Who Specifically is Responsible US Financial Woes…?

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    Sep 20, 2008 4:38 PM GMT

    I think it is important to create a Knock (sp?) list (aka Mission Impossible) of those institutions and persons responsible directly or indirectly for the fine financial mess they have gotten us into.

    I believe it is also important to be sensitive to slander and libel. I believe it would also be beneficial to include those behind the gold-price suppression scheme to see how much cross-over there is. So I would challenge group to create an on-going list of culprits (reasons, institutions, and persons) for all to see.

    Now, I believe the cause is many fold with not one or two reasons, persons, or institutions behind it. So, I will start the list of reasons and post a link that may help jump-start the discussion (These are not in a particular order that I can discern).

    SEC Decision in 2002 (NPR) that allowed some banks to go from 15:1 to 30:1 leverage.

    SEC looking the other way on short sellers and other important regulations.

    CFTC failure to regulate the commodities markets.

    Naked Shorting of all stocks.

    Shorting of Gold Market by to-large-to-fail US and European banks in the face of an estimated 1500 ton production deficit to demand — done at the bidding of ESF.

    Leasing of US Gold Reserve (and European gold reserves) to contain interest rates below the actual rate of inflation in order to dupe bond market and stock market.

    Greed and lack of ethics from the top down starting in the mid to late 1980’s.

    Repeal of the gold standard and confiscation of gold in the 1930’s.

    Repeal of the gold standard by President Nixon in the early 1970’s.

    Repeal of the Glass-Steagall Act by President Clinton, supported by his Secretary of Treasurer at the time (Robert Rubin), and the Congressional members who voted for it and introduced it, including Gramm, Leach, and, Bliley.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glass-Steagall_Act

    The Creation and increase in Power of the Plunge Protection Team and any and all members who make decisions for our country without transparency or accountability. This one is about to get worse with new powers given to Treasury and Fed in upcoming legislation.

    The Concept of Sovereign Immunity as it pertains to governmental decisions by the Fed and its partner banks that participate in the silver and gold price suppression scheme. SI is the concept in which the King and his entourage (government) is not touchable by the courts except where the government allows itself to be sued.

    The two-tier gold markets, one transparent and the other not-transparent, used to set the price of gold independent of its market. See Red Barron articles at goldeagle.com.

    The politics and influence brought to bear the CPI and PPI in which there is a built-in reason to report lower than authenticate numbers. See articles related to how they determine these rates now vs. in the 1970’s. There are at least 3 differences that throw the determination of these into doubt as being valid today.

    Power of futures markets in discovering the price of commodities sometimes without a real connection to the underlying assets availability. See GATA and its treatment of this subject.

    The influence of the Banking Lobby on Congress and election politics.

    The creation, reach, span, and influence of the Federal Reserve.

    The failure of Greenspan and Rubin to tell Congress to regulate Derivative’s markets in the late 1990’s.

    Citigroup’s role in the repeal of the Glass-Steagal Act (who are the persons at Citigroup responsible for this?)

    The leaders of Fannie and Freddie and the lobbyists behind them. Congress and its failure to act sooner.

    That should be a list of some of the more obvious reasons, persons, and institutions. Hopefully, I have sparked the discussion and the creation of the list. Feel free to add to the list as one sees fit. Please no libel or slander unless true, in which case truth trumps.

  • GQjock

    Posts: 11649

    Sep 20, 2008 6:48 PM GMT
    Phil Gramm this is the man who helped push through The Financial Modernization Act of 1999, also known as the "Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act,"
    (I don't see Clinton's name on this bill - in 1999 we had a republican House and Senate if I recall0
    This Bill effectively repealed the Glass-Steagall Act which was passed during the Depression Era as a measure intended to avoid a repeat of the 1929 Stock Market Crash.

    The Glass-Steagall Act prohibited a bank from offering investment, commercial banking and insurance services, or from consolidating with other companies providing such services.

    Then there was the Commodity Futures Modernization Act written by Uncle Phil Again
    which snuck through on an unsuspecting and uncomprehending Congress in the year 2000. This piece of work allowed the so-called Enron loophole which is currently being exploited by insolvent banks and other large financial institutions to speculate in oil futures.
    Even more toxic and mega-destructive than the Enron loophole is this act's deregulation of credit default swaps, which are essentially insurance policies against bond losses. Normally insurance products are regulated by the states, and this act keeps both the states and federal regulatory agencies such as the SEC and CFTC out of this arena.
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    Sep 20, 2008 8:46 PM GMT
    funny pictures
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    Sep 21, 2008 2:45 AM GMT
    Greed and misinformation. . The media has this death wish about creating a
    "bad economy" regardless of the real economic reality.. Wall street kicks in and tries to set up a condition where it will "make a killing" shorting stocks in a souring economy.

    The media keeps up the bad economy news but it never really happens...then its hell to pay ......someone has to pay for of all of those shorted stocks because the bad economy never happened. Boom.... wall street is left with its ass hanging out without sufficient resources to cover it losses.

    Solution: Shorting need to curtailed big time but that's how people/brokerage houses make "real money" in the stock market.
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    Sep 21, 2008 2:47 AM GMT
    I'd blame Phill Gramm, but hey, maybe I'm just a whiner.
  • Koaa2

    Posts: 1556

    Sep 21, 2008 2:49 AM GMT
    I think Ronald Reagan started to deregulate everything, and this could have started the ball rolling.
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    Sep 21, 2008 3:07 AM GMT
    mswete saidI'd blame Phill Gramm, but hey, maybe I'm just a whiner.
    icon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gif
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Sep 21, 2008 3:41 AM GMT
    Could someone please tell me how the media is to blame for reporting the attributes to a downward economy such as the unemployment rate, the financial crisis, the mortgage meltdown, the deficit, etc etc? Face the facts!
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    Sep 21, 2008 5:46 AM GMT
    Something more here!!!

    http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601039&sid=amhY7f0W2igY&refer=home
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    Sep 21, 2008 6:00 AM GMT
    Azstreaker saidSomething more here!!!

    http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601039&sid=amhY7f0W2igY&refer=home


    You so rock! Thanks for posting this stuff. I keep saying that there is an Enron or two about to bubble up to the surface. I agree with Ann Woolner, go for civil suits if criminality will be hard to prove in this clusterf*ck of a meltdown.
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    Sep 21, 2008 6:12 AM GMT

    Because the true fact is that the world and the USA have never been so cash fat in the history of the planet. Trust me, people in the 1970's people did not buy $3.00 coffees and kids didn't drive beemers or new Jettas . My first house came with a 16% mortgage that i was lucky to get. The big debate was if the economy could still support get this . three TV Networks or three automobile makers!!!!! Unemployment.....someone had to die in order to get a job and inflation was 15%. I would spend my pay check the day i got it to keep it from devaluating. The average house size was 1,600 s.f not todays 2,400 s,f, etc etc etc.

    Enjoy the abundance.














    coolarmydude saidCould someone please tell me how the media is to blame for reporting the attributes to a downward economy such as the unemployment rate, the financial crisis, the mortgage meltdown, the deficit, etc etc? Face the facts!





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    Sep 21, 2008 6:13 AM GMT
    ruck_us said
    Azstreaker saidSomething more here!!!

    http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601039&sid=amhY7f0W2igY&refer=home


    You so rock! Thanks for posting this stuff. I keep saying that there is an Enron or two about to bubble up to the surface. I agree with Ann Woolner, go for civil suits if criminality will be hard to prove in this clusterf*ck of a meltdown.


    It's a huge mess and now I am mad!! LOL I am looking at all kinds of stuff. They make money and then they want all the...rest of us....to bail them out when they fail!!
  • CuriousJockAZ

    Posts: 19138

    Sep 21, 2008 6:35 AM GMT
    The economy is going to be fine, it's the markets and Wall Street that are in the shitter. Give it 6 months and we will forget this ever happened.
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    Sep 21, 2008 6:37 AM GMT
    CuriousJockAZ saidThe economy is going to be fine, it's the markets and Wall Street that are in the shitter. Give it 6 months and we will forget this ever happened.


    LOL...we just added another trillion to it all!
  • CuriousJockAZ

    Posts: 19138

    Sep 21, 2008 6:39 AM GMT
    Yeah, so, you act like that is going to really change anything in YOUR life? Tell us, how is this personally affecting you?
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    Sep 21, 2008 6:46 AM GMT
    CuriousJockAZ saidYeah, so, you act like that is going to really change anything in YOUR life? Tell us, how is this personally affecting you?


    Rrrr.... Now this is another discussion. I do think it will hit home eventually. It will just drag the dollar down lower bla...bla....I will finish later..lol

    I do smell a BIG TAX increase!! You can part with some of that extra you got stashed....
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Sep 21, 2008 6:49 AM GMT
    Two dudes.

    One is named Dumbass, the other Greed.
  • GQjock

    Posts: 11649

    Sep 21, 2008 11:31 AM GMT
    It's the Culture we are living in Joseph Stiglitz has said that America cannot survive as an economy by pushing paper around, flipping burgers and suing each other

    We no longer Make anything
    Our Industries have all been sent over seas because we've handed
    the reins of our economy over to the CEOs
    Whose only concern is profit ... specifically for themselves

    We've deregulated everything to the point where cpmpanies can do the hell they want
    they can nickle and dime workers to the point where they are NOW ... actually with less mean income then a generation ago
    Unions have gone from 35% of companies to 9%
    they are free to pollute as they see fit with the Blessing of a hobbled EPA

    And with this going on Right Now
    To have the evidence of the FOLLY of the corporate mentality where
    all the Gains are privatized But the Losses are Socialized
    and STILL people are looking at Grampy as a Viable candidate????

    You're really kidding me right?


  • jarhead5536

    Posts: 1348

    Sep 21, 2008 3:53 PM GMT
    Who is responsible? The Republican Party.

    Capitalism is the most efficient method of wealth creation and social mobility ever. It is however ruthless and unforgiving. Capitalism requires vigorous and eternally vigilant regulation to control it's worst excesses, and it will fight such regulation tooth and nail. For a government to lay down like a cheap whore in front of the march of capitalism as RONALD REAGAN and his disciples have done is the very height of short sighted irresponsibility. The result is what we have now - a colossal government intervention. Let this be an abject lesson to all the pro-business supply siders here: capitalism cares not one bit about the common good or general welfare. Capitalism cares about profit, profit, profit - the long term stability of this nation be damned.
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Sep 21, 2008 3:54 PM GMT
    Alpha13 said, "Because the true fact is that the world and the USA have never been so cash fat in the history of the planet. Trust me, people in the 1970's people did not buy $3.00 coffees and kids didn't drive beemers or new Jettas . My first house came with a 16% mortgage that i was lucky to get. The big debate was if the economy could still support get this . three TV Networks or three automobile makers!!!!! Unemployment.....someone had to die in order to get a job and inflation was 15%. I would spend my pay check the day i got it to keep it from devaluating. The average house size was 1,600 s.f not todays 2,400 s,f, etc etc etc.

    Enjoy the abundance."


    Thanks for not implicating the media like I asked. You validate my point.

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    Sep 21, 2008 3:55 PM GMT
    And the current administration is all about privatizing profits and socializing losses.
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    Sep 21, 2008 4:12 PM GMT
    GQjock saidIt's the Culture we are living in Joseph Stiglitz has said that America cannot survive as an economy by pushing paper around, flipping burgers and suing each other

    We no longer Make anything
    Our Industries have all been sent over seas because we've handed
    the reins of our economy over to the CEOs
    Whose only concern is profit ... specifically for themselves

    We've deregulated everything to the point where cpmpanies can do the hell they want
    they can nickle and dime workers to the point where they are NOW ... actually with less mean income then a generation ago
    Unions have gone from 35% of companies to 9%
    they are free to pollute as they see fit with the Blessing of a hobbled EPA

    And with this going on Right Now
    To have the evidence of the FOLLY of the corporate mentality where
    all the Gains are privatized But the Losses are Socialized
    and STILL people are looking at Grampy as a Viable candidate????

    You're really kidding me right?



    You nailed it, GQ. (Me next! icon_biggrin.gif) I have been concerned about the exodus of manufacturing to foreign nations, primarily to Asia, since the early 1990's. I used to check labels to select products made in the USA, or if none were available, I'd try to at least purchase those produced in friendlier nations. Nowadays, that's virtually impossible. This is actually one of the reasons that I favor Obama -- he is in favor of resurrecting America's manufacturing sector.

    On that note, I guess you could also blame WalMart. Back in the day, Wally World promoted the Made in the USA label. After Sam Walton died, they chucked that idea and instead started putting intense pressure on suppliers to outsource manufacturing to countries with a cheaper labor pool -- all so that they could "slash" prices by a few pennies. Check out the PBS FrontLine documentary, "Is WalMart Good for America?"

    I also don't like the fact that the FTC is so quick to approve foreign buyouts of, or major investments in, American companies. For example, Abu Dabai, flush with oil revenues, has been buying huge stakes in many American companies, including my own (they purchased an 8% share to shore up our ailing balance sheet). With our devalued dollar and a struggling credit market, it's bargain basement shopping for foreign entities. When other countries control so much of our commerce, they can start to manipulate our economy and, thereby, our politics. And don't get me started on NAFTA and CAFTA...

    Sounds like Larry Burkett was right about "The Coming Economic Earthquake," but just a decade or so later than he projected. Someone once said that he who controls the economy controls the nation. It seems pretty clear that this is what's happening in America, today.
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    Sep 21, 2008 5:50 PM GMT
    ruck_us said
    GQjock saidIt's the Culture we are living in Joseph Stiglitz has said that America cannot survive as an economy by pushing paper around, flipping burgers and suing each other

    We no longer Make anything
    Our Industries have all been sent over seas because we've handed
    the reins of our economy over to the CEOs
    Whose only concern is profit ... specifically for themselves

    We've deregulated everything to the point where cpmpanies can do the hell they want
    they can nickle and dime workers to the point where they are NOW ... actually with less mean income then a generation ago
    Unions have gone from 35% of companies to 9%
    they are free to pollute as they see fit with the Blessing of a hobbled EPA

    And with this going on Right Now
    To have the evidence of the FOLLY of the corporate mentality where
    all the Gains are privatized But the Losses are Socialized
    and STILL people are looking at Grampy as a Viable candidate????

    You're really kidding me right?



    You nailed it, GQ. (Me next! icon_biggrin.gif) I have been concerned about the exodus of manufacturing to foreign nations, primarily to Asia, since the early 1990's. I used to check labels to select products made in the USA, or if none were available, I'd try to at least purchase those produced in friendlier nations. Nowadays, that's virtually impossible. This is actually one of the reasons that I favor Obama -- he is in favor of resurrecting America's manufacturing sector.

    On that note, I guess you could also blame WalMart. Back in the day, Wally World promoted the Made in the USA label. After Sam Walton died, they chucked that idea and instead started putting intense pressure on suppliers to outsource manufacturing to countries with a cheaper labor pool -- all so that they could "slash" prices by a few pennies. Check out the PBS FrontLine documentary, "Is WalMart Good for America?"

    I also don't like the fact that the FTC is so quick to approve foreign buyouts of, or major investments in, American companies. For example, Abu Dabai, flush with oil revenues, has been buying huge stakes in many American companies, including my own (they purchased an 8% share to shore up our ailing balance sheet). With our devalued dollar and a struggling credit market, it's bargain basement shopping for foreign entities. When other countries control so much of our commerce, they can start to manipulate our economy and, thereby, our politics. And don't get me started on NAFTA and CAFTA...

    Sounds like Larry Burkett was right about "The Coming Economic Earthquake," but just a decade or so later than he projected.

    Someone once said that he who controls the economy controls the nation. It seems pretty clear that this is what's happening in America, today.


    Now your figuring it out...we are being controlled by the bankers. They want it all....

    "Give me control of a nation's money, and
    I care not who makes her laws"

    Mayer Rothschild, the most powerful man who ever lived.


    Here are a few more links:

    http://www.fdrs.org/federal_reserve.html

    http://www.rense.com/general79/tril.htm

    Rothschilds' favorite saying who along with the Rockefellers are the major Illuminati Banking Dynasties: "Who controls the issuance of money controls the government!"
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    Sep 21, 2008 6:01 PM GMT
    To the question of how this will impact "us": higher prices, higher taxes, etc. The real trickle down of privatized gains - who exactly receives the money paid out in the government buyout? - and socialized losses - losses being bought on credit by the "taxpayers"? - is higher taxes first, higher prices, inflation, higher interest rates, etc. Even if the crisis is stabilized by the loss purchases - will consumer confidence improve so as to stimulate the economy? That depends on regular folks like us still having money to spend! I received a 2% raise this year...even as gas prices are spiking - despite the plummeting price of oil..hmm - as well as food costs, etc. And of course a strategically timed increase in parking fees at my workplace!

    Ridiculous. How are we going to be active in our now largely consumer economy if we've nothing to spend? The credit is drying up - that's part of the reason for the buyout - banks with money to lend are refusing to do so, fearing capital loss.
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    Sep 21, 2008 6:17 PM GMT

    We no longer Make anything
    Our Industries have all been sent over seas because we've handed
    the reins of our economy over to the CEOs
    Whose only concern is profit ... specifically for themselves

    et me started on NAFTA and CAFTA...
    Sounds like Larry Burkett was right about "The Coming Economic Earthquake," but just a decade or so later than he projected. Someone once said that he who controls the economy controls the nation. It seems pretty clear that this is what's happening in America, today.[/quote]


    Try to remember that only a few years ago...( before the world became cash flush thu trade and making stuff) that the USA thought it was our job to give a "living" to third world countries thru direct infusion of cash called foreign aid and thru volunteer efforts.( peace core) . Trade works so much better.

    I remember it was considered politically incorrect to pay a third world person one dollar a day for their labor! Well, 15 years later ,3 billion people making $1 a day really adds up and becomes a powerhouse economy.

    The system of trade is self leveling tho..At some point the workers in China become as rich as us and the labor advantage diminishes . This has already happened in India where engineers wages have risen to the point where we are out sourcing to the eastern block to get some price advantage.