNC cause i'm a sucker for marketing lol, but it costs fortune (about $200/month!)

    I take (all from GNC)
    the Sport Vita Multipacks (multivitamins),
    Jack3d as a preworkout,
    Wheybolic protein powder,
    their Amplified Creatine,
    Oxyelite Pro,

    a good calcium supplement, and a good molecularly distilled omega3 fish oil supplement.

    Its a real fistful every morning icon_wink.gif


    I'm surprised you think you need OxyElite... you seem pretty lean to me, and your shape implies that your body type is pretty ectomorph. You shouldn't need more than a modified diet to get really cut up.

    The vitamin multipack is a waste of money, imo. A big jar of gummy vitamins from SAM's or something is just as useful. Though, really, if you have a balanced diet you should get most if not all of your nutrients from food.
    Jack3d is good... you finding it effective long term? A lot of people - myself included - build up a resistance and have to cycle out.
    The Wheybolic is good, more or less... though unless you're training in a very serious way, or you like the macronutrient spread on that particular brand, whey tends to pretty much be whey. And GNC charges a pretty penny for their proprietary blend. You may consider going generic somewhere.
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    Jul 05, 2012 12:44 AM GMT
    Firebrand saidOP, you're already Hot, you don't need more supps.


    THIS.

    And to add, You're too young to be taking additional T.
    Old guys like me need it, you don't. Go natural, and eat foods that naturally raise your testosterone levels. And try to get a lot of sleep! It helps.
    That is all. icon_smile.gif
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    Jul 05, 2012 12:46 AM GMT
    Instead of using OxyElite Pro have you thought of using a EC stack (ephedrine and Caffeine)? It's really effective and the results are amazing. I'm on and off cycle right now but I'll start again in a week and a half.
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    Jul 05, 2012 1:54 AM GMT
    OP, the only testosterone enhancing supplements that seem to have some promise to them are maybe Erase Pro (sold at some GNCs) and I'm hearing good things about Activate Extreme + Triazole stack. These are safe supplements that work by helping your body metabolize estrogen (which leads to a natural increase in testosterone).

    It is true, however, that most testosterone boosters are either too mild or just flat out placebo pills.

    If anything, just go get a blood test to get your levels checked. If they are in the low-normal range, then start taking something.
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    Jul 05, 2012 3:56 AM GMT
    Czarodziej,
    Hypogonadism (also called Low testosterone or Low T) is a medical term for a defect of the reproductive system that results in lack of function of the testes. Low Testosterone can be identified through a simple blood test performed by a laboratory, ordered by a physician. Normal testosterone levels are said to range from 298 - 1098 ng/dl, but most men with levels below 350 will benefit from treatment.

    MANopause, Andropause or Primary Hypogonadism, came upon me with subtle symptoms. My body stopped making Testosterone 12 years ago when I was 55 years old. My Testosterone blood level was 85ng.

    Symptoms of my low testosterone level included all of the below:
    Uncontrollable crying
    Fatigue
    Irritability
    Low sex drive
    Erectile dysfunction
    Anxiety
    Difficulty concentrating
    Increasing weight
    Glucose intolerance (early diabetes)
    Cholesterol/Lipid abnormalities
    Hot flashes
    Poor sleep secondary to achy muscles
    Night Sweats
    Difficulty in choosing words in language
    Dry Skin
    Depression

    The deepest part of my depression would send thoughts of suicide playing with my head, even though I had no desire to kill myself. Scary!!!

    In the 12 years I've been using testosterone, I've noticed several things about me that have changed. Most prominent is that I have become much more hairy than I was before using testosterone. My penis has increased in size by about a half inch in length and girth.

    Additionally, I have become much more aggressive, and I am not an aggressive man! I've had to learn how to control my aggression so that it doesn't cause problems with family, friends and co-workers.

    My testicles have shrunk from the size of large walnuts to the size of jelly beans. In fact, I can gauge what my testosterone level is, by the size of my balls and my aggression level.

    My voice has deepened slightly. My skin has thickened and toughened up some. I am able to gain muscle with very few gym workouts, but I do have very good genes.

    Czarodziej, your body is lean and muscular... Considering the symptoms of low testosterone levels and the effects of being on testosterone, do you really think that you need to use testosterone? Unless your body is medically deficient of testosterone, in my opinion... No!
  • rowerchgo

    Posts: 31

    Jul 07, 2012 10:57 AM GMT
    I tried tribulus terrestris and it didnt do anything for me.... Guess it is for ppl that are already taking steroids and need support.

    For me what has worked is whey protein (optimum) and jack3d for weekend workouts. Need to be careful when on jack3d not to hurt myself, it makes it easy to lift heavy weights :-)

    Other than that just sleep, proper technique when lifting and a good diet. Sometimes i have casein protein (optimum) before bed, since it is slow digesting.

    I have thought about using steroids to increase mass, even researched, but for me i dont think the benefits offset the drawbacks. Instead of 3 months it might take 3 years to get similar results, but it is all about the evolution :-D. Good luck!
  • muscletruk

    Posts: 109

    Jul 07, 2012 11:28 AM GMT
    1st If your going to try any T boosters get with your DR. and watch your blood work.
    I'm a supplement junkie and have tried most of the boosters over the yrs.
    one really screwed up my cholesterol profile. my DR called me after a blood test and said " what ever your doing STOP NOW"
    I found pink magic worked the 1st time i used it , but got nothing on subsequent cycles.
    the biggest down side for me is the depression and sluggishness coming off them at the and of the cycle.
    that being said I agree with a lot of the guys here your to young to need it and already very HOT
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    Jul 10, 2012 12:16 PM GMT
    WOW!!! This has been the most informative read in a long time. Thanks to everyone for your input... I've learned a lot!!! =)
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    Jul 10, 2012 12:52 PM GMT
    Over the counter supplements are certainly not the same as a Testosterone supplement.

    Most of the sups you will see over the counter will be herbal and will work on stimulating endocrine functions in the body, boosting metabolism etc.

    Some precurse other hormone like substances like DHEA and are pretty much unproven to be of real use.

    Even the best of them are unlikely to encourage the production of more testosterone in your body, at best they *may* reduce the levels of the sex binding hormones, which reduce the available levels of Testosterone in your body.

    The packaging on most of these products recommend "cycling off" .. ie. to stop taking the supplement for a period of time in order for your body to regain its balance..

    I would recommend you get your Testosterone levels checked... in about 20 years time - unless you have a history of low testosterone among the men in your family, or are taking some other drugs like propecia for hair loss.


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    Jul 10, 2012 2:15 PM GMT
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finasteride

    Check this for some of the interactions between Finasteride (Propecia) in the body - the "Mechanism of action" section is a heavy read, but give some insight into how the drug is designed to work,

    Some Guys who take propecia have had libido and erectile difficulties, because the SBH are required for these functions as well as causing pattern baldness.

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    Jul 10, 2012 2:22 PM GMT
    Testosterone is not a supplement. It is a steroid hormone, that, like estrogen, is soluble in lipids. In particular, testosterone is both androgenic, and anabolic, and has a long list of benefits.

    AIDS research has shown that test levels of 1000, or higher, provide much improved outcome for sick folks (HIV people), and remains the treatment of choice for many debilitating illnesses.

    It improves mood, provides a sense of well being, lowers blood pressure, raises base metabolism, and lowers diseases of aging, improves fat distribution, and preserves lean muscle mass.

    Nowadays, more and more, folks are getting T-therapy, which is a huge money maker, because like almost all American medicine the profit margins are over the top. They are also getting it because IT WORKS.

    You'll want to read about this from qualified sources like reputable organizations such as the American Heart Association, American Cancer Society, and HIV agencies, geriatric and HIV studies. There's been LOTS of research done on this. Watch the movie "Bigger, Stronger, Faster" for a reality check about the potential ups and downs of AAS.

    The GAO also produced a report for Congress in 2007.

    Much of the information you've received here is ill qualified.

    Many of the OTC stuff in nutrition stores are JUNK, and will cause problems like "bitch tits" because they bump your estrogen to bump your test. DUMB. You should stay away from that stuff. It's crap. Take the real thing.

    If you engage in anabolic use, the main things to monitor closely are blood pressure and electrolyte levels. You can have serious health consequences from high bp, or low sodium / high sodium.

    Remember: the highest mortality is from obesity. The second highest is from smoking. Both are FAR more dangerous than testosterone.

    Like anything exogenous the affects go away when you discontinue use. The notion of "cycling" is absurd. Get on; stay on; watch the important stuff, or don't bother.

    In America, AAS is big business, just like pot, with both sides having no interest in a truthful discussion nor in decriminalization because there is so much money involved, with the dangers grossly overstated. E.g. the cost of product is extremely low, but the medical and "fitness" community have made huge profits with their control of stuff that works, and...is junk.