How many of you believe in true love? Fairy tale romance has seems like it has always been geared towards heterosexual women...from childhood Disney films to Shakespearean sonnets. True I enjoy TLA films, Here! network dramas and gay romance novels, but the pop-culture doesn't incorporate or idealize romance between two men or two women. Let me know what you think.
luc21_83 saidHow many of you believe in true love? Fairy tale romance has seems like it has always been geared towards heterosexual women...from childhood Disney films to Shakespearean sonnets. True I enjoy TLA films, Here! network dramas and gay romance novels, but the pop-culture doesn't incorporate or idealize romance between two men or two women. Let me know what you think.
YES, I have had the great privilege to have experienced very powerful, mutual, true love and there is nothing better .... truly something to aspire for and I hope it finds me again.
During a relationship couples can grow and the love change. Hopefully for a deeper and more intimate love. Romance is great and I really enjoy it, but the deep love of know you are loved warts and all for better or worse is awesome and the same goes the other way. I love my partner for who he, regardless.
I guess I mean the the lose-yourself-in-the-moment, forget about everything else, quit your job and fly to Paris kind of love. I'm talking happily ever after shit, where cheating and petty dating crap is just out the window.
Love being the be all, end all, sacred romance that saves you from the doom and gloom of reality.
Quitting your job, flying to Paris, and being whirled up in a torrent of lovey emotional ecstasy is a temporary situation. Actually living with a person long term involves paying phone bills, fixing overflowing toilets, and the overwhelming banality of life.
You can be madly, deeply in love with one guy for the rest of your life. It could happen. But statistically it isn't likely. And if it does it wont be faery tale romance the whole time. People fight, people grow apart, people grow back together. It is a life together, not a continual moment.
Well needless to say, I have never believed in this type of love, nor do I believe in love at first sight or any other little fantasy romance crap...but this is why I ask the question.
It's like believing in ghosts...I don't know how to believe in something that is for the most part mythical.
BTW, Mr.Zombie, I am moving to Buffalo in January. We will be neighbors.
Quitting your job, flying to Paris, and being whirled up in a torrent of lovey emotional ecstasy is a temporary situation. Actually living with a person long term involves paying phone bills, fixing overflowing toilets, and the overwhelming banality of life.
You can be madly, deeply in love with one guy for the rest of your life. It could happen. But statistically it isn't likely. And if it does it wont be faery tale romance the whole time. People fight, people grow apart, people grow back together. It is a life together, not a continual moment.
of course it's real. i've been there. when your entire being is consumed with the image, the smell and the taste of a man. he is all you can think of. you can't bear to be apart. all you want to do is be cuddled up naked together. you know exactly what he's thinking, you finish eachother's sentences. you laugh uncontrollably at the silliest things with him. life is wonderful. you notice the trees and the flowers and birdsong and just cannot understand why everyone else seems so miserable when you're so blissfully happy?
also, all your friends and family pale into insignificance, who needs them? and frankly you make them vomit with your babyish puke making behaviour. you burn with lust and if he doesn't call or he has to go away, you feel sick to your stomach. it's unbearable. you can't concentrate on anything but thoughts of him. work is impossilbe. where is he, what's he up to, is he with someone else, does he really love you? you become ill with worry, your psychotic!
am i glad i had it? yes. do i want to feel like that again? hell no! it's just exhausting!
you burn with lust and if he doesn't call or he has to go away, you feel sick to your stomach. it's unbearable. you can't concentrate on anything but thoughts of him. work is impossilbe. where is he, what's he up to, is he with someone else, does he really love you? you become ill with worry, your psychotic!
am i glad i had it? yes. do i want to feel like that again? hell no! it's just exhausting!
Yes, I experienced that too more than once. Damn right it's exhausting and draining, and worse when you don't know if he's experiencing the same. Then someone tells you to stop being stupid and snap the hell out of it or they'll smack you in the face.
Hmmmmm. It's strange that you'd equate true love with fairy tale romance in your first two lines. There are a lot of fairy tales, some of them quite grim, so the comparison confuses without a particular story in mind.
We've been in true love for 19 years, and we're no ghosts. (Well, not yet, and it will be interesting to see what that's like.)
You said, "Love being the be all, end all, sacred romance that saves you from the doom and gloom of reality.
Oh hell yeah I believe in love. Love is an amazing thing, a great emotional gift and one of the few truly free things we are offered in life. I don't know what I would do if I didn't have love in my life. Call me an idealist, but I think the fairytale love, though a bit stylized and exaggerated does exist to some extent.
Devildog78 saidOh hell yeah I believe in love. Love is an amazing thing, a great emotional gift and one of the few truly free things we are offered in life. I don't know what I would do if I didn't have love in my life. Call me an idealist, but I think the fairytale love, though a bit stylized and exaggerated does exist to some extent.
I totally agree. Nothing makes me more happy then the feeling of new love. That mushy, giddy feeling
the love jack and ennis had in brokeback mountain was strong and undeniable, it's too bad it also destroyed two women's lives. but that's the closest we've seen to an all-out gay love story in mainstream movies in a long time
Quitting your job, flying to Paris, and being whirled up in a torrent of lovey emotional ecstasy is a temporary situation. Actually living with a person long term involves paying phone bills, fixing overflowing toilets, and the overwhelming banality of life.
You can be madly, deeply in love with one guy for the rest of your life. It could happen. But statistically it isn't likely. And if it does it wont be faery tale romance the whole time. People fight, people grow apart, people grow back together. It is a life together, not a continual moment.
Happy Hunting Romeo
I do not believe in the overly romanticized version of love the way luc21_83 describes/suggests, however MunchingZombie's perspective I can 'bite' in to.
luc21_83 saidHow many of you believe in true love? Fairy tale romance has seems like it has always been geared towards heterosexual women...from childhood Disney films to Shakespearean sonnets. True I enjoy TLA films, Here! network dramas and gay romance novels, but the pop-culture doesn't incorporate or idealize romance between two men or two women. Let me know what you think.
The real question is: why do you need pop-culture to validate same-sex romance?
The same reason anyone else benefits from these crappy shows. To not feel like we're so different or strange from others by how the media and television promote hetero based idealists viewpoints.
i do...when there are ppl out there who are with their best friend for life... people who are married for 50 years, people who need to have that specific person next to them to feel alive, people whos heart races every time that special someone walks thru the door, i sure do believe in it.
Absolutely... The holding hands wanting to get to know everything pit of your stomach kind of love
Call it what you want infatuation .... delusion we do fall in love with people whether it's a good thing or a bad thing depends on your perspective There are some men I've fallen in love with for good reason ... and there are others I look back and say .... WTF?
luc21_83 saidHow many of you believe in true love? Fairy tale romance has seems like it has always been geared towards heterosexual women...from childhood Disney films to Shakespearean sonnets. True I enjoy TLA films, Here! network dramas and gay romance novels, but the pop-culture doesn't incorporate or idealize romance between two men or two women. Let me know what you think.
first of all pop-culture = popular culture or culture of the majority. Since majority of the world population is straight, don't expect it to idealize such thing
dakuk saidof course it's real. i've been there. when your entire being is consumed with the image, the smell and the taste of a man. he is all you can think of. you can't bear to be apart. all you want to do is be cuddled up naked together. you know exactly what he's thinking, you finish eachother's sentences. you laugh uncontrollably at the silliest things with him. life is wonderful. you notice the trees and the flowers and birdsong and just cannot understand why everyone else seems so miserable when you're so blissfully happy?
also, all your friends and family pale into insignificance, who needs them? and frankly you make them vomit with your babyish puke making behaviour. you burn with lust and if he doesn't call or he has to go away, you feel sick to your stomach. it's unbearable. you can't concentrate on anything but thoughts of him. work is impossilbe. where is he, what's he up to, is he with someone else, does he really love you? you become ill with worry, your psychotic!
am i glad i had it? yes. do i want to feel like that again? hell no! it's just exhausting!
but i hope you get the chance.
YES YES YES... been there, done that and REALLY hope it finds me again!
I love you guys. Ok so there was the question: why do you need pop-culture to validate same-sex romance?
My answer: I don't. But I believe that it would help people on a broad scale beyond the gay community understand that gay love is more than just stereotypical gay lifestyle or sex. If there was one Disney animated film that could validate feelings for youthful homosexuals, I believe it could help people understand that like heterosexual romance, love is powerful and truthful. I believe it would be a groundbreaking moment for the gay community, however I wonder if the world will ever be ready for that.
Why is it ok to depict hetero romance in children's film, but depicting homo romance would be obscure?
I do believe in true love now, I didn't at first. It is a gift (from god imo), though sometimes as a couple of you mention, it is a burden. You just need to experience it once to know what it is.
But like everything in life, you have to work hard to maintain it, so it doesn't get humdrum and banal. People do it. It doesn't florish by itself.
You're gay, you are a minority, you shouldn't expect anyone to validate that type of romance -- though I'm sure many on this site will be able to if you need that type of support.
I don't know who you are. Please believe. There is no way I can convince you that this is not one of their tricks. But I don't care. I am me, and I don't know who you are, but I love you.
I have a pencil. A little one they did not find. I am a women. I hid it inside me. Perhaps I won't be able to write again, so this is a long letter about my life. It is the only autobiography I have ever written and oh God I'm writing it on toilet paper.
I was born in Nottingham in 1957, and it rained a lot. I passed my eleven plus and went to girl's Grammar. I wanted to be an actress.
I met my first girlfriend at school. Her name was Sara. She was fourteen and I was fifteen but we were both in Miss. Watson's class. Her wrists. Her wrists were beautiful. I sat in biology class, staring at the picket rabbit foetus in its jar, listening while Mr. Hird said it was an adolescent phase that people outgrew. Sara did. I didn't.
In 1976 I stopped pretending and took a girl called Christine home to meet my parents. A week later I enrolled at drama college. My mother said I broke her heart.
But it was my integrity that was important. Is that so selfish? It sells for so little, but it's all we have left in this place. It is the very last inch of us. But within that inch we are free.
London. I was happy in London. In 1981 I played Dandini in Cinderella. My first rep work. The world was strange and rustling and busy, with invisible crowds behind the hot lights and all that breathless glamour. It was exciting and it was lonely. At nights I'd go to the Crew-Ins or one of the other clubs. But I was stand-offish and didn't mix easily. I saw a lot of the scene, but I never felt comfortable there. So many of them just wanted to be gay. It was their life, their ambition. And I wanted more than that.
Work improved. I got small film roles, then bigger ones. In 1986 I starred in "The Salt Flats." It pulled in the awards but not the crowds. I met Ruth while working on that. We loved each other. We lived together and on Valentine's Day she sent me roses and oh God, we had so much. Those were the best three years of my life.
In 1988 there was the war, and after that there were no more roses. Not for anybody.
In 1992 they started rounding up the gays. They took Ruth while she was out looking for food. Why are they so frightened of us? They burned her with cigarette ends and made her give them my name. She signed a statement saying I'd seduced her. I didn't blame her. God, I loved her. I didn't blame her.
But she did. She killed herself in her cell. She couldn't live with betraying me, with giving up that last inch. Oh Ruth. . . .
They came for me. They told me that all of my films would be burned. They shaved off my hair and held my head down a toilet bowl and told jokes about lesbians. They brought me here and gave me drugs. I can't feel my tongue anymore. I can't speak.
The other gay women here, Rita, died two weeks ago. I imagine I'll die quite soon. It's strange that my life should end in such a terrible place, but for three years I had roses and I apologized to nobody.
I shall die here. Every last inch of me shall perish. Except one.
An inch. It's small and it's fragile and it's the only thing in the world worth having. We must never lose it, or sell it, or give it away. We must never let them take it from us.
I don't know who you are. Or whether you're a man or a woman. I may never see you or cry with you or get drunk with you. But I love you. I hope that you escape this place. I hope that the world turns and that things get better, and that one day people have roses again. I wish I could kiss you.
the "Love delusion", to me , is similar to the "God delusion". What can call some to their higher self can turn others into complete fucking nightmares unable to cope with the reality of living day to day life. In our quest for the fairy tale ending, we often let common sense fly out the window and leave room only for fantasy and illusion.
I've had a couple of true loves - but I was so focused on my career and climbing the proverbial "ladder of success" that I am afraid I gave my relationships something less than first priority. I let a couple of great, wonderful guys go by the wayside - not fully appreciating them - carelessly thinking there were always going to be more quality guys out there. I'd re-align my priorities if I had to do it all over again.
The type of love you are talking about here, the giddy, forget about everything else, romantic type love, I experienced once in my life, however, it was with a gal, not a guy. We were both seniors at university and we met each other by both being on the student council. That was a tough year to get through because I found it really hard to study. My mind was on her all the time.
However, I have fallen seriously in love with two men in my life and one of them I am still with after nearly 18 years. We still have romantic times and we also have are moments of disagreement as munchingzombie has pointed out. Somehow, though, looking back at my two gay love affairs, I feel that they were and are more real true love than the kind I experienced with the gal.
Jdunn1973 saidthe "Love delusion", to me , is similar to the "God delusion". What can call some to their higher self can turn others into complete fucking nightmares unable to cope with the reality of living day to day life. In our quest for the fairy tale ending, we often let common sense fly out the window and leave room only for fantasy and illusion.
That being said, of course I believe.
I find it extremely frightening to think that not only is there a possibility that God and Love are delusions, but that as a race we have struggled with these reaccuring delusions throughout history and yet we will never really know the Truth until we are dead, but might as well delude ourselves in the mean time just in case.
Biological models of sex tend to view love as a mammalian drive, much like hunger or thirst.[7] Helen Fisher, a leading expert in the topic of love, divides the experience of love into three partly-overlapping stages: lust, attraction, and attachment. Lust exposes people to others, romantic attraction encourages people to focus their energy on mating, and attachment involves tolerating the spouse long enough to rear a child into infancy. Lust is the initial passionate sexual desire that promotes mating, and involves the increased release of chemicals such as testosterone and estrogen. These effects rarely last more than a few weeks or months. Attraction is the more individualized and romantic desire for a specific candidate for mating, which develops out of lust as commitment to an individual mate forms. Recent studies in neuroscience have indicated that as people fall in love, the brain consistently releases a certain set of chemicals, including pheromones, dopamine, norepinephrine, and serotonin, which act similar to amphetamines, stimulating the brain's pleasure center and leading to side-effects such as an increased heart rate, loss of appetite and sleep, and an intense feeling of excitement. Research has indicated that this stage generally lasts from one and a half to three years.[8] Since the lust and attraction stages are both considered temporary, a third stage is needed to account for long-term relationships. Attachment is the bonding which promotes relationships that last for many years, and even decades. Attachment is generally based on commitments such as marriage and children, or on mutual friendship based on things like shared interests. It has been linked to higher levels of the chemicals oxytocin and vasopressin than short-term relationships have.[8] In 2005, Italian scientists at Pavia University found that a protein molecule known as the nerve growth factor (NGF) has high levels when people first fall in love, but these levels return to as they were after one year. Specifically, four neurotrophin levels, i.e. NGF, BDNF, NT-3, and NT-4, of 58 subjects who had recently fallen in love were compared with levels in a control group who were either single or already engaged in a long-term relationship. The results showed that NGF levels were significantly higher in the subjects in love than as compared to either of the control groups.[9]
Biological models of sex tend to view love as a mammalian drive, much like hunger or thirst.[7] Helen Fisher, a leading expert in the topic of love, divides the experience of love into three partly-overlapping stages: lust, attraction, and attachment. Lust exposes people to others, romantic attraction encourages people to focus their energy on mating, and attachment involves tolerating the spouse long enough to rear a child into infancy. Lust is the initial passionate sexual desire that promotes mating, and involves the increased release of chemicals such as testosterone and estrogen. These effects rarely last more than a few weeks or months. Attraction is the more individualized and romantic desire for a specific candidate for mating, which develops out of lust as commitment to an individual mate forms. Recent studies in neuroscience have indicated that as people fall in love, the brain consistently releases a certain set of chemicals, including pheromones, dopamine, norepinephrine, and serotonin, which act similar to amphetamines, stimulating the brain's pleasure center and leading to side-effects such as an increased heart rate, loss of appetite and sleep, and an intense feeling of excitement. Research has indicated that this stage generally lasts from one and a half to three years.[8] Since the lust and attraction stages are both considered temporary, a third stage is needed to account for long-term relationships. Attachment is the bonding which promotes relationships that last for many years, and even decades. Attachment is generally based on commitments such as marriage and children, or on mutual friendship based on things like shared interests. It has been linked to higher levels of the chemicals oxytocin and vasopressin than short-term relationships have.[8] In 2005, Italian scientists at Pavia University found that a protein molecule known as the nerve growth factor (NGF) has high levels when people first fall in love, but these levels return to as they were after one year. Specifically, four neurotrophin levels, i.e. NGF, BDNF, NT-3, and NT-4, of 58 subjects who had recently fallen in love were compared with levels in a control group who were either single or already engaged in a long-term relationship. The results showed that NGF levels were significantly higher in the subjects in love than as compared to either of the control groups.[9]
It is strange to think that love is scientifically explainable. Thank you for doing a wikipedia search on the subject..LOL!
Every morning when i look in the mirror. I think to myself. Oh Lord it's hard to be humble, when I'm perfect in every way, and then I can't help myself, I just fall in love again.
No i dont believe in love its just an emotion that gets in the way of your focus it just throws you off track.I think you may love a person for a short time,but it does not last.I myself have had strong crushes but when i try to show interest in guys they dont respond or block me,in fact i think i have a crush on on of the members on real jock but he has not written me back.IT hurts i guess i am too ugly or sometthing i dont know. Love works and then again love does not,but i am willing to give love a try if the right guy comes along with the right chemistry oooooh i am so ready for it.!!!
I don't believe in love, I know love is out there, it's human brain chemistry.
When people "fall in love" it's brain chemicals interacting to bring it about.
That certain person sets off these brain chemicals and love is in the air. The trouble with brain chemicals is; constant exposure to the same stimulus that excited the brain cehmicals (neurotransmitters) will diminish over time and unfortunately not at the same rate.
There's nothing romantic about biology but the phenomenon does make for some great songs.
I def believe in it. It's a beautiful thing; challenging, intimate, risky, scary, painful, amazing...haha it's like life itself, much more meaningful and valuable than any hook up.
..................................................................................................................................... if so ,i have never been in love.and will never be
Nope, I don't believe. I think believing in stuff like that and waiting for it to happen is actually what makes you feel lonely and incomplete. Because no love is that strong forever and no partner seems that perfect forever. There is no "forever" damn it ...
fulldelight saidNope, I don't believe. I think believing in stuff like that and waiting for it to happen is actually what makes you feel lonely and incomplete. Because no love is that strong forever and no partner seems that perfect forever. There is no "forever" damn it ...
I think I could love someone the way you believe no one can.
true love for me is unconditional love. and yes i still believe there's such a thing as unconditional love...there's nothing wrong in believing, is there?
Wow, unconditional love. Our mothers love us unconditionally, but there's no romance in it. (eww!) When in love, we feel it's going to be conditional. Why? Because if Bill murdered my mother and then threw our littlest dog in the microwave, I wouldn't be in love with him anymore. I'd likely still love him, in the way I would for any person hopelessly insane, and therefore out of control.
Being in love is conditional as it requires reciprocation. That's a big condition!
Wow, unconditional love. Our mothers love us unconditionally, but there's no romance in it. (eww!) When in love, we feel it's going to be conditional. Why? Because if Bill murdered my mother and then threw our littlest dog in the microwave, I wouldn't be in love with him anymore. I'd likely still love him, in the way I would for any person hopelessly insane, and therefore out of control.
Being in love is conditional as it requires reciprocation. That's a big condition!
We can always count on Meninlove for solid, practical non fairytale advice.......sounds like these guys got where they are at now through experience, wisdom and kind hearts.
Wow, unconditional love. Our mothers love us unconditionally, but there's no romance in it. (eww!) When in love, we feel it's going to be conditional. Why? Because if Bill murdered my mother and then threw our littlest dog in the microwave, I wouldn't be in love with him anymore. I'd likely still love him, in the way I would for any person hopelessly insane, and therefore out of control.
Being in love is conditional as it requires reciprocation. That's a big condition!
i understand you're older than me but, if this is the definition of your "true love", then i don't believe in that. My definition stands...mother's love is not always unconditional, you see abortion everywhere and moms killing their own biological babies.. Yours is a sweeping example...
i guess i'm a dreamer....but how can you not reciprocate someone who loves you unconditionally? no recipient of an unconditional love would blindlessly not reciprocate the same....you get the point...
Wow, unconditional love. Our mothers love us unconditionally, but there's no romance in it. (eww!) When in love, we feel it's going to be conditional. Why? Because if Bill murdered my mother and then threw our littlest dog in the microwave, I wouldn't be in love with him anymore. I'd likely still love him, in the way I would for any person hopelessly insane, and therefore out of control.
Being in love is conditional as it requires reciprocation. That's a big condition!
No offense but you lost me when you mentioned murder & throwing dogs in microwaves...
Unconditional love (by definition) requires no reciprocation. Sorry to contradict you, but for you(obviously) being in love is conditional.
Gosh, it seems we're offending which we certainly don't want to do!
We did, though, say OUR mothers love us unconditionally, which they do. We can't speak for all mothers, any more than we could for all brothers, sisters, cousins etc. Our point is that family is often the commonest source of unconditional love.
When a lover's love is not reciprocated it's unrequited love. Unconditional love, as well, is often not reciprocated. There are stories, movies, songs and poems composed over many ages about this very thing.
Unconditional love is not given with the expectation of any reciprocation nor is any required. That's what makes it unconditional. If you love a guy unconditionally and he leaves you, you will always remain in love with him and be unable to stop and find another as the love is unconditional.
The burning topic here is true romantic love between two people. If two people can be in love with each other unconditionally, excellent! It means that no matter what the other one does, or how much one hurts the other, they will still be madly emotionally and sexually in love with each other. This is why we brought forward such a ( apologies for that) graphic example of when one might no longer feel in love with another.
Luc, earlier in this topic you said, "Well needless to say, I have never believed in this type of love, nor do I believe in love at first sight or any other little fantasy romance crap...but this is why I ask the question.
It's like believing in ghosts...I don't know how to believe in something that is for the most part mythical."
Monogamous love is conditional. The big condition is that there be no-one else, such as open or poly-amorous relationships.
Open and poly-amorous relationships are conditional as each person must have the freedom to love (or make love) to more than one other.
In romantic relationships there are these conditions, as examples: Each must treat the other the same or better than themselves. Each must strive to understand the mystery of the other, which sometimes may take a whole lifetime ( a fascinating never-ending joy, we think). These conditions actually protect the participants, as failure of these conditions may mean falling out of love, which allows ex-lovers to move on and find another.
fulldelight saidNope, I don't believe. I think believing in stuff like that and waiting for it to happen is actually what makes you feel lonely and incomplete. Because no love is that strong forever and no partner seems that perfect forever. There is no "forever" damn it ...
I think I could love someone the way you believe no one can.
jprichva saidRegarding love, I believe Aristotle said it best, or it might have been Reinhold Niebuhr, or perhaps I said it myself:
"Bah, humbug!"
It was Scrooge in a Christmas Carol by Charles Dickens said about Christmas, not love
xkorix said "I def believe in it. It's a beautiful thing; challenging, intimate, risky, scary, painful, amazing...haha it's like life itself, much more meaningful and valuable than any hook up."
I wish you find that... I have several times and have seen in in others.
Love can be displayed in so many ways. My spouse rarely will say I love you, but he shows it by cooking a nice dinner, a hug, kiss or calling me when I travel.
Today, he was leaving work before me and said good bye and headed down the stairs to leave, then realized he forgot to give me a kiss..he ran back up wrapped me in his arms and give me a great kiss..then headed off to work.
meninloveMonogamous love is conditional. The big condition is that there be no-one else, such as open or poly-amorous relationships.
Open and poly-amorous relationships are conditional as each person must have the freedom to love (or make love) to more than one other.
In romantic relationships there are these conditions, as examples: Each must treat the other the same or better than themselves. Each must strive to understand the mystery of the other, which sometimes may take a whole lifetime ( a fascinating never-ending joy, we think). These conditions actually protect the participants, as failure of these conditions may mean falling out of love, which allows ex-lovers to move on and find another.
Just to clarify...you haven't offended me and I hope that I have not offended you.
If you have conditions[demands/expectations/requirements] for love, then love becomes business. You are correct in saying that most people experience unconditional love with their family members, but you can term anything as a "condition" if you want to get technical. i.e.: I love my mother under the condition that she mothers me, that is a huge condition...right?
meninloveLuc, earlier in this topic you said, "Well needless to say, I have never believed in this type of love, nor do I believe in love at first sight or any other little fantasy romance crap...but this is why I ask the question.
It's like believing in ghosts...I don't know how to believe in something that is for the most part mythical."
....so now us old guys are thoroughly confused.
*Ironing out the wrinkles* Just because I do not believe in this particularly romantic idea of love doesn't mean that I don't believe in love. I do believe however that if you dare to love someone that you must soldier through the reality of modern relationships and all that it entails.
However, I would very much enjoy losing myself to a romance that was worthy of the term "true love" or even capable of making a realist into a dreamer once again...but this is real life, not a fairytale.
"i.e.: I love my mother under the condition that she mothers me, that is a huge condition...right?"
For some people. But we love our Moms whether they're mothering us or not. Ours' love us whether we are good devoted sons or not. Unconditional.
Conditions shouldn't equate to business, otherwise the Golden Rule, "do unto others as you would have them do unto you" would be enshrined in every business and guaranteed - it's not. heheh. Think of it as a set of ground rules for happiness for both people. No cheating - big condition in just about any romantic relationship, but neither of us can say you'd find that rule in business. heh
God (if you believe in God) loves us unconditionally, but religions would have you believe otherwise!
Although I feel I am doomed to be single for the rest of my life...I do believe in true love! whether gay or straight I think it is something that many people hope to have one day. Who wouldn't want to wake up everyday next to someone who loves them unconditionally. Maybe someday it will be in my cards and until then I will be patiently waiting!
"i.e.: I love my mother under the condition that she mothers me, that is a huge condition...right?"
For some people. But we love our Moms whether they're mothering us or not. Ours' love us whether we are good devoted sons or not. Unconditional.
Conditions shouldn't equate to business, otherwise the Golden Rule, "do unto others as you would have them do unto you" would be enshrined in every business and guaranteed - it's not. heheh. Think of it as a set of ground rules for happiness for both people. No cheating - big condition in just about any romantic relationship, but neither of us can say you'd find that rule in business. heh
God (if you believe in God) loves us unconditionally, but religions would have you believe otherwise!
On the subject of mothers and other family members, do you speak for yourselves or in general?...not all people love their mother. What if your mother put your dog in the microwave? (LOL)
On the subject of cheating...you are telling me that if the man you love cheats on you, you will seize to love him?
chariot saidAlthough I feel I am doomed to be single for the rest of my life...I do believe in true love! whether gay or straight I think it is something that many people hope to have one day. Who wouldn't want to wake up everyday next to someone who loves them unconditionally. Maybe someday it will be in my cards and until then I will be patiently waiting!
If by love you mean love at first sight, I don't believe it. Not only is it 100% of the time confused with lust, but love is not something that just happens. Love is hard work, just like anything else that is worth it. Sure, some people might say they had "love at first sight" with their partner of X years.... but even if they did, I bet you they couldn't sustain it without work, and I bet you they only say that because that's how they look on it from their perspective (not that its wrong. People can have inklings of if they may be able to love a person, but I doubt TRUE love comes along on a fight meeting.)
Most movies, TV, and the like are unrealistic portrayals of what love is like. Shit happens, people evolve, drama gets in the way. Love is being able to overcome all of this together, and have a stronger and deeper bond because of it. In fact, I would say that love isn't LOVE if it isn't tested. Sure most people want the happily-ever-after ending, but it's just not going to happen most of the time. In fact, I might even rather having stuff happen, just because that is life, and you can't really appreciate what you have without having to earn it, or having to fight for it.
I would say it is EVEN harder to find love these days, because of how people want everything the easy way, and want it now (even I fall into the trap.) The apparent shallow nature and oversexualization of a lot of gay guys makes true love even more rare, in my opinion. A lot of guys just find it easier to have emotionless sex with someone. Get the physical pleasure and go, without getting attached. While I can't say I haven't been both a victim and perpetrator of this, I'm somewhat ashamed about this. These kinds of temporary relationships is why the gay community isn't taken as serious as we would like, and why STDs are spread so easily; because its easier to lie to someone you don't care about.
The phrase "Love is not having to say 'You're fat'" while humorous, should really be "Love is saying 'You're fat, but I love you anyway' (LOL)"
So my point is, and handsome, well muscled guy want to settle down and have puppies with me? HAHA
"On the subject of mothers and other family members, do you speak for yourselves or in general?...not all people love their mother. What if your mother put your dog in the microwave? (LOL)
On the subject of cheating...you are telling me that if the man you love cheats on you, you will seize to love him? "
If my Mom put my dog in the microwave I would still love her, and feel sorry for her when I visited her in the institution she'd end up in. LOL
If my guy cheated on me I'd still love him but likely would no longer be in love with him ; the two are quite different types of love.
In regards to are we speaking about all families etc with regards to unconditional love, erm, of course not, as we mentioned earlier.
2dudesin"conditional"loveIf my Mom put my dog in the microwave I would still love her, and feel sorry for her when I visited her in the institution she'd end up in. LOL
If my guy cheated on me I'd still love him but likely would no longer be in love with him ; the two are quite different types of love.
In regards to are we speaking about all families etc with regards to unconditional love, erm, of course not, as we mentioned earlier.
I never understood "I love you" vs "I'm in love with you."
I'm really just giving you a hard time because I like your imput. And the dog in the microwave visual cracked me up. I enjoy eccentricity.
"I'm really just giving you a hard time because I like your imput. And the dog in the microwave visual cracked me up. I enjoy eccentricity."
...you bad boy! Here we were with our hair on fire fearing we were being too obscure in our comments!
We've decided one of the big handsome guys on this site should be sent over to rip your clothes off you and give a slow good spanking and then...er...we have to go now.
KissingPro saidOr, as one famous diva sang.....Do you believe in LIFE after love"?......Some of us have experienced a breakup after a very long relationship.
Can you imagine loving someone for 50 years of marriage, 6 children, 12 grandchildren and 5 great-grandchildren and losing them to old age and disease. I'm not sure there is life after that kind of love.
luc21_83 saidI don't know who you are. Please believe. There is no way I can convince you that this is not one of their tricks. But I don't care. I am me, and I don't know who you are, but I love you.
I have a pencil. A little one they did not find. I am a women. I hid it inside me. Perhaps I won't be able to write again, so this is a long letter about my life. It is the only autobiography I have ever written and oh God I'm writing it on toilet paper.
I was born in Nottingham in 1957, and it rained a lot. I passed my eleven plus and went to girl's Grammar. I wanted to be an actress.
I met my first girlfriend at school. Her name was Sara. She was fourteen and I was fifteen but we were both in Miss. Watson's class. Her wrists. Her wrists were beautiful. I sat in biology class, staring at the picket rabbit foetus in its jar, listening while Mr. Hird said it was an adolescent phase that people outgrew. Sara did. I didn't.
In 1976 I stopped pretending and took a girl called Christine home to meet my parents. A week later I enrolled at drama college. My mother said I broke her heart.
But it was my integrity that was important. Is that so selfish? It sells for so little, but it's all we have left in this place. It is the very last inch of us. But within that inch we are free.
London. I was happy in London. In 1981 I played Dandini in Cinderella. My first rep work. The world was strange and rustling and busy, with invisible crowds behind the hot lights and all that breathless glamour. It was exciting and it was lonely. At nights I'd go to the Crew-Ins or one of the other clubs. But I was stand-offish and didn't mix easily. I saw a lot of the scene, but I never felt comfortable there. So many of them just wanted to be gay. It was their life, their ambition. And I wanted more than that.
Work improved. I got small film roles, then bigger ones. In 1986 I starred in "The Salt Flats." It pulled in the awards but not the crowds. I met Ruth while working on that. We loved each other. We lived together and on Valentine's Day she sent me roses and oh God, we had so much. Those were the best three years of my life.
In 1988 there was the war, and after that there were no more roses. Not for anybody.
In 1992 they started rounding up the gays. They took Ruth while she was out looking for food. Why are they so frightened of us? They burned her with cigarette ends and made her give them my name. She signed a statement saying I'd seduced her. I didn't blame her. God, I loved her. I didn't blame her.
But she did. She killed herself in her cell. She couldn't live with betraying me, with giving up that last inch. Oh Ruth. . . .
They came for me. They told me that all of my films would be burned. They shaved off my hair and held my head down a toilet bowl and told jokes about lesbians. They brought me here and gave me drugs. I can't feel my tongue anymore. I can't speak.
The other gay women here, Rita, died two weeks ago. I imagine I'll die quite soon. It's strange that my life should end in such a terrible place, but for three years I had roses and I apologized to nobody.
I shall die here. Every last inch of me shall perish. Except one.
An inch. It's small and it's fragile and it's the only thing in the world worth having. We must never lose it, or sell it, or give it away. We must never let them take it from us.
I don't know who you are. Or whether you're a man or a woman. I may never see you or cry with you or get drunk with you. But I love you. I hope that you escape this place. I hope that the world turns and that things get better, and that one day people have roses again. I wish I could kiss you.
Valerie
from V for Vendetta Written by Alan Moore.
Honestly, I cried at that part of the movie. It was so beautiful.
I had some wetness in my eyes as well. It is a very empowering moment in one of the best gay themed films of all time. I really believe that a positive and non-stereotypical portrayal of gay characters in film can help people to understand that there is depth to people beyond sexuality.
Kill me now. 
That mushy, giddy feeling 
