Do you consider a $675,000 home "working class?" - Marco Rubio taking heat

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    Feb 14, 2013 2:13 AM GMT
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/13/marco-rubio-working-class-house-for-sale-675000_n_2681264.html

    Marco Rubio is taking some heat for the following statement: "Mr. President, I still live in the same working class neighborhood I grew up in. My neighbors aren’t millionaires. They’re retirees who depend on Social Security and Medicare. They’re workers who have to get up early tomorrow morning and go to work to pay the bills. They’re immigrants, who came here because they were stuck in poverty in countries where the government dominated the economy."

    It got me wondering, what would you consider a "working class" home in terms of price for the city in which you live? For those of you that live in South Florida, do you consider a home in the $675,000 range "working class?"

    I think it is all relative, but in Tampa when I think of working class residences I think of those under $200,000. That was the first firgue that came to mind then I saw that according to bankrate.com, the median home price in the Tampa metro area is $138,800. http://www.bankrate.com/finance/real-estate/median-home-price-buys-tampa.aspx

    Again, I'm not so much interested in debating what Marco Rubio said but, rather, what you consider the price range of a "working class" home. Let's try to keep it civil.
  • Timbales

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    Feb 14, 2013 2:17 AM GMT
    I think it's a matter of semantics - how does one define working class, middle class, etc.
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    Feb 14, 2013 2:25 AM GMT
    southbeach1500 saidYeah, $400k-800k is middle class range here in Miami-Dade.



    I was surprised that the median single family home price in Miami Dade wasn't higher than stated in this 2011 housing market report.

    http://www.miamidade.gov/oedit/library/11_02_HMR.pdf


    I would have thought more around $300,000.
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    Feb 14, 2013 2:26 AM GMT
    Timbales saidI think it's a matter of semantics - how does one define working class, middle class, etc.


    I know right? If most of the people in a neighborhood aren't independently wealthy and work for a living, is the neighborhood still working class even if most who live there work in occupations that pay well above the median?
  • Timbales

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    Feb 14, 2013 2:37 AM GMT
    Sashaman said
    Timbales saidI think it's a matter of semantics - how does one define working class, middle class, etc.


    I know right? If most of the people in a neighborhood aren't independently wealthy and work for a living, is the neighborhood still working class even if most who live there work in occupations that pay well above the median?


    I took a course a few years ago, and one of the things that was discussed is how there isn't a set-in-stone class system in the US. Wealth is distributed along a continuum and the various communities and regions of the US make it very difficult to state with any real basis in fact what is working class, middle class, etc. Most people across the US polled said they were middle class, and incomes ranged anywhere from $20,000 to $800,000.
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    Feb 14, 2013 2:44 AM GMT
    Timbales said
    Sashaman said
    Timbales saidI think it's a matter of semantics - how does one define working class, middle class, etc.


    I know right? If most of the people in a neighborhood aren't independently wealthy and work for a living, is the neighborhood still working class even if most who live there work in occupations that pay well above the median?


    I took a course a few years ago, and one of the things that was discussed is how there isn't a set-in-stone class system in the US. Wealth is distributed along a continuum and the various communities and regions of the US make it very difficult to state with any real basis in fact what is working class, middle class, etc. Most people across the US polled said they were middle class, and incomes ranged anywhere from $20,000 to $800,000.


    So what, in your opinion, would be the price of a typical working class home in Syracuse?
  • Timbales

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    Feb 14, 2013 2:48 AM GMT
    Sashaman said
    Timbales said
    Sashaman said
    Timbales saidI think it's a matter of semantics - how does one define working class, middle class, etc.


    I know right? If most of the people in a neighborhood aren't independently wealthy and work for a living, is the neighborhood still working class even if most who live there work in occupations that pay well above the median?


    I took a course a few years ago, and one of the things that was discussed is how there isn't a set-in-stone class system in the US. Wealth is distributed along a continuum and the various communities and regions of the US make it very difficult to state with any real basis in fact what is working class, middle class, etc. Most people across the US polled said they were middle class, and incomes ranged anywhere from $20,000 to $800,000.


    So what, in your opinion, would be the price of a typical working class home in Syracuse?


    Working class in the city of Syracuse would probably currently range from around $60,000 for a smaller home, like a 500 square foot cape to $100,000 for something 1000 and more square feet. Go out to some of the suburbs and you can get 2000 square feet and up for $250,000 to $400,000.
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    Feb 14, 2013 3:13 AM GMT
    Another thought - even if someone has a home that is pretty much valued at the median price for a neighborhood, aren't some neighborhoods simply not working class? I'm thinking of places like Malibu and Fisher Island.
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    Feb 14, 2013 3:22 AM GMT
    If you worked to make your income and invested it wisely, yes.
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    Feb 14, 2013 6:39 AM GMT
    a) Nobody in their right mind will give this guy $600k for that.

    http://www.zillow.com/homes/6060-SW-13-ST-miami-fl_rb/#/homedetails/6060-SW-13th-St-West-Miami-FL-33144/80784573_zpid/

    Looks like that neighborhood averages about or a little over 200k. The genius bought at peak in 2005.

    b)

    Miami-Dade Zillow Home Value Index
    app?service=chart&chartType=geo&mt=34&dt


    c) working class can be a snob's phrase. My parents lived on the water with a boat behind the house and they worked until they dropped. How is that not working class?
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    Feb 14, 2013 10:43 AM GMT
    theantijock saida) Nobody in their right mind will give this guy $600k for that.

    http://www.zillow.com/homes/6060-SW-13-ST-miami-fl_rb/#/homedetails/6060-SW-13th-St-West-Miami-FL-33144/80784573_zpid/

    Looks like that neighborhood averages about or a little over 200k. The genius bought at peak in 2005.

    b)

    Miami-Dade Zillow Home Value Index
    app?service=chart&chartType=geo&mt=34&dt


    c) working class can be a snob's phrase. My parents lived on the water with a boat behind the house and they worked until they dropped. How is that not working class?



    It could be that Rubio lives in an enclave of higher priced newer construction where the houses on immediately surrounding streets have significantly lower prices. If you look at the map on Zillow you'll see what I mean.

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/6060-SW-13th-St-West-Miami-FL-33144/80784573_zpid/

    Therefore, while he might not get the full asking price, i think he'll probably get way above $200,000.

    I agree that the term working class can be a snob's phrase. Maybe there isn't any clear and generally accepted meaning. It could mean different things to different people depending on their background.

    I'm curious though, when you hear the term working class neighborhood, what is the price range of homes that first come to your mind?
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    Feb 14, 2013 4:07 PM GMT
    GetMedia.ashx?Q=UmVzb3VyY2U9UHJvcGVydHkm
    The lowest priced home in my hometown ($1,599,000 with 2200 sq. ft ). A fixer / probably in such bad shape it will be torn down.

    GetMedia.ashx?Q=UmVzb3VyY2U9UHJvcGVydHkm
    In the next town over, you can find a neat little house (2 bdr. 1 bath) priced just below $700,000, but it is not in a great section of town, and is near busy roads & the freeway. This is our working class section. Nice, clean - this is what your dollar buys when you're in this price range in San Mateo, California - - 1/2 hour south of San Francisco.
  • conservativej...

    Posts: 2465

    Feb 14, 2013 4:35 PM GMT
    Uhm, with wife and husband both holding advanced degrees and making between $90k and $130k, that about right.

    Keep in mind not everyone flunked out of high school and later earned a G.E.D.
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    Feb 14, 2013 5:00 PM GMT
    PS. I just googled his house again. Look at the main artery coming into his immediate neighborhood, SW 62 Ave. How is it that so much public money was spent to redo all the sidewalks and driveways coming down both sides of that one street towards his house but not on the avenues to the east or west of his home? The improvement project runs from Tamiami down to 24th and even includes some decorative circles. Anyone for a taste of blatant pork?

    And here it is http://www.miamidade.gov/citt/library/5_year_plan/table-A.pdf SW 62 Avenue (SW 24 Street to NW 7 Street) Street Improvements
    Complete
    $9.979M


    I certainly hope the publics $9,979,000 helped his home value. It'd be a shame if that was wasted.
  • rnch

    Posts: 11524

    Feb 14, 2013 5:17 PM GMT
    Marco's remarks show HOW MUCH "out of touch" the elected represenative(s) in Washington are with the Real World "outside of the beltway".


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    Feb 14, 2013 5:57 PM GMT
    Jockbod48 saidGetMedia.ashx?Q=UmVzb3VyY2U9UHJvcGVydHkm
    The lowest priced home in my hometown ($1,599,000 with 2200 sq. ft ). A fixer / probably in such bad shape it will be torn down.

    GetMedia.ashx?Q=UmVzb3VyY2U9UHJvcGVydHkm
    In the next town over, you can find a neat little house (2 bdr. 1 bath) priced just below $700,000, but it is not in a great section of town, and is near busy roads & the freeway. This is our working class section. Nice, clean - this is what your dollar buys when you're in this price range in San Mateo, California - - 1/2 hour south of San Francisco.


    Wow! I knew the price of real estate in San Fran was up there but it's even higher than I thought. $700,000 in most of Tampa can buy a pretty nice place unless it is right on the water. Then it'll probably be a fixer upper or sold mainly for land value.
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    Feb 14, 2013 6:03 PM GMT
    southbeach1500 saidJust as a comparison... Joe Biden has frequently labelled himself as "working class."



    I'd be curious abut the market value of his primary residence.

    I don't know how accurate the information on this site is, but it lists the mortgage on his primary residence as being between $501,000 and $1,000,000.

    http://www.davemanuel.com/pols/joe-biden/
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    Feb 14, 2013 6:06 PM GMT
    rnch saidMarco's remarks show HOW MUCH "out of touch" the elected represenative(s) in Washington are with the Real World "outside of the beltway".


    icon_rolleyes.gif


    icon_mad.gif


    Out of curiosity, what is the first dollar figure that comes to your mind when you hear the term working class home?
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    Feb 14, 2013 6:07 PM GMT
    conservativejock saidUhm, with wife and husband both holding advanced degrees and making between $90k and $130k, that about right.

    Keep in mind not everyone flunked out of high school and later earned a G.E.D.


    Most people don't hold advanced degrees, though.
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    Feb 14, 2013 6:26 PM GMT
    I think it depends completely on the market. $675,000 gets you a starter house in Arlington, VA. Most truly working class folks here don't own single family homes.

    I don't think Rubio's house looks working class, at all. Though I guess his statement was technically accurate if his less immediate neighborhood isn'r nearly as nice.
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    Feb 15, 2013 2:03 AM GMT
    showme said

    I don't think Rubio's house looks working class, at all. Though I guess his statement was technically accurate if his less immediate neighborhood isn'r nearly as nice.


    Lawyers know how to work them technicalities! icon_cool.gif
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    Feb 15, 2013 3:06 AM GMT
    Sashaman said
    southbeach1500 saidJust as a comparison... Joe Biden has frequently labelled himself as "working class."



    I'd be curious abut the market value of his primary residence.


    I don't know how accurate the information on this site is, but it lists the mortgage on his primary residence as being between $501,000 and $1,000,000.

    http://www.davemanuel.com/pols/joe-biden/


    Behold the power of the internetz....

    http://www.zillow.com/h/1209-Barley-Mill-Rd-Wilmington-DE-19807-72996610/

    http://de.blockshopper.com/property/0702900052/1209_barley_mill_road/
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    Feb 15, 2013 3:14 AM GMT
    showme saidI think it depends completely on the market. $675,000 gets you a starter house in Arlington, VA. Most truly working class folks here don't own single family homes.

    I don't think Rubio's house looks working class, at all. Though I guess his statement was technically accurate if his less immediate neighborhood isn'r nearly as nice.


    I think working class is such a loaded term that it mostly just has meaning for propagandizing.

    FYI...

    Arlington Zillow Home Value Index
    app?service=chart&chartType=geo&mt=34&dt


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    Feb 15, 2013 5:05 AM GMT
    ^ I think that chart includes condos and coops.
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    Feb 15, 2013 6:42 AM GMT
    here's the single family houses without the condos

    Arlington Zillow Home Value Index
    app?service=chart&chartType=geo&mt=34&dt


    here's the condo & coops

    Arlington Zillow Home Value Index
    app?service=chart&chartType=geo&mt=34&dt