"Individuals with documented histories of childhood sexual abuse were significantly more likely than controls to report ever having had same-sex sexual partners."

  • Medjai

    Posts: 2671

    Apr 07, 2013 3:17 AM GMT
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19130206

    Thoughts?
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    Apr 07, 2013 4:07 AM GMT
    I was physically abused when I was 10, and another time when I was 12....
    2 years, both were my math teachers(female)...& both times, I changed the school!
    But never sexually abused! & I turned out to be gay!

    But, I didn't understand what this research trying to say....
    Is it that abused children are more likely to be gay?

    I feel the other way around, I feel that gay people are more likely to be abused! That is the reason why the statistics shows that abused kids are more likely to be having same-sexual partners!
    who knows!? they have said 'although further research is needed to explore this relationship and to examine potential underlying mechanisms.'
  • reptile18

    Posts: 199

    Apr 07, 2013 6:09 AM GMT
    Never sexually abused either...

    The results don't make any sense to me.
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    Apr 07, 2013 6:33 AM GMT
    I don't even need to read it to know it's bullshit.
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    Apr 07, 2013 6:36 AM GMT
    Their findings state physical abuse and neglect have no bearing. All they state is in their sample size (which was a measly 72 people) of sexually abused children showed an increase in them having a same-sex partner... but only saw this in men.

    They also don't distinguish between these people identifying themselves as gay or just having a same-sex experience at some point in their life.

    Personally I don't find this news when the sample size is 72, if you believe normal gay rates are 3-5%, a couple extra gay people thrown into this group by random luck throws everything off.
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    Apr 07, 2013 6:56 AM GMT
    well that was pointless.

    What is there to discuss
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    Apr 07, 2013 11:04 AM GMT
    I read the full article, which I have access to as a psych student. Very interesting stuff if you understand stats.

    Papers like these are actually very important to all of us. This paper actually does good in that it challenges the previous literature that suggests childhood sexual abuse could lead to same-sex relationships or cohabitation. The results from the sample indicate that about 6.4% of males that have been sexually abused end up experimenting in some way with a same-sex partner, 2.9% of sexually abused males have had a same-sex partner in the last year, and 3% have cohabitated with a same-sex partner. That said, an important item of note is that only five men out of the entire sample reported having had exclusively same-sex sexual partners. These numbers are fairly consistent with what one could expect based on the existing literature.

    When ignoring outdated p-value significance testing and instead looking at effect size, the researchers reported a moderate effect size of .57 for childhood sexual abuse and same-sex sexual partners, a significant finding given the sample size (btw, with a smaller sample size researchers have to stack the deck against themselves, so when they say it's statistically significant, trust that it is not arbitrary). What does that mean in plain English? Compared to people who have not been sexually abused, people who have been are more likely to experiment with the same sex. Nothing about sexual identity whatsoever. Pulled straight from their results section: "our findings do not suggest that sexually abused boys are more likely to identify as gay when they grow up, only that they are more likely to have male sexual partners at some point in their lives." Accordingly, a key limitation of this study is that they didn't ask any participants to self-identify as straight, gay, lesbian or bisexual, and because of this there is no way that this study can be used to link sexual abuse and sexual identity.

    Anyone who is just interested in human sexuality in general can learn a fair bit from this study, but this study was never intended to imply any sort of causation of sexual identity as a result of sexual abuse. It simply informs us that childhood sexual abuse is connected to sexual experimentation, but it's only a minor association. It is in no way a primary factor for "sexual deviancy" that conservatives would have you believe it is.
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    Apr 07, 2013 11:15 AM GMT
    ^
    You need to get outside more often.
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    Apr 07, 2013 11:24 AM GMT
    credo said^
    You need to get outside more often.

    Hi, my name's Jesse. What's your name? Pleased to meet you. Aside from being a full-time student in the senior year of my honours program, I am a volunteer stats/Spanish tutor, volunteer personal trainer, musician, soccer official, and I work in media relations in my school's varsity athletics department. On top of that, I play competitive volleyball several days a week, indoor or outdoor grass/beach depending on time of year. I love sharing with people and in doing so advocating a lifestyle with a focus on others, not just on myself.

    I get outside a fair damn bit, thank you very much icon_rolleyes.gif
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    Apr 07, 2013 11:30 AM GMT
    juvenescences said
    credo said^
    You need to get outside more often.

    Hi, my name's Jesse. What's your name? Pleased to meet you. Aside from being a full-time student in the senior year of my honours program, I am a volunteer stats/Spanish tutor, volunteer personal trainer, musician, soccer official, and I work in media relations in my school's varsity athletics department. On top of that, I play competitive volleyball several days a week, indoor or outdoor grass/beach depending on time of year. I love sharing with people and in doing so advocating a lifestyle with a focus on others, not just on myself.

    I get outside a fair damn bit, thank you very much icon_rolleyes.gif

    Someone's testy.
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    Apr 07, 2013 11:33 AM GMT
    48220249_a9a4bc8f56.jpg
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    Apr 07, 2013 12:42 PM GMT
    I think this is true because during my childhood, when I was playing with a friend older than me, he told me to stand on the wall and eventually his rocket was rubbing against my butt. I was scared but he told me it's fine and he stopped when he heard his mother was opening the gate. As far as I remember he had an access to pornographic magazines which was from his highschool friends. I was a bit puzzled and then on I started to stay away from him. I guess this is the reason I don't trust a guy easily but looking for a man who would be trusted in a relationship. Most probably I would never be gay if I never experienced that thing...
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    Apr 07, 2013 2:08 PM GMT
    If that article had an ounce of truth, law enforcement could go arrest the parents of gay people for sexual abuse.
  • jayatl56

    Posts: 463

    Apr 07, 2013 2:43 PM GMT
    What's the difference between abuse and molestation? I was molested as a boy but not abused - at least that's my take on it.

    It was an uncle who was a bachelor living with my grandparents. My parents would drop me off at their house and I'd stay there over the weekend when mom and dad wanted a weekend to them selves. I'd sleep with my uncle in his bed. It started around 11 years old and lasted a few years. Now the strange part of this is that I think I enjoyed it especially when I was older.

    I wonder now if any of this has affected (1) my sexuality (2) my inability to have a long term relationship and (3) getting more of a thrill out of behind the scene rendezvous'. In other words, I have more fun cruising a park or Craigslist than trying to have a straight forward date, etc. I think it comes from the secretive way my sexuality developed.

    My ex was sort of the same. He was 30 years younger than me and grew up in communist Czechoslovakia. His step dad was always rubbing his butt and while he never said there was sex there was some playing around and apparently other older men paid special attention to him. That apparently developed his attraction to older men where mine caused me to avoid older men.
  • O5vx

    Posts: 3154

    Apr 07, 2013 3:13 PM GMT
    There are several research that seek to justify the reason a person will want to engage in a same sex encounter with abuse. What I find most fascinating in many of those research is that those perpetrator are more than likely someone that they know; some one that they and their family trust. It is an evolution of human sexuality that seek to justify many of these action with the need to exert control; the need to maintain dominance is often the motivating factor in most situation that abuse is taking place. I find many of their findings distorted because it never really explain the relationship between the people interview and their so called abusers.
  • calibro

    Posts: 8888

    Apr 07, 2013 3:27 PM GMT
    the report singles out men who have same sex sexual relationships... that isn't the same thing as being gay
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    Apr 07, 2013 4:51 PM GMT
    calibro saidthe report singles out men who have same sex sexual relationships... that isn't the same thing as being gay


    Bingo.
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    Apr 07, 2013 5:06 PM GMT
    So according to this, I should feel what? That my sexual attraction to men is less than normal...maybe a consequence of an immoral act on me as a child? If it is...it's how I'm wired now and I'm happy with how I'm wired. I love being attracted to guys and I wouldn't change it...EVER!
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    Apr 07, 2013 6:36 PM GMT
    juvenescences saidI read the full article, which I have access to as a psych student. Very interesting stuff if you understand stats.

    Papers like these are actually very important to all of us. This paper actually does good in that it challenges the previous literature that suggests childhood sexual abuse could lead to same-sex relationships or cohabitation. The results from the sample indicate that about 6.4% of males that have been sexually abused end up experimenting in some way with a same-sex partner, 2.9% of sexually abused males have had a same-sex partner in the last year, and 3% have cohabitated with a same-sex partner. That said, an important item of note is that only five men out of the entire sample reported having had exclusively same-sex sexual partners. These numbers are fairly consistent with what one could expect based on the existing literature.

    When ignoring outdated p-value significance testing and instead looking at effect size, the researchers reported a moderate effect size of .57 for childhood sexual abuse and same-sex sexual partners, a significant finding given the sample size (btw, with a smaller sample size researchers have to stack the deck against themselves, so when they say it's statistically significant, trust that it is not arbitrary). What does that mean in plain English? Compared to people who have not been sexually abused, people who have been are more likely to experiment with the same sex. Nothing about sexual identity whatsoever. Pulled straight from their results section: "our findings do not suggest that sexually abused boys are more likely to identify as gay when they grow up, only that they are more likely to have male sexual partners at some point in their lives." Accordingly, a key limitation of this study is that they didn't ask any participants to self-identify as straight, gay, lesbian or bisexual, and because of this there is no way that this study can be used to link sexual abuse and sexual identity.

    Anyone who is just interested in human sexuality in general can learn a fair bit from this study, but this study was never intended to imply any sort of causation of sexual identity as a result of sexual abuse. It simply informs us that childhood sexual abuse is connected to sexual experimentation, but it's only a minor association. It is in no way a primary factor for "sexual deviancy" that conservatives would have you believe it is.


    Thank you fror this. Of course, get ready for the actual findings to go way over the heads of homophobes.
  • steve2steeve

    Posts: 27

    Apr 07, 2013 6:42 PM GMT
    @juvenescences..i am having a hard time understandin stats in my course..and i am serious..do u provide tutorials, help, recommendations as well....
    and again i am serious...no jokes here...
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 07, 2013 7:27 PM GMT
    topathlete said
    Good messages and very appropriate, mature response to the type of trolling BS seen too much here.

    I appreciate the support, thank you!

    dayumm said
    Thank you for this. Of course, get ready for the actual findings to go way over the heads of homophobes.

    You're welcome! And yes, I suspect some homophobes will not understand the actual findings, but judging by a number of responses to this thread, they aren't the only ones...

    steve2steeve said@juvenescences..i am having a hard time understandin stats in my course..and i am serious..do u provide tutorials, help, recommendations as well....
    and again i am serious...no jokes here...

    I have a very important exam coming up on Wednesday so I won't have time to help you in any sort of meaningful way until after then. If your course is not finishing any time soon I can help you after that. Otherwise, let me know more specifically what you're struggling with so I can give you at least a start on understanding statistics to some measure, either through teaching you a bit myself or providing links to something else that can help you. Cheers!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 08, 2013 12:27 AM GMT
    The numbers are far too small to support the conclusions drawn.
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    Apr 08, 2013 12:36 AM GMT
    Unintended said
    TigerTim saidThe numbers are far too small to support the conclusions drawn.


    Not true, JUVENESCENCES has it right...


    Professional statistician here X
  • TheBizMan

    Posts: 4091

    Apr 08, 2013 12:42 AM GMT
    Correlation is not equal to causation.
  • TroyAthlete

    Posts: 4269

    Apr 08, 2013 12:47 AM GMT
    Unintended said
    TheBizMan saidCorrelation is not equal to causation.


    Is that the best you can come up with?


    He's doesn't need to come up with anything else. He's right.

    The suggestion is that sexually abuse leads to homosexuality, but it could well be that homosexuality leads to abuse, i.e., kids who present as 'gay' more likely to be sexually abused.

    It could also be that kids who are sexually abused are more likely to move to big cities and thus end up around more gay people in general, which leads to more same-sex partners.

    It could also be that kids who are sexually abused are more likely to enter creative industries, where they are more gay people and therefore most chances to for same-sex hookups.

    I could go on and on, but we have a correlation here but no cause. So people should relax about it.