How do some acheive super-ripped abs, not just a 6 pack?

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  Apr 11, 2013 5:46 AM GMT

  So I'm the local hole in wall gay bar the other day, you know...the ones that have a TV screen rotating a gallery of thousands of photos of models you'll never meet. Seeing some of them, they're like ripped to the core.
  
  I'm just wondering, what is involved in achieving that physique? Like for me, I have an 8 pack, but if I relax sometimes I can come out looking kinda like I have a beer belly. My friend teases me to suck in sometimes. But it's not like I don't have abs. I also notice if an angle of light shining above from sideways (as opposed to directly above looking into a mirror) makes my abs look really good to.
  
  But I know I can get them to be a bit more ripped than they are. I'll confess I don't do a 'ab' days, but i do 2-3 exercises for abs/obliques 2-4 times a week. I've upped my cardio, which seems to help also. But I'm thinking, is there some kind of supplement out here that may be giving extra results? Also...do you find simply shaving your body hair makes your abs look more ripped? This is a picture example:
  
  

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• calibro
  
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  Apr 11, 2013 1:05 PM GMT

  photoshop

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  Apr 11, 2013 1:07 PM GMT

  Diet.

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• Montague
  
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  Apr 11, 2013 1:08 PM GMT

  natty

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• He_Man
  
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  Apr 11, 2013 2:03 PM GMT

  Abs are made in the kitchen, not the gym.
  
  I have a friend here in Fort Lauderadale, Florida, who competes in men's physique competitions and is an IFBB pro, Mark Anthony. I asked him what he has to do and eats in order to get into competition shape. He told me that it takes him about four months of intense cardio and weight training and that he only eats fish and drinks proteins shakes during this time with the absolute minimum carbs.
  
  
  
  Another secret that most guys won't tell you is that to do the above, you would eat away valuable muscle mass, so in order to halt muscle wasting, they use anabolic supplements (Winstrol, Masteron, Trenbelone, etc), growth hormone and other cutting supplements, such as clenbuterol, Cytomel/Synthrod, etc.
  
  Over the years of being in the bodybuilding scene, I've found that not too many people are natural, and the ones that claim to be natural used some type of sports enhancing drugs at least once in their lives.
  
  Don't fall for all of the marketing hype, no one ever gets abs and looks like professional fitness models just by taking X-brand of fat loss supplements and X-brand of protein. It cracks me up when people think they can look like this by taking some kind of nutritional supplement.
  
  Exhibit A:
  
  

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  Apr 11, 2013 2:08 PM GMT

  How do some acheive super-ripped abs, not just a 6 pack?
  
  Diet.

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  Apr 11, 2013 2:10 PM GMT

  Also: Christian Boeving can go ahead and set up camp on my face.

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• honestsweat
  
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  Apr 11, 2013 2:11 PM GMT

  Christian Boeving. Huh, what did he say? I was distracted by his nips.

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• sans_serif
  
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  Apr 11, 2013 2:15 PM GMT

  Most of it is genetics; however, good lighting and photoshop also help.
  
  People don't realize that it takes extreme monitoring of your diet (water, calorie and sodium intake) and body fat percentage to look like that. Also, it's extremely hard on your body, unhealthy even, to maintain that.

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• pelotudo
  
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  Apr 11, 2013 3:21 PM GMT

  He_Man saidAbs are made in the kitchen, not the gym.
  
  I have a friend here in Fort Lauderadale, Florida, who competes in men's physique competitions and is an IFBB pro, Mark Anthony. I asked him what he has to do and eats in order to get into competition shape. He told me that it takes him about four months of intense cardio and weight training and that he only eats fish and drinks proteins shakes during this time with the absolute minimum carbs.
  
  
  
  Another secret that most guys won't tell you is that to do the above, you would eat away valuable muscle mass, so in order to halt muscle wasting, they use anabolic supplements (Winstrol, Masteron, Trenbelone, etc), growth hormone and other cutting supplements, such as clenbuterol, Cytomel/Synthrod, etc.
  
  Over the years of being in the bodybuilding scene, I've found that not too many people are natural, and the ones that claim to be natural used some type of sports enhancing drugs at least once in their lives.
  
  Don't fall for all of the marketing hype, no one ever gets abs and looks like professional fitness models just by taking X-brand of fat loss supplements and X-brand of protein. It cracks me up when people think they can look like this by taking some kind of nutritional supplement.
  
  Exhibit A:
  
  

  
  
  THIS. Perfect response, He_Man.
  
  I will also add that before professional shots like this one are taken, fitness models will often go through a "peak week." They will go extremely / no carb for a few days so that they deplete their body. They will also drink ridiculous amounts of water. Then, they will dramatically increase carbs the day before the shoot, as well as stop drinking water.
  
  Because their bodies are carb-depleted, their muscles will absorb the carbs and look fuller. Likewise, because they have been drinking so much water, their body will not retain any when they stop drinking; thus, they will remove any water that is being stored under the skin, making their skin very tight.
  
  As you can see, it can take months of dieting, and then a week of torturing yourself, for an incredible photo like the one at the beginning of this thread. Nobody looks like this 24/7, unless he has a ton of steroids that a lot of bodybuilders wouldn't even touch...

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  Apr 11, 2013 3:34 PM GMT

  That look is all about diet. Doing endless crunches and variations of crunches wont get you there. You need to step up you diet game and adjust you training to match to get that above average look.
  
  Most guys look like that when they are prepping for a competition. However take a look at leangains.com. Martin maintains a single digit body-fat level year around. I don't believe he does steroids. If he did, he'd likely look a lot different.
  
  

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  Apr 11, 2013 6:59 PM GMT

  Photoshop and lighting

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  Apr 11, 2013 10:45 PM GMT

  sounds like some of this involves not drinking alchol as well
  
  I know for sure I can work on my diet, but god...I would like that look before a photo shoot or pool party though.
  
  Sometimes the camera can work for you or against you. Some photo shoots have shown me looking like I have no 6 pack at all because the photographer didn't angle the light correctly. While others showed me having ripped obliques/6 pack etc.
  
  The thought of eating nothing but fish and protien shakes makes me really lose weight...by puking! lol. (hmmm, sounds like a good idea?

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• He_Man
  
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  Apr 11, 2013 10:52 PM GMT

  FuzzyPecs25 saidsounds like some of this involves not drinking alchol as well
  
  I know for sure I can work on my diet, but god...I would like that look before a photo shoot or pool party though.
  
  Sometimes the camera can work for you or against you. Some photo shoots have shown me looking like I have no 6 pack at all because the photographer didn't angle the light correctly. While others showed me having ripped obliques/6 pack etc.
  
  The thought of eating nothing but fish and protien shakes makes me really lose weight...by puking! lol. (hmmm, sounds like a good idea?

  
  
  Haha... Yeah, I thought the "local hole in wall gay bar the other day" part was funny because you can't drink all of those empty carbs and get those abs you want.
  
  From now on, it's only fish and rice cakes and lots of water, no alcohol!
  
  
  
  
  
  Oh, I love this guy! Look how hard he has to think about what he's going to eat throughout the day. The poor guy is so carb depleted that he's almost brain dead. <3

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  Apr 11, 2013 10:59 PM GMT

  Danny won his show, by the way. ROFL.
  
  Anyway, here are the secrets of bodybuilders and "models" alike:
  1. Strict diet (Can't be fat if you aren't driving the insulin response the wrong way.)
  2. Plenty of cardio (HIIT, or steady state) (burn the calories
  3. Metabolic stacks like:
  ECA, T3, T4, Clen, Ephy, Caffiene..Green Tea. Even DNP (which is CRAZY in my view.) (Speed up cellular respiration).
  4. AAS (to be full, and preserve lean mass, and to be able to train at a high level)
  5. Anti-estrogens (even "natural guys" do this stuff). "Natural guys do anti-e's for that dry look.)
  6. Water pills / diuretics for that dry look.
  7. Carb loading / carb deloading. (fullness)
  8. Insulin push (fullness)
  9. Blood pressure meds for vascularity
  10. EPO for vascularity.
  11. Alcohol, for fullness, and dryness.
  12. Shitload diet before shoot (high fat, high sodium, while dehydrated is what makes you big and dry and loaded).
  
  There's your reality check.

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• Danskerb
  
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  Apr 11, 2013 11:20 PM GMT

  its nearly depressing reading through this, hearing how impossible this is to look good. Im going to keep trying without supplements and without a crazy diet

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• highforthis
  
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  Apr 12, 2013 2:32 AM GMT

  That's why I only aim for "toned". I never work on abs. Much better returns on effort
  
  

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• He_Man
  
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  Apr 12, 2013 2:43 AM GMT

  bxp011 saidits nearly depressing reading through this, hearing how impossible this is to look good. Im going to keep trying without supplements and without a crazy diet

  
  
  I'm not trying to be rude, but what's really depressing is that you, as well as most other gay guys, think that unless you look like the models above that you don't or can't possibly look good enough, and I'm quoting you here, "hearing how impossible this is to look good." Seriously?
  
  I'm just looking at your profile picture, and you look good to me. Why do you have to have eight-pack abs, be dried out and hard as a rock just to look good. I can't be hypocritical because I, too, spend countless hours in the gym, eating crazy amounts of protein and am always dieting to achieve an idealistic goal, but that's part of a bodybuilder's mentality --you're never good enough, and you will never achieve an end because in bodybuilding there is no end, just continuous gains and improvements -- but I don't think I don't "look good."
  
  No wonder we kill ourselves in the gym, with steroids and crazy shit because, god only knows, that you only "look good" when you look like the hot, ripped, eight-pack, Greek gods posted on RealJock, which only compose, I'd say, 1% of the population, if that.
  
  Sorry, I have to go now and spend two hours doing cardio and only eating fish and rice cakes!

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  Apr 12, 2013 2:53 AM GMT

  He_Man saidOver the years of being in the bodybuilding scene, I've found that not too many people are natural, and the ones that claim to be natural used some type of sports enhancing drugs at least once in their lives.
  
  Don't fall for all of the marketing hype, no one ever gets abs and looks like professional fitness models just by taking X-brand of fat loss supplements and X-brand of protein. It cracks me up when people think they can look like this by taking some kind of nutritional supplement.

  
  
  If only the general population knew that...
  
  Listen, folks, your standards are juiced standards. It's just amazing how you all manage to fantasize these fitness models are natural. There are people on RJ who are vehemently opposed to anabolic steroids, yet hot list confirmed steroid users. It would be interesting to see what would happen if all juicers disappeared from Earth... many anti-AAS people would be without fap material for sure...

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  Apr 12, 2013 2:57 AM GMT

  Note that some guys starve themselves, and..e.g. take a picture of their torso and are 5'10" and say 130. They have "abs" (kinda) and nothing else.
  
  Fitness / bodybuilding photo shoots are as much about science as art.
  
  Lots and lots of guys on this site are in GREAT SHAPE.
  
  Being super lean, though, is neither good for you, nor is it something that is obtained without some form of extreme dieting / chemistry.
  
  There a few folks who are classic mesomorphs who carry low fat, and tons of muscle, without doing anything special. Those are the guys who are the freaks when you throw science in on top of it. Still, there are others who lack one, or both, genes controlling muscle growth (super babies).
  
  In my own case, I never work to get super lean, unless for a contest, and I weighed 185 in high school. It's easy for guys like me...with...or without...extras.
  
  If you eat sugary, fried, food, once a day, and don't work out, you're either going to be skinny fat or just fat fat.
  
  The fitness industry's look / marketing is largely farce because the open, honest, research, and discussion, as well as treatment of adverse affects, has all been driven into the underworld, because of a failed war on drugs, which, of course, results in a worse outcome across the board, but, most accomplished athletes are fairly bright.
  
  Many over the counter products are far more dangerous via side effects than naturally occurring hormones in higher amounts.
  
  Popular culture also has a double standard: the fat ass at home doesn't want watch two hairy-backed, fat ass MMA fighters,...he wants to watch to cleaned up, juiced guys kick some ass. That's reality.
  
  It is what it is, and Lance Armstrong stands as the shining example. Everyone else was taking EPO (there was no test for it at the time), and Lance simply pissed to many folks off along the way. That's reality.
  
  Muscle and Fitness isn't on every newsstand in the country because folks want to see average guys from next door. They want to see juiced to the gills, genetic freaks...and...of course...they peddle the so, so over the counter stuff.
  
  I personally feel having it all in the open would be much safer for all concerned and tear down the marketing of "supplement" companies.
  
  That won't happen because the folks in Big Pharm want huge profit taking, and the military industrial complex is making a killing on "outlaws."
  
  Many of the fitness industries products are very close or are designer hormones, and the folks who can't stand the thought of using stuff, have really works to outlaw anything that works...hormone, or not. (which is absolutely crazy because it's subjective and much of the OTC stuff is nothing less than crap).
  
  Guys my age, and older, grew up with the stuff, and through HIV research, and geriatrics, the many benefits of hormone supplementation have come to light, and Big Pharm is now trying to milk it for everything it can. Like "Reefer Madness", you simply can't lie to The Public in an ongoing way.

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• TroyAthlete
  
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  Apr 12, 2013 4:59 AM GMT

  Clenbuterol.
  
  /end thread

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  Apr 12, 2013 5:28 AM GMT

  He_Man saidAnother secret that most guys won't tell you is that to do the above, you would eat away valuable muscle mass, so in order to halt muscle wasting, they use anabolic supplements (Winstrol, Masteron, Trenbelone, etc), growth hormone and other cutting supplements, such as clenbuterol, Cytomel/Synthrod, etc.

  
  
  I take the natural version of Synthroid for a thryoid condition. Since I have no choice, should I be compensating in some way? Could this be why I can't gain muscle mass, even though I work out nearly every day and already cut out much of the cardio?

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  Apr 12, 2013 5:55 AM GMT

  Fish and a rice cake is a shitty way to go through life. You might look amazing, but who cares. If you are not a fitness model or training for a competition, why the hell would you put yourself through hell? We all want to look good, but if you ruin your health in the process of trying to appear fit (abs don't equal fitness) then you are really just a fraud. Give me athletic and fit over pumped and ripped any day. Honestly, I think your priorities are screwed up.

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• He_Man
  
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  Apr 12, 2013 5:59 AM GMT

  shortbutsweet said

  He_Man saidAnother secret that most guys won't tell you is that to do the above, you would eat away valuable muscle mass, so in order to halt muscle wasting, they use anabolic supplements (Winstrol, Masteron, Trenbelone, etc), growth hormone and other cutting supplements, such as clenbuterol, Cytomel/Synthrod, etc.

  
  
  I take the natural version of Synthroid for a thryoid condition. Since I have no choice, should I be compensating in some way? Could this be why I can't gain muscle mass, even though I work out nearly every day and already cut out much of the cardio?

  
  
  Not likely... You said that you take "the natural version of Synthroid." Do you mean that you take an OTC or a natural alternative to help stimulate your thyroid, or did your doctor prescribe you a medical version of Synthroid to stimulate your thyroid?
  
  Either way, if you already have hypothyroidism, then the Synthroid, or whatever you're taking to stimulate the thyroid, should bring you close to your natural baseline, not jack it up to the point that it is causing your body to burn more calories than you consume. If you're taking a prescription form T3 or T4, then ask your doctor about the dosage, and he or she may have to tweak it if you think it increasing your metabolism that much. On the other hand, OTC remedies for hypothyroidism rarely work, and some are dangerous such as Potassium Iodide, if taken in large amounts. ALWAYS ask your doctor or health care professional about supplement or medications before you take them, or at least study the hell out of them from reputable sources such as WebMD, NIH, The Mayo Clinic, PubMed, etc. You do not want to F-up your thyroid, as any bodybuilder will tell you. If you destroy your thyroid, then just looking at a salad will make you fat.
  
  If you're not gaining muscle mass, and you're working out hard everyday, while not doing cardio, then take a look at your diet. Are you consuming enough calories, carbohydrates and proteins? Excluding other health issues that you may not know about, gaining weight is a matter of eating enough nutrients and also the timing of those nutrients. Take advantage of the "anabolic window" following your workouts. Have a lot of carbs immediately after working out to get an insulin spike with some fast-acting proteins such as whey isolate or hydrowhey, and then have a real wholefood meal about thirty minutes to an hour after the workout to utilize the "anabolic window." Eat every two to three hours after that to make sure your body is getting enough nutrients and amino acids that it needs.
  
  You could be an ectomorph, and if that's the case, then you just have to eat, eat and eat some more. Again, I highly doubt that you're not gaining weight due to taking some kind of thyroid supplement. Fitness models and bodybuilders take large amounts of T3/T4, plus GH, Insulin, AAS and clen just to shred excess body fat, so I don't think the amount you're taking will cause you to lose too much weight. Again, consult your physician if you are concerned with the side effects with whatever you're taking.

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  Apr 12, 2013 6:20 AM GMT

  He_Man said

  shortbutsweet said

  He_Man saidAnother secret that most guys won't tell you is that to do the above, you would eat away valuable muscle mass, so in order to halt muscle wasting, they use anabolic supplements (Winstrol, Masteron, Trenbelone, etc), growth hormone and other cutting supplements, such as clenbuterol, Cytomel/Synthrod, etc.

  
  
  I take the natural version of Synthroid for a thryoid condition. Since I have no choice, should I be compensating in some way? Could this be why I can't gain muscle mass, even though I work out nearly every day and already cut out much of the cardio?

  
  
  Not likely... You said that you take "the natural version of Synthroid." Do you mean that you take an OTC or a natural alternative to help stimulate your thyroid, or did your doctor prescribe you a medical version of Synthroid to stimulate your thyroid?
  
  Either way, if you already have hypothyroidism, then the Synthroid, or whatever you're taking to stimulate the thyroid, should bring you close to your natural baseline, not jack it up to the point that it is causing your body to burn more calories than you consume. If you're taking a prescription form T3 or T4, then ask your doctor about the dosage, and he or she may have to tweak it if you think it increasing your metabolism that much. On the other hand, OTC remedies for hypothyroidism rarely work, and some are dangerous such as Potassium Iodide, if taken in large amounts. ALWAYS ask your doctor or health care professional about supplement or medications before you take them, or at least study the hell out of them from reputable sources such as WebMD, NIH, The Mayo Clinic, PubMed, etc. You do not want to F-up your thyroid, as any bodybuilder will tell you. If you destroy your thyroid, then just looking at a salad will make you fat.
  
  If you're not gaining muscle mass, and you're working out hard everyday, while not doing cardio, then take a look at your diet. Are you consuming enough calories, carbohydrates and proteins? Excluding other health issues that you may not know about, gaining weight is a matter of eating enough nutrients and also the timing of those nutrients. Take advantage of the "anabolic window" following your workouts. Have a lot of carbs immediately after working out to get an insulin spike with some fast-acting proteins such as whey isolate or hydrowhey, and then have a real wholefood meal about thirty minutes to an hour after the workout to utilize the "anabolic window." Eat every two to three hours after that to make sure your body is getting enough nutrients and amino acids that it needs.
  
  You could be an ectomorph, and if that's the case, then you just have to eat, eat and eat some more. Again, I highly doubt that you're not gaining weight due to taking some kind of thyroid supplement. Fitness models and bodybuilders take large amounts of T3/T4, plus GH, Insulin, AAS and clen just to shred excess body fat, so I don't think the amount you're taking will cause you to lose too much weight. Again, consult your physician if you are concerned with the side effects with whatever you're taking.

  
  
  Thank you for the detailed advice, He_Man. What I take is Armour Thryroid. It's a T3/T4 combination that is prescription only, unlike Synthroid which is just T4. Doctors are always pushing Synthroid, but many people with thyroid disease respond better to the natural combination. I tend to avoid physician advice when it comes to health, although they occasionally have good stock tips. ;-)
  
  You may be right about the diet. I already eat every two or three hours, already consume protein after a workout to reduce/eliminate soreness, and already eat a diet that is mostly protein, veg, and few simple carbs. I don't however, eat many complex carbs, either. And I'm not always as careful about sticking to my diet as I could be. I will Google "anabolic window."
  
  I don't want to make this all about me. I think your advice would work equally well for any ectomorph, regardless of thyroid condition.

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