Interesting Article...."The Gay Hate Mirror"

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    Mar 25, 2013 11:11 PM GMT
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jordan-bach/the-gay-hate-mirror-disco_b_2950073.html?utm_hp_ref=gay-voices
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    Mar 26, 2013 12:06 AM GMT
    That is some truth right here. I would say about 90% of my gay "guy" friends fall into the vicious gay category. And I always ask them why they have to be like that, but they could never give me a straight up answer. This link is going on my fb, so that they can ALL see this. Thanks for this link!
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    Mar 26, 2013 12:21 AM GMT
    I loved this.
  • He_Man

    Posts: 906

    Mar 26, 2013 12:52 AM GMT

    It might be a little cliche-ish, but you attract what you are. Damn! I must be a self-absorbed, egotistical and a selfish prick, then, because that's what I seem to attract! FML icon_evil.gif
  • tautomer

    Posts: 1010

    Mar 26, 2013 1:30 AM GMT
    A lot of this speaks to what I have discussed with my therapist over the past year when it's come up.

    I'll admit, I don't want to be become friends with most gay man. At least intentionally. I have a few gay men I am friends with that I've met over the years, but that wasn't acknowledged until some time had passed. If I become friends with someone, it's because of qualities I like in them as a person, and that's that. That's what happened with them.

    I think a bit part of this is spurred by online dating. Almost everyone assumes that if you're contacted by someone, regardless if they are "just looking for friends", they have some attraction to you. That can make the other party uncomfortable. At least with me, I reject those who are just looking for friends. I just flat out don't want to deal with unspoken undercurrents. I have aspergers anyway, so that's really hard for me to deal with anyway.
  • Drift

    Posts: 217

    Mar 26, 2013 9:11 AM GMT
    "What is he showing me about myself?" Really like this.

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    Mar 26, 2013 11:11 AM GMT
    I completely agree with this article. 100% on point and poignant.

    I highly recommend the read.

    Below is the copied article (for those of us who can't be bothered to click the link ;) :




    Jordan BachWriter, blogger, and speaker
    GET UPDATES FROM JORDAN BACH


    The Gay Hate Mirror: Discovering Who We Are Through Each Other

    In 20MALEGAYNYC, filmmaker Blake Pruitt offers us a peek into the minds of a group of gay New Yorkers in their early 20s. Pruitt, 19, had heard several gay men say in passing, "I hate gay guys," and wanted to explore why, in an age of unprecedented miracles in the courthouses of America, so many gay men find themselves deeply at odds with each other out on the streets. The film has just been accepted into the Johns Hopkins Film Festival.

    First posted on Andrew Sullivan's Daily Beast blog in December 2012, the 10-minute-long compilation of video interviews has since inspired hundreds of impassioned comments on that blog and on websites like Advocate.com and NextMagazine.com.

    Many of the responses take aim at the men's views on the desirability of masculinity and femininity among gay men. The interviews suggested that a masculine man is both the sexual prize and the personal ideal, while a feminine man is not only sexually unwanted but sometimes repulsive on a personal level.

    One perplexed commenter rightfully noted that some of the interviewees embody the very same feminine qualities that they so despise in other men. Another commenter wrote, "They are all so insufferable and self-hating." A contrasting voice rebutted, "Those of you who are attacking these young men are only doing so because they are speaking truths that are painful to you because they are so real."

    Indeed, there are many soundbites in 20MALEGAYNYC that we can roll our eyes at or brush off as culturally insignificant, but a closer look at Pruitt's film reveals a selection of seemingly ordinary men, each of whom is struggling to reconcile his beliefs about what makes a man lovable with the reality of the man looking back at him in the mirror.

    This struggle is not uncommon; many gay men find their own qualities, perhaps apparent to everyone else but them, extremely discomfiting in other gay men. We slither in embarrassment for them or laugh uneasily and toss snide remarks. Comments about 20MALEGAYNYC are full of this type of response, belying a self-righteous anger that simply does not coexist with self-awareness.

    A self-aware man instead asks himself this challenging question and affords himself the compassion to answer truthfully: "What qualities do I find upsetting in other gay men, and do they reside in me?"

    Author Simon Peter Fuller wrote, "What angers us in another person is more often than not an unhealed aspect of ourselves. If we had already resolved that particular issue, we would not be irritated by its reflection back to us."

    Often, a quality in someone else that provokes a deep, visceral reaction has been within us all along, yet we choose to blame them rather than admit that they've simply reminded us of our own dark thoughts.

    The saving grace of this "mirror" perspective is that the qualities we so admire and desperately seek out in others have also been within us all along. The sexiness, the strength, the confidence. They reveal themselves when we dance to our favorite music when no one is watching or think about being stars at our dream jobs. In exhilarating moments like these we feel what it would be like to unleash the fullest possible version of ourselves.

    We are quick to disconnect from such images of glory, rejecting them as fantasy or narcissism. We ask ourselves, "Who am I to be sexy, strong and deeply at peace with myself?" Looking at our mental list called "Things About Me That I Need to Change Before I Can Be Happy," we conclude that because of what we have done or have not done, we are unworthy of the power that owning our sexiness, strength and confidence would bring us. We have the fabulous qualities; we would just rather that someone else own them for us. This is how many gay relationships begin. And it's how many end; we may ultimately feel unworthy even to be loved by someone who has the power we want for ourselves, so one way or another, we unconsciously drive it out of our lives.

    But it is not narcissistic or arrogant to think that you deserve an amazing life. It is humble. The evolutionary impulse of the universe effortlessly turns an acorn into an oak tree. It does the same thing with a zygote, turning it into a fully functioning adult human. And this evolutionary impulse wants to do the same thing with the circumstances of your life: grow and expand them to their highest potential. We need only get out of the way and allow the universe to do its job. When we truly forgive ourselves, we automatically release the judgment we have held toward others and humbly accept our rightful destiny as sexy, strong, powerful children of the universe.

    Of course, these life lessons apply to all human relationships, but a gay man is on a spiritual fast-track to learn them, or at least he can choose to see it that way. His primary relationship is with himself, and all others are mirrors of it. An honest investigation of what irritates him about or attracts him to another gay man can hasten his own quest for personal power and authenticity.

    The miraculous shift in perspective that begins to evolve your life is going from saying, "I totally hate that guy," to asking, "What is he showing me about myself?"
  • MuscleComeBac...

    Posts: 2376

    Mar 26, 2013 11:59 AM GMT
    It's a thought provoking piece, but terribly convenient like most pop psychology theories. I think it's much more complicated than the article implies and not a universal truth. People are more complex and not so easily analyzed. This kind of theory becomes 'the answer' too easily, I find. Not every fucking trait is a reflection of our fears, hang ups, prejudices and personas.
    Great for taking your practice on the book circuit or film festival circuit but so boring eventually - like all reductive psychology. It leaves no room for self actualized men to avoid over-educated and under-lived degree candidates in search of a project.
  • Rhi_Bran

    Posts: 904

    Mar 26, 2013 12:02 PM GMT
    "Author Simon Peter Fuller wrote, "What angers us in another person is more often than not an unhealed aspect of ourselves. If we had already resolved that particular issue, we would not be irritated by its reflection back to us."

    One of the worst parts of the human condition.
  • MuscleComeBac...

    Posts: 2376

    Mar 26, 2013 12:07 PM GMT
    Rhi_Bran said"Author Simon Peter Fuller wrote, "What angers us in another person is more often than not an unhealed aspect of ourselves. If we had already resolved that particular issue, we would not be irritated by its reflection back to us."

    One of the worst parts of the human condition.


    This is not applicable to being angered by homophobia, animal abuse, lack of character, lack of integrity, etc. Nor to hyper-femininity or hyper-masculinity that parades as personas within limited segments and social groupings in both straight and gay culture. Unevolved asses abound and finding them irritating is seldom a reflection of a lack of evolution in the observer. That's bogus.

    As a generalization - 'more often than not' - this kind of thinking makes for a very solipsistic culture unable to advance important debates and model mature relationships.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Mar 26, 2013 1:24 PM GMT
    MuscleComeBack said
    Rhi_Bran said"Author Simon Peter Fuller wrote, "What angers us in another person is more often than not an unhealed aspect of ourselves. If we had already resolved that particular issue, we would not be irritated by its reflection back to us."

    One of the worst parts of the human condition.


    This is not applicable to being angered by homophobia, animal abuse, lack of character, lack of integrity, etc. Nor to hyper-femininity or hyper-masculinity that parades as personas within limited segments and social groupings in both straight and gay culture. Unevolved asses abound and finding them irritating is seldom a reflection of a lack of evolution in the observer. That's bogus.

    As a generalization - 'more often than not' - this kind of thinking makes for a very solipsistic culture unable to advance important debates and model mature relationships.




    I think there is a huge difference to being justly angered, or to disagree with a harmful and insidious behaviour acted out by another, and to have a strong, illogical, visceral hatred about a personality characteristic displayed in another that disturbs one's own emotional equilibrium to such a degree that they become consumed with a deeply rooted hatred and misguided anger.

    Comparing being angered by animal abuse and being angered by hyper masculinity/femininity is starkly dis-analogous.

    One scenario deals with justified and rationally expressed anger, the other unjustified and irrational.

    Of course, the point of view put forward by the author of this article is not a universal truth, but it certainly rings true to a lot of situations that fit this context, and results from studies that cohere with it's hypothesis (such as the scientific studies on self-identifying straight men, homophobic and non-homophobic, watching gay porn, and the very strong correlation between the openly homophobic men becoming significantly sexually aroused during the display of gay porn).
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Mar 26, 2013 2:00 PM GMT
    Some of my closest friends are gay and I can honestly none of them falls in this category. Gay or straight am not going to pick friends based on looks or mannerism but their character. Though I have met guys who only want to be friends with other handsome guys and cringe when someone is more feminine than them.
  • sannn

    Posts: 11

    Mar 26, 2013 2:06 PM GMT
    many things written here are true there has been a secret love-hate reaction

    which happens between men straight or gay or bi

    even with girls and girls and boys.

    between women and men too!l

    I feel if we teach the world to respect people more and be humble

    we will be able to forgive our own mistakes that we see in others.

    Hatred has become very fashionable from the time we learn't to hate.

    Some are diplomatic ,Some take un reasonable steps to show their anger

    ,some where it is a deep attraction which we fear may be exhibited and we crush it and show hatred .


    We are trained to hate which is the biggest flaw in humans.