The Nature of "I" and identity

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Mar 02, 2013 10:14 PM GMT
    I debated where to post this, but spirituality seemed kind of fitting.

    What is the nature of the self? How do you think about your identity in the sea of humanity?

    I have thoughts of my own on the above, but I want to wait to see where others take this.
  • calibro

    Posts: 8888

    Mar 03, 2013 2:12 AM GMT
    there's an "i" in penis
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    Mar 03, 2013 2:32 AM GMT
    Wanna brainfuck ?
    How can you demonstrate that anything exist outside of yourself ?
  • Medjai

    Posts: 2671

    Mar 03, 2013 2:52 AM GMT
    minox saidWanna brainfuck ?
    How can you demonstrate that anything exist outside of yourself ?


    That's old news. Descartes was so 400 years ago.
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    Mar 03, 2013 3:03 AM GMT
    JerseyJames75 saidI debated where to post this, but spirituality seemed kind of fitting.

    What is the nature of the self? How do you think about your identity in the sea of humanity?

    I have thoughts of my own on the above, but I want to wait to see where others take this.


    What exactly are you asking?
  • calibro

    Posts: 8888

    Mar 03, 2013 3:13 AM GMT
    Trollileo said
    minox saidWanna brainfuck ?
    How can you demonstrate that anything exist outside of yourself ?
    How do you prove something exists inside yourself?


    you let someone cut it out
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    Mar 03, 2013 4:10 PM GMT
    Trollileo said
    minox saidWanna brainfuck ?
    How can you demonstrate that anything exist outside of yourself ?
    How do you prove something exists inside yourself?


    Inside or out, open yourself and you open their eyes so that they can see (for) themselves.

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    As to the nature of the self. Here's Castaneda's take on the Toltec view...

    energy-body-w-Assemblage-Point.jpg

    http://www.prismagems.com/castaneda/donjuan8.html
    ...Human beings are also composed of an incalculable number of the same threadlike energy fields...an encased agglomeration that manifests itself as a ball of light the size of the person's body with the arms extended laterally, like a giant luminous egg....

    ...Perception occurs when the energy fields in that small group immediately surrounding the point of brilliance extent their light to illuminate identical energy fields outside the ball. Since the only energy fields perceivable are those lit by the point of brilliance, that point is named "the point where perception is assembled" or simply "the assemblage point."

    The assemblage point can be moved from its usual position on the surface of the luminous ball to another position on the surface, or into the interior. Since the brilliance of the assemblage point can light up whatever energy field it comes in contact with, when it moves to a new position it immediately brightens up new energy fields, making them perceivable. This perception is known as seeing .

    When the assemblage point shifts, it makes possible the perception of an entirely different world--as objective and factual as the one we normally perceive. Sorcerers go into that other world to get energy, power, solutions to general and particular problems, or to face the unimaginable.

    Intent is the pervasive force that causes us to perceive. We do not become aware because we perceive; rather, we perceive as a result of the pressure and intrusion of intent .

    The aim of sorcerers is to reach a state of total awareness in order to experience all the possibilities of perception available to man. This state of awareness even implies an alternative way of dying.
    * * *
    A level of practical knowledge is included as part of teaching the mastery of awareness. On this practical level are taught the procedures necessary to move the assemblage point. The two great systems devised by the sorcerer seers of ancient times to accomplish this are dreaming , the control and utilization of dreams; and stalking , the control of behavior.
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    Mar 03, 2013 5:24 PM GMT
    Thanks for sharing that previous link. I love the Toltec teachings.

    Assemblage point is really interesting to think about. I have had experiences where me, or "I" existed as a ball of light within my abdomen. I could sense that there was a body around me, but it was not me. More like a vessel that "I" was in. Strange.
  • BeNiHiKoU

    Posts: 250

    Mar 03, 2013 6:28 PM GMT
    JerseyJames75 saidI debated where to post this, but spirituality seemed kind of fitting.

    What is the nature of the self? How do you think about your identity in the sea of humanity?

    I have thoughts of my own on the above, but I want to wait to see where others take this.



    The concept of Self – or Self-concept – is indeed central to constructing/defining Identity. Have you ever come across 'Global Ambitions and Local Identities: An Israeli-American High-Tech Merger' by Galit Ailon? The author states that Identity can be defined as a collective, non-static, symbolic process that is actively constructed rather than passively internalized - thus permanently negotiated and somehow characterized by emergent phases over various periods of time.

    In that regards, I consider that one's identity is constructed and defined as a Situated Self – i.e. a configuration of the Self. This supposes the Self to be a constantly fluid construct until the right factors (i.e. socio-cultural dynamics acting as sources of identities) temporarily lock it into a specific configuration (i.e. Situated Self or Identity). This is not saying that the Self - i.e. the dynamic interaction between reflective awareness, sources of identities and self-perception - is in a perpetual unstable state, but rather that it has a constant potential for mutability and reconfiguration until the point where it gets expressed to the appropriate extent of its situated individuality (i.e. an expression of one's identity befitting a specifically given social instance).
  • Destinharbor

    Posts: 4434

    Mar 03, 2013 6:33 PM GMT
    yourname2000 said
    calibro saidthere's an "i" in penis

    Which is a lot better than a penis in your eye. icon_confused.gif

    "Ever had come in your eye? IT BURNS!"
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    Mar 03, 2013 6:51 PM GMT
    BeNiHiKoU said
    JerseyJames75 saidI debated where to post this, but spirituality seemed kind of fitting.

    What is the nature of the self? How do you think about your identity in the sea of humanity?

    I have thoughts of my own on the above, but I want to wait to see where others take this.



    The concept of Self – or Self-concept – is indeed central to constructing/defining Identity. Have you ever come across 'Global Ambitions and Local Identities: An Israeli-American High-Tech Merger' by Galit Ailon? The author states that Identity can be defined as a collective, non-static, symbolic process that is actively constructed rather than passively internalized - thus permanently negotiated and somehow characterized by emergent phases over various periods of time.

    In that regards, I consider that one's identity is constructed and defined as a Situated Self – i.e. a configuration of the Self. This supposes the Self to be a constantly fluid construct until the right factors (i.e. socio-cultural dynamics acting as sources of identities) temporarily lock it into a specific configuration (i.e. Situated Self or Identity). This is not saying that the Self - i.e. the dynamic interaction between reflective awareness, sources of identities and self-perception - is in a perpetual unstable state, but rather that it has a constant potential for mutability and reconfiguration until the point where it gets expressed to the appropriate extent of its situated individuality (i.e. an expression of one's identity befitting a specifically given social instance).


    ^^^This. I am not familiar with your direct reference, however the ideas I am very familiar with. In my current PhD program we talk a lot about learning as socially constructed. As knowledge existing between individuals and the tools that they use to construct knowledge. Tools like pen, paper, internet, forums...

    icon_smile.gif

    It's cool way to think about life, and has mitigated my anxieties for sure. I'm pretty certain aspects of this way of thinking tie right into mental health. Hmmm.
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    Mar 03, 2013 6:59 PM GMT
    Shawnathan saidI'm like this lake

    lake-superior-map.jpg

    If you enlarge the image you'll see Split Rock on the far left shore. That's where I used to teach rappelling and rock climbing to college students. When I was dangling 220 feet on a rope I had many thoughts about my identity, and the likelihood it would continue to exist if something went wrong. Nothing clarifies your thoughts about life & death like danger.
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    Mar 03, 2013 7:05 PM GMT
    Destinharbor said
    yourname2000 said
    calibro saidthere's an "i" in penis

    Which is a lot better than a penis in your eye. icon_confused.gif

    "Ever had come in your eye? IT BURNS!"

    Not always, to my experience. Is that your quote or by someone we should know?

    On a serious note, the eye is thought to be a possible entry point for HIV in semen or blood. Therefore be careful with a facial when jerking off a guy.
  • JackDoyle

    Posts: 706

    Mar 03, 2013 7:07 PM GMT
    yourname2000 said
    calibro saidthere's an "i" in penis

    Which is a lot better than a penis in your eye. icon_confused.gif


    Cum in the eye is the worst though! the sperm can mistake it for the vagina and start eating through the eyeball!! icon_eek.gif
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    Mar 03, 2013 9:58 PM GMT
    I'm still waiting for someone to prove this thread exists. If it exists. Which it doesn't, and does.
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    Mar 05, 2013 10:15 PM GMT
    I'm just so happy/sad to see that we all agree/disagree about this topic and it's inverse that everything-is-everything, and nothing-even-matters, since we all exist, and don't exist, just like this thread might...
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    Mar 05, 2013 10:15 PM GMT
    calibro saidthere's an "i" in penis


    Wanna feel my penis in your eye
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    Mar 05, 2013 10:23 PM GMT
    no-words-homer-into-brush.gif
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    Mar 08, 2013 11:57 PM GMT
    So in all seriousness (even though many of the responses have been hilarious)... I am really struggling with this idea of being an individual. As the internet becomes more pervasive, and as people interconnect more, and more, I am starting to think that I am simply this little beacon of information. I take in information, and pass out information. That is all.

    Sure, I guess I synthesize new thoughts and interesting ideas, but those thoughts and ideas surely can't be "owned" by "me" since they are all constructed from other people...
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    Mar 09, 2013 12:00 AM GMT
    You know it's funny. In the korean language, "I" is de-emphasized in the way we speak. For example, in English we say, "I love YOU". It is about the act of one self giving action to the subject. However in Korea, we say, "Sarang-He" which literally translates into "Love Happens" The I and the YOU are implied. The Love is the thing that is important and has all the value. We are just lucky to be a part of it.
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    Mar 09, 2013 6:18 AM GMT
    huhwhat saidYou know it's funny. In the korean language, "I" is de-emphasized in the way we speak. For example, in English we say, "I love YOU". It is about the act of one self giving action to the subject. However in Korea, we say, "Sarang-He" which literally translates into "Love Happens" The I and the YOU are implied. The Love is the thing that is important and has all the value. We are just lucky to be a part of it.

    That is fantastic!

    But there are "no gay in Korea," says Margaret Cho's mother...