"I'm Negative" vs. "I'm Undetectable"

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Mar 16, 2013 7:32 PM GMT
    Given the choice, would you feel more comfortable being intimate with a guy who claims he's negative or with a guy who admits to being HIV+ but undetectable? I think the risks are self explanatory: take your chances with a guy who might be lying or doesn't know about his status - potentially having a much higher viral load... OR someone who you know has the virus but is honest about it and has a much lower viral load.

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    Mar 17, 2013 1:53 AM GMT
    You should use a condom with both individuals. You must assume everyone who is not your trusted monogamous lover, being regularly tested, may have HIV. That's the essence of safe sex, and you take much less of a chance when you wear a condom.

    I saw my doctor last week for a routine check-up, and asked her about the undetectable issue. She's an infectious disease specialist and most of her practice is HIV+ patients.

    She said undetectable does not mean noninfectious to others. It means the infection risk may be lower, but not eliminated. Furthermore, the length of time from the patient's last blood work is critical. Tested as undetectable several months ago may not mean that person is undetectable today.
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    Mar 17, 2013 2:01 AM GMT
    "I'm negative" = "I'm undetectable."

    The underlying cause of my aversion to penetrative sex is the fact listed in the previous line.
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    Mar 17, 2013 2:19 AM GMT
    paulflexes said"I'm negative" = "I'm undetectable."

    The underlying cause of my aversion to penetrative sex is the fact listed in the previous line.


    Or worse...

    "I'm negative" = "I don't want to know what my status is, I'm too afraid to go get tested, because I've been taking it up the ass bareback by a line of guys that goes around the block and I know I won't be able to say 'I'm negative' anymore!"
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    Mar 17, 2013 2:22 AM GMT
    paulflexes said"I'm negative" = "I'm undetectable."

    The underlying cause of my aversion to penetrative sex is the fact listed in the previous line.

    That is not an equivalent sentence, because -

    I'm undetectable ≠ I'm negative
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Mar 18, 2013 5:35 AM GMT
    Thinking of Hiv & stds i think im asexual lol
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    Mar 18, 2013 5:45 AM GMT
    yourname2000 saidI've answered this a thousand times in a hundred threads, but here goes again: I would rather date a poz guy who knows, admits, and is successfully treating his HIV (and therefore is undetectable) than date a guy who says "I'm neg" because the last time he got tested --in 2005-- he was. I'll probably blow either, but they've both gotta wrap it up if they want to poke me with it. And if the condom breaks, in both cases I'm off to get PEP. But with the "I guess I'm neg, I think, maybe" guy, I'm running to the hospital, and with the undetectable guy I'm walking. (kidding)

    The guy who says he's neg but doesn't get tested, and is actually poz, and doesn't know it, and has an out of control viral load is the danger to our community...he only finds out his status when one of his partners tells him "I was neg after my last test before I met you; you're the only person I slept with since; and today I'm poz." And I've also read that the virus left in a person who is successfully treating their HIV is so incapacitated that even if there is exposure it's actually unlikely it could infect you.

    The more valuable question to me is "when were you last tested?" as a follow up to "So, we're gonna play safe, but I'm HIV-, how about you?" If a person says they're neg but they've never gotten tested, or it was 3 years ago and they could be slutting it up every week with someone new, I'm outta there. But if the guy's poz and in control of his HIV, we're probably good to go....I know of lots of poz/neg relationships that have remained so for years and years....I know it's possible.

    And before all the asswipes come in and poop that, I grant anyone the "get out of this situation" card if you can't handle it and are gonna get all weird. No guy --HIV-neg or poz--deserves to be treated like they're lepers....if you're gonna be all nervous, stressed, and act like even his sweat is vampire blood, get the fuck out: spare that person from having to deal with your 1990's psychosis. Done well, saying "sorry, I'm not comfortable doing anal then" can be a "no harm, no foul" kinda thing...you can still cuddle, make-out, massage, frottage, and/or masturbate and still make it a fun evening (even if it has no future).

    You're likely going to have to deal with this situation if you're actively dating: there are a ton of uber-sexy, keen-to-take-care-of-themselves (mind, spirit and body), HIV+ gay men --the kind of men that many whiners bitch "don't exist in the gay community". If you're dating, you better have a classy strategy on how you're gonna deal with that situation.....because even if you have no desire to ever see that poz guy again, he's got friends....neg and poz....and most of us live in pretty small pools of potential gay partners. I (as a neg) personally would have a hard time dating an otherwise hot guy if I heard he was a cunt to someone he chose to go home with, after the guy did the good-guy thing and offered his status before sex.

    Educate yourself and always play safe (you can reevaluate that if you want when you're in a committed relationship --it's a matter of managing risk). I worry that the guys who freak out about poz guys do so because they actually want to have risky sex with a stranger on just the assurance "I'm neg" --he may be lying, he may just not know.

    I can think of a dozen guys on poz guys on RJ who I'd date in a NY minute, but I have to admit: they're just way outta my league.



    Extremely well stated. As someone who is HIV- I am responsible for my own well being. I've dated guys who are HIV+ and will do so again I'm sure if I like them and find them attractive. There are many ways to be intimate, safe and satisfying to both of us icon_exclaim.gif
  • Medjai

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    Mar 18, 2013 5:54 AM GMT
    I would not keep with a poz guy. I will only sleep with a guy who is actually negative.

    Say what you will. My mind isn't changing. My health is not worth risking for a fun night.
  • gwuinsf

    Posts: 525

    Mar 18, 2013 10:56 PM GMT
    Medjai saidI would not keep with a poz guy. I will only sleep with a guy who is actually negative.

    Say what you will. My mind isn't changing. My health is not worth risking for a fun night.


    Everyone is entitled to use whatever criteria they want. Everyone is responsible for their own sexual decisions. For me until I am with someone for several months and we decide to be monogamous and we both get simultaneously tested, I will operate under the assumption that each and every person I'm with is positive. They could be lying (and lots of people lie about their status.) Worse, they could not know themselves. I've had guys ask me if I was positive or negative. What does that tell you? Absolutely nothing.

    For me personally, I have been in a great relationship with a positive man. (I'm negative.) My best friend is positive and his partner is negative. I feel like it's hard enough to meet the right guy, let alone immediately eliminate a big chunk of the population right off the bat.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Mar 18, 2013 11:06 PM GMT
    You are assuming he is being honest about his viral load.

    The answer is condom, condom, condom each and everytime you are not 100% sure of your partner's (or your) status and planning on high rish activity (e.g., anal intercourse).
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    Mar 19, 2013 3:01 AM GMT
    UndercoverMan saidYou are assuming he is being honest about his viral load.

    The answer is condom, condom, condom each and everytime you are not 100% sure of your partner's (or your) status and planning on high rish activity (e.g., anal intercourse).


    This has always been a given for me.

    The question originally posed was based under the assumption of safe sex always. I'm not an idiot and always assume every partner I'm with is +.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Mar 22, 2013 4:24 AM GMT
    As I've said before, ill say it again.

    Ill take the guy with HIV who is honest and upfront with me.

    HIV doesn't scare me. I say that not because I'm not scared of contracting it or because I'm blaise about HIV.

    Because the virus isn't the scary part.

    It's some of the people who carry it, who in ignorance and stupidity don't get checked, have unprotected sex, push others into it and don't give a shit.

    Or those people who do have it and knowingly infect others, who go around intentionally lying and deceiving.

    No, I don't give a damn if the guy I'm interested in has HIV he has an equal a chance as anyone else as long as he has the balls to be honest with me about it!
  • Medjai

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    Mar 22, 2013 4:30 AM GMT
    lilTanker saidAs I've said before, ill say it again.

    Ill take the guy with HIV who is honest and upfront with me.

    HIV doesn't scare me. I say that not because I'm not scared of contracting it or because I'm blaise about HIV.

    Because the virus isn't the scary part.

    It's some of the people who carry it, who in ignorance and stupidity don't get checked, have unprotected sex, push others into it and don't give a shit.

    Or those people who do have it and knowingly infect others, who go around intentionally lying and deceiving.

    No, I don't give a damn if the guy I'm interested in has HIV he has an equal a chance as anyone else as long as he has the balls to be honest with me about it!


    Not being scared of the single most fatal infectious disease on the planet is completely idiotic. It's this lack of respect for how serious it actually is that has the disease on the rise yet again.
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    Mar 22, 2013 4:32 AM GMT
    Enough said...
    photo oraquick_product_006-ecom_1_zpsf747daf3.png
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Mar 22, 2013 4:36 AM GMT
    [quote][cite]Medjai said[/cite
    Not being scared of the single most fatal infectious disease on the planet is completely idiotic. It's this lack of respect for how serious it actually is that has the disease on the rise yet again.[/quote]
    You've never come across as anything but argumentative and rude so ill keep my answer short and simple for you.

    I know a hell of a lot about HIV a lot more then the average gay guy in fact.

    I've volunteered a few times for HIV support groups that provide assistance to people with HIV and AIDS.

    I've seen what it can do, how people can wither away not just physically but mentally.

    I've also seen the worst that can happen to a person.

    You have no idea what a person who doesn't care can do.

    You fear a virus, I hold more fear for the person who doesn't care they have it.
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    Mar 22, 2013 4:39 AM GMT
    Arjuna saidEnough said...
    photo oraquick_product_006-ecom_1_zpsf747daf3.png

    I really hate that test. It can give false readings and where is the support, the care, the love being shown when someone finds out they do have HIV?

    When someone finds out the first thing they need is to know they aren't alone. They need to be given care and love. They need to be able to see that it isn't the end.


    So sitting down in an empty room looking at a stick with no one around
  • Medjai

    Posts: 2671

    Mar 22, 2013 4:39 AM GMT
    lilTanker said
    Not being scared of the single most fatal infectious disease on the planet is completely idiotic. It's this lack of respect for how serious it actually is that has the disease on the rise yet again.
    You've never come across as anything but argumentative and rude so ill keep my answer short and simple for you.

    I know a hell of a lot about HIV a lot more then the average gay guy in fact.

    I've volunteered a few times for HIV support groups that provide assistance to people with HIV and AIDS.

    I've seen what it can do, how people can wither away not just physically but mentally.

    I've also seen the worst that can happen to a person.

    You have no idea what a person who doesn't care can do.

    You fear a virus, I hold more fear for the person who doesn't care they have it.


    Fair enough. You post just came off awful dismissive, and when dealing with something as serious as HIV, dismissive is the last thing one should be.