Is it wrong to write someone off because they're closeted?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Oct 08, 2012 10:07 PM GMT
    Ok I'm not thirsty for attention, I just had one more question I wanted to ask (Mostly due to having nothing else to do at the moment and also because I just got told off on Grindr.)

    Is it wrong to write someone off because they're closeted. I ask this because this guy bit my head off today because I told him I was no longer interested since he wasn't out. Even though on my profile I specifically say that if you're DL or not out its a huge minus. For me, its down to personal experience since I've only ever dated closeted guys. I told myself that I would never put myself in a situation like that again, especially now that I'm out.

    But this guy goes on to tell me that he's a great guy, and that I'm being a dick for not wanting to talk to him when his circumstances are beyond his control. While thats all well and good, I've come to the conclusion that I just don't want to deal with closet drama anymore.

    The "DL" culture to me isn't really appealing. Being someone's dirty little secret used to be a turn-on for me but it just isn't appealing anymore. And I especially am disgusted when people write me telling me to come over because their "gf" is on vacation or at work. Part of what disgusts me about this is the fact that the cheating aspect is hot to them, to sneak a guy over while their gf is away. Whereas if I were in that situation I would feel like shit, I wouldn't be bragging about it.

    There's just a dishonesty to everyone around you including yourself when you're closeted. And seeing as I just came out I don't want to be dragged back in. So is it wrong for me not even wanting to get to know someone as friends just because they're not out? I won't even respond to someone who messages me with no picture on their profile, even if they offer to send it later because I feel like they probably have something to hide. And I know I went through my sketchy phase when I was closeted as well.

    Thoughts?
  • Timbales

    Posts: 13993

    Oct 08, 2012 10:09 PM GMT
    No, I don't think it's wrong. I'm out and I wouldn't want to deal with sneaking around and hiding because someone chooses to stay in.
  • Amira

    Posts: 327

    Oct 08, 2012 10:17 PM GMT
    wannaseeitBut this guy goes on to tell me that he's a great guy, and that I'm being a dick for not wanting to talk to him when his circumstances are beyond his control.


    You're not wrong. He allows those "circumstances" to control his present life.

    I too recently told a guy that I wouldn't date him because he's not out. He goes further to say, "I will come out for you, that's all you had to say." I told him coming out is a personal choice, that's something you do for yourself and not for another person. He still did not understand where I was coming from.
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    Oct 08, 2012 10:22 PM GMT
    Amira said
    wannaseeitBut this guy goes on to tell me that he's a great guy, and that I'm being a dick for not wanting to talk to him when his circumstances are beyond his control.


    You're not wrong. He allows those "circumstances" to control his present life.

    I too recently told a guy that I wouldn't date him because he's not out. He goes further to say, "I will come out for you, that's all you had to say." I told him coming out is a personal choice, that's something you do for yourself and not for another person. He still did not understand where I was coming from.


    Yeah I definitely get where you're coming from. I've definitely been on that exact same boat recently. I mean, I'm not a walking pride parade. I don't only have gay friends. But I value honestly in a friendship so if I know someone in general is a dishonest person (For whatever reason.) I just would rather not have that person around me.
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    Oct 08, 2012 10:28 PM GMT
    wannaseeit said
    But this guy goes on to tell me that he's a great guy, and that I'm being a dick for not wanting to talk to him when his circumstances are beyond his control. While thats all well and good, I've come to the conclusion that I just don't want to deal with closet drama anymore.


    Did he really just want to talk? I don't see the harm in just talking to the guy.
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    Oct 08, 2012 10:37 PM GMT
    Having a random one-nighter with a closeted guy is one thing; but after being out of the closet and fighting for "our" rights for 20+ years it would be a slap in the face to actually befriend and date someone who's still in.

    So no, it's not wrong. In fact, it's safer to keep it that way. After all, most gay bashings are committed by closet fags afraid of being outed. icon_wink.gif
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    Oct 08, 2012 10:44 PM GMT
    unfounded7 said
    wannaseeit said
    But this guy goes on to tell me that he's a great guy, and that I'm being a dick for not wanting to talk to him when his circumstances are beyond his control. While thats all well and good, I've come to the conclusion that I just don't want to deal with closet drama anymore.


    Did he really just want to talk? I don't see the harm in just talking to the guy.


    Eh, I don't like endless e-mails/convos with someone I know I'm never going to want to meet. The guy was hot enough that I'm sure there were 20 other people who would have no problem talking to him.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Oct 08, 2012 11:00 PM GMT
    I'm not out at all, but I can totally understand your situation. If you're a patient guy and would do it for the love, you can play this hide and seek game at the beginning. Sooner or later it would be too complicated and painful for both sides. I think the "out guy" will suffer more. There's nothing wrong with your thought.

    Yeah, definitely a turn-off. I wouldn't take his offer, if someone is in a relationship. Those people are big selfish jerks.
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    Oct 08, 2012 11:15 PM GMT
    I understand you don't want to deal with closet guys anymore and that's fine.

    If they have a problem with it....it's exactly that, THEIR problem.
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    Oct 09, 2012 12:09 AM GMT
    Its called a closet for a reason...let the door close behind you on your way out.
  • FireDoor211

    Posts: 1030

    Oct 09, 2012 12:29 AM GMT
    Seriously, Someone in the closet has nothing to offer someone who is outside the closet, at least not in terms of a relationship. Riding the whole coming out wave with another person is such a drag. It's hard to have an open and honest relationship with someone who is lying to the world.
  • squally

    Posts: 180

    Oct 09, 2012 12:41 AM GMT
    There's absolutely nothing wrong with your choice. You are entitled to what you prefer and clearly it is a deal breaker to you if someone is in the closet. Don't compromise and feel the need to please this individual. It might be hard to stick with what you believe in sometimes bc you may really like this person, but following through with what you believe in will yield the best experience for you.

    Your honesty to yourself and this guy will be the best for the both of you icon_biggrin.gif
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    Oct 09, 2012 12:42 AM GMT
    Good for you for creating healthy boundaries.

    My summary of closeted guys:

    If our relationship can only be as good as the relationship you hold with yourself, being in denial of who you are makes our relationship nothing more than two guys touching.
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    Oct 09, 2012 12:46 AM GMT
    closeted guys are good for sex and that's about it
    use and abuse him then drop him like dirt lol jk
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    Oct 09, 2012 12:49 AM GMT
    When I was younger, I had a friend so in the closet that everything had to have a code. If we were at a restaurant and discussing gay friends that were a couple, we would either have to pretend one of the two was a female or whisper. If were discussing what were doing for the weekend, he had alternative names for bars and clubs. One gay bar in town was called "Menjos" and he would call it "Joes" and "The Street" is how he referred to a bar called "Backstreet". Luckily he was finally out of the closet and conquered his fear. Today I would not have the patience.
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    Oct 09, 2012 1:07 AM GMT
    I say you do what's best and not dealing with ppl on DL who lie and cheat on gf's and whatnot is definitely the smart way to go.


    To your question concerning is it wrong to not even want to get to know a DL guy as a friend perhaps it would be easier for that guy to one day come out if he knew he had the support and reassurance form someone on the other side.

    You get more bee's with honey lol

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Oct 09, 2012 1:11 AM GMT
    I'm closeted.
    I expect guys to write me off because we will never be able to have the same relationship that could have been had if I where an openly gay man. I wouldn't say I'm insecure or maybe I am, but I do keep a lot of things to myself... I'm a very private sort of person, it's just how I was raised.
  • LJay

    Posts: 11612

    Oct 09, 2012 1:14 AM GMT
    Yes. Next question, please.
  • great_scott

    Posts: 519

    Oct 09, 2012 2:08 AM GMT
    No, I wouldn't say a personal preference is wrong, but I think rejecting a guy using that as a sole basis is kinda hypocritical and snobby because most of us know what it's like to go through what they're dealing with. You'll probably miss out on some good guys too. Oh and they're usually better lays (IME).
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    Oct 09, 2012 2:10 AM GMT
    I prefer closeted guys actually. Their limited exposure to other gay people means their brains have decayed significantly less than those of the one's who've been out forever.
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    Oct 09, 2012 2:16 AM GMT
    It wouldn't say much about us if we made that the primary basis for choosing who we date. Relationships will not necessarily succeed because someone is out of the closet. They will not necessarily fail because someone is in the closet.

    Go with what you're feeling and what makes you comfortable in your own skin...it will make you happier. icon_smile.gif
  • Jonny21

    Posts: 199

    Oct 09, 2012 2:42 AM GMT
    Guilty conscious? Lol.

    In terms of a relationship, I really don't know the answer to this, it really depends. Possibly you are missing out on something special by writing someone off. Possibly you are wasting time waiting for someone to exit the closet. Up to you at the end of the day.

    In terms of friendship, I think it is ridiculous to write someone off because they are closeted.

    Lastly, I think there is a distinction between the term "DL" and "closeted." In my opinion, a person is on the DL if he is in some type of relationship with a woman for the purposes of concealing their orientation. Conversely, being closeted is simply concealing your orientation. Generally, I feel that being on the DL is "more culpable" behavior because you are dragging someone else into the equation.

  • FuriousGeorge

    Posts: 181

    Oct 09, 2012 7:13 AM GMT
    You're fine.

    Your preference isn't a judgment upon him; it's simply a situation you don't want to get involved with. If he wants to stay in the closet, he's welcome to it, but he can't expect you to want to waltz back into it yourself.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Oct 09, 2012 7:21 AM GMT
    Jonny21 saidGuilty conscious? Lol.
    In terms of friendship, I think it is ridiculous to write someone off because they are closeted.

    Lastly, I think there is a distinction between the term "DL" and "closeted." In my opinion, a person is on the DL if he is in some type of relationship with a woman for the purposes of concealing their orientation. Conversely, being closeted is simply concealing your orientation. Generally, I feel that being on the DL is "more culpable" behavior because you are dragging someone else into the equation.


    DL, closeted...kind of same difference.

    I don't do closeted types. I'm really not even into hooking up with those types. Confusion is something they need to work on themselves and someone who is fully out versus someone in hiding doesn't typically work.

    When Jesus walked out on water and Peter followed, he was fine until he looked back and sunk. Closeted men can be similar. If they don't feel comfortable being out, they are going to panic and sink and try to swim back to the boat.
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    Oct 09, 2012 8:14 AM GMT
    If a guy is in the closet, he has bigger issues to deal with than trying to get involved in a relationship. I don't mean that to sound harsh, but in order to have a healthy relationship, you must first have a life of your own before you can share it with someone else. In a sense, someone in the closet is living a half-lived life, because this big secret prevents them from living it completely...as themselves. I honestly do sympathize with guys who, for whatever circumstances, are afraid to make such a big change in their life by coming out. Once you are out to everyone you know, you can't go back in. It's frightening, I know. There are three different kinds of guys in the closet...the ones who muster the courage and come out completely and are happy, the ones who will never muster that courage and stay permanently locked inside, and the ones who yearn to come out but try to have the best of both worlds by staying in the closet and "safe" to many, and venturing out to a small few, in a very discreet manner...maybe to "test the waters" or alleviate a little of the pressure of living in the closet all the time...who knows why...

    Closeted guys can be a lot of unnecessary frustration, if you are hopelessly trying to have some semblance of a normal, healthy relationship with them, because you CAN'T...there is always that locked closet door that stands between you and him, and him and the rest of the world. I had an experience dating a closeted guy once. Of course, I made it clear in the beginning that if he and I were going to make a go of it, he was going to have to come out, in order for us to have a fair shake at things. He promised up and down he was going to (it was his family that was the biggest problem...they lived in an area that time and tolerance had forgotten) but after several months, I could see it was useless. I flat out told him one night, "This is really going to put a damper on Thanksgiving plans." A minor concern on the surface, but I was using it as an example to him that keeping his relationship a secret was going to mean leading seperate lives for most of the time. He decided not to move in because that would raise questions...it was a big mess. And, as much as I cared for him, I had to care about myself and my own happiness more. I was never in the closet, not even as a teen, and I wasn't going to be dragged into one for the love of any guy. In a closeted relationship, how CAN it go anywhere? There is no where for it to go but into the closet, and who the hell wants that? Clothes live in a closet; I don't.

    Moral to the story: Be a supportive friend to a closeted guy all you can, in the hopes of maybe helping him find his way out and be a completley happy person...but don't attempt a relationship with one. Relationships need nourishment and light in order to grow, and how can one grow and thrive whilst living in the dark?