Big Pharma HIV Scam, Using Poppers, Destroying the Immune System?

  • 6packabs

    Posts: 216

    Jul 15, 2012 9:48 AM GMT
    I subscribe to a newsletter by the Telly Award Winning documentary film maker, author, researcher, G. Edward Griffin. Some time ago, about two months I think, he cited a documentary and this is what it said:

    G. Edward Griffin: House of Numbers. Here is a documentary that challenges the common view about HIV and AIDS. [Be prepared to learn that (1) HIV testing is bunk, (2) AIDS statistics are manipulated to justify funding for AIDS programs, (3) the most common AIDS drugs are deadly even to healthy people, and (4) HIV has never been seen under the microscope, is entirely theoretical, and may not even exist. This is a blockbuster.]
    YouTube Posted 2012 May 3


    http://www.realityzone.com/20120504.html

    The Documentary on Youtube:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BwgmzbnckII

    I'm intrigued to see what you guys here think of this.

    Of note, Poppers were once used like crazy, according to the documentary, found in gay clubs, bars, and anything gay. This states that this substance damages and destroys the immune system.

    And what of all those who demanded to be on the HIV drugs early on? It was their death sentence!

    Fascinating.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jul 15, 2012 10:54 AM GMT
    Poppers damage the immune system ?! Oh shit ! icon_eek.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jul 15, 2012 11:13 AM GMT
    Do you mean fascinating... From the 'look at the crazy shit you can put out there on the internet and get retarded people to believe' point?
  • thisguy023

    Posts: 204

    Jul 15, 2012 11:42 AM GMT
    Sound like a lot of wishful thinking to me
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    Jul 15, 2012 11:47 AM GMT
    I've been on meds since 2006, and thanks to them, i'm healthier than ever. I went from 158 lbs to 190, tcells from 82 to 550, and been undetectable ever since. So I'm proof that drugs work well. I wouldn't be here without them.

    Also, I should point out, that I don't drink, do drugs, or smoke. Alot of guys I think that turn poz start using drugs and drinking out of depression. I didn't, and I think it's been conducive to my good health.

    icon_biggrin.gif
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    Jul 15, 2012 12:09 PM GMT
    pf008 saidI've been on meds since 2006, and thanks to them, i'm healthier than ever. I went from 158 lbs to 190, tcells from 82 to 550, and been undetectable ever since. So I'm proof that drugs work well. I wouldn't be here without them.

    Also, I should point out, that I don't drink, do drugs, or smoke. Alot of guys I think that turn poz start using drugs and drinking out of depression. I didn't, and I think it's been conducive to my good health.

    icon_biggrin.gif


    AMEN!!

    Meds have kept me going and undetectable for 18 years. So please don't believe everything you read.
  • hebrewman

    Posts: 1367

    Jul 15, 2012 12:18 PM GMT
    pf008 saidI've been on meds since 2006, and thanks to them, i'm healthier than ever. I went from 158 lbs to 190, tcells from 82 to 550, and been undetectable ever since. So I'm proof that drugs work well. I wouldn't be here without them.

    Also, I should point out, that I don't drink, do drugs, or smoke. Alot of guys I think that turn poz start using drugs and drinking out of depression. I didn't, and I think it's been conducive to my good health.

    icon_biggrin.gif


    mazel tov on your higher cd4 count and continuation of being undc....
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    Jul 15, 2012 12:38 PM GMT
    hebrewman said
    pf008 saidI've been on meds since 2006, and thanks to them, i'm healthier than ever. I went from 158 lbs to 190, tcells from 82 to 550, and been undetectable ever since. So I'm proof that drugs work well. I wouldn't be here without them.

    Also, I should point out, that I don't drink, do drugs, or smoke. Alot of guys I think that turn poz start using drugs and drinking out of depression. I didn't, and I think it's been conducive to my good health.

    icon_biggrin.gif


    mazel tov on your higher cd4 count and continuation of being undc....


    Thank you! icon_biggrin.gif
  • RunnerMD

    Posts: 157

    Jul 15, 2012 1:00 PM GMT
    Is it supposed to be ironic that such drivel is being hosted by a site with the URL of "Reality Zone"?

    Edited: Double irony, that site is selling a book called "THE DELIBERATE DUMBING DOWN OF AMERICA". Bwahahaha
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    Jul 15, 2012 1:02 PM GMT
    MsclDrew saidDo you mean fascinating... From the 'look at the crazy shit you can put out there on the internet and get retarded people to believe' point?


    LOL +1!!!
  • neosyllogy

    Posts: 1714

    Jul 15, 2012 1:06 PM GMT
    http://movies.nytimes.com/2009/09/04/movies/04house.html

    I haven't done more than skim the documentary (I'll watch it and add comments some time if I have time), but from the looks of it the author is doing a couple things.
    (1) Misunderstanding or exploiting the uncertainty that is the nature of science. Science understands what absolute certainty is and thus when it doesn't have it. It is also excellent at composing a complex civilization based on likelihood.
    (2) Making RIDICULOUS counter explanations after removing the science. Poppers, poverty, treatment drugs themselves. People have been acquiring and dying from rapidly failing immune systems in a consistent and identifiable way for decades now. Across different communities and locations.
    (3) Falling for the "monolith" theory of science, medicine, and government. Those three things are remarkable separated. Science in particular is built on work of individual labs, whose prestige comes about largely from debunking eachother. It is incredibly hard to introduce systematic cheating into that system.
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    Jul 15, 2012 1:13 PM GMT
    RunnerWannabe saidIs it supposed to be ironic that such drivel is being hosted by a site with the URL of "Reality Zone"?

    Edited: Double irony, that site is selling a book called "THE DELIBERATE DUMBING DOWN OF AMERICA". Bwahahaha

    More than drivel, this is dangerous propaganda from extreme Right Wing loonies. That tell gay men not to take their HIV meds, don't get tested, there is no such thing as AIDS, etc. Beyond drivel, this is criminally irresponsible, and RJ Admin might want to look into this. This isn't a mere "opinion" but a life-threatening agenda, that has no place on a gay site.
  • neosyllogy

    Posts: 1714

    Jul 15, 2012 1:16 PM GMT
    Ugh. Okay, I've got to stop watching this bs and gget real work done.
    I just saw some piece where he smugly asks a nurse why they would test with two less accurate tests instead of jumping to the "most accurate test. Little **** lacks a basic understanding of statistics or economics.
    I honestly can't tell if he's just a smug liar, or smugly dumb. icon_mad.gif
  • CuriousJockAZ

    Posts: 19119

    Jul 15, 2012 1:55 PM GMT
    Art_Deco said
    More than drivel, this is dangerous propaganda from extreme Right Wing loonies. That tell gay men not to take their HIV meds, don't get tested, there is no such thing as AIDS, etc. Beyond drivel, this is criminally irresponsible, and RJ Admin might want to look into this. This isn't a mere "opinion" but a life-threatening agenda, that has no place on a gay site.



    Oh good lord. Is EVERYTHING a right-wing conspiracy to you that somehow relates to sinister intentions aimed right here on RJ? Clearly, you know little, if anything, about G. Edward Griffin. He is more of a conspiracy theorist than a right wing loon, though he is actually classified politically as a Libertarian who founded Freedom Force International in 2002, a libertarian activist network, whose members value individual freedom above government power. To be clear, I am in no way supporting or do I agree with the information in the OP.
  • RunnerMD

    Posts: 157

    Jul 15, 2012 1:59 PM GMT
    Art_Deco said
    RunnerWannabe saidIs it supposed to be ironic that such drivel is being hosted by a site with the URL of "Reality Zone"?

    Edited: Double irony, that site is selling a book called "THE DELIBERATE DUMBING DOWN OF AMERICA". Bwahahaha

    More than drivel, this is dangerous propaganda from extreme Right Wing loonies. That tell gay men not to take their HIV meds, don't get tested, there is no such thing as AIDS, etc. Beyond drivel, this is criminally irresponsible, and RJ Admin might want to look into this. This isn't a mere "opinion" but a life-threatening agenda, that has no place on a gay site.


    I think that would be more than a slight over reaction. I think it falls more into the category of:

    duty_calls.png

    Call out the BS and move on.
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    Jul 15, 2012 2:04 PM GMT
    Paxton said
    pf008 saidI've been on meds since 2006, and thanks to them, i'm healthier than ever. I went from 158 lbs to 190, tcells from 82 to 550, and been undetectable ever since. So I'm proof that drugs work well. I wouldn't be here without them.

    Also, I should point out, that I don't drink, do drugs, or smoke. Alot of guys I think that turn poz start using drugs and drinking out of depression. I didn't, and I think it's been conducive to my good health.

    icon_biggrin.gif


    AMEN!!

    Meds have kept me going and undetectable for 18 years. So please don't believe everything you read.


    pf008 saidI've been on meds since 2006, and thanks to them, i'm healthier than ever. I went from 158 lbs to 190, tcells from 82 to 550, and been undetectable ever since. So I'm proof that drugs work well. I wouldn't be here without them.

    Also, I should point out, that I don't drink, do drugs, or smoke. Alot of guys I think that turn poz start using drugs and drinking out of depression. I didn't, and I think it's been conducive to my good health.

    icon_biggrin.gif


    OMG, congrats to BOTH of You! icon_smile.gif Amazing how far modern medicine has come.

    On another note... poppers.... tried them twice.

    Like anything in this world, MODERATION IS KEY.
  • RunnerMD

    Posts: 157

    Jul 15, 2012 2:04 PM GMT
    CuriousJockAZ said
    Art_Deco said
    More than drivel, this is dangerous propaganda from extreme Right Wing loonies. That tell gay men not to take their HIV meds, don't get tested, there is no such thing as AIDS, etc. Beyond drivel, this is criminally irresponsible, and RJ Admin might want to look into this. This isn't a mere "opinion" but a life-threatening agenda, that has no place on a gay site.



    Oh good lord. Is EVERYTHING a right-wing conspiracy to you that somehow relates to sinister intentions aimed right here on RJ? Clearly, you know little, if anything, about G. Edward Griffin. He is more of a conspiracy theorist than a right wing loon, though he is actually classified politically as a Libertarian who founded Freedom Force International in 2002, a libertarian activist network, whose members value individual freedom above government power. To be clear, I am in no way supporting or do I agree with the information in the OP.


    Agreed the site is just one whack job conspiracy theory and hysterical headline after another. I mean, they have headlines over the top on pesticides and GMO's. Pooh-poohing those isn't exactly a mainline right wing position ;).
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    Jul 15, 2012 2:10 PM GMT
    CuriousJockAZ said
    Art_Deco said
    More than drivel, this is dangerous propaganda from extreme Right Wing loonies. That tell gay men not to take their HIV meds, don't get tested, there is no such thing as AIDS, etc. Beyond drivel, this is criminally irresponsible, and RJ Admin might want to look into this. This isn't a mere "opinion" but a life-threatening agenda, that has no place on a gay site.

    Oh good lord. Is EVERYTHING a right-wing conspiracy to you that somehow relates to sinister intentions aimed right here on RJ? Clearly, you know little, if anything, about G. Edward Griffin. He is more of a conspiracy theorist than a right wing loon, though he is actually classified politically as a Libertarian who founded Freedom Force International in 2002, a libertarian activist network, whose members value individual freedom above government power. To be clear, I am in no way supporting or do I agree with the information in the OP.

    And this disproves what I wrote HOW? Do you support the HIV poz not taking their meds? Do you oppose HIV testing? Do you believe there is no such thing as AIDS? Your disclaimer is rather weak.

    As usual, you make this a personal attack on me, while deflecting attention away from the matter at hand: the OP posting dangerous misinformation from sources that the Right Wing endorses and promotes.

    Will you go on record as saying his post is bad information, bad science, and bad for gay men to follow? It would be nice if for once you could shift your sick obsession with me, to topics that are vital to the gay community. Try for once to think of our community, and not your own agenda, OK?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jul 15, 2012 2:13 PM GMT
    HIV-denial theories have been around forever. It's nothing new. It's also utter horseshit.

    And PS: Poppers are STILL used like crazy. They don't cause AIDS.
  • cowboyathlete

    Posts: 1346

    Jul 15, 2012 2:14 PM GMT
    MsclDrew saidDo you mean fascinating... From the 'look at the crazy shit you can put out there on the internet and get retarded people to believe' point?
    Exactly
  • RunnerMD

    Posts: 157

    Jul 15, 2012 2:18 PM GMT
    Art_Deco said
    CuriousJockAZ said
    Art_Deco said
    More than drivel, this is dangerous propaganda from extreme Right Wing loonies. That tell gay men not to take their HIV meds, don't get tested, there is no such thing as AIDS, etc. Beyond drivel, this is criminally irresponsible, and RJ Admin might want to look into this. This isn't a mere "opinion" but a life-threatening agenda, that has no place on a gay site.

    Oh good lord. Is EVERYTHING a right-wing conspiracy to you that somehow relates to sinister intentions aimed right here on RJ? Clearly, you know little, if anything, about G. Edward Griffin. He is more of a conspiracy theorist than a right wing loon, though he is actually classified politically as a Libertarian who founded Freedom Force International in 2002, a libertarian activist network, whose members value individual freedom above government power. To be clear, I am in no way supporting or do I agree with the information in the OP.

    And this disproves what I wrote HOW? Do you support the HIV poz not taking their meds? Do you oppose HIV testing? Do you believe there is no such thing as AIDS? Your disclaimer is rather weak.

    As usual, you make this a personal attack on me, while deflecting attention away from the matter at hand: the OP posting dangerous misinformation from sources that the Right Wing endorses and promotes.

    Will you go on record as saying his post is bad information, bad science, and bad for gay men to follow? It would be nice if for once you could shift your sick obsession with me, to topics that are vital to the gay community. Try for once to think of our community, and not your own agenda, OK?


    Dude, he already did say he doesn't agree with the information on the site and the original post. It isn't a right wing site it is a conspiracy theory site. Those Venn diagrams have common regions but aren't identical.
  • CuriousJockAZ

    Posts: 19119

    Jul 15, 2012 2:24 PM GMT
    Art_Deco saidDo you support the HIV poz not taking their meds? Do you oppose HIV testing? Do you believe there is no such thing as AIDS? Your disclaimer is rather weak.

    No, of course not --- why would I? However, these claims have absolutely NOTHING to do whatsoever with this site.

    Art_Deco saidthis is criminally irresponsible, and RJ Admin might want to look into this. This isn't a mere "opinion" but a life-threatening agenda, that has no place on a gay site.

    Your comments relating this to right wingers infiltrating this propaganda onto this site is laughable at best, but classic Colonel Cuckoo nonetheless

    Art_Deco saidAs usual, you make this a personal attack on me, while deflecting attention away from the matter at hand: the OP posting dangerous misinformation from sources that the Right Wing endorses and promotes. .

    Calling you out on your own lunacy is NOT an "attack", it's stating the obvious -- there IS a difference icon_rolleyes.gif

    Art_Deco saidWill you go on record as saying his post is bad information, bad science, and bad for gay men to follow? It would be nice if for once you could shift your sick obsession with me, to topics that are vital to the gay community. Try for once to think of our community, and not your own agenda, OK?

    What part of this in my original post is beyond your comprehension skills...

    CuriousJockAZ saidTo be clear, I am in no way supporting or do I agree with the information in the OP.

    If you're going to make ridiculous conspiracy theory comments aimed at the right wing, not to mention go even further to state that there is possibly even something "criminal" at work here on this site that the RJ admins should "look into", expect to be called out on it. We all get it --- you like to make these comments, then play the "victim" of some sort of "personal attack" or "obsession" when anyone dares simply call you out on it. If you're going to make these claims, toughen up solider. icon_rolleyes.gif

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    Jul 15, 2012 2:31 PM GMT
    RunnerWannabe saidDude, he already did say he doesn't agree with the information on the site and the original post. It isn't a right wing site it is a conspiracy theory site. Those Venn diagrams have common regions but aren't identical.

    First of all, I am not your "Dude". Anyone who uses that twink expression at 37 has other generational issues, that we won't discuss here.

    Second, I did acknowledge his lame disclaimer of the OP. I said it was rather weak. When a guy tells us that AIDS is a scam, HIV testing worthless, and that HIV is some kind of plot, I expect a stronger denunciation.

    This kind of crap is rampant in Right Wing circles, whether this particular author Griffin is classified as a Libertarian or not. It's the stuff of the Right Wing war on gays, and I expect gays here to condemn it, not pass over it, or rationalize it. Or attack me personally for pointing it out.
  • RunnerMD

    Posts: 157

    Jul 15, 2012 2:35 PM GMT
    Art_Deco said
    RunnerWannabe saidDude, he already did say he doesn't agree with the information on the site and the original post. It isn't a right wing site it is a conspiracy theory site. Those Venn diagrams have common regions but aren't identical.

    First of all, I am not your "Dude". Anyone who uses that twink expression at 37 has other generational issues, that we won't discuss here.

    Second, I did acknowledge his rather lame disclaimer of the OP. I said it was rather weak. When a guy tells us that AIDS is a scam, HIV testing worthless, and that HIV is some kind of plot, I expect a stronger denunciation.

    This kind of crap is rampant in Right Wing circles, whether this particular author Griffin is classified as a Libertarian or not. It's the stuff of the Right Wing war on gays, and I expect gays here to condemn it, not pass over it, or rationalize it.


    Well dude (get off your colloquialism high horse), I've heard plenty of that kind of pseudo-scientific new age medical crap from friends that are quite politically liberal. It's right up there with all the magnet therapy and homeopathy stuff. He did and is condemning it, and making fun of the ridiculousness of it just like everyone else is. Posting BS on the internet is not a criminal offense and asking administrators or others to treat it as such is just sounding shrill.
  • CuriousJockAZ

    Posts: 19119

    Jul 15, 2012 2:35 PM GMT
    Art_Deco said
    First of all, I am not your "Dude". Anyone who uses that twink expression at 37 has other generational issues, that we won't discuss here.




    Ummmmmm...speaking of "generational issues"...Okay, nevermind...I won't go there on a Sunday icon_wink.gif