Half Drag

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    Aug 07, 2012 11:30 AM GMT
    The article and pics are really fascinating!

    Some of the guys look better sans drag though! icon_lol.gif
    http://www.vogue.it/en/people-are-talking-about/vogue-arts/2012/08/bobbe-s-half-drag-shots

    crystal-demure-145586_0x440.jpg


    epiphany-get-paid-110874_0x440.jpg

    jessica-payge-5587205_0x440.jpg

    titania-steele-136946_0x440.jpg

    check out the rest!
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    Aug 07, 2012 3:07 PM GMT
    Interesting..........I'd say only the top one makes a truly beautiful drag queen, the rest look better sans wigs/makeup.

    Reminds me of Ingrid Thulin in Salon Kitty

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    Aug 07, 2012 3:26 PM GMT
    "Half man, half drag. The world of photos created by Leland Bobbé expresses with extraordinary insight humanity’s modernity as it crosses into the third millennium. It’s the Nietzschean “overman”: the man that goes beyond, who is beyond. Not male, not female, not biological."

    ...

    "Through the power of hair and makeup these men are able to completely transform themselves and find their female side while simultaneously showing their male side."

    Psychobabble bullshit disguised as psychology & art.

    I didn't view any of that as half drag, rather as devoid of masculinity, just some chick who needs to shave and finish putting on her makeup.
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    Aug 08, 2012 3:41 PM GMT
    theantijock said[cut for length]
    Psychobabble bullshit disguised as psychology & art.
    I didn't view any of that as half drag, rather as devoid of masculinity, just some chick who needs to shave and finish putting on her makeup.
    Wow, you're a fucking cunt.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Aug 08, 2012 3:47 PM GMT
    kawaiidesu said
    theantijock said[cut for length]
    Psychobabble bullshit disguised as psychology & art.
    I didn't view any of that as half drag, rather as devoid of masculinity, just some chick who needs to shave and finish putting on her makeup.
    Wow, you're a fucking cunt.


    I agree. Your comment sounds less antijock and more stupid Jock. Maybe you're just having a bad day?icon_sad.gif
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    Aug 09, 2012 7:18 AM GMT
    HottJoe said
    kawaiidesu said
    theantijock said[cut for length]
    Psychobabble bullshit disguised as psychology & art.
    I didn't view any of that as half drag, rather as devoid of masculinity, just some chick who needs to shave and finish putting on her makeup.
    Wow, you're a fucking cunt.


    I agree. Your comment sounds less antijock and more stupid Jock. Maybe you're just having a bad day?icon_sad.gif


    Hottjoe, you know I've never treated you disrespectfully and we even had a decent conversation once so maybe I'm not the one having the bad day but please note that the next time you try to treat me like shit will be the last time we chat. As to the other guy, no idea who that is. So thanx so much for quoting the ignored.

    As to my comment, I'm standing by it. As to your somewhat rude comment about me, instead of about the topic, had you something to say about it, are you trying to say that when you look at those guys wearing lipstick, eyeshadow and rhinestones that you would get an erection based upon the half that isn't made up, from what supposed half a masculine face remains? Excellent, enjoy your evening masterbating to that. But I'm willing to bet that most gay guys who are not turned on by chicks with dicks wouldn't get as much as half hard from that, not even with viagra.

    So instead of simply calling me a fucking cunt, how about examining just how easily a little drag corrupts masculinity in pretty much its entirety. Perhaps there you will find some art. For the only art in trying to tell the observer that there's still half a man there is nothing but the art of bullshitting.

    Because if what they say is true, than we'd all have some urge to masterbate to those pictures--anyone wanna fess up?--and I'm gonna bet those pictures not only wouldn't make 90% of the guys on RJ cum but they'd prevent an erection to begin with. If that is the case, and I haven't noticed much conversation to the contrary in any thread, then the theory of art as proposed by the so-called artist is, as I stated, horseshit.

    The only thing weaker than this so-called art is insisting that anything gay is artistic and worthy of study when there's plenty of gay life which is simply not that interesting and better simply left on ignore.

    Oprah--76697.jpg
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    Aug 09, 2012 8:27 AM GMT
    theantijock said[cut for misogynistic bullshit]
    As Viitz already mentioned, it has nothing to do with boners and masturbating, which you should learn how to spell. The quote that you provided from the article does not mention sex or sexuality whatsoever.

    Masculinity and femininity are imaginary concepts that were conceived by society so that heterosexual men could enforce the idea that men are better than women in every single way possible, which we all know in this day and age is not true. The idea that it is possible to "corrupt" an already extremely corrupt idea such as misogyny (which you'll probably have to Google) is absurd.

    The reason people aren't taking this up as an opportunity for conversation is that they are either not interested in discussing the ideas of masculinity and femininity in the context of drag queens or they are simply assholes like you.

    Viitz is also right in that drag queens were the people leading the protests to allow you to live as an openly homosexual man. Remember that next time you think of insulting someone brave enough to wear whatever the fuck they want in public, because I sure as hell bet that you wouldn't be caught dead wearing what they wear on a busy street corner of whatever big city you live near, and do you know why that is? Because you're a coward, and unless you get your shit together and stop being such a fucking asshole that's all you'll ever be.
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    Aug 09, 2012 8:39 AM GMT
    saw this on tumblr, it's so cool.

    also, theantijock aka theidioticjock needs to shut the fuck up. you know nothing.
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    Aug 09, 2012 9:38 AM GMT
    sirdreamalot saidsaw this on tumblr, it's so cool.

    also, theantijock aka theidioticjock needs to shut the fuck up. you know nothing.


    You seem to be new here. I'm sure you're going to make lots of friends. All sorts of creepy, inconsiderate guys about. Their gonna just love you. But I won't be seeing you ever again. Feel free to put my posts on ignore as well. Buh bye, I won't miss you. Click.

    viitz saidNo offense, but you sound like a total insecure douche. Not everything is about busting a load.

    If it weren't for drag queens you'd still be hiding in your closet.


    Oh, gee, thanx for the history lesson but at 55, I am that history, sweetie. No matter. Never noticed you before either. And will never notice you again. Sorry for you that your mother taught you to treat people you don't even know like shit. My mother, on the other hand, taught me to click people like you on ignore. So, no offense but, buh bye. I won't miss you either. Click.


    For the Rjecord, I said nothing denigrating to drag, as I have been accused of doing; rather, I was speaking specifically and only to this particular exhibit which I find to be largely inane. That someone else might enjoy it, I've no issue, simply state your case if you care to. No reason to make it personal. Doesn't matter the fuck to me if someone doesn't agree. That someone takes a discussion of ideas personally is a personal problem, not mine.

    In any case, certainly there's no reason in the world for any gay person to feel badly about not getting sexually turned on by drag queens. That doesn't mean we don't like them around the house; we just might not care to eat one.

    I've a long history with drag queens going as far back as 1977 when I was friends for two years with Apple Love who performed near the UofF in G-ville at a time when I was first living as an out gay man at the age of 20, you know, before Will & Grace made it easy for you. Also throughout the 70s & 80s, as my best bi bud was partial to the performers, I woke up with everyone from Dana Manchester to pretty much anyone in town performing that weekend.

    Probably, I've had more drag queens in my bed than most of you have seen on stage or, since you don't even leave your computers--surprising because apparently some of your reading comprehension ain't so great--on Logo.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Aug 09, 2012 3:45 PM GMT
    theantijock said
    HottJoe said
    kawaiidesu said
    theantijock said[cut for length]
    Psychobabble bullshit disguised as psychology & art.
    I didn't view any of that as half drag, rather as devoid of masculinity, just some chick who needs to shave and finish putting on her makeup.
    Wow, you're a fucking cunt.


    I agree. Your comment sounds less antijock and more stupid Jock. Maybe you're just having a bad day?icon_sad.gif


    Hottjoe, you know I've never treated you disrespectfully and we even had a decent conversation once so maybe I'm not the one having the bad day but please note that the next time you try to treat me like shit will be the last time we chat. As to the other guy, no idea who that is. So thanx so much for quoting the ignored.

    As to my comment, I'm standing by it. As to your somewhat rude comment about me, instead of about the topic, had you something to say about it, are you trying to say that when you look at those guys wearing lipstick, eyeshadow and rhinestones that you would get an erection based upon the half that isn't made up, from what supposed half a masculine face remains? Excellent, enjoy your evening masterbating to that. But I'm willing to bet that most gay guys who are not turned on by chicks with dicks wouldn't get as much as half hard from that, not even with viagra.

    So instead of simply calling me a fucking cunt, how about examining just how easily a little drag corrupts masculinity in pretty much its entirety. Perhaps there you will find some art. For the only art in trying to tell the observer that there's still half a man there is nothing but the art of bullshitting.

    Because if what they say is true, than we'd all have some urge to masterbate to those pictures--anyone wanna fess up?--and I'm gonna bet those pictures not only wouldn't make 90% of the guys on RJ cum but they'd prevent an erection to begin with. If that is the case, and I haven't noticed much conversation to the contrary in any thread, then the theory of art as proposed by the so-called artist is, as I stated, horseshit.

    The only thing weaker than this so-called art is insisting that anything gay is artistic and worthy of study when there's plenty of gay life which is simply not that interesting and better simply left on ignore.

    Oprah--76697.jpg


    I'm not often aroused by drag queens either. I'm a fan of drag culture though, and I even published a novel about a drag queen, "The Tragedy of Miss Geneva Flowers." I will ALWAYS militantly defend drag queens from being shit on, doesn't really matter who's doing the shitting. I enjoyed our previous conversations as well, but we hardly have to agree on everything. As for calling you a cunt, that was another poster. I simply agreed that you were being cunt-like. I don't think you should be offended by that. I've been called much worse, and it doesn't faze me all that much. We all have to choose our battles and defending femme men from homophobia has been one of my greatest causes and highest ideals. If you're on the wrong side of that debate, then I will be there again to argue my perspective, and I'm not trying to be PC about it. Putting me on ignore won't really make much of a difference, because I'm never talking to just one person on here anyway. I do like you, and I sincerely hope that they're no hard feelings. That's just where I stand.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Aug 09, 2012 3:50 PM GMT
    theantijock said
    sirdreamalot saidsaw this on tumblr, it's so cool.

    also, theantijock aka theidioticjock needs to shut the fuck up. you know nothing.


    You seem to be new here. I'm sure you're going to make lots of friends. All sorts of creepy, inconsiderate guys about. Their gonna just love you. But I won't be seeing you ever again. Feel free to put my posts on ignore as well. Buh bye, I won't miss you. Click.

    viitz saidNo offense, but you sound like a total insecure douche. Not everything is about busting a load.

    If it weren't for drag queens you'd still be hiding in your closet.


    Oh, gee, thanx for the history lesson but at 55, I am that history, sweetie. No matter. Never noticed you before either. And will never notice you again. Sorry for you that your mother taught you to treat people you don't even know like shit. My mother, on the other hand, taught me to click people like you on ignore. So, no offense but, buh bye. I won't miss you either. Click.


    For the Rjecord, I said nothing denigrating to drag, as I have been accused of doing; rather, I was speaking specifically and only to this particular exhibit which I find to be largely inane. That someone else might enjoy it, I've no issue, simply state your case if you care to. No reason to make it personal. Doesn't matter the fuck to me if someone doesn't agree. That someone takes a discussion of ideas personally is a personal problem, not mine.

    In any case, certainly there's no reason in the world for any gay person to feel badly about not getting sexually turned on by drag queens. That doesn't mean we don't like them around the house; we just might not care to eat one.

    I've a long history with drag queens going as far back as 1977 when I was friends for two years with Apple Love who performed near the UofF in G-ville at a time when I was first living as an out gay man at the age of 20, you know, before Will & Grace made it easy for you. Also throughout the 70s & 80s, as my best bi bud was partial to the performers, I woke up with everyone from Dana Manchester to pretty much anyone in town performing that weekend.

    Probably, I've had more drag queens in my bed than most of you have seen on stage or, since you don't even leave your computers--surprising because apparently some of your reading comprehension ain't so great--on Logo.


    If this is your past then you should be pleased to see the next generation step up to the plate and defend this important aspect of our culture.
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    Aug 09, 2012 6:14 PM GMT
    HottJoe saidI'm not often aroused by drag queens either. I'm a fan of drag culture though, and I even published a novel about a drag queen, "The Tragedy of Miss Geneva Flowers." I will ALWAYS militantly defend drag queens from being shit on, doesn't really matter who's doing the shitting. I enjoyed our previous conversations as well, but we hardly have to agree on everything. As for calling you a cunt, that was another poster. I simply agreed that you were being cunt-like. I don't think you should be offended by that. I've been called much worse, and it doesn't phase me all that much. We all have to choose our battles and defending femme men from homophobia has been one of my greatest causes and highest ideals. If you're on the wrong side of that debate, then I will be there again to argue my perspective, and I'm not trying to be PC about it. Putting me on ignore won't really make much of a difference, because I'm never talking to just one person on here anyway. I do like you, and I sincerely hope that they're no hard feelings. That's just where I stand.


    As I already said, it is no crime that you are not often aroused by drag queens. Who among us fantasizes drag queens as we bring ourselves to orgasm? Christ, it would be like thoughts of your mother popping into your head just as you're about to pop. So we don't. It is that simple even if some fem would try to convince you that how we truly feel is both misguided and nothing but theory. Bullshit. It is real. Deal with it.

    Those of us who don't bullshit ourselves are in touch with that because it is completely natural for gay people to not be aroused by drag as most of us seek out masculinity. Being turned on by femininity--also not a crime--is not being turned on by masculinity, however, and it is nonsense to say the two are blurred in a drag queen as they most certainly are not. If they were, you'd be just as turned on by a guy in drag as you would by a big biceps bottom. We are men who seek men, that's what makes us gay. Drag is about accepting yourself, not pretending to be what you are not. Drag says its okay for men to love men.

    Critiquing what someone is trying to pass off as art and their theory behind it is not shitting on the subject of the so-called art. So your anger is misplaced and your expression of it when you are being rude sucks.

    That you either crave or tolerate people treating you like shit and therefore accept it from your peers, I suppose, to fit in, is not my permission to you to treat me like shit. I don't follow such fashion. I could give a rat's ass about fitting in. Or hadn't you noticed?

    And here's, not only where you prove my point, but where you and the others are completely offbase in your attack upon me: "defending femme men" as you say, "from homophobia", because the very premise of my critique as stated in my very first post had absofuckinglutely nothing to do with any kind of attack on femininity, homophobic-motivated (and fuck you for suggesting so) or otherwise. Rather, what I noted was that the self-promoting artist who said about his work that "Through the power of hair and makeup these men are able to completely transform themselves and find their female side while simultaneously showing their male side." is bullshit and instead I proposed my own theory during your attack upon me but which I had in mind all along, even if I was originally merely glib about it, that the male side is not maintained but is wiped away by applying makeup, even if only a partial. Because that's how our minds process that vision of a guy in a dress, regardless if he's wearing a jock. I'm saying that we no longer see the jock through the dress. The jock is not maintained and saying it so doesn't make it so. And that is the aspect of this so-called art which I'm calling bullshit.

    As to the ignore thing, it makes a difference to me, regardless as to whether or not it makes no difference to you There's no reason in the world why I should let a rude person ruin my internet experience, as there are too many good and interesting guys here still to read.

    I also like a lot of what I've read which you have to say, but I will cut out even someone I've long loved if they treat me like shit, even if the political correctness today is to be rude. So feel free to be as rude as you want. I simply will also feel free to filter what someone tries to subject me to as I require for my own sense of peace. You don't have to play by my rules. But most certainly neither must I play by yours. How about we compromise and simply play by our mother's rules. Did your mom treat people like shit? I've read you; I doubt it. All I'm saying is that if you can't play nice, I won't want to play with you. I'm not warning you that I'll put you on ignore as some sort of ego trip. I'm only telling you so that you know that I would at that point no longer be reading anything you might think that you might otherwise be saying to me.

    I announce it as a matter of consideration to the other guy with no intention other than that. Anyway, no hard feelings towards you. I appreciate you not calling me (even if just by agreeing with another poster) a fucking cunt this time around and I appreciate also your taking the time to explore this issue. Peace.
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    Aug 09, 2012 6:18 PM GMT
    HottJoe saidIf this is your past then you should be pleased to see the next generation step up to the plate and defend this important aspect of our culture.


    I love that the younger people are exploring our world. I denounce that someone would use the guise of defending as merely strategy of offense.
  • HottJoe

    Posts: 21366

    Aug 09, 2012 7:49 PM GMT
    theantijock said
    HottJoe saidIf this is your past then you should be pleased to see the next generation step up to the plate and defend this important aspect of our culture.


    I love that the younger people are exploring our world. I denounce that someone would use the guise of defending as merely strategy of offense.


    I see I mischaracterized you. Having no context as to how you felt about men in drag, I saw the glib part of you original statement as degrading toward them. Glib statements are often venomous, and it isn't always clear what someone means on the forum. In this case, I wasn't the only one who misunderstood you, though I am sorry I did.

    Your view of the art make sense to me, though I have a different take. For starters, seeing what they'd look like with no makeup on, I can tell they're stunning men. If any of them were covered entirely in makeup I'd see more of a female than the man underneath, and although I'm a huge fan of women, I'm just not turned on by them. Beyond that, the pictures are an interesting take on how the sexes are really more alike than we realize, and also how so much of what we're attracted to is a matter of perception, which can depend on whether or not a makeup artist interfered.
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    Aug 09, 2012 11:51 PM GMT
    HottJoe said
    theantijock said
    HottJoe saidIf this is your past then you should be pleased to see the next generation step up to the plate and defend this important aspect of our culture.


    I love that the younger people are exploring our world. I denounce that someone would use the guise of defending as merely strategy of offense.


    I see I mischaracterized you. Having no context as to how you felt about men in drag, I saw the glib part of you original statement as degrading toward them. Glib statements are often venomous, and it isn't always clear what someone means on the forum. In this case, I wasn't the only one who misunderstood you, though I am sorry I did.

    Your view of the art make sense to me, though I have a different take. For starters, seeing what they'd look like with no makeup on, I can tell they're stunning men. If any of them were covered entirely in makeup I'd see more of a female than the man underneath, and although I'm a huge fan of women, I'm just not turned on by them. Beyond that, the pictures are an interesting take on how the sexes are really more alike than we realize, and also how so much of what we're attracted to is a matter of perception, which can depend on whether or not a makeup artist interfered.


    You, sir, are a scholar and a gentleman.

    May your willingness to make a mid course correction keep you off rocks sure to tear the keels of lesser men. Follow not others when you sense them off course; rely not on GPS but on your own eyes when the two conflict. May you continue as Invictus to be the master of your fate and the captain of your soul.

    Back on task, yes, intellectually we can see there's a man under the makeup, but it doesn't feel like a man so in that sense it is not a man. Beyond intellect, beyond perspective, if any man truly remained, we'd still be turned on. But we're not, just like most guys who are into guys are not; and certainly, none of us are looking under Oprah's beard for dick. So then is there something else which determines what is a man aside from intellect. Does he pass the dick test as crude as that might seem? It is how we know men.

    When viewed as a two-halved whole, why does the beard not make the makeup seem less feminine, yet the make up makes the beard seem less masculine? Because the man does not remain, which is my argument. As I said, she needs to shave and finish putting on her makeup.

    And I'm not saying others don't get turned on by this. But they are not being turned on by masculinity, by any man who remains, rather by the absence of man in men. That turned on my best bud who enjoyed most all the variations of orientation & preferences. That didn't take away from his masculinity, however: the guy dripped testosterone, he was so fucking hot. But the only part of those experiences which turned me on was enjoying him being turned on in all the various ways. So we shared and played well with others. Just like our mothers taught us was proper. Well, almost enough just like.
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    Aug 10, 2012 12:08 AM GMT
    theantijock said
    HottJoe saidI'm not often aroused by drag queens either. I'm a fan of drag culture though, and I even published a novel about a drag queen, "The Tragedy of Miss Geneva Flowers." I will ALWAYS militantly defend drag queens from being shit on, doesn't really matter who's doing the shitting. I enjoyed our previous conversations as well, but we hardly have to agree on everything. As for calling you a cunt, that was another poster. I simply agreed that you were being cunt-like. I don't think you should be offended by that. I've been called much worse, and it doesn't phase me all that much. We all have to choose our battles and defending femme men from homophobia has been one of my greatest causes and highest ideals. If you're on the wrong side of that debate, then I will be there again to argue my perspective, and I'm not trying to be PC about it. Putting me on ignore won't really make much of a difference, because I'm never talking to just one person on here anyway. I do like you, and I sincerely hope that they're no hard feelings. That's just where I stand.



    Those of us who don't bullshit ourselves are in touch with that because it is completely natural for gay people to not be aroused by drag as most of us seek out masculinity. Being turned on by femininity--also not a crime--is not being turned on by masculinity, however, and it is nonsense to say the two are blurred in a drag queen as they most certainly are not. If they were, you'd be just as turned on by a guy in drag as you would by a big biceps bottom. We are men who seek men, that's what makes us gay. Drag is about accepting yourself, not pretending to be what you are not. Drag says its okay for men to love men.

    Critiquing what someone is trying to pass off as art and their theory behind it is not shitting on the subject of the so-called art. So your anger is misplaced and your expression of it when you are being rude sucks.



    oh ..... my ....

    this is really not a very good argument and you should re-think it (even if you "are" that history). you don't seem to grasp the concept of drag at all. drag doesn't pick one end of the masculinity/femininity spectrum and cling to it like ends of a magnet, but rather it says the whole thing is asinine. it mocks "man/woman," shaved/unshaved, polar ends of the spectrum. calling this whole display a load of crap because it doesn't fit your understanding of drag is pretty silly. and your understanding is not well supported - but I guess if you have an entire boatload of academic publications hidden away from the rest of the world hidden away, do share. all you have really said is what you think these models should look like. totally not good enough!

    I mean, take a look at the "female" sides of the faces - do those look like women to you?? no, they look almost clownish. they're deliberately exaggerated to make a point. they have even covered up existing facial features to create news ones with cosmetics. do every-day women or transgender women do that? no. that is your clue that there is something else is going on here.
  • Timbales

    Posts: 13993

    Aug 10, 2012 12:31 AM GMT
    it really is amazing what make-up can do to a face.
  • Kipstrdl

    Posts: 162

    Aug 10, 2012 12:54 AM GMT
    It seems that theantijock's criterion for masculinity is "does it make my dick hard?" which is quite ridiculous.

    The article wasn't saying "look how butch these drag queens can be," it was simply presenting the striking visual contrast when these guys had only half of their face made up and speculated that the ability of a man to explore the duality of his feminine side (yes we all have an X chromosome) can liberate the mind.

    The issue of sexual attraction had nothing to do with this article
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    Aug 10, 2012 1:02 AM GMT
    homastj said
    oh ..... my ....

    this is really not a very good argument and you should re-think it (even if you "are" that history). you don't seem to grasp the concept of drag at all. drag doesn't pick one end of the masculinity/femininity spectrum and cling to it like ends of a magnet, but rather it says the whole thing is asinine. it mocks "man/woman," shaved/unshaved, polar ends of the spectrum. calling this whole display a load of crap because it doesn't fit your understanding of drag is pretty silly. and your understanding is not well supported - but I guess if you have an entire boatload of academic publications hidden away from the rest of the world hidden away, do share. all you have really said is what you think these models should look like. totally not good enough!

    I mean, take a look at the "female" sides of the faces - do those look like women to you?? no, they look almost clownish. they're deliberately exaggerated to make a point. they have even covered up existing facial features to create news ones with cosmetics. do every-day women or transgender women do that? no. that is your clue that there is something else is going on here.


    I have not written a paper on it, which does not interest me. As I said, I have a huge amount of years, that period was about a decade on and off, of actually living with them fairly frequently in my bed. My bud and I were a bit crazy in those days, enjoying a lot of fun with a lot of different types of people and he kept bringing home the strays.

    But even with so much attitude in your comments, I believe I've identified the substance: You are partially correct by saying drag can be a mockery but also it serves many functions, be it mockery, art, theater, imitation, probably for some it is a pre-sex change process, in native cultures perhaps shamanism is involved, etc. So for you to declare just one aspect and scream eureka is less enlightened, rather perhaps a bit narrow minded. I do appreciate your criticism of my thinking nonetheless and I have already considered, though I did not express, the idea of makeup as clown costuming. I do pretty much feel that way about make up women use, I even think of business garb, shirt, tie, jacket, etc, as its own type of drag.

    Timbales saidit really is amazing what make-up can do to a face.


    I have serious trouble telling one female from the other when they wear makeup. I'm fortunate that most of the women in my personal life used makeup only sparingly if at all but most of the women I see all made up out in public pretty much all look to me like the same person.
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    Aug 10, 2012 1:05 AM GMT
    Fivealive saidThe article and pics are really fascinating!

    Some of the guys look better sans drag though! icon_lol.gif
    http://www.vogue.it/en/people-are-talking-about/vogue-arts/2012/08/bobbe-s-half-drag-shots

    crystal-demure-145586_0x440.jpg


    epiphany-get-paid-110874_0x440.jpg

    jessica-payge-5587205_0x440.jpg

    titania-steele-136946_0x440.jpg

    check out the rest!
    Thanks for sharing! That's Amazing!
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    Aug 10, 2012 1:06 AM GMT
    Kipstrdl saidIt seems that theantijock's criterion for masculinity is "does it make my dick hard?" which is quite ridiculous.

    The article wasn't saying "look how butch these drag queens can be," it was simply presenting the striking visual contrast when these guys had only half of their face made up and speculated that the ability of a man to explore the duality of his feminine side (yes we all have an X chromosome) can liberate the mind.

    The issue of sexual attraction had nothing to do with this article


    You've
    missed
    my
    point
    entirely
    Have a nice day
  • Kipstrdl

    Posts: 162

    Aug 10, 2012 1:20 AM GMT
    theantijock said"

    Psychobabble bullshit disguised as psychology & art.

    I didn't view any of that as half drag, rather as devoid of masculinity, just some chick who needs to shave and finish putting on her makeup.


    Please enlighten me. It looks like your point was that the choice to put on make up completely discredits these individuals as men ("just some chick").
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    Aug 10, 2012 1:45 AM GMT
    Kipstrdl said
    theantijock said"

    Psychobabble bullshit disguised as psychology & art.

    I didn't view any of that as half drag, rather as devoid of masculinity, just some chick who needs to shave and finish putting on her makeup.


    Please enlighten me. It looks like your point was that the choice to put on make up completely discredits these individuals as men ("just some chick").


    I've already put forth extended effort under less than comfortable conditions to cover this more than adequately. You are welcome to review the rest of what I've already proffered.

    I would only add here to clarify, since you brought it up, that the use in my argumentation augmented by our male-finding divining rods was just partially metaphoric yet still applicable. And how would we know that? While Manchester was, if I recall right--I'm going back now a lot of years and a lot parties--not just beautiful in drag but also a very good looking guy out of drag, picture if you will someone who would never turn you on in or out of drag. Now put that person in drag. Your dick still tells you what is what. It isn't that the man would never turn you on anyway, so then it must be something else. That is how powerful is the transformation of drag and how tenuous can be the sexuality of man.
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    Aug 12, 2012 1:01 AM GMT
    Am I the only person theantijock didn't reply to because I'm on his ignore list or.........?
  • Kipstrdl

    Posts: 162

    Aug 12, 2012 1:08 AM GMT
    kawaiidesu saidAm I the only person theantijock didn't reply to because I'm on his ignore list or.........?


    I'll respond to you Honey. Do you want me to trivialize your opinions, or just disrespect you as a person? What's with the new screen name?