Creatine VS Whey Protein: Which is better?

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    Jul 18, 2012 6:07 PM GMT
    Which is better in terms of promoting and building muscle mass? I've been consuming 150 grams of protein daily derived from whey protein supplements and additional sources in my diet for the past year-and-a-half, and I haven't really gotten the results I desire. Or maybe it just takes time and I'm impatient.

    I'm beginning to think maybe I should switch to Creatine, maybe I will have better/quicker results?

    Any thoughts/tips are appreciated. Thanks!
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    Jul 18, 2012 8:06 PM GMT
    You're asking to compare two different things. It's like asking if meat or vegetables are better?

    To find out the answer you need to look at your diet. If you have enough protein in your diet, get creatine. If you need more protein don't get creatine.
  • paramoore

    Posts: 71

    Jul 18, 2012 8:15 PM GMT
    Excessive and prolonged use of Creatine can damage your kidneys. Whey protein will not. That is all I need to know to stay away from Creatine and stick with Whey.
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    Jul 18, 2012 8:25 PM GMT
    i've been told that to build muscle mass, you need to consume one gram of protein for each pound you weigh. i weigh 150 lbs, which is why i consume 150 grams of whey protein. is this correct or a myth? am i consuming too much protein (if that is at all possible)?

    typically i take my protein shake in the morning at least an hour before working out, and then again within 30-45 minutes after working out as well.

    i think i have a pretty well-balanced diet, and i make sure to get protein from additional sources as well: eggs, greek yogurt, cottage cheese, turkey, chicken, tuna (i don't eat red meat), almonds, peanut butter and the like.

    how can prolonged creatine use damage your kidneys? i understand that when taking creatine, it is best to drink a lot of water, i guess to help flush out the kidneys. that's kind of scary though.
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    Jul 18, 2012 8:25 PM GMT
    It depends on how much protein you get in your diet. If you're a vegetarian, whey protein is definitely the better supplement. If you get a lot of protein in your diet, creatine is the better supplement. Protein isn't the only factor that builds muscle anyway. You could take in 300 grams of protein if you want, but if you're on a calorie deficit you won't see results.
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    Jul 18, 2012 8:29 PM GMT
    joe122 saidIt depends on how much protein you get in your diet. If you're a vegetarian, whey protein is definitely the better supplement. If you get a lot of protein in your diet, creatine is the better supplement. Protein isn't the only factor that builds muscle anyway. You could take in 300 grams of protein if you want, but if you're on a calorie deficit you won't see results.


    i wonder if this could be a factor in the equation for me as to why i haven't seen the results i'm desiring in the past year-and-a-half.

    i only consume 1200 calories a day maximum.
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    Jul 18, 2012 8:37 PM GMT
    1200 calories/day is a starvation diet-EAT!
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    Jul 18, 2012 8:46 PM GMT
    yourname2000 said
    Are you sure? I use a lean whey product (not one of the "mass builder" kinds, with lots of extra calories) and yet for me to get 150gr of protein from that powder, I'd actually be taking in 950 cal JUST in whey powder (mixed with water, not milk).

    Are you eating nothing but whey? icon_wink.gif


    this whey protein i use is low calorie, 1 scoop = 120 cals, and i use 2 scoops in the two shakes i drink for a total of 480 calories.
  • TroyAthlete

    Posts: 4269

    Jul 18, 2012 8:48 PM GMT
    paramoore saidExcessive and prolonged use of Creatine can damage your kidneys.


    #broscience

    Water can kill you too...in amounts that nobody is every going to intake.
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    Jul 18, 2012 8:57 PM GMT
    yourname2000 said
    eightball said
    yourname2000 said
    Are you sure? I use a lean whey product (not one of the "mass builder" kinds, with lots of extra calories) and yet for me to get 150gr of protein from that powder, I'd actually be taking in 950 cal JUST in whey powder (mixed with water, not milk).

    Are you eating nothing but whey? icon_wink.gif


    this whey protein i use is low calorie, 1 scoop = 120 cals, and i use 2 scoops in the two shakes i drink for a total of 480 calories.

    Nope.

    1 gr protein = 4 cals. If you're taking in 150gr of protein, you're getting 600 cals from that + whatever overhead there is (and there is always extra caloric overhead). So something isn't adding up. icon_wink.gif


    nope? are you calling me a liar? lol
    too bad i am looking at the label right now, and it says 1 scoop = 120 calories and 28 grams of protein.

    28*4 = 112 grams of protein total from the two shakes i drink a day.

    to get to 150 grams of protein, i get it from additional sources in my diet, whether it be greek yogurt, cottage cheese, peanut butter, eggs, milk, almonds, chicken, turkey, tuna, etc.

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    Jul 18, 2012 9:12 PM GMT
    yourname2000 said
    eightball said
    yourname2000 said
    eightball said
    yourname2000 said
    Are you sure? I use a lean whey product (not one of the "mass builder" kinds, with lots of extra calories) and yet for me to get 150gr of protein from that powder, I'd actually be taking in 950 cal JUST in whey powder (mixed with water, not milk).

    Are you eating nothing but whey? icon_wink.gif


    this whey protein i use is low calorie, 1 scoop = 120 cals, and i use 2 scoops in the two shakes i drink for a total of 480 calories.

    Nope.

    1 gr protein = 4 cals. If you're taking in 150gr of protein, you're getting 600 cals from that + whatever overhead there is (and there is always extra caloric overhead). So something isn't adding up. icon_wink.gif


    nope? are you calling me a liar? lol
    too bad i am looking at the label right now, and it says 1 scoop = 120 calories and 28 grams of protein.

    28*4 = 112 grams of protein total from the two shakes i drink a day.

    to get to 150 grams of protein, i get it from additional sources in my diet, whether it be greek yogurt, cottage cheese, peanut butter, eggs, milk, almonds, chicken, turkey, tuna, etc.


    Cool....now that we know that, and based on the second sentence in your initial post ("I've been taking 150 grams of whey protein supplements...", I feel safe to call you a liar now, hahaha. icon_wink.gificon_biggrin.gif

    You've not given any stats as to your current weight, so difficult to assess whether you're under or over your protein needs with only 150gr per day, but I'd bet you're under. And yeah, 1200 cals is ridiculously low for a guy, let alone for a guy trying to build muscle. I don't think you could actually build muscle at all with that caloric intake....you'll be adding it during the day and just catabolizing it over night, lol. In fact, much of your whey protein is probably being metabolized into energy rather than being used to build.

    Load up some stats in your profile and/or this thread...there are a bunch of guys on here who actually know what they're doing, but they would need SOME information in order to suggest a plan.

    Based on what you've said so far though, I doubt creatine would do you any good...this might be a diet thing first and then start fine-tuning proteins and then look at other performance supplements.

    EDIT: whoops! I see in a post I missed that you say you're 150. You're probably under eating causing your body to "eat" the protein you're feeding yourself rather than actually build muscle with it.



    are you done being rude to me and arguing semantics now? perhaps i should edit my original post to say i consume 150 grams of protein a day derived from whey protein and additional sources in my diet if that would make you happy. icon_rolleyes.gif

    however, i will take into consideration what you said about consuming more than 1200 cals/day. thank you.
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    Jul 18, 2012 9:14 PM GMT
    yourname2000 saidBodybuilding.com has a "calorie calculator" for this stuff. According to them, a 150lb person should eat 2700 calories per day....and if they're trying to ADD muscle, they should add 500 calories to that.

    http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/macronutcal.htm


    thanks for this. i'm not sure if i'm hungry enough to consume 2700 calories/day though. that seems like so much!
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    Jul 18, 2012 9:23 PM GMT
    1200 calories/day, most of your protein and significant calories are supplements. You're not gaining because your diet is beyond terrible.

    Shakes are supposed to *SUPPLEMENT* a healthy balanced diet. Also you only need 1g protein/ lb of LEAN body mass - not what you actually weigh. You need to dramatically increase your calories and drastically change your diet if you want to see any serious changes.
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    Jul 18, 2012 9:33 PM GMT
    uoft23 said1200 calories/day, most of your protein and significant calories are supplements. You're not gaining because your diet is beyond terrible.

    Shakes are supposed to *SUPPLEMENT* a healthy balanced diet. Also you only need 1g protein/ lb of LEAN body mass - not what you actually weigh. You need to dramatically increase your calories and drastically change your diet if you want to see any serious changes.


    how is a low calorie, high protein diet beyond terrible though? i don't eat junk food, candy, fast food etc.

    i honestly don't think i'm hungry enough to eat 3000 cals/day. that seems like so much to me.
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    Jul 18, 2012 9:39 PM GMT
    your diet isn't high protein. Its high supplement, low calorie, starvation. You need to google proper nutrition for weight lifting and do a lot of reading. Your question shows that you have zero understanding of basics and your diet says so even more. Not trying to insult you but just explain you need a lot of information - probably a lot more than you realize. There is lots of great information online.
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    Jul 18, 2012 9:48 PM GMT
    eightball said
    uoft23 said1200 calories/day, most of your protein and significant calories are supplements. You're not gaining because your diet is beyond terrible.

    Shakes are supposed to *SUPPLEMENT* a healthy balanced diet. Also you only need 1g protein/ lb of LEAN body mass - not what you actually weigh. You need to dramatically increase your calories and drastically change your diet if you want to see any serious changes.


    how is a low calorie, high protein diet beyond terrible though? i don't eat junk food, candy, fast food etc.

    i honestly don't think i'm hungry enough to eat 3000 cals/day. that seems like so much to me.

    Less calories than your body needs to maintain your weight=weight loss=no muscle gains. It's as simple as that.
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    Jul 18, 2012 10:01 PM GMT
    eightball saidi've been told that to build muscle mass, you need to consume one gram of protein for each pound you weigh. i weigh 150 lbs, which is why i consume 150 grams of whey protein. is this correct or a myth? am i consuming too much protein (if that is at all possible)?

    typically i take my protein shake in the morning at least an hour before working out, and then again within 30-45 minutes after working out as well.

    i think i have a pretty well-balanced diet, and i make sure to get protein from additional sources as well: eggs, greek yogurt, cottage cheese, turkey, chicken, tuna (i don't eat red meat), almonds, peanut butter and the like.

    how can prolonged creatine use damage your kidneys? i understand that when taking creatine, it is best to drink a lot of water, i guess to help flush out the kidneys. that's kind of scary though.


    I thought it was that you eat one gram of protein for your target weight. For instance, if you weigh 130lbs and want to bulk up to 150lbs, you eat 150g of protein a day.
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    Jul 18, 2012 10:05 PM GMT
    joe122 said
    eightball said
    uoft23 said1200 calories/day, most of your protein and significant calories are supplements. You're not gaining because your diet is beyond terrible.

    Shakes are supposed to *SUPPLEMENT* a healthy balanced diet. Also you only need 1g protein/ lb of LEAN body mass - not what you actually weigh. You need to dramatically increase your calories and drastically change your diet if you want to see any serious changes.


    how is a low calorie, high protein diet beyond terrible though? i don't eat junk food, candy, fast food etc.

    i honestly don't think i'm hungry enough to eat 3000 cals/day. that seems like so much to me.

    Less calories than your body needs to maintain your weight=weight loss=no muscle gains. It's as simple as that.


    thank you. this is the feedback i needed, not someone saying that i have a horrible diet and "zero understanding."

    i honestly don't think i'm hungry enough to eat 3000 calories a day. i mean, right now i'm feeling satiated with just 1200. i really just don't eat that much. what can i do to make myself hungrier so i can more easily consume more calories needed to build muscle?
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    Jul 18, 2012 10:55 PM GMT
    Why the this or that choice? They do different things and function by different pathways. There are lots of studies that prove both work and both are safe. Why not utilize both. The other thing is that as the guys above have mentioned your diet is going to make both irrelevant. Supplements are just that supplements. You can't out-supplement or out-train a bad diet. Get your diet dialed in then use both for best results.
  • gwuinsf

    Posts: 525

    Jul 18, 2012 11:19 PM GMT
    YngHungSFSD saidGet your diet dialed in then use both for best results.


    Agreed! Learn how to eat first before supplementing.

    You can get all the initial protein and creatine you need from real food. Once you have nutrition dialed in, then take it to the next level, but right now you have no foundation.

    It's also not a good idea to be supplementing with things that you don't know what they are or what they do. The fact that you thought they were the same thing is very, very bad.
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    Jul 18, 2012 11:36 PM GMT
    gwuinsf said
    YngHungSFSD saidGet your diet dialed in then use both for best results.


    Agreed! Learn how to eat first before supplementing.

    You can get all the initial protein and creatine you need from real food. Once you have nutrition dialed in, then take it to the next level, but right now you have no foundation.

    It's also not a good idea to be supplementing with things that you don't know what they are or what they do. The fact that you thought they were the same thing is very, very bad.


    i never said they were the same though - which they obviously aren't.

    how about you people offer some constructive advice, rather than just sitting back and spewing inane bullshit like, "Learn how to eat first." icon_rolleyes.gif
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    Jul 18, 2012 11:40 PM GMT
    and p.s. i do have a good diet, and do know how to eat correctly. i don't eat junk or fast food i eat very clean.

    i'm basically on the mediterranean diet, and am a pescatarian (except i eat chicken):
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mediterranean_diet

    i just need to up my daily caloric intake to closer to 3000 calories a day to build the muscle mass i'm looking for.

    anyway, if we could get back on topic here now to whey protein vs creatine, that would be great. thanks!
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    Jul 18, 2012 11:42 PM GMT
    eightball said
    gwuinsf said
    YngHungSFSD saidGet your diet dialed in then use both for best results.


    Agreed! Learn how to eat first before supplementing.

    You can get all the initial protein and creatine you need from real food. Once you have nutrition dialed in, then take it to the next level, but right now you have no foundation.

    It's also not a good idea to be supplementing with things that you don't know what they are or what they do. The fact that you thought they were the same thing is very, very bad.


    i never said they were the same though - which they obviously aren't.

    how about you people offer some constructive advice, rather than just sitting back and spewing inane bullshit like, "Learn how to eat first." icon_rolleyes.gif


    Based on your question of "creatine" vs "whey" and your 1200 calorie/day diet, and your diet made up of supplements, its clear that you have invested ZERO time in trying to learn the basics.

    When you make a little effort to learn the basics, and then have questions about stuff, people will in turn make an effort to help you out. You're basically coming here and asking for the ABCs because you're too lazy to use a search engine.

    And my advice that your diet was terrible you and clearly lacked a lot of basics was genuine advice, because if you ask the questions you've asked, you need to invest a whole lot of time in reading the basics because as I said, you probably don't even realize half of what you don't know.
  • mz29xy

    Posts: 37

    Jul 18, 2012 11:44 PM GMT
    paramoore saidExcessive and prolonged use of Creatine can damage your kidneys. Whey protein will not. That is all I need to know to stay away from Creatine and stick with Whey.


    This is correct, stay away from creatine!
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    Jul 18, 2012 11:45 PM GMT
    MuchoMasQueMusculo saidAnimal protein sources have creatine so keep in mind that you are getting creatine when you eat eggs and meats.

    Copied from:

    http://trainmuscles.com/know-your-food-best-natural-creatine-food-sources

    What is creatine good for, anyway?

    In layman’s terms, creatine can be compared to building blocks for the muscles. It’s actually an amino acid that gets stored mostly in the skeletal muscle, and it’s used in situations of intense physical activity.

    Keeping a good stock of creatine in your body will help make you a bit stronger and it will also make your exercise sessionsyieald better results.

    A good storage of creatine allows increasing your body’s response to physical exercise. It helps maximize the production of muscle force, which in turn allows working out harder and building muscle mass at much faster rates.

    What kinds of food have creatine?

    Creatine makes for a good diet supplement since it’s something that occurs naturally in the human body. In fact, we keep getting more creatine each day from certain types of food. Approximately half of the creatine that’s stored in our sketelal muscle is obtained from the food we eat.

    Most of the foods which are rich in protein are also rich in creatine. You can stock up on this muscle building amino acid by eating foods such as meat, fish, poultry and cranberries.

    Some of the foods that have higher amounts of creatine are herring, pork, salmon and beef. By eating a pound of any of these foods, you can get as much as 2.5 grams of creatin in your body.

    How much creatine rich food should you eat?

    You can eat as much creatine rich food as you want, as long as it doesn’t interfere with your diet. Needless to say, eating lots of these foods isn’t the smartest way to get a creatine boost, since you’ll get an excess of calories and some nutrients doing so.


    thanks for this. i had no idea that creatine was present in animal or organic protein sources as well. i'm going to bookmark that site.