Is knowledge really valuable?

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    Nov 18, 2012 3:00 AM GMT
    In the last few years I've questioned the validity of knowledge. I really think knowledge, Harvard, proper grammar, Nobel Prizes, and logic are just another way for people to establish themselves as "better" than other people. They might use the defense that we have computers, a well-functioning society, and effective communication because of them and because of our accumulated knowledge database. I think all of that is an illusion. We are not any better off than when we were cavemen. If I didn't know computers or the internet existed, I could care less about it and I'd be as happy as I am now; in that case, computers and the interest were never necessary, and neither were cars, electricity, or shelter... so I hope the snobby intellectual people are intelligent enough to realize how little value their knowledge really is.

    The best counter-argument that I can think of right now is that knowledge would only be beneficial when passing it down to the next generation. But that doesn't answer why we need new knowledge. You don't need a nobel prize, it doesn't really give a real contribution. If someone finds a cure for all cancers, sure we'll enjoy it for a while, but then we'll go back to where we are now and hope for even longer lives. It's kind of like money, no matter how much you make you'll always wanna make more
  • Pontifex

    Posts: 1882

    Nov 18, 2012 3:13 AM GMT
    bodyboarder725 saidIn the last few years I've questioned the validity of knowledge. I really think knowledge, Harvard, proper grammar, Nobel Prizes, and logic are just another way for people to establish themselves as "better" than other people. They might use the defense that we have computers, a well-functioning society, and effective communication because of them and because of our accumulated knowledge database. I think all of that is an illusion. We are not any better off than when we were cavemen. If I didn't know computers or the internet existed, I could care less about it and I'd be as happy as I am now; in that case, computers and the interest were never necessary, and neither were cars, electricity, or shelter... so I hope the snobby intellectual people are intelligent enough to realize how little value their knowledge really is.

    The best counter-argument that I can think of right now is that knowledge would only be beneficial when passing it down to the next generation. But that doesn't answer why we need new knowledge. You don't need a nobel prize, it doesn't really give a real contribution. If someone finds a cure for all cancers, sure we'll enjoy it for a while, but then we'll go back to where we are now and hope for even longer lives. It's kind of like money, no matter how much you make you'll always wanna make more


    Where we are now is as much a product of our intellectual evolution as much as our physical evolution. Even the simple task of using basic tools that allowed our distant primitive ancestors to survive is a form of knowledge. Do you seriously think that life was better living outside in a world that was constantly attempting to kill you? In general the increasing level of knowledge is improving our lives. You can't just decide to are happy and want to stop evolving at a certain point. The drive to learn is what got us here in the first place.
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    Nov 18, 2012 3:19 AM GMT
    Pontifex said
    bodyboarder725 saidIn the last few years I've questioned the validity of knowledge. I really think knowledge, Harvard, proper grammar, Nobel Prizes, and logic are just another way for people to establish themselves as "better" than other people. They might use the defense that we have computers, a well-functioning society, and effective communication because of them and because of our accumulated knowledge database. I think all of that is an illusion. We are not any better off than when we were cavemen. If I didn't know computers or the internet existed, I could care less about it and I'd be as happy as I am now; in that case, computers and the interest were never necessary, and neither were cars, electricity, or shelter... so I hope the snobby intellectual people are intelligent enough to realize how little value their knowledge really is.

    The best counter-argument that I can think of right now is that knowledge would only be beneficial when passing it down to the next generation. But that doesn't answer why we need new knowledge. You don't need a nobel prize, it doesn't really give a real contribution. If someone finds a cure for all cancers, sure we'll enjoy it for a while, but then we'll go back to where we are now and hope for even longer lives. It's kind of like money, no matter how much you make you'll always wanna make more


    Where we are now is as much a product of our intellectual evolution as much as our physical evolution. Even the simple task of using basic tools that allowed our distant primitive ancestors to survive is a form of knowledge. Do you seriously think that life was better living outside in a world that was constantly attempting to kill you? In general the increasing level of knowledge is improving our lives. You can't just decide to are happy and want to stop evolving at a certain point. The drive to learn is what got us here in the first place.


    I don't think that was a BETTER life than today, but I also don't think today is any better than that life. Being a caveman chased by a tiger is analogous to a 21st century man or woman being "chased" (abused) by his or her boss at work. If you were a caveman out in the heat of summer, you wouldn't know air-conditioning, thus you wouldn't care because you wouldn't know of its existence. I don't know of the existence of whatever technology will exist 1,000 years from now, and I'm not gonna say I'm worse off than them cuz I don't know what "worse off" is.
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    Nov 18, 2012 3:23 AM GMT
    Knowledge is only as valuable as the people who are willing to pay for it.
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    Nov 18, 2012 3:35 AM GMT
    bodyboarder725 said
    Pontifex said
    bodyboarder725 saidIn the last few years I've questioned the validity of knowledge. I really think knowledge, Harvard, proper grammar, Nobel Prizes, and logic are just another way for people to establish themselves as "better" than other people. They might use the defense that we have computers, a well-functioning society, and effective communication because of them and because of our accumulated knowledge database. I think all of that is an illusion. We are not any better off than when we were cavemen. If I didn't know computers or the internet existed, I could care less about it and I'd be as happy as I am now; in that case, computers and the interest were never necessary, and neither were cars, electricity, or shelter... so I hope the snobby intellectual people are intelligent enough to realize how little value their knowledge really is.

    The best counter-argument that I can think of right now is that knowledge would only be beneficial when passing it down to the next generation. But that doesn't answer why we need new knowledge. You don't need a nobel prize, it doesn't really give a real contribution. If someone finds a cure for all cancers, sure we'll enjoy it for a while, but then we'll go back to where we are now and hope for even longer lives. It's kind of like money, no matter how much you make you'll always wanna make more


    Where we are now is as much a product of our intellectual evolution as much as our physical evolution. Even the simple task of using basic tools that allowed our distant primitive ancestors to survive is a form of knowledge. Do you seriously think that life was better living outside in a world that was constantly attempting to kill you? In general the increasing level of knowledge is improving our lives. You can't just decide to are happy and want to stop evolving at a certain point. The drive to learn is what got us here in the first place.


    I don't think that was a BETTER life than today, but I also don't think today is any better than that life. Being a caveman chased by a tiger is analogous to a 21st century man or woman being "chased" (abused) by his or her boss at work. If you were a caveman out in the heat of summer, you wouldn't know air-conditioning, thus you wouldn't care because you wouldn't know of its existence. I don't know of the existence of whatever technology will exist 1,000 years from now, and I'm not gonna say I'm worse off than them cuz I don't know what "worse off" is.


    Uh, as a caveman your biggest threat would be... from other cavemen.

    It takes a truly pampered product of bourgeois America to not see the obvious experiential differences between life 800,000 years ago and now. Of course, we all start out that way when we're young.

    Try being homeless for any period of time, and then let us know how you decide ;-)
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 18, 2012 3:35 AM GMT
    I know so many educated people that are still so stupid.
  • Medjai

    Posts: 2671

    Nov 18, 2012 3:44 AM GMT
    That sounds like justifications for an uneducated individual being jealous of the educated.
  • Size_Queen_92

    Posts: 7

    Nov 18, 2012 3:50 AM GMT
    I think University degrees are a bullshit waste of time. Its just a place for friendless loosers who can't survive for shit in the outside world to fuck around and waste time and there parents money and effort while they play video games and socially isolate themselves from the outside world. fucking virgin nerds are loosers.

    IMO real life skills dont come from college but from actually experience in the real world and making friends and social interactions. I spend two years at college, got no where, and realised it was a waste of time and I would never be able to get through anyway cause the system is biased against LGBT and is homophobic. I'm sick of institutionalised discrimination and thats why i refuse to play their little game of oppression.
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    Nov 18, 2012 3:51 AM GMT
    Size_Queen_92 said.
    oMG UR USERNAME IS KILLING ME LMFAO
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    Nov 18, 2012 3:53 AM GMT
    Chuckles777 saidI know so many educated people that are still so stupid.
    Me too. I like to call them "professional angus inverters" (burger flippers with a degree).
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    Nov 18, 2012 4:13 AM GMT
    Medjai saidThat sounds like justifications for an uneducated individual being jealous of the educated.


    you saying that is proof of what I'm arguing lol using education as a way to establish yourself as better than a lesser-educated person.

    As for the homeless thing... yea if I turn back my quality of life now i would notice it and wanna go back to where I am... but as a cavemen, I was never in this position. You can stay where you are and then go to a higher standard of living, and you would go back to where you are now. But if you go backwards, you'll probably never get over it. Cavemen had nothing to go back to.
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    Nov 18, 2012 4:14 AM GMT
    Size_Queen_92 saidI think University degrees are a bullshit waste of time. Its just a place for friendless loosers who can't survive for shit in the outside world to fuck around and waste time and there parents money and effort while they play video games and socially isolate themselves from the outside world. fucking virgin nerds are loosers.

    IMO real life skills dont come from college but from actually experience in the real world and making friends and social interactions. I spend two years at college, got no where, and realised it was a waste of time and I would never be able to get through anyway cause the system is biased against LGBT and is homophobic. I'm sick of institutionalised discrimination and thats why i refuse to play their little game of oppression.


    First, are you serious? Second, "there" refers to a specific place or location, "their" shows possession, and "they're" means they are. Please note this, and use them correctly from this point on. Third, you meant to use losers rather than "loosers", and those losers are going to be a big part of your future. When you're used up by the time you're 30 and still waiting tables, you'll be looking at them and hoping they leave a generous tip.

    The fact that you spent two years in a university and dropped out says nothing about "the system", but rather that you simply couldn't make the cut. College might not be for everyone, and there is nothing wrong with that, but don't lay your hangups on those of us who are working our way through a college degree that will lead to a promising career.
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    Nov 18, 2012 4:17 AM GMT
    Size_Queen_92 saidI think University degrees are a bullshit waste of time. Its just a place for friendless loosers who can't survive for shit in the outside world to fuck around and waste time and there parents money and effort while they play video games and socially isolate themselves from the outside world. fucking virgin nerds are loosers.

    IMO real life skills dont come from college but from actually experience in the real world and making friends and social interactions. I spend two years at college, got no where, and realised it was a waste of time and I would never be able to get through anyway cause the system is biased against LGBT and is homophobic. I'm sick of institutionalised discrimination and thats why i refuse to play their little game of oppression.


    Uhhh... elaborate on how this institutional discrimination is keeping you from completing required coursework toward a degree?
  • Medjai

    Posts: 2671

    Nov 18, 2012 4:17 AM GMT
    bodyboarder725 said
    Medjai saidThat sounds like justifications for an uneducated individual being jealous of the educated.


    you saying that is proof of what I'm arguing lol using education as a way to establish yourself as better than a lesser-educated person.

    As for the homeless thing... yea if I turn back my quality of life now i would notice it and wanna go back to where I am... but as a cavemen, I was never in this position. You can stay where you are and then go to a higher standard of living, and you would go back to where you are now. But if you go backwards, you'll probably never get over it. Cavemen had nothing to go back to.


    Trolling successful then? I'm still not very good at it...
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    Nov 18, 2012 4:17 AM GMT
    bodyboarder725 said
    Medjai saidThat sounds like justifications for an uneducated individual being jealous of the educated.


    you saying that is proof of what I'm arguing lol using education as a way to establish yourself as better than a lesser-educated person.

    As for the homeless thing... yea if I turn back my quality of life now i would notice it and wanna go back to where I am... but as a cavemen, I was never in this position. You can stay where you are and then go to a higher standard of living, and you would go back to where you are now. But if you go backwards, you'll probably never get over it. Cavemen had nothing to go back to.


    We are way past the caveman phase sir...last time I checked its 2012 unless you're still watching this movie

    220px-Ten_thousand_b_c.jpg
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    Nov 18, 2012 4:19 AM GMT
    bodyboarder725 said
    Medjai saidThat sounds like justifications for an uneducated individual being jealous of the educated.


    you saying that is proof of what I'm arguing lol using education as a way to establish yourself as better than a lesser-educated person.

    As for the homeless thing... yea if I turn back my quality of life now i would notice it and wanna go back to where I am... but as a cavemen, I was never in this position. You can stay where you are and then go to a higher standard of living, and you would go back to where you are now. But if you go backwards, you'll probably never get over it. Cavemen had nothing to go back to.


    You've totally contradicted your original argument. You're saying that if you were to lose the standard of living you enjoy now, then you would want to go back to it. Well, that places an inherent value on the advances that knowledge has given us. You can't say knowledge has no value if you would not be willing to lose the privileges you have received from it.
  • Medjai

    Posts: 2671

    Nov 18, 2012 4:19 AM GMT
    sonicpower19 said
    We are way past the caveman phase sir...last time I checked its 2012 unless you're still watching this movie

    220px-Ten_thousand_b_c.jpg


    THAT MOVIE WAS SO RIFE WITH INACCURACIES THAT IT SHOULD BE BURNED AND FORGOTTEN!!!

    Yes, the caps were completely necessary.
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    Nov 18, 2012 4:24 AM GMT
    Most people need a college degree to get by in this world now, unless you are smart and have a plan. That plan can be anything in all honesty. Being smart comes in different forms: Intellectual, streets, common sense. Some people only have one of those or all three. But just because you went to a big university does not mean you are the smartest person. It's what you do with that degree and/or your life...

    Also please don't insult Harvard, while I didn't graduate from there. I took classes there in college and I am very proud of that fact. I don't think I am better than anyone for that, but it is accomplishment no one will ever be able to take away from me
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    Nov 18, 2012 4:25 AM GMT
    Hawk_Guy13 said
    bodyboarder725 said
    Medjai saidThat sounds like justifications for an uneducated individual being jealous of the educated.


    you saying that is proof of what I'm arguing lol using education as a way to establish yourself as better than a lesser-educated person.

    As for the homeless thing... yea if I turn back my quality of life now i would notice it and wanna go back to where I am... but as a cavemen, I was never in this position. You can stay where you are and then go to a higher standard of living, and you would go back to where you are now. But if you go backwards, you'll probably never get over it. Cavemen had nothing to go back to.


    You've totally contradicted your original argument. You're saying that if you were to lose the standard of living you enjoy now, then you would want to go back to it. Well, that places an inherent value on the advances that knowledge has given us. You can't say knowledge has no value if you would not be willing to lose the privileges you have received from it.


    That's not contradicting my original argument... I said that going forward from where we are now has no value. Going backwards would be bad because of the "level" of living that knowledge has gotten us to. That would actually give knowledge even less value than I already mentioned because it gets us used to a seemingly better standard of living. If we never raised it up to this point we would never get spoiled.

    But don't take this so seriously, it's just something to wonder about...
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 18, 2012 4:25 AM GMT
    Let me answer your question: "Is knowledge really valuable"

    You asked an ambiguous question with a very unclear explanation which truly does not make anything clearer. Technology and knowledge does not relate as much as you may think.

    Britannica states: "knowledge can be gained through a person's experience or education."

    Facts, information, and other date has nothing to do with knowledge.

    Personally, I believe higher education is valuable, I think that was what the OP is trying to ask: If getting an education is valuable nowadays. In college you learn A LOT. For the most part, everyone begins on their own and is forced to be independent. College is the perfect place for liberalism and independent thinking and leads one to find more about oneself. You are thrown into a thinking environment inside and outside the classroom. From study abroad to class lectures you are engrossed in the world around you and you view things in a new lens.

    However, one of the most important things you learn are life lessons. You learn so much about yourself and what you want to do in life. It is a once in a lifetime experience that everyone should take advantage of when they get the offer.
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    Nov 18, 2012 4:27 AM GMT
    bodyboarder725 saidThat's not contradicting my original argument... I said that going forward from where we are now has no value. Going backwards would be bad because of the "level" of living that knowledge has gotten us to. That would actually give knowledge even less value than I already mentioned because it gets us used to a seemingly better standard of living. If we never raised it up to this point we would never get spoiled.
    What are you even actually saying? I legitimately have no idea what the fuck you're talking about.
  • Medjai

    Posts: 2671

    Nov 18, 2012 4:28 AM GMT
    bodyboarder725 said
    That's not contradicting my original argument... I said that going forward from where we are now has no value. Going backwards would be bad because of the "level" of living that knowledge has gotten us to. That would actually give knowledge even less value than I already mentioned because it gets us used to a seemingly better standard of living. If we never raised it up to this point we would never get spoiled.

    But don't take this so seriously, it's just something to wonder about...


    I simply cannot fathom why you'd suggest that advancement has no benefit. Sure, there's always going to be more to know, but that does not devalue what's been acquired at all...
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    Nov 18, 2012 4:54 AM GMT
    The attitude of "useless learning" that I see in today's students directly correlates to the reason why we as a nation are more and more uneducated, and less qualified to fill the few career opportunities that exist. Without knowledge, all that exists is a population of unskilled labor. And you know where THOSE jobs are--and they're not coming back.

    The US high school dropout rate is near 25%. Go to your local WalMart (if you dare). People watch. This is what America is becoming. The lack of "wanting to learn" just amazes me.

    I think the OP needs to spend about 30 more years in the working world.
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    Nov 18, 2012 5:00 AM GMT
    garyinla saidThe attitude of "useless learning" that I see in today's students directly correlates to the reason why we as a nation are more and more uneducated, and less qualified to fill the few career opportunities that exist. Without knowledge, all that exists is a population of unskilled labor. And you know where THOSE jobs are--and they're not coming back.

    The US high school dropout rate is near 25%. Go to your local WalMart (if you dare). People watch. This is what America is becoming. The lack of "wanting to learn" just amazes me.

    I think the OP needs to spend about 30 more years in the working world.


    I'm not one of them. Graduated near the top of my class, freshman double major here in college with an internship this winter icon_biggrin.gif
  • Just_Tim

    Posts: 1723

    Nov 18, 2012 5:12 AM GMT
    I wish you had figured all this out before learning how to write.