Racism in the gay community (thread #534)

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 19, 2013 4:27 AM GMT
    *edit: old thread

    I'm sure many people on RJ are sick of this topic. But it tends to get more complicated than it needs to be. Basically it boils down to:

    1. Do you agree that there is racism in the gay community?
    -- if no, then there's obviously no point in you staying in this thread any longer.
    -- if yes, do you think it matters? Does it matter that there is racism in the gay community?

    Or, more to the point, do you care? Do you honestly give two fucks about the "issue"?


    On the whole, the answer seems to be no.
    I'm not saying you have to -- or should -- change your minds. But it really shouldn't be of any surprise when these threads keep popping up from time to time. I mean, the gay community never actually addresses the issue of racism because, apparently, we don't care. Unfortunately, racism doesn't disappear magically by turning a blind eye to it and by denying its existence.

    If anything, if you really are sick of these threads and would prefer never to see them again -- why not actually start caring? There's a fix for you.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 19, 2013 4:48 AM GMT
    I like the topic....
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 19, 2013 4:51 AM GMT
    Yes, it matters. But your thread is STILL tired. icon_neutral.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 23, 2013 6:41 AM GMT
    Edit**: not "seems to be"; it is

    These things speak well enough for itself, I suppose
  • PolaroidSwing...

    Posts: 1131

    Feb 23, 2013 7:10 AM GMT
    There's racism present everywhere, in every community.
    Prejudice, to some extent, will always exist.
    There will never be a perfect utopian society.


    Outside of offering people the necessary information, and addressing overt acts of discrimination, there's absolutely nothing that can be done about it.

    Yes, I do care. At the end of the day, all the caring in the world isn't going to change the reality of flawed human behavior though.





    /thread
  • agro

    Posts: 199

    Feb 23, 2013 7:21 AM GMT
    PolaroidSwinger saidThere's racism present everywhere, in every community.
    Prejudice, to some extent, will always exist.
    There will never be a perfect utopian society.




    yeah this sums it up pretty much
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    Feb 23, 2013 9:41 AM GMT
    PolaroidSwinger saidThere's racism present everywhere, in every community.
    Prejudice, to some extent, will always exist.
    There will never be a perfect utopian society.


    Outside of offering people the necessary information, and addressing overt acts of discrimination, there's absolutely nothing that can be done about it.

    Yes, I do care. At the end of the day, all the caring in the world isn't going to change the reality of flawed human behavior though.

    Whatever he said but in my case, I don't care. For one guy not interested in you for your race there will be someone else who will be into you. So why even bother about it.
  • PolaroidSwing...

    Posts: 1131

    Feb 23, 2013 9:58 AM GMT
    Shagglot saidWhatever he said but in my case, I don't care. For one guy not interested in you for your race there will be someone else who will be into you. So why even bother about it.


    Yeah, I should have clarified that I care about racism in the sense of a real or perceived race hierarchy in regards to social status. I'm not at all interested in people's choice of potential mates.
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    Feb 23, 2013 2:11 PM GMT
    yourname2000 saidA1UthsPCIAAzMji.jpg:large


    But the line they left off probably read, "he's black, he's white and he smells like shit; he's either mexican or middle-eastern."

    icon_lol.gif
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    Feb 24, 2013 6:46 AM GMT
    PolaroidSwinger said
    Shagglot saidWhatever he said but in my case, I don't care. For one guy not interested in you for your race there will be someone else who will be into you. So why even bother about it.


    Yeah, I should have clarified that I care about racism in the sense of a real or perceived race hierarchy in regards to social status. I'm not at all interested in people's choice of potential mates.

    But why are the two different? Racism has always been based on the devalorization of racial minorities, whether it be in intellect, aesthetics, civility, etc. Sure, aesthetics seem the most "shallow", but it's nonetheless a dehumanizing, demeaning form of racism that implants psychic inferiorization.
  • Karl

    Posts: 5787

    Feb 24, 2013 6:50 AM GMT
    No , racism is everywhere , every community , not only gay community.
    btw I just seen this photo today , is it a kind of racism and nationalist between us Asians ?
    545772_341594145958713_28351470_n.jpg
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 24, 2013 7:23 AM GMT
    I was talking to someone who is Black and Gay. He told me that he's dealt with more racism and bigotry from Gay White men than he ever has from heterosexual White people. I'm Oriental and Gay and feel the same way.
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    Feb 24, 2013 7:30 AM GMT
    Smegmatron saidI was talking to someone who is Black and Gay. He told me that he's dealt with more racism and bigotry from Gay White men than he ever has from heterosexual White people. I'm Oriental and Gay and feel the same way.
    You experience more racism from yo damn self than anybody else.
  • PolaroidSwing...

    Posts: 1131

    Feb 24, 2013 8:04 AM GMT
    nevz saidBut why are the two different? Racism has always been based on the devalorization of racial minorities, whether it be in intellect, aesthetics, civility, etc. Sure, aesthetics seem the most "shallow", but it's nonetheless a dehumanizing, demeaning form of racism that implants psychic inferiorization.


    Because people are entitled to pair up with whoever they want, even if their reasons are less than noble.
    Is total aversion to dating anyone within a particular ethnic group rooted in racial discrimination? Yeah, sure.

    But who's really hurt by that? They are.
    People aren't obligated to be open minded in decisions that impact only their personal lives. My quality of life isn't lessened because John Doe isn't attracted to brunettes. Not to mention, that if you look at many of these race threads on here, the OP operates on the same racist principals that they complain about. Petty rants like these detract from serious issues that actually disadvantage people.

    Is writing something like "not into ____" on a dating profile completely tactless and insensitive? Yes; it needs to stop.
    Would people benefit from a general discussion about Eurocentric standards of beauty in the media, and the effect it has on self-esteem within minority groups? Absolutely.


    Someones personal life is not a topic that's up for debate though; that's their business.


    Edit- Also, racism goes beyond the devaluation of minorities. Let's not pretend people in minority groups are above being racist.
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    Feb 24, 2013 9:17 AM GMT
    nevz saidI'm sure many people on RJ are sick of this topic. But it tends to get more complicated than it needs to be. Basically it boils down to:

    1. Do you agree that there is racism in the gay community?
    -- if no, then there's obviously no point in you staying in this thread any longer.
    -- if yes, do you think it matters? Does it matter that there is racism in the gay community?

    Or, more to the point, do you care? Do you honestly give two fucks about the "issue"?


    On the whole, the answer seems to be no.
    I'm not saying you have to -- or should -- change your minds. But it really shouldn't be of any surprise when these threads keep popping up from time to time. I mean, the gay community never actually addresses the issue of racism because, apparently, we don't care. Unfortunately, racism doesn't disappear magically by turning a blind eye to it and by denying its existence.

    If anything, if you really are sick of these threads and would prefer never to see them again -- why not actually start caring? There's a fix for you.



    love this post.

    it's like leaving food out in your kitchen and wondering why you keep getting ants.

    you never clean up the food, but you get pissed that the ants keep showing up.

    people never ask why all these race threads exist in the first place.
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    Feb 24, 2013 9:43 AM GMT
    O__O said
    nevz saidI'm sure many people on RJ are sick of this topic. But it tends to get more complicated than it needs to be. Basically it boils down to:

    1. Do you agree that there is racism in the gay community?
    -- if no, then there's obviously no point in you staying in this thread any longer.
    -- if yes, do you think it matters? Does it matter that there is racism in the gay community?

    Or, more to the point, do you care? Do you honestly give two fucks about the "issue"?


    On the whole, the answer seems to be no.
    I'm not saying you have to -- or should -- change your minds. But it really shouldn't be of any surprise when these threads keep popping up from time to time. I mean, the gay community never actually addresses the issue of racism because, apparently, we don't care. Unfortunately, racism doesn't disappear magically by turning a blind eye to it and by denying its existence.

    If anything, if you really are sick of these threads and would prefer never to see them again -- why not actually start caring? There's a fix for you.



    love this post.

    it's like leaving food out in your kitchen and wondering why you keep getting ants.

    you never clean up the food, but you get pissed that the ants keep showing up.

    people never ask why all these race threads exist in the first place.


    Thank you.

    I hate when people try to disregard racism and say "let's not talk about it." or even worse "i don't see color." What the fuck? There is clearly a difference, we are not the same color -- what exactly does that even mean, that my struggles aren't real? Give me a break.
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    Feb 24, 2013 10:53 AM GMT
    nevz said

    If anything, if you really are sick of these threads and would prefer never to see them again -- why not actually start caring? There's a fix for you.



    The ones who will care the most, are the ones who are most negatively affected by Racism. For those that turn a blind eye to it, or simply don't experience it due to not being affected by it... well for the most part they simply won't care, while at the same time they may even be ignoring it or obliviously perpetuating it. So in that sense it’s easy to be annoyed when someone bitches on the threads or complains about racism when in one's heart they simply have no affection or care for the random on-liner who is afflicted by racism or worse a repeated complainer. Gosh I should have just posted the video. This guy says it best on the topic.


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    Feb 24, 2013 5:09 PM GMT
    This is stupid, everyone knows that:
    If you are white and only date white guys = racist
    If you are any other race and only date white guys = not racist

    icon_rolleyes.gif
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    Feb 24, 2013 5:11 PM GMT
    Are you a racist if you are equally hateful towards everyone?
  • CityofDreams

    Posts: 1173

    Feb 24, 2013 5:20 PM GMT
    Claystation saidThis is stupid, everyone knows that:
    If you are white and only date white guys = racist
    If you are any other race and only date white guys = not racist

    icon_rolleyes.gif


    I know you are being sarcastic, but in reality, yes, both are equally as racist.
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    Feb 24, 2013 5:38 PM GMT
    CityofDreams said

    I know you are being sarcastic, but in reality, yes, both are equally as racist.


    Only partly sarcastic.

    7 out of 10 people who play this particular race card are usually anything but white. Sometimes they even say in their profiles that they prefer white guys or their names are like dark4white or whatever and they arent hit with the racism spiel. But a white guy doing that shit will be crucified. Shit even those white guys who say only into asian guys or whatever get a pass. My eyes doth roll-eth

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Feb 24, 2013 5:43 PM GMT
    The problem with these threads (and there are 6 million of them) is that they fail to make any real point and merely state the obvious without offering any real insight.

    Racism - as hideous as it is - continues to persist although it is steadily diminishing. Sexual Orientation will not effect some deeply ingrained "isms" like some magic bullet.

    Just like minority groups were not so quick to embrace Homosexuality simply because they themselves understood discrimination.

    It may be argued that not being sexually attracted to a particular race is a form of racism - but it is hardly the most virulent or dangerous. Not wanting to get naked with an Asian or African American or Latino Man does NOT equate to denying them Civil Rights, housing, employment or basic Human dignity.

    And while I am sure I will be skewered for writing this, I have noticed that when certain individuals are calling the race card (at least in terms of dating, mating etc) they are not too overly concerned about the lack of attention they recieve from Joe Average Caucasion.

    It is generally the Icelandic Runway Model that they are pining after.

    When the day comes that you are upset over not being able to get together for drinks with the Anglo CPA with a slightly receding hairline and a coupla extra inches around His waist - get back to Me and We can explore the topic beyond the obvious attention-getting headline.

    icon_wink.gificon_wink.gificon_wink.gif
  • bnamj1987

    Posts: 3

    Feb 24, 2013 6:24 PM GMT
    Im black and have a preference in dating white men. I think it mainly has to do with growing up in England in a neighborhood with hardly any other ethnic groups. Im still attracted to all other races though and would be happy to date an asian, latino or black guy.

    I moved to the south in the US when i was 18 and could definitely feel racism. Kinda bothered me but i was in College and had my circle of good friends. Just felt a little lonely sometimes since i was always that one black guy at a party or gathering and felt that no one was interested in me. Moved to Sydney in 2011 and wow, its been completely different from the US.
  • JArking

    Posts: 139

    Feb 24, 2013 6:38 PM GMT
    I've never considered what you are proposing to be "racist" as you say, but rather a pretty strict sexual preference. I think it's dangerous to call someone a racist when the term implies that they have a general aversion to an entire race, the races qualities, and culture especially when that race can sometimes be different from their own.

    More personally, I don't think you or anyone else has the right to determine who anyone should be sexually attracted to. I see your argument going in the direction of gay men not being attracted to women physically and having another person forcing them into a relationship with one,. People have preferences, and they always will. I am sorry if it offends you.

    Your plight is really about the blunt attitude we have when it comes to our preferences. In this high speed day and age people are used to getting what they want instantly. Because of this society is now used to putting information out there to achieve faster results. In the dating world that means we have lost tact and sensitivity for others. You are seeing people be more direct about their preferences in public settings when they are best left behind closed doors in polite conversation.

    Do I think you can change this for everyone? No, not right now. I'm sorry but the world is changing far to fast to fight it.. But in time people will develop ways of dealing with this high speed culture and rules of polite and proper engagement may be established. Until then you can simply ask someone not to be so blunt.

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    Feb 24, 2013 6:40 PM GMT
    Although these often go hand-in-hand, racism isn't really about who is being mean to who, and it isn't necessarily even about who is included in what. People will always have a side of them that is mean and exclusive.

    Racism is programming. And everyone, no matter your color or orientation, grows up with a certain amount of conditioning that comes from a lot of sources. This also means that people's experience and perception of racism is always going to be pretty different. And just cause you are gay, have gay friends, have friends of different colors/cultures than you, doesn't mean you are immune.

    For example, I have some friends who have never, and will never have to deal with racism as a significant obstacle in their lives. I have known some people who don't even believe it really exists in the US these days. I once knew a white man who only referred to people of other colors and orientations as "those people" and never used their names.

    However I have other friends who have lost jobs, have jobs passed over for vastly under qualified candidates, and friends who have gotten death threats just for being a different color in a predominately homogenized neighborhood. None of these things were in the 50s or 60s; they were recent. I myself have received a few full-on death threats while working at a bank in an all white neighborhood.

    So why all the forum threads? Yes they are tiring, but Awareness and Education and a Willingness to understand another person's perspective are the things that will in the long run, fight the problem of racism within any community. They are the things that will help break another person's old programming and help them to see people more accurately.

    Some people will tend to cry wolf a little when it comes to certain things, sure. Because people will still be people, with all their fears and insecurities. But I've seen others on this very thread and other threads that have voiced their actual experiences and concerns in an honest way, only to get mocked and shot down by a few others in our community. Seriously? Are we not better than that?

    A simple thing that I ask for, but don't always get, is to be treated fairly without judgement or preconception. Just AIM for it. Many of us want this too--comes with being gay/minority/different in this time. But I can't really go about asking or demanding that, if I don't try my hardest to always keep in mind that "We are all the same."