FORUMS > Rowing Forum Rules

I have been at the gym using a machine doing about 300 meters at a time. What is normal and times???

"Normal" is too generic a term to respond to. It all depends on what your goals are and where you are at in your fitness level and what level your rowing technique is at. Here's a good link to start. Google things like "ergometer training" "ergometer scores" etc. and that should keep you busy. When you're done reading, you should be able to set up your own personal training goals.

http://www.concept2.com/us/training/programs/competition.asp

Most rowers go by time rather than distance on a machine, but a typical rowing workout on the water is 1600 meters-ish. On the rowing machine, a 'normal' 500 meter split time for a non-rower or beginner rower would be about 2:30-2:45. This is the split that almost any beginner rower could hold almost indefinitely--boredom non-withstanding.

20 minutes on the Concept II is the quickest way to an ass kicking you can get from a workout. I put the tension at the highest level, then start with 5 minutes at a 2:30 pace, then I do 15-20 minutes of alternating 10 reps @ 1:50 pace, recovering with 10 reps @ 2:30 between the "Power Tens," then finishing with another 5 minutes of slow easy pace. The key is to maintain control at all times, remaining smooth and level arms throughout the stroke. I see people on the Ergs all the time jerking their hands over there knees. Remember,legs, back (straight) then arms on the pull then reverse sequence on the recovery. Keep your finger loose. But go at a pace that allows you to get your heart rate up to 75% for the main set.

Reverse C..!! =)

portrowr17 saidReverse C..!! =)

Clarification:
legs > back > arms on the pull back.
arms > back > legs on the recovery forward.

Here in United Kingdom they are doing
The Concept 2 Challenge Series
www.concept2.co.uk/challengeseries
Beginning in September 2008 you will be able to take part in this new participation-driven league series. The Concept 2 Challenge Series is a league, a ranking and a monthly challenge all rolled into one.
First Challenge is the O’Neill Fitness test, a 4 minute row designed to give a simple and reliable test of aerobic fitness. Aerobic fitness is a good indicator of general condition as it underpins 95% of all forms of activity. The closing date for round 1 is Wednesday 1st October at 5pm, gmt but don't forget you don't have to stick with the first time you enter, you can do row the Challenge as many times as you like and update your result with your best time for the month.
Individuals from outside Britain and Ireland can enter, although they are not eligible for the prizes.
(Your prize is to yourself been that much fitter)


Just done O’Neill Fitness test 1045 metres in four minutes not to bad
but room for improvement

good luck kev

armylad saidHere in United Kingdom they are doing
The Concept 2 Challenge Series
www.concept2.co.uk/challengeseries
Beginning in September 2008 you will be able to take part in this new participation-driven league series. The Concept 2 Challenge Series is a league, a ranking and a monthly challenge all rolled into one.
First Challenge is the O’Neill Fitness test, a 4 minute row designed to give a simple and reliable test of aerobic fitness. Aerobic fitness is a good indicator of general condition as it underpins 95% of all forms of activity. The closing date for round 1 is Wednesday 1st October at 5pm, gmt but don't forget you don't have to stick with the first time you enter, you can do row the Challenge as many times as you like and update your result with your best time for the month.
Individuals from outside Britain and Ireland can enter, although they are not eligible for the prizes.
(Your prize is to yourself been that much fitter)


Just done O’Neill Fitness test 1045 metres in four minutes not to bad
but room for improvement

good luck kev

Sounds very cool. Will give it a try.

I didn't see this mentioned - may have missed it - but remember that your split/500m will change depending on what resistance setting you use, so bear that in mind when you compare your times to others.

My rowing club always used setting 5 (of 10), on the concept 2s. I still use that now. I think my PB for 500m is 1:43ish, but I'm a lightweight - the hardest I can pull is 1:39, but only for a few strokes. My favourite sessions are several sets of 2k (averaging 1:50ish/500m), or a couple of 2ks and a 5k. Sometimes I'll do a number of intervals of 500m, averaging 1:47ish/500m, with a rest of between 30 and 60 secs between each.

Nothing extraordinary or very exciting.

The concept2 website previously mentioned has tons of info and schedules.

Make sure you're always paying attention to good technique!

Have fun!

I would say to start at doing sets of 1000 and just aim to keep your 500 avg below 2:00. I am not sure what kind of erg you are using. If you are with a group of people, erg relays are fun too. :]

In high school we would row 2000 meters trying to keep our splits (time per 500 meters) under 2 minutes. Try that out. You'll want to kill yourself when you're done

I'll echo what most of the guys are saying here.... I would advise that you spend a little time ensuring your technique is correct... Rarely have I seen somebody at the gym using good form... And the better the form, the more beneficial the would.

Check out this page on Concept2s website... compare your form to the animation/vid as a first step:
http://www.concept2.com/us/training/technique.asp

If you poke around a little on the site you can find online rankings that provide the information you are seeking by age group. Whereever you start, don't be discouraged, just work on improving... trust me you will.....

Hope this helps a bit.

Hi guys
As a former competitive rower, and current rowing coach I can say that ''normal'' rowing times vary a lot by height and weight. When I was at my best, my best 500m time was 1:27.8 and my best 2K time was 6:29.9--needless to say, both of these are beyond using the erg for fitness.

If you are looking to do interval pieces on the ergs, the best way I've found is to use the interval/rest timer function with a minimum of 45sec ON (otherwise you don't have enough strokes to bring the rate and pressure up) and between 15sec and 1min off... You should aim for a 2:1 ratio of On:Off time.

Furthermore, Stoms, based on your height, I would aim for a 2:00-2:05 split for a 2000m piece, for shorter pieces, you should try to be below that... On that note, proper technique will definitely help you achieve a lower split time (and prevent injuries). Try and find a rower at your gym who can explain proper technique... and if that's not possible, the most basic pointer I can give is that if you don't feel it in your quads, you most likely have the sequence of actions out of order... Feel free to message me any questions.

I used to row competitively and coach too.

Impressive times tbalsamo. I do 1500m in about 5 mins 45 on a good day. Ergos were a rarity when I was your age. You are retired from competitive rowing at the tender age of 20??

Stoms74 you should ignore those times for now. The technique tips above are fine but after that the most common mistake I see is people setting the resistance too high. You should set it on 1/lowest for a Concept2 till you are much further advanced. 300m is pointless; there's no use in busting a gut for 2 minutes then stopping. Depending what your aims and level are, I should think 1500 - 5000 would make more sense. And take it steady. Build up the rate, resistance and duration over many weeks or even months.

The gym I use is running a challenge this month but only 5-6 of us have taken it up. 500m either level 5 or 10. I think the fact that the 3rd person did 500m on level 10 in 1 min 26 has put the rest off (mine was 1-47).
I've trained on it more for endurance than speed- normal distance 15km,1 hour , level 10. Then mop up the puddles either side. Glutes go a bit numb after 50 minutes

kew1 said... Glutes go a bit numb after 50 minutes

True that.
I could go a lot longer if it didn't make my arse hurt so much.

(and there's the lob, ready for an easy spike)

I'm quite embarrassed about my rowing times. I don't look or feel particularly out of shape, but gosh, when I get on the rower I seem to go nowhere quickly. I use the excuse that I'm short, so my legs are shorter and I require more strokes to row the same distance as someone with longer legs. But still. While I usually do interval training on the rower, If I were to go steady I think I could manage something just below 10 minutes/2000m. That's a measly 2:25ish/500m, nothing to rave about. This is also at roughly 22 strokes/min. I'm not sure if my problem is my stroke rate is too low or that my distance per stroke isn't all that great.

Anyways, it's a hell of a workout lol

rating 22 is very low. I am 6 foot 5 and I do about 24 when I'm comfortable, or up to high 30s when pushing it. used to touch 40 in a boat racing when I was your age. At your height, and your age and fitness you should be in the high 30s.

your "problem" must be technique I think.

Try to get a little expert help (from somone who rows/rowed rather than a gym trainer would be best). Failing that, try to find some videos on line.

Legs then back then arms is a good start, as someone says above. but it only works if you connect. See what I mean by keeping your hands stationary at the start of the stroke and pushing your legs down. The "oar" doesn't move much so you don't do any effective work. In British rowing slang, you "bumshove". Instead try to engage your back as you push with your legs, then bring the back then the arms fully in to play.

At the end of the stroke, reverse your arms back out again very smartly before you lean forward and only then start up the slide. Otherwise you tend to start coming up the slide while you are still pulling back, cancelling each other out and meaning again no effective work. I see that all the time in the gym. We call that (rather boringly) rushing the slide.

once you get the technique right you'll be able to increase the rating and your speed/distance greatly.

Or just forget about the numbers, and slog your heart out getting nowhere but feeling knackered so you clearly have a good workout!

Thanks everyone for your input, I will decrease the resistant to about 5 and do 500 meters. I will post up my times when I get a chance. All the information was very helpful.

Cool. I await with interest :-)

Your goals here are really important. Are you going for cv endurance in which case just row at a steady pace for 30 - 40' ( but you will need an ipod!)? Use a hear rate monitor and keep your rate at 65-70% of your maximum heart.

If you are going for a high level of aerobic fitness do interval training on the rower keeping your hear rate at 80%+ of maximum heart rate. Steadily increase the number of intervals so that your total time on the rower is 20 - 30'

I'm late to the party, but thought this might be helpful.

Concept II, maker of the rowing ergometers used by competitive rowers,
has this excellent workout calculator. Put in the basic data and it gives you a recommended workout for your level and goals.

http://www.concept2.com/us/interactive/workoutoftheday.asp

If you are using the erg at your gym the number on the side is almost alway wrong and gives a false idea of your true resistance. You will need to check the erg's drag factor. I typically have my rowers train and test at about 115 setting. What model number is written on the erg's monitor? if it is a PM3 or 4 then there is a setting in the menus. Otherwise if it is an older PM2 I think you need to hold two buttons for a few seconds.


Anyhow, the numbers you want to be pulling depend on what you are training for. Are you planning on doing any indoor races? Are you looking to join a rowing club and be competitive?

Based on what your answer is I recommend the following book. "Training For Rowing" by Ed Mcnealy. He is the strength and conditioning coach for many of the Canadian Olympic teams including the rowers. I met him some years back when he came and talked to my college team.

These days I base all my training programs for the clubs I coach off his methods, which are the same used by the Canadian National Teams.

Workouts are broken down into the following...

Cat 2
Target Heart Rate ~90-100%
Duration 30-90 min
Session/week 2
Sessions/day 1
Workout type Interval
Work 2-7 min
Rest 10-20 min

Cat 3
~90-100%
30-90 min
1-3
1
Interval
4-10 min
8-20 min

Cat 4
~85-90%
30-90 min
1-5
1-2
Interval or SS
5-10 min
5-10 min

Cat 5
75-85%
45-120 min
2-5
1-3
Interval or SS
Long
Varied

Cat 6
65-75%
45-120 min
3-8
1-3
Steady State
Long
None

The majority of all rowing programs are Cat 6 workouts. on the off season that is pretty much all you do. Cat 6 workouts are long, boring and extremely beneficial to lowering your race times. Once you have a solid base you can start to build. Depending on where you want to peak, and what type of race you plan on you can plan a taper.


I hope this does not all overload your circuits...

Here is a list of workouts. You are free of course to modify them based on your heart rate and mess around within the confines of the above Categories. Whereever you see "2K" of "6k" those assume you know the fastest you pull a 2k or 6k race on the erg. In the spring and summer 2K erg tests are done to rank rowers on speed and power and in the fall and winter we use 6k times.

Cat 6

3x20 minute 20,22,24

10 min each @20,22,24spm

45 minute steady state

2x20’ steady state 6K+8sec, 5 minutes active rest

Pyramids. 2 min each rate (18, 20,22, 20,1 (20, 22, 24, 22, 20) (22, 24,26, 28,paddle) X 2 or 3

2x20’ steady state slightly harder than “Conversational pressure”

Castles 2x (5 min each 24, 26, 24, 26, 24)

Hour of Power

2 x 30', each 10' split into 4',3',2',1' increasing rates

4’x15 with 10 jump squats in between.

60 minutes with power 10 every 5’ at 6K minus 10”

2x25 minutes at 6K plus 15 seconds

70 minutes at 6k plus 16 seconds

70 minutes at 6K plus 16 negative splitting every 10’ 10 6k minus 13 and then back up.







Cat 5

Warm up 15 min each @22,24,26spm.

10 minute pyramids

10k negative split every 1k

2x30’ Pyramid. 5, 4 3,2,1’ base rate at a 24 or 26.

50’ at 6K plus 10 seconds

2x20’ at 6K plus 6-9 with 3 minutes rest



Cat 4

2x2000k @ 24, 26spm

Warm up 10 min each @22,24,26spm at 6K + 10 seconds

10 minute pyramids

3x 3k at 6K plus 4 with 5’ rest

12x90 seconds on with 45 seconds off



Cat 3

5k extended warm-up, 3x5mins (1st 5 min 40 secs on, 20 off, 2nd 5 mins 30 secs on, 30 off, 3rd 5 mins 20 on, 40 off) 5 mins active rest between each set

10 minute pyramids

3x10 minutes @ 28 2k+8 seconds

1000, 750, 250 max stroke rate 5’ rest between

6x1000m at 6K minus 1-3 seconds

3x2K 1st 6K or better, 2nd 2K or better, 3rd 6K plus 2 or better. 5 minutes rest



Cat 2

5x20 strokes MAX effort, 5 minutes rest

10x40 seconds on with 20 seconds off x4


Misc/Cat “1”

2x20@22. 1x10@28, 5 minutes at 90% pressure @ 28

5k,4k,3k,2k,1k increasing stroke rates each piece, negative splitting each distance

30 minute warm up, 2K race simulation, 30-45 minute cool down

Dirty Dozens

P.S. All these comparing times is irrelevant. Sure, a lower 2K time is better. On a competitive level one way to rank rowers is with a Watts/Weight ratio.

After a 2K erg test look up how many watts you pulled on average. Divide that number by your weight. You should get a number around 1 up to 2. If you pull anything around a 1 you are pulling your weight only. The best rowers pull close to 2 or above. That means in addition to their own weight they are pulling a second person of equal weight. This is important as a racing shell can weigh around 200 lbs. Add in a coxswain and its about another 110-130 lbs. If a rower is pulling less than a 1.... well lets just say you can seat race them against a Twinkie and the Twinkie will will every time.

And remember.... Ergs dont float. Just because a guy has a phenomenal erg time does not mean he can make a boat move. A lot of coaches learn this the hard way and only put the fastest erg times in a boat without proper seat racing on the water.

Oh, the concepts 1 and 2s. 300mtrs is not bad, but trying out 8 x 500mtrs will set up with sprint-ability and a moderate level of endurance.

also, try increasing by meters, i.e.,
2 x 500, 1 x 1000, 1 x 1500, 1 x 2000, 1 x 1500, 1 x 1000, 2 x 500

it's crazy to erg at all, but once you're finished, you'll be glad you did. =]